More gun stuff
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Here's a thought exercise -
Carlos Boozer's first child had sickle-cell anemia. He and his wife wanted to ensure that their second child did not.
They didn't want an abortion for their first child, it never was an option. For their second child, they used in vitro fertilization, which required the fertilization of ~20 ova. Only a few of these embryo did not express the sickle-cell trait, those which did were destroyed. Would you consider Carlos Boozer a mass murderer?
Also, how do you feel about in vitro fertilization?
Explain your comparison. In vitro is sort of an anti abortion. Science using their powers for good and not evil.
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Also, how do you feel about in vitro fertilization?
Explain your comparison. In vitro is sort of an anti abortion. Science using their powers for good and not evil.
Explain your comparison. In vitro is sort of an anti abortion. Science using their powers for good and not evil.
I edited my post above. And you really are showing that you have no idea how IVF works. If you have time, please watch the video. It's from ESPN's Outside the Lines and it's a great example of the dynamic of medical ethics.
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Here's a thought exercise -
Carlos Boozer's first child had sickle-cell anemia. He and his wife wanted to ensure that their second child did not.
They didn't want an abortion for their first child, it never was an option. For their second child, they used in vitro fertilization, which required the fertilization of ~20 ova. Only a few of these embryo did not express the sickle-cell trait, those which did were destroyed. Would you consider Carlos Boozer a mass murderer?
Here's a thought exercise -
Carlos Boozer's first child had sickle-cell anemia. He and his wife wanted to ensure that their second child did not.
They didn't want an abortion for their first child, it never was an option. For their second child, they used in vitro fertilization, which required the fertilization of ~20 ova. Only a few of these embryo did not express the sickle-cell trait, those which did were destroyed. Would you consider Carlos Boozer a mass murderer?
Sort of, yes. I can't agree with them destroying embryos to prevent sickle cell which is a disease that can be lived with
Early man walked away as modern man took control. Their minds weren't all the same and to conquer was their goal. So He built his great empires and he slaughtered his own kind, and he died a confused man and killed himself in his own mind... -
Explain your comparison. In vitro is sort of an anti abortion. Science using their powers for good and not evil.
I edited my post above. And you really are showing that you have no idea how IVF works. If you have time, please watch the video. It's from ESPN's Outside the Lines and it's a great example of the dynamic of medical ethics.
I edited my post above. And you really are showing that you have no idea how IVF works.
I've no reason to. I've never had to go the IVF route. So everybody should know everything in your world? My understanding of IVF is that its primarily used to help couples who can't conceive naturally have children. That is at least a noble cause. Abortion somewhat less so
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Here's a thought exercise -
Carlos Boozer's first child had sickle-cell anemia. He and his wife wanted to ensure that their second child did not.
They didn't want an abortion for their first child, it never was an option. For their second child, they used in vitro fertilization, which required the fertilization of ~20 ova. Only a few of these embryo did not express the sickle-cell trait, those which did were destroyed. Would you consider Carlos Boozer a mass murderer?
Sort of, yes. I can't agree with them destroying embryos to prevent sickle cell which is a disease that can be lived with
Sort of, yes. I can't agree with them destroying embryos to prevent sickle cell which is a disease that can be lived with
The median life expectancy for sickle cell is in the 40's. Those with sickle cell are significantly more susceptible to stroke, penile infarction, spontaneous abortions, ulcers, renal failure, and many more symptoms that would make life hell. To deal with these symptoms is going to require a lifetime of close medical attention. That's a huge financial burden that many people are not willing nor able to take on. If I have a low/middle-class income, I'm very much considering an abortion in this case.
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70's with medical advances I just looked it up
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70's with medical advances I just looked it up
70's with medical advances I just looked it up
The mean is in the 40's, I said median in the above post
Source:http://www.sicklecelldisease.org/index.cfm?page=faq
You can live up to your 70s, but it's not the majority of cases. Not yet, anyways.
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Anyway abortion for medical reasons is substantially different than abortion because you just don't want the child.
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We've had this argument before and my opinion of elective abortion has failed to change
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Jonathan Swift.
Yummy, but no.
So using your chicken example abortion should be legal years after birth? Fine with me. There are a lot of kids I would like to get rid of.
