Clevedog Mock Draft 1.0 - In Hoyer We Trust
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A little to much home town love for me but nice write up. Please update the blog a little more frequently, some nice reads there.
Thanks a lot, really appreciate that! I'm going to be posting at least one, hopefully 2 articles per week. Trying to get my spring training analysis done by tomorrow or Wednesday for the Tribe. After that back to the Brownies - if you have something you'd like to read hit me up!
I don't see the point of making an OSU homer draft, and that is coming from a very devote OSU fan. Honestly anyone who has watched any game the past two seasons knows this.
1. Shazier is ALWAYS HURT. He is never seriously injured. He always starts games. But every other game he plays he has to miss the 3rd or 4th quarter due to some kind of injury he sustained. On another note, he is NOT a MLB in ANY scheme. He should be a strict OLB in a 4-3, period. He isn't a run stuffer like you claim. He uses his speed to run down guys from the sides and behind. If a lineman gets his hands on Shazier in the run game, Shazier is done for the play unless he chases the guy down 20 yards down field. I wouldn't select him before the end of the 2nd round and thats only for teams running a 4-3.
2. Roby isn't that great. He is a lightning bolt for sure, he makes some big plays, but he lets just as many big plays get made. He got embarassed this year in the Big 10. Not the SEC or Pac 10 who normally produce the top WR talent, but the Big 10. Who was the last 1st round WR from the Big 10 in the past 5 years? Have we had one? Robinson is going to be the first Big 10 WR who has a chance of being selected in the first round in a long time. He is athletically gifted, but he relies on it too much. Like Shazier I don't see him being selected before the end of the 2nd round. If he is there for us in the third I would be more than happy with the pick. I think your back up selection of Desir is a much better option in the beginning of the second round. I put way more stock into production and game film than silly numbers while in shorts. With products that come from small schools and lower divisions, I rely more on the East West Shrine game and the Senior Bowl. Desir shined at the senior bowl against top Div 1 competition.
Now your first pick back ups. Anyone who suggests an offensive linemen is an idiot. At some point we need to start putting money else where. We have the highest paid and most talented LT in the game of football and next season we are going to have one of the best and highest paid Centers in the game of football. Not to mention an early 2nd round pick playing RT. We want to put another 1st round pick on the line. At some point we are going to need to start just grabbing mid to late round linemen and develop then like the successful teams do. Ya most teams have 1, MAYBE 2 first round picks invested in their lines, but 3? Nope. You said better to have your guy two years early, I say better to have him right on time. When Thomas is going to be let go/traded/retire, that is when we draft our future LT. You don't make this move unless you think your gonna trade Thomas this season or next. If the front office is envisioning a 2015-2016 without Thomas, ok, but why now. It makes no sense.
No need for name calling, but ya, I guess throw me in with the idiots too. Thomas is not nearly as dominant as you're making him out to be, and even if he was, this is still not an awful pick - you can re-arrange the cap hit in the offseason by restructuring Thomas' deal or, hopefully not, but trading or releasing him depending how he does this year. Assuming Hoyer does well we'll be owing him a huge contract so this cap space work will be forced anyway. Roby's problems are, in my opinion, mostly from the scheme they ran, as I wrote. I believe he'd be much more effective with good coaching, which he will get on the Browns. He's a freak athlete, as is Shazier, and I think they'll both have good careers in the NFL. Shazier is obviously a more sure bet, hence why he's going to be picked higher.
As for the preparation for Thomas leaving being too early...Shanahan LOVES versatile line and moves linemen often. All of the guys we have now, except Thomas and Mack, have and can currently play multiple positions on the line. That's critical not only from a depth perspective but from heavy iso formations or pull blocking or any of that. On top of that you get the depth and the insurance while solidifying your line and getting two thousand yard rushers or close to it and making the QBs job infinitely easier.
No need for name calling, but ya, I guess throw me in with the idiots too. Thomas is not nearly as dominant as you're making him out to be, and even if he was, this is still not an awful pick - you can re-arrange the cap hit in the offseason by restructuring Thomas' deal or, hopefully not, but trading or releasing him depending how he does this year. Assuming Hoyer does well we'll be owing him a huge contract so this cap space work will be forced anyway. Roby's problems are, in my opinion, mostly from the scheme they ran, as I wrote. I believe he'd be much more effective with good coaching, which he will get on the Browns. He's a freak athlete, as is Shazier, and I think they'll both have good careers in the NFL. Shazier is obviously a more sure bet, hence why he's going to be picked higher.
