How we should attack our needs next year.
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It's draft's like yours that got us in the mess we are today. I'm not knocking your opinion or anything bro, but we have 3 positions on our line that are either first or second round picks. The two most important, LT and Guard, are first rounders. It's fine that our guards are later rounds because Mack doubles down a lot and hides their weaknesses. When was the last time a lineman won Super Bowl MVP?
We're at the top of the league in sacks given up. Our run blocking is terrible, no disgraceful ! We need to after skill positions, people that touch the ball on almost every play. QB, WR, RB in that order with the top 3 picks....no messing around Cleveland! You need a quarterback, draft one with the first pick. Look what Gordon can do with three different starting qb's ? He's a beast!
You win games by scoring early and often. If it's down to the last possession and your team is down, you need the offensive weapons to move down the field and score. Many games come down to this situation and usually the offense either drives and scores, or the offense beats itself. Cleveland's offense needs those skill players to put points on the board. We get a holding call on first down - drive ends. We get flagged on illegal procedure on third and shorty to make it third and long - drive ends. We get a personal foul on any down - drive ends. We ALWAYS beat ourselves.
Our defense is fine. Fill out positions of need in the later rounds but I don't see us going anything less than Offense, Offense, Offense with our first three pics at a minimum, and not lineman at that, skill positions that defenses game plan for and lose sleep over.
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It's draft's like yours that got us in the mess we are today. I'm not knocking your opinion or anything bro, but we have 3 positions on our line that are either first or second round picks. The two most important, LT and Guard, are first rounders. It's fine that our guards are later rounds because Mack doubles down a lot and hides their weaknesses. When was the last time a lineman won Super Bowl MVP?
We're at the top of the league in sacks given up. Our run blocking is terrible, no disgraceful ! We need to after skill positions, people that touch the ball on almost every play. QB, WR, RB in that order with the top 3 picks....no messing around Cleveland! You need a quarterback, draft one with the first pick. Look what Gordon can do with three different starting qb's ? He's a beast!
You win games by scoring early and often. If it's down to the last possession and your team is down, you need the offensive weapons to move down the field and score. Many games come down to this situation and usually the offense either drives and scores, or the offense beats itself. Cleveland's offense needs those skill players to put points on the board. We get a holding call on first down - drive ends. We get flagged on illegal procedure on third and shorty to make it third and long - drive ends. We get a personal foul on any down - drive ends. We ALWAYS beat ourselves.
Our defense is fine. Fill out positions of need in the later rounds but I don't see us going anything less than Offense, Offense, Offense with our first three pics at a minimum, and not lineman at that, skill positions that defenses game plan for and lose sleep over.
It's draft's like yours that got us in the mess we are today. I'm not knocking your opinion or anything bro, but we have 3 positions on our line that are either first or second round picks. The two most important, LT and Guard, are first rounders. It's fine that our guards are later rounds because Mack doubles down a lot and hides their weaknesses. When was the last time a lineman won Super Bowl MVP?
We're at the top of the league in sacks given up. Our run blocking is terrible, no disgraceful ! We need to after skill positions, people that touch the ball on almost every play. QB, WR, RB in that order with the top 3 picks....no messing around Cleveland! You need a quarterback, draft one with the first pick. Look what Gordon can do with three different starting qb's ? He's a beast!
You win games by scoring early and often. If it's down to the last possession and your team is down, you need the offensive weapons to move down the field and score. Many games come down to this situation and usually the offense either drives and scores, or the offense beats itself. Cleveland's offense needs those skill players to put points on the board. We get a holding call on first down - drive ends. We get flagged on illegal procedure on third and shorty to make it third and long - drive ends. We get a personal foul on any down - drive ends. We ALWAYS beat ourselves.
Our defense is fine. Fill out positions of need in the later rounds but I don't see us going anything less than Offense, Offense, Offense with our first three pics at a minimum, and not lineman at that, skill positions that defenses game plan for and lose sleep over.
You just said what we need Offensive line help? Sorry alex mack is gone next year unless we dump a shit load of money on him. Our offence needs help. hense an additional stud at WR, OG, C, RB on defense its ILB and CB
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Let me first say I am not a believer in drafting a QB with our 1st rounders this year. Next year yes.
We are in need of the following in our draft and should be a priority.
