hate crime? What's the difference.

Westside Steve

http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/13/us/kansas-jewish-center-shooting/

Here's one for you, boys.

So the debate here is whether or not this bastard should be charged with a crime. Hate crime?

I say whatever the worst possible punishment allowed by the harshest of judges would be appropriate.

Kansas still has a death penalty but if their prison system is harsh enough maybe life would be ok.

WSS

The Cysko Kid

Is he white? If so he will be charged with a hate crime.

The thing is though it doesn't matter. If you kill three people and you're not named oj you're going away. The hate crime label only matters if your crime was miniscule enough to allow you to get out of prison relatively quickly

Westside Steve

Not only white but a past high ranking member of the Ku Klux Klan.

Reportedly he shouted Heil Hitler from the back seat of the police cruiser...

WSS

sadbrownsfan

I am pretty sure this it the definition of "Hate Crime"

"A hate crime is a traditional offense like murder, arson, or vandalism with an added element of bias. For the purposes of collecting statistics, Congress has defined a hate crime as a “criminal offense against a person or property motivated in whole or in part by an offender’s bias against a race, religion, disability, ethnic origin or sexual orientation.” Hate itself is not a crime—and the FBI is mindful of protecting freedom of speech and other civil liberties" http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/civilrights/hate_crimes/overview

Unless he hires one really, really good attorney that prove he didn't attack these people b/c the where jewish.

Also I like how you added b/c he is white- http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/hate-crime/2012/topic-pages/offenders/offenders_final

By race

In 2012, race was reported for 5,331 known hate crime offenders. Of these offenders:

54.6 percent were white.
23.3 percent were black.
8.8 percent were groups made up of individuals of various races (multiple races, group).
0.9 percent were Asian/Pacific Islander.
0.9 percent were American Indian/Alaskan Native.
11.5 percent were unknown.

DieHardBrownsFan

He is 73 years old, so no matter what sentence he receives he probably isn't going to hang around much longer.

The Cysko Kid

@sadbrownsfan said:

<p>

I am pretty sure this it the definition of "Hate Crime"

"A hate crime is a traditional offense like murder, arson, or vandalism with an added element of bias. For the purposes of collecting statistics, Congress has defined a hate crime as a criminal offense against a person or property motivated in whole or in part by an offenders bias against a race, religion, disability, ethnic origin or sexual orientation. Hate itself is not a crimeand the FBI is mindful of protecting freedom of speech and other civil liberties" http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/civilrights/hate_crimes/overview

Unless he hires one really, really good attorney that prove he didn't attack these people b/c the where jewish.

Also I like how you added b/c he is white- http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/hate-crime/2012/topic-pages/offenders/offenders_final

By race

In 2012, race was reported for 5,331 known hate crime offenders. Of these offenders:

54.6 percent were white.

23.3 percent were black.

8.8 percent were groups made up of individuals of various races (multiple races, group).

0.9 percent were Asian/Pacific Islander.

0.9 percent were American Indian/Alaskan Native.

11.5 percent were unknown.

Your statistics don't do anything to disprove what I said. What's your point?

sadbrownsfan

@the-cysko-kid said:
Your statistics don't do anything to disprove what I said. What's your point?

Actually it does, quite well if you actually look at the stats and compare it to the racial break down of the US.

Osiris

@sadbrownsfan said:
Actually it does, quite well if you actually look at the stats and compare it to the racial break down of the US.

It proves that white people are charged with hate crimes at a rate greater than their demographic piece of the population pie. I wouldn't be too hasty in drawing a conclusion from that, though. It doesn't prove that they are unfairly charged or fairly charged.

DieHardBrownsFan

People

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USA

People QuickFacts USA

Population, 2013 estimate 316,128,839

Population, 2012 estimate 313,873,685

Population, 2010 (April 1) estimates base 308,747,716

Population, percent change, April 1, 2010 to July 1, 2013 2.4%

Population, percent change, April 1, 2010 to July 1, 2012 1.7%

Population, 2010 308,745,538

Persons under 5 years, percent, 2012 6.4%

Persons under 18 years, percent, 2012 23.5%

Persons 65 years and over, percent, 2012 13.7%

Female persons, percent, 2012 50.8%

White alone, percent, 2012 (a) 77.9%

Black or African American alone, percent, 2012 (a) 13.1%

American Indian and Alaska Native alone, percent, 2012 (a) 1.2%

Asian alone, percent, 2012 (a) 5.1%

Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander alone, percent, 2012 (a) 0.2%

Two or More Races, percent, 2012 2.4%

Hispanic or Latino, percent, 2012 (

16.9%

White alone, not Hispanic or Latino, percent, 2012 63.0%

sadbrownsfan

@osiris said:
It proves that white people are charged with hate crimes at a rate greater than their demographic piece of the population pie. I wouldn't be too hasty in drawing a conclusion from that, though. It doesn't prove that they are unfairly charged or fairly charged.

White alone, percent, 2012 (a) 77.9%(latino's included)

54.6 percent were white.(latino's included)

Even if you add the 11.5% that the race was unknown that would only raise it to 66.1%

gftChris

Well I was going to say you can't automatically assume it's a 'hate crime' just because of the location - it may be that he had some problem with the people involved, perhaps he felt ripped off by some businessmen, or his wife fancied some pork-free porking. But then when you find out the bit about Heil Hitler, that all kinda goes out the window.

Open and shut case, unless the defence pleads insanity, somehow.

Westside Steve

Well if 87 percent of the population only commits 77% of the hate crimes I guess we are doing alright.

I would say those numbers are skewed to the point of being worthless but...

But that isn't my point. My point is that any savage brutal senseless attack should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

I don't really care if you hate the person or just have no respect for human life or only want their money. f*** you go to the chair.

( Unfortunately we don't still use old Sparky or a cottonwood tree...)

WSS

sadbrownsfan

@osiris said:

It proves that white people are charged with hate crimes at a rate greater than their demographic piece of the population pie. I wouldn't be too hasty in drawing a conclusion from that, though. It doesn't prove that they are unfairly charged or fairly charged.

Don't white people make up 85 or so set of the population?

And would you say it's a lesser offense if a black man rapes and robs a white woman just because he wanted some white pussy and some money? Gee at least it's not a hate crime.

WSS

To fall under a "Hate Crime" the prosecutor would have to prove that he attacked her because she was white.

@westside-steve said:

Well if 87 percent of the population only commits 77% of the hate crimes I guess we are doing alright.

I would say those numbers are skewed to the point of being worthless but...

But that isn't my point. My point is that any savage brutal senseless attack should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

I don't really care if you hate the person or just have no respect for human life or only want their money. f*** you go to the chair.

( Unfortunately we don't still use old Sparky or a cottonwood tree...)

WSS

its 77% of the population and 54% of the hate crimes(66% if all unkown where white).

calfoxwc

To fall under a "Hate Crime" the prosecutor would have to prove that he attacked her because she was white. sad

*******************************************************

yet, if the races were reversed, it would be assumed by many/most of the activist black culture, and the left, that

it was a crime because the victim was black. How did we ever let this garbage get to this point ?

sadbrownsfan

@calfoxwc said:

To fall under a "Hate Crime" the prosecutor would have to prove that he attacked her because she was white. sad

*******************************************************

yet, if the races were reversed, it would be assumed by many/most of the activist black culture, and the left, that

it was a crime because the victim was black. How did we ever let this garbage get to this point ?

Yes Cal that is why even though African Americans only make up 13% of the population they account for 23% of "Hate Crimes". Nobody would ever dare to prosecute African Americans for hate crimes.

beare

IM not condoneing crime im against it . 1 thing ive never understood is this if a WHITE commits crime against black its a HATE CRIME but when a black commits a crime vs white its never charged as a hate crime. WHY shouldnt it all be equal?

Westside Steve

@sadbrownsfan said:
Yes Cal that is why even though African Americans only make up 13% of the population they account for 23% of "Hate Crimes". Nobody would ever dare to prosecute African Americans for hate crimes.

I stand corrected on my mistake. 77 percent it is.

I would bet that the percentage of hate crimes committed by blacks is under reported. And under prosecuted. And under charged. But I would say that's due to the very nature of a hate crime. And the reason for its existence at all.

But that still isn't the point.

WSS

sadbrownsfan

Steve its not very easy to get the "Hate Crime" label only about 6,000 crimes got that label during 2012, while there are millions violent and property crimes in the usa every year.

Edit- The problem is being able to convince a jury that the sole reason for the crime was b/c of the person hatred towards a race\religion\ethnicity\etc.

MLD Woody

@beare said:
IM not condoneing crime im against it . 1 thing ive never understood is this if a WHITE commits crime against black its a HATE CRIME but when a black commits a crime vs white its never charged as a hate crime. WHY shouldnt it all be equal?

Clearly that's not true, even just based on the statistics posted in this thread alone.

Westside Steve

@sadbrownsfan said:

Steve its not very easy to get the "Hate Crime" label only about 6,000 crimes got that label during 2012, while there are millions violent and property crimes in the usa every year.

Edit- The problem is being able to convince a jury that the sole reason for the crime was b/c of the person hatred towards a race\religion\ethnicity\etc.

Ok.

So..........?

WSS