Imagine that, trivia
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Imagine this: here is some trivia on football:
1. One of the Browns retired numbers is for Don Fleming. What position did he play?
Wingback?
2. In their history, the Browns have "changed ship" halfway across the Channel, i.e. they changed head coaches during the middle of a season four time. Here are the years, you simply name the two coaches who led the Browns in those years:
1977 - Little Mo replaced Gregg
1984 - Marty replaced Sam
1990 - ????
2004 - Robiske replaced Butch
3. Ozzie Newsome is tied for most years leading the Browns in receptions: 5 years. Who is the one other person he is tied with?
Prolly Lavelli or Speedie...
4. Greg Pruitt and Mike Pruitt each led the Browns in rushing yards 5 times. Name those Browns players who led them in rushing more times.
Brown, Kelly and Mack for sure.... maybe Motley
5. In 2012, the average points scored per game, per team was 22.8 ppg/per team. This is the third highest in history.
Which seasons are the only ones in which the ppg/pt was higher?
One had to be the Andersen miracle year.... 2007?
Wait... is this a league question or a Browns question?
6. In 2012 the average number of yards rushing per team per game was 115.9. The highest average number of yards rushing per team per game is 156.6 ypg. In which season was this?
1964
7. Which NFL Head Coach lost the most (regular season) games in his career?
Gotta guess Tom Landry... long tenure and some pretty rough years.
8. Which coach lost the most postseason games in his career?
Tempted to go Landry again, but should be more of a modern day coach....
Marv Levy
9. For all coaches who coached for 5 or more years, which coach took his team to the highest average place finish in his division during his career? (e.g. if a HC won his division every year he coached he would have a 1.0 average. If he took his team to a second place finish every single year he would have a 2.0 average)
Paul Brown
10. Who has more? For this, choose the player who has the most of whatever from the choice I give:
A .Career TD passes: Tim Tebow...or Matt Leinert
B. Career TD passes: Brandon Weeden...or Brady Quinn
C. Career TD passes: Sam Bradford...or Andy Dalton
D. Career TD passes: Aaron Rodgers...or Tony Romo
E. Career Rushing yards: Michael Vick...or Ray Rice
F. Career TD catches: Braylon Edwards...or Heath Miller
G. Career Sacks: Kameron Wembley...or Clay Matthews III
H. Career Yards from scrimmage: Calvin Johnson...or Chris Johnson
I. Career Rushing attempts: Michael Bush...or Reggie Bush
J. Career Rushing yards per attempt: Steven Jackson or Fred Jackson
K. Career Receiving yards per game: Calvin Johnson...or Andre Johnson
Imagine this: here is some trivia on football:
1. One of the Browns retired numbers is for Don Fleming. What position did he play?
Wingback?
No, he didn't play that far back
2. In their history, the Browns have "changed ship" halfway across the Channel, i.e. they changed head coaches during the middle of a season four time. Here are the years, you simply name the two coaches who led the Browns in those years:
1977 - Little Mo replaced Gregg
1984 - Marty replaced Sam
1990 - ????
2004 - Robiske replaced Butch
All check except the one you didn't answer
3. Ozzie Newsome is tied for most years leading the Browns in receptions: 5 years. Who is the one other person he is tied with?
Prolly Lavelli or Speedie...
Well, which one do you choose?
4. Greg Pruitt and Mike Pruitt each led the Browns in rushing yards 5 times. Name those Browns players who led them in rushing more times.
Brown, Kelly and Mack for sure.... maybe Motley
These are all correct and complete!
5. In 2012, the average points scored per game, per team was 22.8 ppg/per team. This is the third highest in history.
Which seasons are the only ones in which the ppg/pt was higher?
One had to be the Andersen miracle year.... 2007?
Wait... is this a league question or a Browns question?
Its a league question....and 2007 is wrong
6. In 2012 the average number of yards rushing per team per game was 115.9. The highest average number of yards rushing per team per game is 156.6 ypg. In which season was this?
1964
NO
7. Which NFL Head Coach lost the most (regular season) games in his career?
Gotta guess Tom Landry... long tenure and some pretty rough years.
Good guess, but no. Landry is second
8. Which coach lost the most postseason games in his career?
Tempted to go Landry again, but should be more of a modern day coach....
