Jonathan Paul Manziel
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Lol, I think we all know what's coming now when a thread starts with breaking news
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Yeah. Exactly.
He drank and slept in through meetings. Just like any college kid would do.
College kids are shitty jackasses. All of them. Especially the athletes. I'm one and I don't deny it.
Except your not successful.
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For godsakes whether it be Hoyer, JF, or Freddy Free-agent the browns top priority for week one start is to have him start week 17 and every week inbetween. There is no exception to this. This one single stat is completely unexcusable and really embarrassing. Time for someone to be the browns Iron man.
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Lol, I think we all know what's coming now when a thread starts with breaking news
damn, that didn't last long.
whelp, more warning points for me. la la la.
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Howdy back and we'll talk again when you're a Browns fan for real.
So dense... so diluded...
Nothing has been proven except your inexhaustible ability to cling to your fanciful, empty narrative...
No one will root against us simply to be right about JM, least of all me...
If he turns out to be the guy, I'll gladly admit being wrong.
If he turns out not to be, you will say "I always preferred Teddy B"... because you did... for months...
Now post your little JF gif again since you have nothing else to add to the conversation...
It is amazing isn't it?
I don't think anyone here will root against the Browns just to see Manziel fail, but there are a certain select few who have made their stance clear on the Manziel front and refuse to acknowledge his strengths. These are the few that I believe Mike is referencing, and these are probably the same guys who will be the first to say "we won IN SPITE of Manziel" whenever they get the opportunity.
That's the difference I see between Manziel supporters and detractors. The supporters, for the most part, are just as quick to point out Manziel's flaws as they are his strengths. They (if they're like me) find the flaws to be true claims, but not necessarily valid. The detractors see no good in Manziel and take every opportunity to attribute something ridiculous to one of his flaws, even if there's no correlation.
I don't deny that Manziel is a shitty jackass off the field. I don't deny that he looks like a weaselly asshole and he probably would warrant a punch in the dick. I don't deny that it scares me how much he runs around. I don't deny that he's (slightly) undersized. He's all of those things.
But he's also a natural passer and not just a thrower, something the detractors don't like to mention. He's a clutch player, something that the detractors like to attribute to Mike Evans although he was only responsible for 12 of Manziel's 52 third (or fourth) down conversions. Honestly, if those were the only two assets he possessed, I'd still be happy with the pick. Cleveland hasn't seen a natural clutch passer in years.
However, Manziel also possesses the "it" factor, whatever "it" may be. As I stated in a previous post, there have been very few times that a Browns QB has trotted onto the field in a save situation and I thought to myself "he's got this." I can honestly say that I only recall experiencing that feeling twice- once against Minnesota with Hoyer and once against New Orleans with Colt McCoy ( a game where he really didn't even do anything).
I think it was pretty obvious that I preferred Bortles over the rest of the crop but I am happy that we at least landed Manziel, because I can see his value as it pertains to Shanahan's offensive system. If Manziel fails, yes...I will say that I did prefer Bortles. I will always say that I preferred Bortles. But we didn't get the opportunity to take Bortles.
(For another time- I believe that we may have actually targeted Bortles at #4, but when Jacksonville took him, we took the first trade call we could and went with Plan B. I do not believe that the Buffalo trade was our plan all along.)
@mike-h said:
Nope, this thread has very little information to learn from. Mostly people like you trying hard to accept the fact that you were wrong while trying not to overtly say you are rooting for JF to fail. I saw one of Choco's posts and got that impression, and I didn't read his previous post because I missed a few pages.
I told him sorry, I misinterpreted what he wrote, because I actually respect a lot of his opinions--sometimes, when he's not a cock. But he's fun, and gives interesting takes.
Same can't be said for you.
Wrong about what? I said I didn't want Manziel to be drafted by the Browns. Well, he did get drafted by the Browns, So Mr Jesus avatar, St. Francis said don't sweat the things you can't change. I hope he proves me wrong- big time. If he lives up to the hype, he'll be to football what Tiger Woods is to golf- and incidentally there's a bunch of folks that don't like Tiger either. Should he flop, Cleveland will be to the NFL as the Washington Generals are to the Harlem Globetrotters. BTW, even if he turns out to be "great"- that doesn't necessarily mean I have to like him- need an example? Ray Lewis.
