Let's Lay to Rest the Myth that the Browns are...
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Stats support Browns defensive improvement thru games 4 (yards allowed by defense)
passing yards rushing yards average total/game
2012 1144 469 403
2013 850 316 291
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Stats support Browns defensive improvement thru games 4 (yards allowed by defense)
passing yards rushing yards average total/game
2012 1144 469 403
2013 850 316 291
Stats support Browns defensive improvement thru games 4
passing yards rushing yards average total/game
2012 1144 469 403
2013 850 316 291
I don't know how to read this.
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I don't know how to read this.
They're yards allowed by the defense.
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Jury is still out on a lot of these guys.
Mingo has played great so far. Let's revisit this at the end of the season before we start ranking him. He's only got three games to his name.
Cameron has also been outstanding. But let's not forget that we had two years of no production before this and TE's go in and out of popularity faster than plaid shorts. Kyle Rudolph was a playmaker two years ago.
Skrine had a great game against Cincy. That's how you expect a #2 to play. His PI call was bogus. But he's also had a year of garbage, so let's wait until the end of the year on him as well.
Gordon is becoming a great WR. If he keeps this up he could easily be a top 5 receiving threat. If he keeps this up, though.
Mack is Mack. Thomas is Thomas. DQJ is DQJ. Haden is Haden. All top 10 at their position, Haden and Thomas in the top 5.
We have a solid corps but we still have holes and we still have a big learning curve. Hoyer had been an unexpected surprise and I really hope he continues playing as well as he has.
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Jury is still out on a lot of these guys.
Mingo has played great so far. Let's revisit this at the end of the season before we start ranking him. He's only got three games to his name.
Cameron has also been outstanding. But let's not forget that we had two years of no production before this and TE's go in and out of popularity faster than plaid shorts. Kyle Rudolph was a playmaker two years ago.
Skrine had a great game against Cincy. That's how you expect a #2 to play. His PI call was bogus. But he's also had a year of garbage, so let's wait until the end of the year on him as well.
Gordon is becoming a great WR. If he keeps this up he could easily be a top 5 receiving threat. If he keeps this up, though.
Mack is Mack. Thomas is Thomas. DQJ is DQJ. Haden is Haden. All top 10 at their position, Haden and Thomas in the top 5.
We have a solid corps but we still have holes and we still have a big learning curve. Hoyer had been an unexpected surprise and I really hope he continues playing as well as he has.
Jury is still out on a lot of these guys.
Mingo has played great so far. Let's revisit this at the end of the season before we start ranking him. He's only got three games to his name.
Cameron has also been outstanding. But let's not forget that we had two years of no production before this and TE's go in and out of popularity faster than plaid shorts. Kyle Rudolph was a playmaker two years ago.
Skrine had a great game against Cincy. That's how you expect a #2 to play. His PI call was bogus. But he's also had a year of garbage, so let's wait until the end of the year on him as well.
Gordon is becoming a great WR. If he keeps this up he could easily be a top 5 receiving threat. If he keeps this up, though.
Mack is Mack. Thomas is Thomas. DQJ is DQJ. Haden is Haden. All top 10 at their position, Haden and Thomas in the top 5.
We have a solid corps but we still have holes and we still have a big learning curve. Hoyer had been an unexpected surprise and I really hope he continues playing as well as he has.
I agree. But you have to understand, this is Cleveland and we are starved for a winner.
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Offensive line dominated on the drive resulting in the Ogbo TD. McGaheheehee showed his still has a some left in the tank. Lewis proved in 07 and 08 that a thirty yo running back can compete although I would be feeling a lot better about McGahee with a Browns training camp under his belt. Big question mark on Rainey. I don't know if the could could physically handle 15-20 runs/game. He isn't at Western Kentucky anymore.
I would like to see the Browns make a deal on a RB before trade deadline next month. Ginger might be worth something, after all.
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My call? There isn't really a talent gap between the Bengals and Browns. I didn't believe it, personally... and when the theory ("on paper") was put to the test, your eyeballs could tell you that the Bengals simply were NOT more talented than the Browns.
Yes, the matchups work: The Bengals have a clear-cut #1 WR and the Browns have a clear-cut #1 CB... as opposed to the Browns playing a team that throws to everybody, like the Packers. The Browns have the league's best LT and a quarterback who gets the ball out fast, neutralizing two excellent pass rush teams in a row. The Browns have underrated cover safeties and 'backers like Gipson and Robertson to their 12 formations (two TEs) weren't really effective.