Marv Levy
NO
9. For all coaches who coached for 5 or more years, which coach took his team to the highest average place finish in his division during his career? (e.g. if a HC won his division every year he coached he would have a 1.0 average. If he took his team to a second place finish every single year he would have a 2.0 average)
Paul Brown
NO....in fact PB is not even the best Browns HC at this statistic.
10. Who has more? For this, choose the player who has the most of whatever from the choice I give:
A .Career TD passes: Tim Tebow...or Matt Leinert
B. Career TD passes: Brandon Weeden...or Brady Quinn
C. Career TD passes: Sam Bradford...or Andy Dalton
D. Career TD passes: Aaron Rodgers...or Tony Romo
E. Career Rushing yards: Michael Vick...or Ray Rice
F. Career TD catches: Braylon Edwards...or Heath Miller
G. Career Sacks: Kameron Wembley...or Clay Matthews III
H. Career Yards from scrimmage: Calvin Johnson...or Chris Johnson
I. Career Rushing attempts: Michael Bush...or Reggie Bush
J. Career Rushing yards per attempt: Steven Jackson or Fred Jackson
K. Career Receiving yards per game: Calvin Johnson...or Andre Johnson
Of these 10, you have 5 right. Again, I will keep this open for others to try.
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Interim report: Questions still not answered:
3. Who is tied with Ozzie Newsome for leading the Browns in receptions the most years?
5. In what year was the highest points scored per team average attained?
6. In what year was the highest yards gained rushing per team attained?
Hint: The answer to #s 5 and 6 are the same year.
7. Which NFL HC lost the most regular season games in his career? and it is determined that it is not Jeff Fisher or Marv Levy or Tom Landry
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Close out time on this will be noonish.
Close out time on this will be noonish.
Interim report: Questions still not answered:
3. Who is tied with Ozzie Newsome for leading the Browns in receptions the most years?
max speedy
5. In what year was the highest points scored per team average attained?
1981
6. In what year was the highest yards gained rushing per team attained?
Hint: The answer to #s 5 and 6 are the same year.
7. Which NFL HC lost the most regular season games in his career? and it is determined that it is not Jeff Fisher or Marv Levy or Tom Landry
Hank Stramm
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7. Which NFL HC lost the most regular season games in his career? and it is determined that it is not Jeff Fisher or Marv Levy or Tom Landry
Marty Schottenheimer
7. Which NFL HC lost the most regular season games in his career? and it is determined that it is not Jeff Fisher or Marv Levy or Tom Landry
Marty Schottenheimer
NO, Marty is not in Top 5...but probably in top 10
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Close out time on this will be noonish.
Interim report: Questions still not answered:
3. Who is tied with Ozzie Newsome for leading the Browns in receptions the most years?
max speedy
5. In what year was the highest points scored per team average attained?
1981
6. In what year was the highest yards gained rushing per team attained?
Hint: The answer to #s 5 and 6 are the same year.
7. Which NFL HC lost the most regular season games in his career? and it is determined that it is not Jeff Fisher or Marv Levy or Tom Landry
Hank Stramm
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NO, Marty is not in Top 5...but probably in top 10
George Allen
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Imagine this: here is some trivia on football:
1. One of the Browns retired numbers is for Don Fleming. What position did he play?
2. In their history, the Browns have "changed ship" halfway across the Channel, i.e. they changed head coaches during the middle of a season four time. Here are the years, you simply name the two coaches who led the Browns in those years:
1977
1984
1990
2004
3. Ozzie Newsome is tied for most years leading the Browns in receptions: 5 years. Who is the one other person he is tied with?
4. Greg Pruitt and Mike Pruitt each led the Browns in rushing yards 5 times. Name those Browns players who led them in rushing more times.
5. In 2012, the average points scored per game, per team was 22.8 ppg/per team. This is the third highest in history.
Which seasons are the only ones in which the ppg/pt was higher?
6. In 2012 the average number of yards rushing per team per game was 115.9. The highest average number of yards rushing per team per game is 156.6 ypg. In which season was this?
7. Which NFL Head Coach lost the most (regular season) games in his career?
8. Which coach lost the most postseason games in his career?
9. For all coaches who coached for 5 or more years, which coach took his team to the highest average place finish in his division during his career? (e.g. if a HC won his division every year he coached he would have a 1.0 average. If he took his team to a second place finish every single year he would have a 2.0 average)
10. Who has more? For this, choose the player who has the most of whatever from the choice I give:
A .Career TD passes: Tim Tebow...or Matt Leinert
B. Career TD passes: Brandon Weeden...or Brady Quinn
C. Career TD passes: Sam Bradford...or Andy Dalton
D. Career TD passes: Aaron Rodgers...or Tony Romo
E. Career Rushing yards: Michael Vick...or Ray Rice
F. Career TD catches: Braylon Edwards...or Heath Miller
G. Career Sacks: Kameron Wembley...or Clay Matthews III
H. Career Yards from scrimmage: Calvin Johnson...or Chris Johnson
I. Career Rushing attempts: Michael Bush...or Reggie Bush
J. Career Rushing yards per attempt: Steven Jackson or Fred Jackson
K. Career Receiving yards per game: Calvin Johnson...or Andre Johnson
Imagine this: here is some trivia on football:
Answers:
1. One of the Browns retired numbers is for Don Fleming. What position did he play?
Fleming was a defensive back.Several sourcest didn't say whether safety or corner. Just a generic DB. He died of an electrocution accident.
2. In their history, the Browns have "changed ship" halfway across the Channel, i.e. they changed head coaches during the middle of a season four time. Here are the years, you simply name the two coaches who led the Browns in those years:
Z got all these:
1977 Forrest Gregg replaced by Dick Modzelewski (actually, I think he was Big Mo, no?)
1984 Sam Rutigliano replaced by Marty Schottenheimer.
1990 Bud Carson replaced by Jim Shofner
2004 Butch Davis replaced by Terry Robiskie
Of course, only Marty ended up getting the permanent gig.
3. Ozzie Newsome is tied for most years leading the Browns in receptions: 5 years. Who is the one other person he is tied with?
Mac Speedie with 5 years also ties Ozzie
The following led the Browns 4 times each in rreceiving: Lavelli, Warfield, Rucker, Slaughter
4. Greg Pruitt and Mike Pruitt each led the Browns in rushing yards 5 times. Name those Browns players who led them in rushing more times.
Jim Brown 9 years
Leroy Kelly 7 years
Marion Motley 6 years
Kevin Mack 6 years
5. In 2012, the average points scored per game, per team was 22.8 ppg/per team. This is the third highest in history.
Which seasons are the only ones in which the ppg/pt was higher?
1948 was the highest scoring year in history. Average team score per game that year was 23.2 points.
1950 was next with 22.9 ppg/team
Then 2012 with 22.8
6. In 2012 the average number of yards rushing per team per game was 115.9. The highest average number of yards rushing per team per game is 156.6 ypg. In which season was this?
1948 again had the highest rush avg. per team per game.
So, it just goes to show really that the high flying aerial offenses of today do not really generate more scoring that did the old fashion pounding run game.
7. Which NFL Head Coach lost the most (regular season) games in his career?
Dan Reeves lost 165 regular season games, most ever, vs. 190 career wins
Landry was #2 with 162 losses...but against 250 wins
Shula was #3 with 156 losses...but against 328 wins
Halas and Noll are next tied for 4th highest with 148 losses each....but Halas had 318 wins, Noll 193
So, if you think about it Noll and Reeves are not much different: 190/165 vs. 193/148. The clear difference really is that Noll was 4-0 in Super Bowls and Reeves was 0-4.
Should that matter so much? Marv Levy is also 0-4 and he is in...and his career record was 143-112.
8. Which coach lost the most postseason games in his career?
Don Shula was 19-17 in postseason play, with 17 being tops all time in losses
#2 in losses was Landry
#3 was Marty
#4 is Bud Grant
tied for #5 are: Chuck Knox and Mike Holmgren
9. For all coaches who coached for 5 or more years, which coach took his team to the highest average place finish in his division during his career? (e.g. if a HC won his division every year he coached he would have a 1.0 average. If he took his team to a second place finish every single year he would have a 2.0 average)
John Madden's teams in his 10 years averaged finishing 1.3 place finish. See a follow up post for more on this statistic
10. Who has more? For this, choose the player who has the most of whatever from the choice I give:
A .Career TD passes: Tim Tebow...or Matt Leinert
B. Career TD passes: Brandon Weeden...or Brady Quinn
C. Career TD passes: Sam Bradford...or Andy Dalton
D. Career TD passes: Aaron Rodgers...or Tony Romo
E. Career Rushing yards: Michael Vick...or Ray Rice
F. Career TD catches: Braylon Edwards...or Heath Miller
G. Career Sacks: Kameron Wembley...or Clay Matthews III
H. Career Yards from scrimmage: Calvin Johnson...or Chris Johnson
I. Career Rushing attempts: Michael Bush...or Reggie Bush
J. Career Rushing yards per attempt: Steven Jackson or Fred Jackson
K. Career Receiving yards per game: Calvin Johnson...or Andre Johnson
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OK, on the highest average division finish in a coach's tenure, minimum 5 years, here is the list of the tops:
1. John Madden 1.3 place finish 10 years
t2. Blanton Collier, 1.4... 8 years
t2. John Harbaugh, 1.4 ...5 years
t.4 Vince Lombardi 1.5...10 years
t4. Mike Martz, 1.5... 6 years
t4. Mike Tomlin 1.5...6 years
and these:
Mike Smith 1.6...5 years
Don Shula 1.6...33 years
George Seifert 1.7...11 years
Mike McCarthy 1.7...7 years
Mike Holmgren 1.7...17 years
Bill Cowher 1.7...15 years
Bill Walsh 1.8...10 years
Sean Payton 1.8...6 years
Bud Grant 1.8...18 years
Ray Flaherty 1.8...11 years
Tony Dungy 1.8...13 years
Bill Belichick 1.8...18 years
George Allen 1.8...12 years
Marty Schottenheimer 1.9...21 years
Chuck Noll 1.9...23 years
Note on Paul Brown: His average finish was 2.0. Though his teams finished first in 12 of his first 13 years, with the Browns he did not have a first place finish in 59/60/61/62. Then he started coaching the expansion Bengals, and though he probably did about as well as anyone could with an expansion team, it was still an expansion team. In 8 years of coaching them he finished first just 3 times.
Also note that some coaches who have not coached for 5 years have some pretty good stats:
Jim Harbaugh, now after 2 years has a perfect 1.0 average with 2 division titles
Lou Rymkus back in the 60s coached 2 years and had 2 first place finishes for a 1.0 avg.
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Good little exercise, Gip...
Responses
So, it just goes to show really that the high flying aerial offenses of today do not really generate more scoring that did the old fashion pounding run game.
Surprising... but a couple things may help explain:
- way back then the ball carrier was not down until he was held down;
- defenses were largely an after thought until Landry was Giants' DC; and
- early equipment made tackling a lot less sure back in the early days.
So, if you think about it Noll and Reeves are not much different: 190/165 vs. 193/148. The clear difference really is that Noll was 4-0 in Super Bowls and Reeves was 0-4.
Should that matter so much? Marv Levy is also 0-4 and he is in...and his career record was 143-112.
I think Levi's 4 consecutive SB appearances pretty much set him apart...
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Here are the figures for some HOF coaches not previously mentioned:
Stram...2.1
Gibbs...2.1
Parcells...2.3
Landry...2.3
Levy...2.6
Gillman...2.6
Halas...2.7
Lambeau...3.2
and then there were these guys:
Rutigliano...2.7
Mangini...3.0#
Butch Davis...3.3
Skorich...3.7#
Shurmur...4.0
Gregg...2.8#
Carson...2.5
Palmer...6.0
Crennell...3.3#
# includes record from other teams
and finally, these guys:
Jeff Fisher...2.4
Norv Turner...2.4
(for all the praise that Fisher gets as a HC, and for all the scorn the Turner got...Fisher's teams have performed not one bit better in terms of where their team's have ended up in the standings. And Fisher got to just the one SB,)
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Here are the figures for some HOF coaches not previously mentioned:
Stram...2.1
Gibbs...2.1
Parcells...2.3
Landry...2.3
Levy...2.6
Gillman...2.6
Halas...2.7
Lambeau...3.2
and then there were these guys:
Rutigliano...2.7
Mangini...3.0#
Butch Davis...3.3
Skorich...3.7#
Shurmur...4.0
Gregg...2.8#
Carson...2.5
Palmer...6.0
Crennell...3.3#
# includes record from other teams
and finally, these guys:
Jeff Fisher...2.4
Norv Turner...2.4
(for all the praise that Fisher gets as a HC, and for all the scorn the Turner got...Fisher's teams have performed not one bit better in terms of where their team's have ended up in the standings. And Fisher got to just the one SB,)
Here are the figures for some HOF coaches not previously mentioned:
Stram...2.1
Gibbs...2.1
Parcells...2.3
Landry...2.3
Levy...2.6
Gillman...2.6
Halas...2.7
Lambeau...3.2
and then there were these guys:
Rutigliano...2.7
Mangini...3.0#
Butch Davis...3.3
Skorich...3.7#
Shurmur...4.0
Gregg...2.8#
Carson...2.5
Palmer...6.0
Crennell...3.3#
# includes record from other teams
and finally, these guys:
Jeff Fisher...2.4
Norv Turner...2.4
(for all the praise that Fisher gets as a HC, and for all the scorn the Turner got...Fisher's teams have performed not one bit better in terms of where their team's have ended up in the standings. And Fisher got to just the one SB,)
Wow .... Rosie's 6.0 ... that's a record in futility that can never be topped ... unless the NFL expands to 48 teams.
