Y'all smell that?
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just goes to show you how young you are. obviously you know squadoosh about the HISTORY of the cleveland browns. what are you 16? no way the NFL would ever think about moving this team EVER again. so stop your shit.
i'm 36...and no I won't stop cause I think there's a smidgen of truth to it. The NFL wants to expand and it may need to cull teams from small markets that aren't doing well and don't show signs of ever doing well. I would think Cleveland at this point in time would qualify for this. The NFL has big plans to expand overseas, here the market is saturated...football is god and it's great and everything, but it's not gonna grow much more cause like I said already god. But overseas people don't get it and that bugs the shit out of the NFL....why else do they continue to play games in London when it's only americans showing up to watch? Why do they keep talking about a team in Toronto when clearly Canadians as a whole could give a flying fuck about football when Hockey takes up 9 months of their lives every year. Beleive me I would love to think that the Browns are sacrosanct but i'm not naive enough anymore to think that given the right circumstances, meaning the right money is on teh table, a bunch of franchises could be uprooted.
i'm 36...and no I won't stop cause I think there's a smidgen of truth to it. The NFL wants to expand and it may need to cull teams from small markets that aren't doing well and don't show signs of ever doing well.
You don't get it. "Doing well" to the NFL mean not making enough money. Not selling out. It has nothing to do with the size of the town or the record on the field. Teams that are not doing well by NFL standards would be teams like Oakland or Jax. Not Cleveland.
I would think Cleveland at this point in time would qualify for this. The NFL has big plans to expand overseas, here the market is saturated...football is god and it's great and everything, but it's not gonna grow much more cause like I said already god. But overseas people don't get it and that bugs the shit out of the NFL....why else do they continue to play games in London when it's only americans showing up to watch? Why do they keep talking about a team in Toronto when clearly Canadians as a whole could give a flying fuck about football when Hockey takes up 9 months of their lives every year. Beleive me I would love to think that the Browns are sacrosanct but i'm not naive enough anymore to think that given the right circumstances, meaning the right money is on teh table, a bunch of franchises could be uprooted.
One or two could be. And Oakland is making noise about moving back to LA. As for the US being saturated? Not true. The US could easily support 4 more franchises...if the Raiders stayed in Oakland you could put expansion teams in LA, San Antonio/Austin, Portland, Salt Lake City. Here is the Nielsen DMA by which they would go by:
http://www.tvb.org/media/file/TVB_Market_Profiles_Nielsen_TVHH_DMA_Ranks_2013-2014.pdf
They would probably on pick 2 of those...and yes would probably cream their jeans over the thought of Toronto or London UK...
but they ain't leaving Cleveland, which is one of the Top 20 DMAs.
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Here's your numbers guy- just forget about the Browns ever being moved again- at least in your lifetime. Any teams getting moved- it's the Raiders, Jacksonville, or the Chargers (Mark-O would tell you the Chargers lease is up and they're in no compunction to stay in SD if they want to move). The Browns are in the top 1\2 (despite 14 years of suckage) in attendance, both home and away. If you just went by pure numbers I can make a case it's more likely to move the Steelers out of Pittsburgh.
wow, pgh's really 30th in the league on that list? wut? and you go back a couple years, when they were playing very very good football...they're still not better than the mid 20's. Anyway, it's good news....i certainly knew we had one of the better attendance records in the NFL. But I'm still wondering how much we're worth to the NFL. I know the team makes good gate obviously. I just wonder where we are brand wise. I hate to say it but I would think the Steelers are a much more valuable "brand" to the NFL than we are currently.
wow, pgh's really 30th in the league on that list? wut? and you go back a couple years, when they were playing very very good football...they're still not better than the mid 20's. Anyway, it's good news....i certainly knew we had one of the better attendance records in the NFL. But I'm still wondering how much we're worth to the NFL. I know the team makes good gate obviously. I just wonder where we are brand wise. I hate to say it but I would think the Steelers are a much more valuable "brand" to the NFL than we are currently.
The Steelers are 30th because they play in one of the 3 smallest stadiums in the NFL. They could have built more seats when they built PNC, but they didn't want to so that the demand for their tickets stayed high.