And if you read the above, "great gameplan" flows right out of it. The Browns were able to get heat mostly rushing 4, BTW, which gave us numbers in the defensive backfield. Ginger's numbers were dreadful.
Look, everything is always "as of now," and subject to change... but I came into the season thinking the Browns had quite a few potential Pro Bowl types (is there a Pro Bowl?): Kruger, Mingo, DQJ, Taylor, Rubin, Bryant, Haden and Ward on defense; Thomas, Mack, Cameron, and Gordon on offense. Now I really like Hoyer and I've always thought PFF had it right on Greco: He's good.
It's not a perfect team. We aren't the Broncos or Seahawks. But I think it's a good football team that could win 9 games. I think we'll be 3-2 after Thursday night. Then, those resources for the offseason can't be matched.
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My call? There isn't really a talent gap between the Bengals and Browns. I didn't believe it, personally... and when the theory ("on paper") was put to the test, your eyeballs could tell you that the Bengals simply were NOT more talented than the Browns.
Yes, the matchups work: The Bengals have a clear-cut #1 WR and the Browns have a clear-cut #1 CB... as opposed to the Browns playing a team that throws to everybody, like the Packers. The Browns have the league's best LT and a quarterback who gets the ball out fast, neutralizing two excellent pass rush teams in a row. The Browns have underrated cover safeties and 'backers like Gipson and Robertson to their 12 formations (two TEs) weren't really effective.
And if you read the above, "great gameplan" flows right out of it. The Browns were able to get heat mostly rushing 4, BTW, which gave us numbers in the defensive backfield. Ginger's numbers were dreadful.
Look, everything is always "as of now," and subject to change... but I came into the season thinking the Browns had quite a few potential Pro Bowl types (is there a Pro Bowl?): Kruger, Mingo, DQJ, Taylor, Rubin, Bryant, Haden and Ward on defense; Thomas, Mack, Cameron, and Gordon on offense. Now I really like Hoyer and I've always thought PFF had it right on Greco: He's good.
It's not a perfect team. We aren't the Broncos or Seahawks. But I think it's a good football team that could win 9 games. I think we'll be 3-2 after Thursday night. Then, those resources for the offseason can't be matched.
My call? There isn't really a talent gap between the Bengals and Browns. I didn't believe it, personally... and when the theory ("on paper") was put to the test, your eyeballs could tell you that the Bengals simply were NOT more talented than the Browns.
Yes, the matchups work: The Bengals have a clear-cut #1 WR and the Browns have a clear-cut #1 CB... as opposed to the Browns playing a team that throws to everybody, like the Packers. The Browns have the league's best LT and a quarterback who gets the ball out fast, neutralizing two excellent pass rush teams in a row. The Browns have underrated cover safeties and 'backers like Gipson and Robertson to their 12 formations (two TEs) weren't really effective.
And if you read the above, "great gameplan" flows right out of it. The Browns were able to get heat mostly rushing 4, BTW, which gave us numbers in the defensive backfield. Ginger's numbers were dreadful.
Look, everything is always "as of now," and subject to change... but I came into the season thinking the Browns had quite a few potential Pro Bowl types (is there a Pro Bowl?): Kruger, Mingo, DQJ, Taylor, Rubin, Bryant, Haden and Ward on defense; Thomas, Mack, Cameron, and Gordon on offense. Now I really like Hoyer and I've always thought PFF had it right on Greco: He's good.
It's not a perfect team. We aren't the Broncos or Seahawks. But I think it's a good football team that could win 9 games. I think we'll be 3-2 after Thursday night. Then, those resources for the offseason can't be matched.
Half of your list won't get Pro Bowl nods.
Realistically, it's more like Haden, Rubin, (maybe) Bryant and possibly Mingo on defense. On offense, it's Thomas, Cameron and possibly Gordon. Mack is a toss up, but there's still some very good veteran centers that will get it over him based on name alone.
I don't see a talent gap between us and any team in the NFL, excluding the Broncos and maybe the 49ers. We have the talent to hang with anybody and, where we don't have the talent, the play calling can make up for it.
But we need to temper our expectations a bit. Hoyer is going to have a bad game. Yes, it will happen. And then the "Bench Hoyer, Bridgewater 2014" threads will start. Gordon will have a bad game and we'll see "Trade Gordon while he has value". Cameron will drop a TD pass and we'll get "Antonio Gates available?"
We're so high to glorify guys when they do well and quick to dismiss them when they don't.