I don't think anyone here will root against the Browns just to see Manziel fail, but there are a certain select few who have made their stance clear on the Manziel front and refuse to acknowledge his strengths. These are the few that I believe Mike is referencing, and these are probably the same guys who will be the first to say "we won IN SPITE of Manziel" whenever they get the opportunity.
That's the difference I see between Manziel supporters and detractors. The supporters, for the most part, are just as quick to point out Manziel's flaws as they are his strengths. They (if they're like me) find the flaws to be true claims, but not necessarily valid. The detractors see no good in Manziel and take every opportunity to attribute something ridiculous to one of his flaws, even if there's no correlation.
I don't deny that Manziel is a shitty jackass off the field. I don't deny that he looks like a weaselly asshole and he probably would warrant a punch in the dick. I don't deny that it scares me how much he runs around. I don't deny that he's (slightly) undersized. He's all of those things.
But he's also a natural passer and not just a thrower, something the detractors don't like to mention. He's a clutch player, something that the detractors like to attribute to Mike Evans although he was only responsible for 12 of Manziel's 52 third (or fourth) down conversions. Honestly, if those were the only two assets he possessed, I'd still be happy with the pick. Cleveland hasn't seen a natural clutch passer in years.
However, Manziel also possesses the "it" factor, whatever "it" may be. As I stated in a previous post, there have been very few times that a Browns QB has trotted onto the field in a save situation and I thought to myself "he's got this." I can honestly say that I only recall experiencing that feeling twice- once against Minnesota with Hoyer and once against New Orleans with Colt McCoy ( a game where he really didn't even do anything).
At least from my POV, his weakness outweighed his strengths. Yeah, I saw those spectacular plays- I also saw him take off running with receivers wide open. Mike H. seems to think everyone who doesn't already worship at the Manziel altar is somehow a hatah- and coming from this Browns fan, he's full of shit. Difference is the backers minimize his weaknesses, the skeptics (that would be me and a few others) maximize them. I said pre-draft I thought JF was an injury risk with his style of play- MH oh no, anyone can get injured. Well you know who else said on ESPN today JF will get hurt with that style of play? Bill Parcells- so go put that in your pipe and smoke it Mike.
TC, let's just say I want to see the "it" factor for at least a full (injury free) season before I say wow, that JF was really a great pick. 20 qb busts and counting will make a skeptic out of you.
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@walterwhite said:
Now you're getting it.
Manziel is the man in Cleveland, and ya'll need to get used to it.
Trust me, you'll come around by mid season when he has us playoff bound
You already have both Johnny's home and away gamedays ordered yet? Buy a couple dozen of the SI mags so Johnny can autograph them at $100 a pop?
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LOL this whole thread. The media got one thing right-JFF is damn sure polarizing.
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If no one has seen the presser of him and Gilbert on the Browns home page, you need to. The kid does not talk like the little bastard he is cut out to be. The whole money thing with his hands was something that a guy on his team made up as a secert hand shake during games, and kinda blew up. Johnny has done nothing really wrong off the field that deserves so much shit. The media has build the JF persona, he is just living the dream. You know damn well if any other player had that kind of attention, that they would do the same thing. Look at Mike Sam the first openly gay player, hed said football will come first, now he has a damn show on the Oprah network. Its time to buy in guys and girls. Manziel is the kind of fun Cleveland hasnt had in awhile. There will be a media circus, so what. Just enjoy the games.
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You think maybe the will have guest interviewer Donald Sterling flown in from LA to help out?
You think maybe the will have guest interviewer Donald Sterling flown in from LA to help out?
I would *love* to see that.
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But on a serious note, just let the damn guy play football. Probably do A Football Life on him when he retires, but leave him alone for now.