1. OG
1a. C
2. WR
3. RB
3a. CB
4. ILB
4a. OG
5. RT
6. QB
7. FS
We should go after the following in FA with our CAP space
K
CB
ILB
WR
OG
RT
Let me first say I am not a believer in drafting a QB with our 1st rounders this year. Next year yes.
We are in need of the following in our draft and should be a priority.
1. OG
1a. C
2. WR
3. RB
3a. CB
4. ILB
4a. OG
5. RT
6. QB
7. FS
We should go after the following in FA with our CAP space
K
CB
ILB
WR
OG
RT
I think Hoyer is pretty good, but I would still raise QB on the list of priorities. I might have guard rated as high as you do. I just want to be clear that my priority list doesn't mean I would draft one in the first round. At least with the first of our picks.
In the end, I let BPA sway the bulk of my opinions. In other words I am not for drafting a guard if all the guards available suck or reaching very far to get one at the expense of passing on better players.....lets face it, our team is pretty bad and there aren't that many players on the field who couldn't be upgraded. On O, I'd say Thomas and Gordon are about the only two who are pretty much locks. On D there might be 3-4 players who are about as good as we can expect out of the position.
No doubt you don't like to backtrack and like to build to be deeper, but if a gift is thrown in your lap, you best take it.
Where needs comes in to play is in any grouping of players no matter at what level of the draft you are talking, you are going to find 3-4-5-6 players pretty much graded out the same, or with-in acceptable parameters...then you weigh team needs to help you make your decision. If you head in to round 3 saying we are taking a guard, you are bound to fail. Once your selection come up and you have a CB, G,DE, and RB all rated about the same, then you pull the plug on the guard. If there isn't a guard, you better take one of the other positions rather than dip down to the next rated guard.
If you are Seattle and need a guard, you can reach. When you are the Browns, you better just stock the best talent on the board.
JMO
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As for FA, I don't get the kicker part unless Cundiff is free after the season. I think he has been every bit of solid. I don't care what he does the rest of the season unless he simply falls off the charts, he has been a solid replacement for Dawson.
FA is where you address team needs. It's all about needs. We have needs, so we better start filling some of them. Under the cap, schmap. How about spending the money allowed to try to build a better team in the here and now because the here and now sucks ass.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. -
We need to address our needs in FA and use our money having over 20 million in CAP space.
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As for FA, I don't get the kicker part unless Cundiff is free after the season. I think he has been every bit of solid. I don't care what he does the rest of the season unless he simply falls off the charts, he has been a solid replacement for Dawson.
FA is where you address team needs. It's all about needs. We have needs, so we better start filling some of them. Under the cap, schmap. How about spending the money allowed to try to build a better team in the here and now because the here and now sucks ass.
As for FA, I don't get the kicker part unless Cundiff is free after the season. I think he has been every bit of solid. I don't care what he does the rest of the season unless he simply falls off the charts, he has been a solid replacement for Dawson.
FA is where you address team needs. It's all about needs. We have needs, so we better start filling some of them. Under the cap, schmap. How about spending the money allowed to try to build a better team in the here and now because the here and now sucks ass.
You realize that, if Cundiff makes that field goal in the third quarter, we only have to go about 10 more yards on our final drive for a chance to win the game?
It's stuff like that that bothers me. Clean missed FG's are on nobody but the kicker. Bad snaps are on nobody but the center, although Weeden didn't help things. Mistakes cost us the game. We weren't outplayed at all by Jacksonville.
Alex Mack makes a mistake, Billy Cundiff makes a mistake, Brandon Weeden makes 3 mistakes. That's a 15 point swing based solely on mistakes. Why not just forfeit the game if you're going to play like that.
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I don't remember anyone jumping up for joy when cundiff was signed this year. he is an average kicker. do you feel comfortable him kicking at 45+ yards out?
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How many OG, ILB, WR and CB do we need?! Also, do we really need a kicker? Cundiff's done ok as far as I can see. Also, are you assuming we're not resigning alex mack?
I agree CLE needs a new kicker. Cundiff's a ticking time bomb. Anyway, I'd draft Carlos Hyde w/ the 1st pick and the BQBA with the 2nd pick (Hundley? Manziel? Mariota?)
I'm not sold on any QB enough to spend a first on them.
Assuming that Junior Sammy Watkins (WR) declares, I am hopeful that either he or Anthony Barr (OLB) are still on the board come time for our first pick. I doubt both will be, but if they are, then I draft Watkins. Sammy is an instant 1B to Gordon's 1A... and will push Josh for the 1A.
Come time for our 2nd First round pick I'm open to tabbing an OG. Either Richardson (Baylor) or Martin (ND) should be there. I actually like Martin better, even though he's playing LT on the ND line. I think our interior O-line is a major area of concern. Either of the above are instant starters and add depth from the top.
Note: Franchise Mack for a year and hope progress is enough to convince him to stay.
Round 2 and beyond are becoming nightmares for me as many of my early season favs for the mid-rounds (3 to 5) have risen all the way to the 2nd. Anyway mid-rounders include:
- AJ McCarron (QB) - easy pick in the 3rd, but now he's projected as a 2nd rounder.
- Jason Abbrederis (WR-Wis) - love this kid as our new "possession WR"; started out as a 4th, now a 2/3
- James White (RB-Wis) - still a third; nice hybrid back ala Ray Rice
More later...
Anyway, I'd draft Carlos Hyde w/ the 1st pick ...
Hyde with our first First? Koala humor?
It's draft's like yours that got us in the mess we are today.
Like whose? There have been a couple listed in the thread.
We're at the top of the league in sacks given up. Our run blocking is terrible, no disgraceful !
As LBC pointed out these are points that support drafting O-line...
Our defense is fine.
No it's not... our LBs have proved to be inadequate and that's a situation that is intolerable in a 3-4.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I'm not sold on any QB enough to spend a first on them.
Assuming that Junior Sammy Watkins (WR) declares, I am hopeful that either he or Anthony Barr (OLB) are still on the board come time for our first pick. I doubt both will be, but if they are, then I draft Watkins. Sammy is an instant 1B to Gordon's 1A... and will push Josh for the 1A.
Come time for our 2nd First round pick I'm open to tabbing an OG. Either Richardson (Baylor) or Martin (ND) should be there. I actually like Martin better, even though he's playing LT on the ND line. I think our interior O-line is a major area of concern. Either of the above are instant starters and add depth from the top.
Note: Franchise Mack for a year and hope progress is enough to convince him to stay.
Round 2 and beyond are becoming nightmares for me as many of my early season favs for the mid-rounds (3 to 5) have risen all the way to the 2nd. Anyway mid-rounders include:
- AJ McCarron (QB) - easy pick in the 3rd, but now he's projected as a 2nd rounder.
- Jason Abbrederis (WR-Wis) - love this kid as our new "possession WR"; started out as a 4th, now a 2/3
- James White (RB-Wis) - still a third; nice hybrid back ala Ray Rice
More later...
Anyway, I'd draft Carlos Hyde w/ the 1st pick ...
Hyde with our first First? Koala humor?
It's draft's like yours that got us in the mess we are today.
Like whose? There have been a couple listed in the thread.
We're at the top of the league in sacks given up. Our run blocking is terrible, no disgraceful !
As LBC pointed out these are points that support drafting O-line...
Our defense is fine.
No it's not... our LBs have proved to be inadequate and that's a situation that is intolerable in a 3-4.
I'm not sold on any QB enough to spend a first on them.
Assuming that Junior Sammy Watkins (WR) declares, I am hopeful that either he or Anthony Barr (OLB) are still on the board come time for our first pick. I doubt both will be, but if they are, then I draft Watkins. Sammy is an instant 1B to Gordon's 1A... and will push Josh for the 1A.
Come time for our 2nd First round pick I'm open to tabbing an OG. Either Richardson (Baylor) or Martin (ND) should be there. I actually like Martin better, even though he's playing LT on the ND line. I think our interior O-line is a major area of concern. Either of the above are instant starters and add depth from the top.
Note: Franchise Mack for a year and hope progress is enough to convince him to stay.
Round 2 and beyond are becoming nightmares for me as many of my early season favs for the mid-rounds (3 to 5) have risen all the way to the 2nd. Anyway mid-rounders include:
- AJ McCarron (QB) - easy pick in the 3rd, but now he's projected as a 2nd rounder.
- Jason Abbrederis (WR-Wis) - love this kid as our new "possession WR"; started out as a 4th, now a 2/3
- James White (RB-Wis) - still a third; nice hybrid back ala Ray Rice
More later...
Hyde with our first First? Koala humor?
He's the best RB, don't you think?
Fantasy League Updates Weak SexStarted by Zombo, Today, 09:10 AM @slowburn said:okay, bazooka, you win. r u fucking happy now? u got the last word. btw, your avatar and board name really grate my nerves for some reason.. http://thumbpress.com/best-of-surprised-koala-bear-meme-25-pics/ -
who wants a kicker next year. Who felt we might of got the FG in the game today?
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At first I thought we were almost there. But, with each passing game and as the losing streak continues to extend the list needed to fix this team grows longer and longer. At this rate by the time the draft comes around I'm not sure anyone will be safe, we may need a whole new team. This team has really, really let me down. Time to burn one and forget about this game with a nice game of Madden, the only place the Browns ever win...
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Please look at my list that people laughed about.
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It's draft's like yours that got us in the mess we are today. I'm not knocking your opinion or anything bro, but we have 3 positions on our line that are either first or second round picks. The two most important, LT and Guard, are first rounders. It's fine that our guards are later rounds because Mack doubles down a lot and hides their weaknesses. When was the last time a lineman won Super Bowl MVP?
We're at the top of the league in sacks given up. Our run blocking is terrible, no disgraceful ! We need to after skill positions, people that touch the ball on almost every play. QB, WR, RB in that order with the top 3 picks....no messing around Cleveland! You need a quarterback, draft one with the first pick. Look what Gordon can do with three different starting qb's ? He's a beast!
You win games by scoring early and often. If it's down to the last possession and your team is down, you need the offensive weapons to move down the field and score. Many games come down to this situation and usually the offense either drives and scores, or the offense beats itself. Cleveland's offense needs those skill players to put points on the board. We get a holding call on first down - drive ends. We get flagged on illegal procedure on third and shorty to make it third and long - drive ends. We get a personal foul on any down - drive ends. We ALWAYS beat ourselves.
Our defense is fine. Fill out positions of need in the later rounds but I don't see us going anything less than Offense, Offense, Offense with our first three pics at a minimum, and not lineman at that, skill positions that defenses game plan for and lose sleep over.
It's draft's like yours that got us in the mess we are today. I'm not knocking your opinion or anything bro, but we have 3 positions on our line that are either first or second round picks. The two most important, LT and Guard, are first rounders. It's fine that our guards are later rounds because Mack doubles down a lot and hides their weaknesses. When was the last time a lineman won Super Bowl MVP?
We're at the top of the league in sacks given up. Our run blocking is terrible, no disgraceful ! We need to after skill positions, people that touch the ball on almost every play. QB, WR, RB in that order with the top 3 picks....no messing around Cleveland! You need a quarterback, draft one with the first pick. Look what Gordon can do with three different starting qb's ? He's a beast!
You win games by scoring early and often. If it's down to the last possession and your team is down, you need the offensive weapons to move down the field and score. Many games come down to this situation and usually the offense either drives and scores, or the offense beats itself. Cleveland's offense needs those skill players to put points on the board. We get a holding call on first down - drive ends. We get flagged on illegal procedure on third and shorty to make it third and long - drive ends. We get a personal foul on any down - drive ends. We ALWAYS beat ourselves.
Our defense is fine. Fill out positions of need in the later rounds but I don't see us going anything less than Offense, Offense, Offense with our first three pics at a minimum, and not lineman at that, skill positions that defenses game plan for and lose sleep over.
you just described why we need OL help in the draft.
re-read your own post and it somehow magically translates to, no pass protection, no run blocking no time for our receivers to get open.
uhhhh.................?????????????????????
i guarantee you whatever FO we have ever for this team always chokes on the 'franchise QB' pick. always.
except couch. you know why he didn't last? BECAUSE WE HAD NO FUCKING OFFENSIVE LINE!!!!!
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With a move to LA
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I live in Long Beach and no way the Browns move to LA. LA does not deserve a football team. Fucking flip flop fans.
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Oh, lord. What a Cleveland draft that would be. Thankfully, not THIS brass.
No, guard isn't our biggest need. We'll be adding Pinkston and Faulk to Greco and Lauvao next year, plus maybe a free agent. We're good there. If anything, I'm concerned that Schwartz really struggles with speed. But that's RT, not like trying to find a franchise QB.
This team is highly competitive whenever we get even competent QB play (and we got way more today). Like 9 or 10 win competitive. If we got a great quarterback and maybe a bellcow running back, I'd say this exact team wins 10-11 games. We obviously don't really have a shortage of people to throw the ball to, but I'm still good with adding a receiver somewhere.