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wow, pgh's really 30th in the league on that list? wut? and you go back a couple years, when they were playing very very good football...they're still not better than the mid 20's. Anyway, it's good news....i certainly knew we had one of the better attendance records in the NFL. But I'm still wondering how much we're worth to the NFL. I know the team makes good gate obviously. I just wonder where we are brand wise. I hate to say it but I would think the Steelers are a much more valuable "brand" to the NFL than we are currently.
The Steelers are 30th because they play in one of the 3 smallest stadiums in the NFL. They could have built more seats when they built PNC, but they didn't want to so that the demand for their tickets stayed high.
The Steelers are 30th because they play in one of the 3 smallest stadiums in the NFL. They could have built more seats when they built PNC, but they didn't want to so that the demand for their tickets stayed high.
ahh, they're listing at as raw numbers and not percentage of seats filled. Makes sense I guess.
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The Steelers are 30th because they play in one of the 3 smallest stadiums in the NFL. They could have built more seats when they built PNC, but they didn't want to so that the demand for their tickets stayed high.
ahh, they're listing at as raw numbers and not percentage of seats filled. Makes sense I guess.
what they should have done was compare incomes. Thats all that really matters if u think about it.ahh, they're listing at as raw numbers and not percentage of seats filled. Makes sense I guess.
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what they should have done was compare incomes. Thats all that really matters if u think about it.ahh, they're listing at as raw numbers and not percentage of seats filled. Makes sense I guess.
XxDaBuckeyexX said:
what they should have done was compare incomes. Thats all that really matters if u think about it.
well in some ways that "could" skew the facts. I have no idea what shittspuke ticket prices are but if they're substantially higher than Cleveland than they could theoretically pull in as much gate as the Browns do with lesser attendance. I'm pretty sure merchandise wise the steelers do significantly better than the Browns. I don't where the Browns are ranked but Shittspuke is 9th in team merchanidse. That can't be all pgh people.
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what they should have done was compare incomes. Thats all that really matters if u think about it.ahh, they're listing at as raw numbers and not percentage of seats filled. Makes sense I guess.
XxDaBuckeyexX said:
what they should have done was compare incomes. Thats all that really matters if u think about it.
Most NFL teams are privately held businesses not public....except for the Packers, and they will by NO means ever disclose their income/loss/profit figures.
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I don't where the Browns are ranked but Shittspuke is 9th in team merchanidse. That can't be all pgh people
FRAKS.
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XxDaBuckeyexX said:
what they should have done was compare incomes. Thats all that really matters if u think about it.
well in some ways that "could" skew the facts. I have no idea what shittspuke ticket prices are but if they're substantially higher than Cleveland than they could theoretically pull in as much gate as the Browns do with lesser attendance. I'm pretty sure merchandise wise the steelers do significantly better than the Browns. I don't where the Browns are ranked but Shittspuke is 9th in team merchanidse. That can't be all pgh people.
who cares? Its all about the mighty dollar in the end.well in some ways that "could" skew the facts. I have no idea what shittspuke ticket prices are but if they're substantially higher than Cleveland than they could theoretically pull in as much gate as the Browns do with lesser attendance. I'm pretty sure merchandise wise the steelers do significantly better than the Browns. I don't where the Browns are ranked but Shittspuke is 9th in team merchanidse. That can't be all pgh people.
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XxDaBuckeyexX said:
what they should have done was compare incomes. Thats all that really matters if u think about it.
Most NFL teams are privately held businesses not public....except for the Packers, and they will by NO means ever disclose their income/loss/profit figures.
did not know this though...Most NFL teams are privately held businesses not public....except for the Packers, and they will by NO means ever disclose their income/loss/profit figures.
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Here is the rank of the Nielsen DMAs (Designated Market Areas) as of 1/1/2014 for each NFL team:
1. Giants/Jets NYC
3. Bears...Chicago
4. Eagles...Philly
5. Cowboys...Dallas/Ft. Worth
6. 49ers/Raiders...San Fran/San Jose/Oak.