As for the preparation for Thomas leaving being too early...Shanahan LOVES versatile line and moves linemen often. All of the guys we have now, except Thomas and Mack, have and can currently play multiple positions on the line. That's critical not only from a depth perspective but from heavy iso formations or pull blocking or any of that. On top of that you get the depth and the insurance while solidifying your line and getting two thousand yard rushers or close to it and making the QBs job infinitely easier.
No name calling- but I agree with Harry. It's about a 99.9% certainty the Browns will not draft Robinson, or any other O-lineman at #4. For the Browns, it's a flat out luxury pick they can ill afford to make. I'll grant you Thomas had a slight off year, but that's hardly a good enough reason to go shopping for a replacement in this draft.
As to versatility- at least regarding your left tackle- um, no. Start with Thomas, then Clady, Gross, and any of the other stud LTs and please tell me how "versatile" they are. They play LT for a reason- they have the best skill set for preventing your quarterback from getting killed.
PS, I'm a big OSU homer too, and again I agree with Harry's opinion of the current OSU crop- and I'm siding with Mike H- I liked the idea of Carlos Hyde for the Browns- until we picked up Ben Tate.
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So no one else would want Roby or Shazier at 35 if available? I damn sure would
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XxDaBuckeyexX said:
Im a Buckeye fan who will gladly pass on all Buckeyes in this class.
Agree... But while most I feel are overrated, the interest rise in Mewhort has been surprising and warranted.
No name calling- but I agree with Harry.
PS, I'm a big OSU homer too, and again I agree with Harry's opinion of the current OSU crop- and I'm siding with Mike H- I liked the idea of Carlos Hyde for the Browns- until we picked up Ben Tate.
1. Relatively speaking "idiot" is a term of endearment around here.
2. While Hyde seems to be more agile than I originally thought, I still have him as the 3rd RB in draft behind Mason and now Sankey.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
XxDaBuckeyexX said:
Im a Buckeye fan who will gladly pass on all Buckeyes in this class.
Agree... But while most I feel are overrated, the interest rise in Mewhort has been surprising and warranted.
No name calling- but I agree with Harry.
PS, I'm a big OSU homer too, and again I agree with Harry's opinion of the current OSU crop- and I'm siding with Mike H- I liked the idea of Carlos Hyde for the Browns- until we picked up Ben Tate.
1. Relatively speaking "idiot" is a term of endearment around here.
2. While Hyde seems to be more agile than I originally thought, I still have him as the 3rd RB in draft behind Mason and now Sankey.
Agree... But while most I feel are overrated, the interest rise in Mewhort has been surprising and warrnated.
1. Relatively speaking "idiot" is a term of endearment around here.
2. While Hyde seems to be more agile than I originally thought, I still have him as the 3rd RB in draft behind Mason and now Sankey.
Interesting thing- Mel the Hair touted Kenny Guiton as a late round\developmental prospect. Doubt the Browns will be interested, but someone probably will.
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So no one else would want Roby or Shazier at 35 if available? I damn sure would
I'd take Roby in the 3rd, and we don't need Shazier. As Harry mentioned, always finds a way to get himself dinged, and if he projects as a 4-3 OLB we already have Mingo who's bigger and for all practical purposes just as fast.
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So no one else would want Roby or Shazier at 35 if available? I damn sure would
I'd take Roby in the 3rd, and we don't need Shazier. As Harry mentioned, always finds a way to get himself dinged, and if he projects as a 4-3 OLB we already have Mingo who's bigger and for all practical purposes just as fast.
I'd take Roby in the 3rd, and we don't need Shazier. As Harry mentioned, always finds a way to get himself dinged, and if he projects as a 4-3 OLB we already have Mingo who's bigger and for all practical purposes just as fast.
I've already stated I have him playing ILB not OLB.