Our defense is playoff caliber and we may have found this year's Tashaun Gipson in Jordan Poyer. He had a terrific game (6 tackles) playing mostly safety. He's a corner by trade, with size. He's moved past Bademosi already.
It's quarterback and then blah-blah-blah. I just don't think there's a shred of doubt about that. We'll upgrade at RB and WR, probably look at a veteran OL, maybe bring in a serious ILB for rotation and competition... but that's not high first round stuff.
Hundley asked for his draft evaluation. I think he's coming out. Puts Carr and Hundley as most likelies.
Man, in games without cracked ribs, Campbell looks damn good. Tough to say I'd sit him for Hoyer. They'll have to compete to see who starts the opener but I bet Josh would prefer Campbell for the long balls.
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I'm not sold on any QB enough to spend a first on them.
Assuming that Junior Sammy Watkins (WR) declares, I am hopeful that either he or Anthony Barr (OLB) are still on the board come time for our first pick. I doubt both will be, but if they are, then I draft Watkins. Sammy is an instant 1B to Gordon's 1A... and will push Josh for the 1A.
Come time for our 2nd First round pick I'm open to tabbing an OG. Either Richardson (Baylor) or Martin (ND) should be there. I actually like Martin better, even though he's playing LT on the ND line. I think our interior O-line is a major area of concern. Either of the above are instant starters and add depth from the top.
Note: Franchise Mack for a year and hope progress is enough to convince him to stay.
Round 2 and beyond are becoming nightmares for me as many of my early season favs for the mid-rounds (3 to 5) have risen all the way to the 2nd. Anyway mid-rounders include:
- AJ McCarron (QB) - easy pick in the 3rd, but now he's projected as a 2nd rounder.
- Jason Abbrederis (WR-Wis) - love this kid as our new "possession WR"; started out as a 4th, now a 2/3
- James White (RB-Wis) - still a third; nice hybrid back ala Ray Rice
More later...
Hyde with our first First? Koala humor?
He's the best RB, don't you think?
(Hyde's) the best RB, don't you think?
I'm not sure. He well may be the best collegiate RB. But even if he is, that does not mean he projects to be being the best NFL RB prospect.
Oh, lord. What a Cleveland draft that would be. Thankfully, not THIS brass.
No, guard isn't our biggest need. We'll be adding Pinkston and Faulk to Greco and Lauvao next year, plus maybe a free agent. We're good there. If anything, I'm concerned that Schwartz really struggles with speed. But that's RT, not like trying to find a franchise QB.
This team is highly competitive whenever we get even competent QB play (and we got way more today). Like 9 or 10 win competitive. If we got a great quarterback and maybe a bellcow running back, I'd say this exact team wins 10-11 games. We obviously don't really have a shortage of people to throw the ball to, but I'm still good with adding a receiver somewhere.
Never said OG was our biggest need. My "draft" is about players I like being available at times we are likely to have picks. In case you missed it, my high 1st rounder was either Watkins or Barr. Our second #1, the one where I tabbed an OG, should be around #27 overall. That's a late 1st round pick.
Again... I'll say very clearly that I do not see a 1st round worthy QB in the draft. Additionally given Campbell's healthy performances in addition to the glimpse at Hoyer potential, I do not see an urgent QB need. But even if I saw need at QB, no amount of it will make me see talent in the draft that is not there.
Any top ten pick should be ready to start game one year one. If the degree of QB talent you see yields us merely one added win one or more years down the line, I think you are either seriously underestimating the value of our top pick or overvaluing the QB talent in the draft or both.
We agree that Schwartz has a weakness. A recovered Chris Faulk, who played both LT and RT at LSU, is as likely to be the Schwartz upgrade as he is an OG. Either of the OG prospects I tabbed are instant starters in our line.
We still have 5 months of this back and forth before we find out who is more in tune with our FO.
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After seeing yesterday's game I believe a High High priority should be an inside linebacker that can really cover. The one guy that perhaps hurt the Browns most was the Pats back out of the backfield....Vereen I think got like 12 catches for nearly 150 yards....because DQJ and Robertson cannot cover.
Because I am familiar with him being an Ohio State fan, I would be knocking myself out to get Ryan Shazier.....though, perhaps any one of you may have an idea if there is a better cover ILB in this draft?
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