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Thats just it Hoorta, the supposed injury concern is really his only glaring weakness, when compared to the other available QBs. Who was the last QB who failed because of injury....Joe Theisman? He even acknowledged he won't be able to do some of the stuff he did in college. Every QB coming into the NFL has to learn to protect themselves.
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I think he is just pretending and is actually straight. He just wanted to be drafted and knew he wasn't very good. That and he wants to be the spokesman for Skittles.
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Could be worse. Could be Jerry Springer.
WSS
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If no one has seen the presser of him and Gilbert on the Browns home page, you need to. The kid does not talk like the little bastard he is cut out to be. The whole money thing with his hands was something that a guy on his team made up as a secert hand shake during games, and kinda blew up. Johnny has done nothing really wrong off the field that deserves so much shit. The media has build the JF persona, he is just living the dream. You know damn well if any other player had that kind of attention, that they would do the same thing. Look at Mike Sam the first openly gay player, hed said football will come first, now he has a damn show on the Oprah network. Its time to buy in guys and girls. Manziel is the kind of fun Cleveland hasnt had in awhile. There will be a media circus, so what. Just enjoy the games.
If no one has seen the presser of him and Gilbert on the Browns home page, you need to. The kid does not talk like the little bastard he is cut out to be. The whole money thing with his hands was something that a guy on his team made up as a secert hand shake during games, and kinda blew up. Johnny has done nothing really wrong off the field that deserves so much shit. The media has build the JF persona, he is just living the dream. You know damn well if any other player had that kind of attention, that they would do the same thing. Look at Mike Sam the first openly gay player, hed said football will come first, now he has a damn show on the Oprah network. Its time to buy in guys and girls. Manziel is the kind of fun Cleveland hasnt had in awhile. There will be a media circus, so what. Just enjoy the games.
Money thing with hand. Not only is it gay. His teammates nor Him came up with it.
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This is going to work against Sam. His focus needs to be 100% on football and he won't be able to accomplish that by adding a circus around himself.
Ruining threads since 1897. -
i think as browns fans we HAVE to buy into it correct? i mean he's on our team which means we want him to succeed. it's that simple.
now does that mean that everyone likes the hype that has become JF? no. some people will never like that. i'll put it down to a generational thing. the older people on this board remember the restrictive way we were brought up. either it was a class (the noun) thing or being raised in a time where brash and loud behavior were frowned upon. we were brow beaten by the pervasive tone of the day. hell you didn't see a man and woman in the same bed on tv until the brady bunch in the 70's. it was the boy scouts (no not gay) and 'always do the right thing' and 'help the old lady across the street' era that is totally lost on this new generation. it's all about what you can do for me and you owe me something.
so to me (i'll speak for myself as i don't want to get group a whole bunch of people into my own mindset) this whole hip hop generation, the twitter and facebook scene where everyone is out there doing what they want and daring someone to tell them to STFU (been to a movie in a while?) personifies the spoiled brat dickhead legend of JF. now if he weren't on the browns i'd be a hater and wishing for the guy to get crushed on his very first play, i'm not gonna lie.
and to those who say just jump on board, i'll say hey just win and shut the fuck up. and turn your fucking music down too punks!
hee hee hee.
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@mike-h said:
Nope, this thread has very little information to learn from. Mostly people like you trying hard to accept the fact that you were wrong while trying not to overtly say you are rooting for JF to fail. I saw one of Choco's posts and got that impression, and I didn't read his previous post because I missed a few pages.
I told him sorry, I misinterpreted what he wrote, because I actually respect a lot of his opinions--sometimes, when he's not a cock. But he's fun, and gives interesting takes.
Same can't be said for you.
Wrong about what? I said I didn't want Manziel to be drafted by the Browns. Well, he did get drafted by the Browns, So Mr Jesus avatar, St. Francis said don't sweat the things you can't change. I hope he proves me wrong- big time. If he lives up to the hype, he'll be to football what Tiger Woods is to golf- and incidentally there's a bunch of folks that don't like Tiger either. Should he flop, Cleveland will be to the NFL as the Washington Generals are to the Harlem Globetrotters. BTW, even if he turns out to be "great"- that doesn't necessarily mean I have to like him- need an example? Ray Lewis.
I don't think anyone here will root against the Browns just to see Manziel fail, but there are a certain select few who have made their stance clear on the Manziel front and refuse to acknowledge his strengths. These are the few that I believe Mike is referencing, and these are probably the same guys who will be the first to say "we won IN SPITE of Manziel" whenever they get the opportunity.
That's the difference I see between Manziel supporters and detractors. The supporters, for the most part, are just as quick to point out Manziel's flaws as they are his strengths. They (if they're like me) find the flaws to be true claims, but not necessarily valid. The detractors see no good in Manziel and take every opportunity to attribute something ridiculous to one of his flaws, even if there's no correlation.
I don't deny that Manziel is a shitty jackass off the field. I don't deny that he looks like a weaselly asshole and he probably would warrant a punch in the dick. I don't deny that it scares me how much he runs around. I don't deny that he's (slightly) undersized. He's all of those things.
But he's also a natural passer and not just a thrower, something the detractors don't like to mention. He's a clutch player, something that the detractors like to attribute to Mike Evans although he was only responsible for 12 of Manziel's 52 third (or fourth) down conversions. Honestly, if those were the only two assets he possessed, I'd still be happy with the pick. Cleveland hasn't seen a natural clutch passer in years.
However, Manziel also possesses the "it" factor, whatever "it" may be. As I stated in a previous post, there have been very few times that a Browns QB has trotted onto the field in a save situation and I thought to myself "he's got this." I can honestly say that I only recall experiencing that feeling twice- once against Minnesota with Hoyer and once against New Orleans with Colt McCoy ( a game where he really didn't even do anything).
At least from my POV, his weakness outweighed his strengths. Yeah, I saw those spectacular plays- I also saw him take off running with receivers wide open. Mike H. seems to think everyone who doesn't already worship at the Manziel altar is somehow a hatah- and coming from this Browns fan, he's full of shit. Difference is the backers minimize his weaknesses, the skeptics (that would be me and a few others) maximize them. I said pre-draft I thought JF was an injury risk with his style of play- MH oh no, anyone can get injured. Well you know who else said on ESPN today JF will get hurt with that style of play? Bill Parcells- so go put that in your pipe and smoke it Mike.
TC, let's just say I want to see the "it" factor for at least a full (injury free) season before I say wow, that JF was really a great pick. 20 qb busts and counting will make a skeptic out of you.
Wrong about what? I said I didn't want Manziel to be drafted by the Browns. Well, he did get drafted by the Browns, So Mr Jesus avatar, St. Francis said don't sweat the things you can't change. I hope he proves me wrong- big time. If he lives up to the hype, he'll be to football what Tiger Woods is to golf- and incidentally there's a bunch of folks that don't like Tiger either. Should he flop, Cleveland will be to the NFL as the Washington Generals are to the Harlem Globetrotters. BTW, even if he turns out to be "great"- that doesn't necessarily mean I have to like him- need an example? Ray Lewis.
At least from my POV, his weakness outweighed his strengths. Yeah, I saw those spectacular plays- I also saw him take off running with receivers wide open. Mike H. seems to think everyone who doesn't already worship at the Manziel altar is somehow a hatah- and coming from this Browns fan, he's full of shit. Difference is the backers minimize his weaknesses, the skeptics (that would be me and a few others) maximize them. I said pre-draft I thought JF was an injury risk with his style of play- MH oh no, anyone can get injured. Well you know who else said on ESPN today JF will get hurt with that style of play? Bill Parcells- so go put that in your pipe and smoke it Mike.
TC, let's just say I want to see the "it" factor for at least a full (injury free) season before I say wow, that JF was really a great pick. 20 qb busts and counting will make a skeptic out of you.
I've seen Big Ben take off with receivers open. I've seen Luck take off with receivers open. I've seen Bortles, Bridgewater, