Buyer Beware: Browns Track Record at drafting QBs
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OK, so...on and on and on and on we know that the Browns need a QB. But, perhaps you are not aware of the fact that in 64 (actually 61) years of participating in the NFL draft, their track record is pretty much a pile of stinking pig shit. Here are all the QBs ever drafted by the Browns since 1950, together with their career won-loss records overall as a starting QB in the NFL and their record as a starter for the Cleveland Browns. Note, these are not all the QBs ever drafted by the Browns, just those that were credited with a win/loss as a starter. Many other never saw action in the NFL.
Butch Songin 1950 8-11-1 overall 0-0 with Browns
Milt Plum 1957 56-40-6 overall 33-16-2 with Browns
Bob Brodhead 1958 1-0 overall 0-0 with Browns
Jim Ninowski 1958 15-15-1 overall 5-6 with Browns
Gary Lane 1965 0-1 "all" with Browns
Rick Norton 1966 1-10 overall 0-0 with Browns (thankfully)
Mike Phipps 1970 38-31-2 overall 24-25-2 with Browns
Brian Sipe 1972 57-55 all with Browns
Paul McDonald 1980 8-13 all with Browns
Bernie Kosar 1985 53-54-1 overall 53-51-1 with Browns
Eric Zeier 1995 4-8 overall 1-3 with Browns
Tim Couch 1999 22-37 all with Browns
Spergon Wynn 2000 0-3 all with Browns
Luke McCown 2-7 overall 1-3 with Browns
Charlie Frye 2005 7-16 overall 6-13 with Browns
Brady Quinn 2007 4-16 overall 3-9 with Browns
Colt McCoy 2010 6-15 all with Browns
Brandon Weeden 5-15 all with Browns.
ONLY Milt Plum ever had a record that was more than 2 games over .500. If we had him today we would think he was a God!
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So, here is a proposition: Given this track record, don't bother drafting a QB. Get one some other way. Here are some other Browns QBs, and their record with the Browns:
Otto Graham...57-13-1 (NFL only?) drafted by Lions, acquired as FA
Frank Ryan...52-22-2 drafted originally by Rams, acquired in trade I believe
Bill Nelsen...34-16-1 ...acquired in trade with Steelers for Dick Shiner
Vinny Testaverde 16-15...veteran QB acquired as FA
Derek Anderson 16-18, drafted by Ravens, acquired off their practice squad
Brian Hoyer 3-0 so far. Undrafted FA (originally with Pats) Picked up as FA
Maybe we should just stick with Hoyer and not draft a QB?
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To quote Coach Mike Pettine: "break off the rear view mirror"
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Meaningless stat.
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We have a new owner and front office. Every single QB we've taken before now is completely irrelevant.
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Its the Browns fan motto, be pessimistic until we get results. LIke every year we have hope, like every year our qb throws a behind the back under hand with his eyes closed pass. We have had many many crappy QB's, hopefully this bunch can evaluate a guy and not rush him into it.
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To quote Coach Mike Pettine: "break off the rear view mirror"
I understand...".the past is meaningless to the future"..."we have to get lucky sometime".
Its just that this track record is so bad....we revere 2 guys who were barely over .500. (each had big ups and big downs)
And...no one ever even talks about the one guy who actually had an outstanding record.....Plum.
But like I said in my trivia quiz: the Browns thought so highly of Milt Plum that they traded him after he made the Pro Bowl 2 years in a row. In retrospect the trade was good because Frank Ryan was brought in to replace him. Still, his winning pct. was about .666.
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To quote Coach Mike Pettine: "break off the rear view mirror"
I understand...".the past is meaningless to the future"..."we have to get lucky sometime".
Its just that this track record is so bad....we revere 2 guys who were barely over .500. (each had big ups and big downs)
And...no one ever even talks about the one guy who actually had an outstanding record.....Plum.
But like I said in my trivia quiz: the Browns thought so highly of Milt Plum that they traded him after he made the Pro Bowl 2 years in a row. In retrospect the trade was good because Frank Ryan was brought in to replace him. Still, his winning pct. was about .666.
I understand...".the past is meaningless to the future"..."we have to get lucky sometime".
Its just that this track record is so bad....we revere 2 guys who were barely over .500. (each had big ups and big downs)
And...no one ever even talks about the one guy who actually had an outstanding record.....Plum.
But like I said in my trivia quiz: the Browns thought so highly of Milt Plum that they traded him after he made the Pro Bowl 2 years in a row. In retrospect the trade was good because Frank Ryan was brought in to replace him. Still, his winning pct. was about .666.
it is not meaningless in all situations, just this one when we essentially have a new organization drafting a QB .
The track record is horrible - no argument there - I wish I were alive to see Otto Graham play...really the last great QB we had.
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To quote Coach Mike Pettine: "break off the rear view mirror"
I understand...".the past is meaningless to the future"..."we have to get lucky sometime".
Its just that this track record is so bad....we revere 2 guys who were barely over .500. (each had big ups and big downs)
And...no one ever even talks about the one guy who actually had an outstanding record.....Plum.
But like I said in my trivia quiz: the Browns thought so highly of Milt Plum that they traded him after he made the Pro Bowl 2 years in a row. In retrospect the trade was good because Frank Ryan was brought in to replace him. Still, his winning pct. was about .666.
I understand...".the past is meaningless to the future"..."we have to get lucky sometime".
Its just that this track record is so bad....we revere 2 guys who were barely over .500. (each had big ups and big downs)
And...no one ever even talks about the one guy who actually had an outstanding record.....Plum.
But like I said in my trivia quiz: the Browns thought so highly of Milt Plum that they traded him after he made the Pro Bowl 2 years in a row. In retrospect the trade was good because Frank Ryan was brought in to replace him. Still, his winning pct. was about .666.
OMG, Milt Plum! I used to call him the King of the screen pass....to Jimmy Brown & Bobby Mitchell. THAT was fun to watch and, even though Mitchell was only in Cleveland a few years before the trade to the Redskins, as exciting a pair of backs as you would care to see in the same backfield. Plum was blessed to have a GREAT Team around him.
Mike
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Let's strive for mediocrity and stick with an FA QB.
Or let's have some balls and actually draft one of the top rated QB's for the first time in about 15 years.
None of this wait and see shit. That's what got us Weeden and Quinn.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Yikes. That's a pretty piss poor record drafting QBs. I'm curious how we compare to other teams in that regard.
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Trouble is, there is no qb in this draft that is a "can't miss" guy like a
Luck.
What you could end up with, is a Ryan Leaf, or a Jamarcus Russell.
Seattle did pretty good with a 3rd rounder. The ratbirds nabbed Flacco in the first at 18, when some write ups had him
as a 2nd rounder. Andy Dalton has done pretty well with the Bengals, he
was a second round pick.
It isn't where you draft them so much as WHO you draft. If you know he's your guy, you
draft him before he falls to somebody else as best you can.
And, I'm soooooooo tired of rehashing the failures of the past. It's there, never gonna change -
it's always going to be that history.
But with Farmer as GM, once and for all, we havea FO and coaching staff that
sees character, work ethic, and love for the game as a primary criteria for
players that will be good on and off the field, making for a winning locker room.
It shows in the FA's they signed, and this draft will be a gigantic breath of fresh air -
and I plan on enjoying it without wailing about the stinkin air from the past.
Movin on, says I. If you have to take a big chance on a qb, you sure as hell don't do it
at 4. But, if Farmer and co draft a qb at 4, we'll all know they know he's their guy and they
figure they are not taking a huge chance on him.
I don't see it, but I don't know diddley.
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These aren't precedents. This is pointless statistics. I can't stand when people make "logical arguments" like this.
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No, you draft a guy that you figure is "your guy".
The Browns have taken chances on plenty of players, but their
criteria for drafting was screwed up.
Seattle didn't take a chance on a guy who was in the top ten.
They....drafted....a ...qb...in....the....third...round.
But they knew he was their guy to do what they wanted to do.
Nobody is saying bargain shop. Several of us are saying that to just draft a media
hyped qb really high, and hope maybe he can turn out to be your guy is really counter-productive
to building successful football team.
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Let's strive for mediocrity and stick with an FA QB.
Or let's have some balls and actually draft one of the top rated QB's for the first time in about 15 years.
None of this wait and see shit. That's what got us Weeden and Quinn.
Let's strive for mediocrity and stick with an FA QB.
Otto Graham was a FA QB. So? You think 57-13 is mediocre? (actually I believe it is the very best win pct. of all time for a QB)
Or let's have some balls and actually draft one of the top rated QB's for the first time in about 15 years.
That would be great....if they could get it right. My point is they have never really gotten it right.
None of this wait and see shit. That's what got us Weeden and Quinn.
I guess we could have traded up for Jamarcus Russell....the only QB drafted ahead of Quinn. Or we could have taken Ryan Tannehill in lieu of TR...probably woulda been a good move...but I am not sure Tannehill is much better than Weeden.
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These aren't precedents. This is pointless statistics. I can't stand when people make "logical arguments" like this.
These aren't precedents. This is pointless statistics. I can't stand when people make "logical arguments" like this.
Well, it is indeed "precedent", i.e. it is the the historical record that has preceded the current moment in time.
But, yes, I understand the illogic in saying that "since we have done so poorly in the past we will do poorly again".
I posted it more out of entertainment and information than out of argument.....but yes, I do carry out the narrative to make the arguement about the bad track record. Even if it is for devil's advocated sake.
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