Zombo
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OK, on the highest average division finish in a coach's tenure, minimum 5 years, here is the list of the tops:
1. John Madden 1.3 place finish 10 years
t2. Blanton Collier, 1.4... 8 years
t2. John Harbaugh, 1.4 ...5 years
t.4 Vince Lombardi 1.5...10 years
t4. Mike Martz, 1.5... 6 years
t4. Mike Tomlin 1.5...6 years
and these:
Mike Smith 1.6...5 years
Don Shula 1.6...33 years
George Seifert 1.7...11 years
Mike McCarthy 1.7...7 years
Mike Holmgren 1.7...17 years
Bill Cowher 1.7...15 years
Bill Walsh 1.8...10 years
Sean Payton 1.8...6 years
Bud Grant 1.8...18 years
Ray Flaherty 1.8...11 years
Tony Dungy 1.8...13 years
Bill Belichick 1.8...18 years
George Allen 1.8...12 years
Marty Schottenheimer 1.9...21 years
Chuck Noll 1.9...23 years
Note on Paul Brown: His average finish was 2.0. Though his teams finished first in 12 of his first 13 years, with the Browns he did not have a first place finish in 59/60/61/62. Then he started coaching the expansion Bengals, and though he probably did about as well as anyone could with an expansion team, it was still an expansion team. In 8 years of coaching them he finished first just 3 times.
Also note that some coaches who have not coached for 5 years have some pretty good stats:
Jim Harbaugh, now after 2 years has a perfect 1.0 average with 2 division titles
Lou Rymkus back in the 60s coached 2 years and had 2 first place finishes for a 1.0 avg.
OK, on the highest average division finish in a coach's tenure, minimum 5 years, here is the list of the tops:
1. John Madden 1.3 place finish 10 years
t2. Blanton Collier, 1.4... 8 years
t2. John Harbaugh, 1.4 ...5 years
t.4 Vince Lombardi 1.5...10 years
t4. Mike Martz, 1.5... 6 years
t4. Mike Tomlin 1.5...6 years
and these:
Mike Smith 1.6...5 years
Don Shula 1.6...33 years
George Seifert 1.7...11 years
Mike McCarthy 1.7...7 years
Mike Holmgren 1.7...17 years
Bill Cowher 1.7...15 years
Bill Walsh 1.8...10 years
Sean Payton 1.8...6 years
Bud Grant 1.8...18 years
Ray Flaherty 1.8...11 years
Tony Dungy 1.8...13 years
Bill Belichick 1.8...18 years
George Allen 1.8...12 years
Marty Schottenheimer 1.9...21 years
Chuck Noll 1.9...23 years
Note on Paul Brown: His average finish was 2.0. Though his teams finished first in 12 of his first 13 years, with the Browns he did not have a first place finish in 59/60/61/62. Then he started coaching the expansion Bengals, and though he probably did about as well as anyone could with an expansion team, it was still an expansion team. In 8 years of coaching them he finished first just 3 times.
Also note that some coaches who have not coached for 5 years have some pretty good stats:
Jim Harbaugh, now after 2 years has a perfect 1.0 average with 2 division titles
Lou Rymkus back in the 60s coached 2 years and had 2 first place finishes for a 1.0 avg.
By the way, Ray Flaherty brought the screen pass into the league.