WSS
If you think that a two year old is less sentient than a chicken, you're just being obtuse.
Are the mentally Retarded sentient? Florida could use some clarification, so they can enact a death penalty
Yes, they are sentient. Even people with trisomy 21 have more self-awareness than a chicken.
Nice try fellas. I take it all of you are against pulling the plug on someone who's braindead?
Hey it was your own dip shit example....Yummy, but no.
If you think that a two year old is less sentient than a chicken, you're just being obtuse.
?
Make it a one day old if you'd rather.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
Let's ask this. Would you rather have sickle cell or never get the chance to live at all?
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Yeah, we disagree there. I just don't get the vitriol that's directed at women in college who opt for an abortion. When the options are dropping out of college with student loan debt, no degree, likely single, and a second mouth to feed, I really can't see why people would be angry that they choose abortion. Those who choose to give birth are going to be stuck in the lower class for the rest of their life, likely living off all sorts of social services. I don't really think that's the best thing for society.
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Why aren't those women on free birth control pills? They're pretty efficient at preventing pregnancy in the first place
Early man walked away as modern man took control. Their minds weren't all the same and to conquer was their goal. So He built his great empires and he slaughtered his own kind, and he died a confused man and killed himself in his own mind... -
Yeah, we disagree there. I just don't get the vitriol that's directed at women in college who opt for an abortion. When the options are dropping out of college with student loan debt, no degree, likely single, and a second mouth to feed, I really can't see why people would be angry that they choose abortion. Those who choose to give birth are going to be stuck in the lower class for the rest of their life, likely living off all sorts of social services. I don't really think that's the best thing for society.
Yeah, we disagree there. I just don't get the vitriol that's directed at women in college who opt for an abortion. When the options are dropping out of college with student loan debt, no degree, likely single, and a second mouth to feed, I really can't see why people would be angry that they choose abortion. Those who choose to give birth are going to be stuck in the lower class for the rest of their life, likely living off all sorts of social services. I don't really think that's the best thing for society.
OK. Now we are beginning to be on the same page. Cost to society, I understand that. So let's go back to my facetious argument of a few years ago... Let's sterilize the poor!
problem solved.
WSS
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Hey it was your own dip shit example....Yummy, but no.
If you think that a two year old is less sentient than a chicken, you're just being obtuse.
?
Make it a one day old if you'd rather.
WSS
Hey it was your own dip shit example....
WSS
And you were the only one suggesting that because I'm okay with killing chickens, I'm okay with killing kids. Dipshit
Let's ask this. Would you rather have sickle cell or never get the chance to live at all?
I can't really answer that, I haven't had much exposure to sickle cell. I've been lucky enough to have hit the genetic lottery. Some of the people I've seen who come to free clinics for all their healthcare needs, really heartbreaking stuff - I can tell you that I'd much rather be spared existence than to experience life through their eyes. That being said, those folks need all the help they can get, and I'm happy to oblige.
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Hey it was your own dip shit example....
WSS
And you were the only one suggesting that because I'm okay with killing chickens, I'm okay with killing kids. Dipshit
Let's ask this. Would you rather have sickle cell or never get the chance to live at all?
I can't really answer that, I haven't had much exposure to sickle cell. I've been lucky enough to have hit the genetic lottery. Some of the people I've seen who come to free clinics for all their healthcare needs, really heartbreaking stuff - I can tell you that I'd much rather be spared existence than to experience life through their eyes. That being said, those folks need all the help they can get, and I'm happy to oblige.
And you were the only one suggesting that because I'm okay with killing chickens, I'm okay with killing kids. Dipshit
I can't really answer that, I haven't had much exposure to sickle cell. I've been lucky enough to have hit the genetic lottery. Some of the people I've seen who come to free clinics for all their healthcare needs, really heartbreaking stuff - I can tell you that I'd much rather be spared existence than to experience life through their eyes. That being said, those folks need all the help they can get, and I'm happy to oblige.