All in all, we have a young and talented team. Some are going to fizzle out. Others will be perennial Pro Bowlers.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Regardless of who has what talent on paper, I saw a team that was out coached. And that was especially evident on the defensive side of it. We had an answer for everything Lewis could think of(not saying much) and able to keep them guessing all day
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Regardless of who has what talent on paper, I saw a team that was out coached. And that was especially evident on the defensive side of it. We had an answer for everything Lewis could think of(not saying much) and able to keep them guessing all day
Regardless of who has what talent on paper, I saw a team that was out coached. And that was especially evident on the defensive side of it. We had an answer for everything Lewis could think of(not saying much) and able to keep them guessing all day
Or, would you say that Ray Horton outcoached Jay Gruden?
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Regardless of who has what talent on paper, I saw a team that was out coached. And that was especially evident on the defensive side of it. We had an answer for everything Lewis could think of(not saying much) and able to keep them guessing all day
Or, would you say that Ray Horton outcoached Jay Gruden?
Or, would you say that Ray Horton outcoached Jay Gruden?
Most likely, his schemes have made us vastly improved.
Do you guys think Horton had anything to do with Hoyer getting the nod over Campbell? He saw him in AZ, maybe he got into Chud & Norv's ear.
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Regardless of who has what talent on paper, I saw a team that was out coached. And that was especially evident on the defensive side of it. We had an answer for everything Lewis could think of(not saying much) and able to keep them guessing all day
Or, would you say that Ray Horton outcoached Jay Gruden?
Or, would you say that Ray Horton outcoached Jay Gruden?
I would say that plus Chud out coached Marv. These things do tend to start at the top.
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My call? There isn't really a talent gap between the Bengals and Browns. I didn't believe it, personally... and when the theory ("on paper") was put to the test, your eyeballs could tell you that the Bengals simply were NOT more talented than the Browns.
Yes, the matchups work: The Bengals have a clear-cut #1 WR and the Browns have a clear-cut #1 CB... as opposed to the Browns playing a team that throws to everybody, like the Packers. The Browns have the league's best LT and a quarterback who gets the ball out fast, neutralizing two excellent pass rush teams in a row. The Browns have underrated cover safeties and 'backers like Gipson and Robertson to their 12 formations (two TEs) weren't really effective.
And if you read the above, "great gameplan" flows right out of it. The Browns were able to get heat mostly rushing 4, BTW, which gave us numbers in the defensive backfield. Ginger's numbers were dreadful.
Look, everything is always "as of now," and subject to change... but I came into the season thinking the Browns had quite a few potential Pro Bowl types (is there a Pro Bowl?): Kruger, Mingo, DQJ, Taylor, Rubin, Bryant, Haden and Ward on defense; Thomas, Mack, Cameron, and Gordon on offense. Now I really like Hoyer and I've always thought PFF had it right on Greco: He's good.
It's not a perfect team. We aren't the Broncos or Seahawks. But I think it's a good football team that could win 9 games. I think we'll be 3-2 after Thursday night. Then, those resources for the offseason can't be matched.
Half of your list won't get Pro Bowl nods.
Realistically, it's more like Haden, Rubin, (maybe) Bryant and possibly Mingo on defense. On offense, it's Thomas, Cameron and possibly Gordon. Mack is a toss up, but there's still some very good veteran centers that will get it over him based on name alone.
I don't see a talent gap between us and any team in the NFL, excluding the Broncos and maybe the 49ers. We have the talent to hang with anybody and, where we don't have the talent, the play calling can make up for it.
But we need to temper our expectations a bit. Hoyer is going to have a bad game. Yes, it will happen. And then the "Bench Hoyer, Bridgewater 2014" threads will start. Gordon will have a bad game and we'll see "Trade Gordon while he has value". Cameron will drop a TD pass and we'll get "Antonio Gates available?"
We're so high to glorify guys when they do well and quick to dismiss them when they don't.
All in all, we have a young and talented team. Some are going to fizzle out. Others will be perennial Pro Bowlers.
We have the talent to hang with anybody and, where we don't have the talent, the play calling can make up for it.
NE went into Atl last night with a pair of third stringers at WR (Thomkins, Edelman). Not a big deal when you factor in a bellichik and a Brady. Bellichik continues to to get the best out of his players and Brady has a knack of getting his receivers to believe in themselves. this is another good example of coaching(Playcalling) and (QB's) being one of the major gaps between average teams and perennial winners. I am not sold on Turner by a long shot. His history with Rivers was not all that great and Rivers has actually improved since Turners departure from San Diego. The play calling in the 4th qtr yesterday was masterful. I have a hunch Chud had a lot of input. Hoyer showed poise. I see a lot of potential if this relationship continues to develop.