Zombo
--and Pat Shurmur took it out.
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Here are the figures for some HOF coaches not previously mentioned:
Stram...2.1
Gibbs...2.1
Parcells...2.3
Landry...2.3
Levy...2.6
Gillman...2.6
Halas...2.7
Lambeau...3.2
and then there were these guys:
Rutigliano...2.7
Mangini...3.0#
Butch Davis...3.3
Skorich...3.7#
Shurmur...4.0
Gregg...2.8#
Carson...2.5
Palmer...6.0
Crennell...3.3#
# includes record from other teams
and finally, these guys:
Jeff Fisher...2.4
Norv Turner...2.4
(for all the praise that Fisher gets as a HC, and for all the scorn the Turner got...Fisher's teams have performed not one bit better in terms of where their team's have ended up in the standings. And Fisher got to just the one SB,)
Wow .... Rosie's 6.0 ... that's a record in futility that can never be topped ... unless the NFL expands to 48 teams.
Zombo
Zombo said:
Wow .... Rosie's 6.0 ... that's a record in futility that can never be topped ... unless the NFL expands to 48 teams.
Zombo
Actually, it was topped....and by some notable names. All of the following Hall of Fame players had higher average team finishes as HCs in the NFL:
Jim Thorpe
Pete Henry
Fritz Pollard
Ernie Nevers
Bob Waterfield
All over 6.0 average finishes. Of course, a lot of that was in the days when there were no divisions/conferences, or if there were there were 8-10 teams in each division.
Now, of course a team can never finish lower than 4th.
And how about some of these beauties:
Coonie Checkaye 18.0
Carl Storck 13.6
Jack Fish 11.0
Hank Gilla 11.0
Al Cornsweet 8.0
Brick Muller 6.0
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Zombo said:
Wow .... Rosie's 6.0 ... that's a record in futility that can never be topped ... unless the NFL expands to 48 teams.
Zombo
Actually, it was topped....and by some notable names. All of the following Hall of Fame players had higher average team finishes as HCs in the NFL:
Jim Thorpe
Pete Henry
Fritz Pollard
Ernie Nevers
Bob Waterfield
All over 6.0 average finishes. Of course, a lot of that was in the days when there were no divisions/conferences, or if there were there were 8-10 teams in each division.
Now, of course a team can never finish lower than 4th.
And how about some of these beauties:
Coonie Checkaye 18.0
Carl Storck 13.6
Jack Fish 11.0
Hank Gilla 11.0
Al Cornsweet 8.0
Brick Muller 6.0
Actually, it was topped....and by some notable names. All of the following Hall of Fame players had higher average team finishes as HCs in the NFL:
Jim Thorpe
Pete Henry
Fritz Pollard
Ernie Nevers
Bob Waterfield
All over 6.0 average finishes. Of course, a lot of that was in the days when there were no divisions/conferences, or if there were there were 8-10 teams in each division.
Now, of course a team can never finish lower than 4th.
And how about some of these beauties:
Coonie Checkaye 18.0
Carl Storck 13.6
Jack Fish 11.0
Hank Gilla 11.0
Al Cornsweet 8.0
Brick Muller 6.0
I guess Rosie is just the least productive coach in the Super Bowl era.
Zombo
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Actually, it was topped....and by some notable names. All of the following Hall of Fame players had higher average team finishes as HCs in the NFL:
Jim Thorpe
Pete Henry
Fritz Pollard
Ernie Nevers
Bob Waterfield
All over 6.0 average finishes. Of course, a lot of that was in the days when there were no divisions/conferences, or if there were there were 8-10 teams in each division.
Now, of course a team can never finish lower than 4th.
And how about some of these beauties:
Coonie Checkaye 18.0
Carl Storck 13.6
Jack Fish 11.0
Hank Gilla 11.0
Al Cornsweet 8.0
Brick Muller 6.0
I guess Rosie is just the least productive coach in the Super Bowl era.
Zombo
Zombo said:
I guess Rosie is just the least productive coach in the Super Bowl era.
Zombo
I have checked on that....and you are absolutely correct. No one who coached post 1965 has a worse average.
But then....one of the 4 guys with a "perfect record" 1.0, was fired after his "perfect season"....Hue Jackson, coach of the Raiders in 2011....tied for the division crown with 2 other teams with an 8-8 record....but was canned after one year.
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