Really? You'd rather never experience love, sex, happiness because you may or may not contract a debilitating disease? I wouldn't choose to have missed out on life for any reason
Early man walked away as modern man took control. Their minds weren't all the same and to conquer was their goal. So He built his great empires and he slaughtered his own kind, and he died a confused man and killed himself in his own mind... -
And you were the only one suggesting that because I'm okay with killing chickens, I'm okay with killing kids. Dipshit
I can't really answer that, I haven't had much exposure to sickle cell. I've been lucky enough to have hit the genetic lottery. Some of the people I've seen who come to free clinics for all their healthcare needs, really heartbreaking stuff - I can tell you that I'd much rather be spared existence than to experience life through their eyes. That being said, those folks need all the help they can get, and I'm happy to oblige.
Really? You'd rather never experience love, sex, happiness because you may or may not contract a debilitating disease? I wouldn't choose to have missed out on life for any reason
Really? You'd rather never experience love, sex, happiness because you may or may not contract a debilitating disease? I wouldn't choose to have missed out on life for any reason
I give Cysko the points on this one. There are an awful lot of miserable people in the world probably least of which in the United States, but still relatively few suicides. And suicide is pretty fucking easy to pull off. Most people, I think would choose to live once here.
WSS
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Why aren't those women on free birth control pills? They're pretty efficient at preventing pregnancy in the first place
Why aren't those women on free birth control pills? They're pretty efficient at preventing pregnancy in the first place
In some cases, idiocy, but that hardly seems like a sufficient reason to stick them with that lot in life.
Personally, I think that 95% of people are poorly educated on the efficacy of birth control, and they rely too heavily on a single method. Most birth control methods have a 5-20% failure rate (ie. they result in pregnancy) over the course of a year. If you really want to use birth control effectively, options should be combined. If she's not on the pill, and you're only using a condom, you'd best pull out. With the exception of IUDs, using only one form of birth control is just asking for a kid, imo. Until people start realizing this, there are going to be lots of surprises.
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Why aren't those women on free birth control pills? They're pretty efficient at preventing pregnancy in the first place
In some cases, idiocy, but that hardly seems like a sufficient reason to stick them with that lot in life.
Personally, I think that 95% of people are poorly educated on the efficacy of birth control, and they rely too heavily on a single method. Most birth control methods have a 5-20% failure rate (ie. they result in pregnancy) over the course of a year. If you really want to use birth control effectively, options should be combined. If she's not on the pill, and you're only using a condom, you'd best pull out. With the exception of IUDs, using only one form of birth control is just asking for a kid, imo. Until people start realizing this, there are going to be lots of surprises.
In some cases, idiocy, but that hardly seems like a sufficient reason to stick them with that lot in life.
Personally, I think that 95% of people are poorly educated on the efficacy of birth control, and they rely too heavily on a single method. Most birth control methods have a 5-20% failure rate (ie. they result in pregnancy) over the course of a year. If you really want to use birth control effectively, options should be combined. If she's not on the pill, and you're only using a condom, you'd best pull out. With the exception of IUDs, using only one form of birth control is just asking for a kid, imo. Until people start realizing this, there are going to be lots of surprises.
The good lady has a copper implant which we use as the single method.
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Why aren't those women on free birth control pills? They're pretty efficient at preventing pregnancy in the first place
In some cases, idiocy, but that hardly seems like a sufficient reason to stick them with that lot in life.
Personally, I think that 95% of people are poorly educated on the efficacy of birth control, and they rely too heavily on a single method. Most birth control methods have a 5-20% failure rate (ie. they result in pregnancy) over the course of a year. If you really want to use birth control effectively, options should be combined. If she's not on the pill, and you're only using a condom, you'd best pull out. With the exception of IUDs, using only one form of birth control is just asking for a kid, imo. Until people start realizing this, there are going to be lots of surprises.
In some cases, idiocy, but that hardly seems like a sufficient reason to stick them with that lot in life.
Personally, I think that 95% of people are poorly educated on the efficacy of birth control, and they rely too heavily on a single method. Most birth control methods have a 5-20% failure rate (ie. they result in pregnancy) over the course of a year. If you really want to use birth control effectively, options should be combined. If she's not on the pill, and you're only using a condom, you'd best pull out. With the exception of IUDs, using only one form of birth control is just asking for a kid, imo. Until people start realizing this, there are going to be lots of surprises.
I'm all for education in preventing a cruel and morally reprehensible practice
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