As for Guitton that's an interesting thought... He has good passing instinct and touch and is somewhat mobile. Would be a very good project QB for someone.
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I'd take Roby in the 3rd, and we don't need Shazier. As Harry mentioned, always finds a way to get himself dinged, and if he projects as a 4-3 OLB we already have Mingo who's bigger and for all practical purposes just as fast.
I've already stated I have him playing ILB not OLB.
As for Guitton that's an interesting thought... He has good passing instinct and touch and is somewhat mobile. Would be a very good project QB for someone.
I've already stated I have him playing ILB not OLB.
As for Guitton that's an interesting thought... He has good passing instinct and touch and is somewhat mobile. Would be a very good project QB for someone.
As to moving Shazier inside- his biggest asset his his speed- which somewhat would get negated moving him inside. Is he big enough and strong enough to take the punishment he'd get as an ILB? You have OGs firing out on every running play with their target being the ILB. I don't dislike Shazier, MHO is he's probably not on the Browns defensive draft board, especially not at picks 2-3. A lot will depend what the Browns do with the first two picks.
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Pettine made comments this morning indicating that a LB is very much on the board for Browns and OLB are substantially larger than ILB... so that's where Shazier will play.
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Pettine made comments this morning indicating that a LB is very much on the board for Browns and OLB are substantially larger than ILB... so that's where Shazier will play.
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I dig guiton as a 7th or udfa.
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He's faster larger and stronger than D'Qwell, smaller than mingo (who is already too small to play OLB in the NFL) so Shazier at OLB isn't really an option in 4-3 or 3-4. He is an ILB
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There aren't many. Most around 240-260. It could be possible but even if it were I would assume it is for a year or two until dansby is ready to give up his spot.
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if we draft mack this thread is moot.
if not there are 3 other LBs that'll be @26 that i like better than shazier.
i like the bucs too. only root for ohio teams and they are on the top of the list. doesn't mean i automatically think they have the best pro prospects that the cleveland browns MUST draft, unless they do. hyde, shazier and roby are all going to land on an NFL roster. doesn't mean it will be the browns roster.
if this is your wish scenario, fine. we'll just know how to judge you and your opinions.
clevedog meet PoG. PoG meet clevedog.
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I was big on Watkins before the Hawkins signing, now I dunno. Here's my question and it's something really only Pettine and Farmer can realistically answer. Can Khalil Mack not just make the transition to ILB but in a few years be the captain of the team and at least approaching Ray Lewis type of field command? Athletically he's probably even more gifted than Lewis was coming out of college, but he can he approach Lewis's brain for the game? Ray Lewis was the Peyton Manning of defense, that's a guy we desperately need. If Mack can be close to that we have to take him at 4. If he's just a dumb pass rusher who will never understand how offense's are trying to fuck with him, than I dunno...we can find guys like that in later rounds. By all accounts Urlacher had an outstanding career but a lot of insiders wrote that while he was a physical freak, he was a dumbass for most of his career. If not for Lance Briggs Urlacher would not have been what he was. Only towards the end of his career did he start to really intrinsically understand the game. I don't want that. I want the next fucking Ray Lewis. Now I know you all like the Dansby deal, but I still would have genuflected at the idea of having Mack study under DQ. That would have been my prime defensive scenario even though I think Clowney is the best defensive player in the draft.
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I'd take Roby in the 3rd, and we don't need Shazier. As Harry mentioned, always finds a way to get himself dinged, and if he projects as a 4-3 OLB we already have Mingo who's bigger and for all practical purposes just as fast.
I've already stated I have him playing ILB not OLB.
As for Guitton that's an interesting thought... He has good passing instinct and touch and is somewhat mobile. Would be a very good project QB for someone.
I've already stated I have him playing ILB not OLB.
As for Guitton that's an interesting thought... He has good passing instinct and touch and is somewhat mobile. Would be a very good project QB for someone.
One of Shaziers biggest weaknesses is his ability to stuff the run and you want to put him at MLB? He is the perfect size for a blitzing 4-3 OLB, but he would not only be terrible as a MLB in any scheme, but likely out a bunch from injuries. Don't try to put a square peg into a round hole and try to tell me its a triangle.
Ruining threads since 1897.
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