7. Patriots... Boston/Manchester
8. Redskins...Washington D.C
9. Falcons...Atlanta
10. Texans...Houston
11. Lions...Detroit
12. Cardinals...Phoenix/Prescott
13. Seahawks...Seatlle/Tacoma
14. Buccaneers...Tampa/St. Pete/Sarasota
15. Vikings...Minneapolis/St. Paul
16. Dolphins...Miami/Ft. Lauderdale
17. Broncos...Denver
19. Browns...Cleveland/Akron/Canton
21. Rams...St. Louis
23. Steelers...Pittsburgh
25. Panthers...Charlotte
26. Colts...Indianapolis
27. Ravens...Baltimore
28. Chargers...San Diego
29. Titans...Nashville
31. Chiefs...Kansas City
35. Bengals...Cincinnati
48. Jaguars...Jacksonville
51. Saints...New Orleans
52. Bills...Buffalo
70. Packers...Green Bay
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Here is the DMA rank of various cities that do not have NFL teams:
2. Los Angeles....bigger than 29 other NFL markets
18. Orlando/Daytona...bigger than 14 other NFL Markets
20. Sacramento...bigger than 13 other NFL Markets
22. Portland...bigger than 12 other NFL Markets
24. Raleigh/Durham...bigger than 11 other NFL markets
30. Hartford/New Haven...bigger than 6 other NFL markets
32. Columbus...bigger than 5 other NFL markets (including Cinci)
33. Salt Lake City...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
34. Milwaukee...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
36. San Antonio...Bigger than 4 other NFL markets
37. Greenville/Spartanburgh...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
38. West Palm Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
39. Grand Rapids/Kalamazoo/Battle Creek...bigger that 4 other NFL markets
40. Austin...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
41. Oklahoma City...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
42. Las Vegas...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
43. Harrisburg...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
44. Birmingham...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
45. Norfolk/Va. Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
46. Greensboro/High Pt....bigger than 4 other NFL markets
47. Albequerque/Santa Fe...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
49. Louisville...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
50. Memphis...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
And all of the following are bigger than the Green Bay/Appleton DMA:
Providence
Wilkes Barre/Scranton
Fresno
Little Rock
Richmond
Albany
Mobile/Pensacola
Tulsa
Knoxville
Dayton
Charleston W. Va.
Roanoake/Lynchburg
Wichita
Flint
Honolulu
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Stoolers were ranked 28th at 88.2% capacity, they also set record lows in individual games over the past 2 seasons... lowest ever in 2012 against the Browns and second lowest last year.
Try 15 years of losing football Pittspuke.. Browns fans are the most loyal there is Steelers fans are Fraks.
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Here is the DMA rank of various cities that do not have NFL teams:
2. Los Angeles....bigger than 29 other NFL markets
18. Orlando/Daytona...bigger than 14 other NFL Markets
20. Sacramento...bigger than 13 other NFL Markets
22. Portland...bigger than 12 other NFL Markets
24. Raleigh/Durham...bigger than 11 other NFL markets
30. Hartford/New Haven...bigger than 6 other NFL markets
32. Columbus...bigger than 5 other NFL markets (including Cinci)
33. Salt Lake City...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
34. Milwaukee...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
36. San Antonio...Bigger than 4 other NFL markets
37. Greenville/Spartanburgh...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
38. West Palm Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
39. Grand Rapids/Kalamazoo/Battle Creek...bigger that 4 other NFL markets
40. Austin...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
41. Oklahoma City...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
42. Las Vegas...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
43. Harrisburg...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
44. Birmingham...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
45. Norfolk/Va. Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
46. Greensboro/High Pt....bigger than 4 other NFL markets
47. Albequerque/Santa Fe...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
49. Louisville...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
50. Memphis...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
And all of the following are bigger than the Green Bay/Appleton DMA:
Providence
Wilkes Barre/Scranton
Fresno
Little Rock
Richmond
Albany
Mobile/Pensacola
Tulsa
Knoxville
Dayton
Charleston W. Va.