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Ill be the hometown huckleberry. Add Luavo and Pinkston back and we are the best football team in the division IF Hoyer keeps playing at this level. If stats on paper translated into wins and losses I'd be a millionaire thanks to Vegas. This team is all of a sudden showing the intangible "IT' factor.
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Ill be the hometown huckleberry. Add Luavo and Pinkston back and we are the best football team in the division IF Hoyer keeps playing at this level. If stats on paper translated into wins and losses I'd be a millionaire thanks to Vegas. This team is all of a sudden showing the intangible "IT' factor.
Ill be the hometown huckleberry. Add Luavo and Pinkston back and we are the best football team in the division IF Hoyer keeps playing at this level. If stats on paper translated into wins and losses I'd be a millionaire thanks to Vegas. This team is all of a sudden showing the intangible "IT' factor.
Gawd but I hope you are right!
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We have the talent to hang with anybody and, where we don't have the talent, the play calling can make up for it.
NE went into Atl last night with a pair of third stringers at WR (Thomkins, Edelman). Not a big deal when you factor in a bellichik and a Brady. Bellichik continues to to get the best out of his players and Brady has a knack of getting his receivers to believe in themselves. this is another good example of coaching(Playcalling) and (QB's) being one of the major gaps between average teams and perennial winners. I am not sold on Turner by a long shot. His history with Rivers was not all that great and Rivers has actually improved since Turners departure from San Diego. The play calling in the 4th qtr yesterday was masterful. I have a hunch Chud had a lot of input. Hoyer showed poise. I see a lot of potential if this relationship continues to develop.
NE went into Atl last night with a pair of third stringers at WR (Thomkins, Edelman). Not a big deal when you factor in a bellichik and a Brady. Bellichik continues to to get the best out of his players and Brady has a knack of getting his receivers to believe in themselves. this is another good example of coaching(Playcalling) and (QB's) being one of the major gaps between average teams and perennial winners. I am not sold on Turner by a long shot. His history with Rivers was not all that great and Rivers has actually improved since Turners departure from San Diego. The play calling in the 4th qtr yesterday was masterful. I have a hunch Chud had a lot of input. Hoyer showed poise. I see a lot of potential if this relationship continues to develop.
Turner is a very successful coordinator. When he's spread thin as HC, he's awful.
I think he's great where he is, in the booth. He has a great football mind; scheming, spotting weaknesses, playcalling- he's great at all of it.
When he's in charge of everything...not so much.
I think the duo of Chud and Turner is as great as any in the league. Chud is the ballsy prodigal son returned who's brought back his NFL mentor to be his right hand man.
I've never believed Rivers to be an upper echelon QB. He's a cocky, gunslinging risk taker like Favre but without the horseshoe lodged up his ass.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Sorry, but I think we sneaked up on them.
Our D is faster they they were expecting...
They were not prepared for Hoyer's poise...
... and, yes, we had a great game plan.
Their fans came into our Forum over confidant... I think their team showed up over confident as well. The look on Dalton's face at game's end screamed befudlement... as pretty much did his play. Maybe it's a redhead thang..
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Should have won by more. If our kicker is healthy, it's 23-6, which is more what the stats suggest. Browns seemed in control from the beginning. I never believed they would lose. Just looked like the better team.
On the flip side, when all the Bengals love started, I immediately thought it was way over baked. They don't have a top 10 quarterback to that right there puts you in the second tier and out of Super Bowl talk. At least for me.
I don't see them as some kind of juggernaut at all.
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It sure would be sweet to give blowitmore a real run at the AFCN title. They are defending AFCN and SB champs and I want it to be the Browns that dethrones that flock. Gotta beat the champ to be the champ.
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By the way, Skrine leads the team with 7 PDs and is second with 19 solo tackles (DQJ, of course, has 22). Also has a pick. He's a keeper. I'd love to get a bigger #2 and move him into the slot but he might make it impossible to bench him pretty soon.
Also the pass interference on him didn't look like a problem. The ball was under thrown and Skrine just happened to bump into the receiver as he stopped. Skrine has looked a lot better.
Also the pass interference on him didn't look like a problem. The ball was under thrown and Skrine just happened to bump into the receiver as he stopped. Skrine has looked a lot better.
meh.. Skrine has ball tracking problems (he's the DB version of MoMass) The PI could have been avoided had he just made a play on the ball instead of tripping over the WR.
He's night & day better than last season though.
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