Roanoake/Lynchburg
Wichita
Flint
Honolulu
Here is the DMA rank of various cities that do not have NFL teams:
2. Los Angeles....bigger than 29 other NFL markets
18. Orlando/Daytona...bigger than 14 other NFL Markets
20. Sacramento...bigger than 13 other NFL Markets
22. Portland...bigger than 12 other NFL Markets
24. Raleigh/Durham...bigger than 11 other NFL markets
30. Hartford/New Haven...bigger than 6 other NFL markets
32. Columbus...bigger than 5 other NFL markets (including Cinci)
33. Salt Lake City...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
34. Milwaukee...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
36. San Antonio...Bigger than 4 other NFL markets
37. Greenville/Spartanburgh...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
38. West Palm Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
39. Grand Rapids/Kalamazoo/Battle Creek...bigger that 4 other NFL markets
40. Austin...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
41. Oklahoma City...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
42. Las Vegas...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
43. Harrisburg...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
44. Birmingham...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
45. Norfolk/Va. Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
46. Greensboro/High Pt....bigger than 4 other NFL markets
47. Albequerque/Santa Fe...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
49. Louisville...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
50. Memphis...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
Dayton
Yes, but Gip. A lot of those smaller markets overlap a bigger one. You have the Carolina Panthers, not the Charlotte Panthers, and the Tennessee Titans, not the Nashville Titans. Think of the NFL's 75 mile blackout rule. Dayton is considered part of Cinci's market, so the Browns are always preempted by those damn Bungles- though Columbus is not. Toledo and Ann Arbor are part of the Detroit market. Baltimore and Washington DC's markets overlap.
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Here is the DMA rank of various cities that do not have NFL teams:
2. Los Angeles....bigger than 29 other NFL markets
18. Orlando/Daytona...bigger than 14 other NFL Markets
20. Sacramento...bigger than 13 other NFL Markets
22. Portland...bigger than 12 other NFL Markets
24. Raleigh/Durham...bigger than 11 other NFL markets
30. Hartford/New Haven...bigger than 6 other NFL markets
32. Columbus...bigger than 5 other NFL markets (including Cinci)
33. Salt Lake City...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
34. Milwaukee...bigger than 5 other NFL markets
36. San Antonio...Bigger than 4 other NFL markets
37. Greenville/Spartanburgh...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
38. West Palm Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
39. Grand Rapids/Kalamazoo/Battle Creek...bigger that 4 other NFL markets
40. Austin...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
41. Oklahoma City...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
42. Las Vegas...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
43. Harrisburg...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
44. Birmingham...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
45. Norfolk/Va. Beach...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
46. Greensboro/High Pt....bigger than 4 other NFL markets
47. Albequerque/Santa Fe...bigger than 4 other NFL markets
49. Louisville...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
50. Memphis...bigger than 3 other NFL markets
Dayton
Yes, but Gip. A lot of those smaller markets overlap a bigger one. You have the Carolina Panthers, not the Charlotte Panthers, and the Tennessee Titans, not the Nashville Titans. Think of the NFL's 75 mile blackout rule. Dayton is considered part of Cinci's market, so the Browns are always preempted by those damn Bungles- though Columbus is not. Toledo and Ann Arbor are part of the Detroit market. Baltimore and Washington DC's markets overlap.
Yes, but Gip. A lot of those smaller markets overlap a bigger one. You have the Carolina Panthers, not the Charlotte Panthers, and the Tennessee Titans, not the Nashville Titans. Think of the NFL's 75 mile blackout rule. Dayton is considered part of Cinci's market, so the Browns are always preempted by those damn Bungles- though Columbus is not. Toledo and Ann Arbor are part of the Detroit market. Baltimore and Washington DC's markets overlap.
Yes, Larry, I know that is all true. If you combined markets that are within that 75 mile radius you would get a different result.
Example: Orlando would be combined with Tampa. As noted, Baltimore and Washington would be combined.
West Palm Beach and Miami. Dayton and Cinci. Toledo and Detroit. Greensboro and Raleigh/Durham (but these would not be within the Charlotte 75 mile radius) Maybe Harrisburg and Philly (though actually, Harrisburg may actually be closer to Baltimore)
Sacramento and the Bay Area possibly. Flint and Detroit.
But, as noted, probably the largest two areas that can be combined that does not already have a team...besides LA... is the San Antonio/Austin area. Combine those two and you have a potential Top 15 marketplace. But Jerry Jones jealousy guards that as his personal territory despite already having the #5 largest market sewn up.
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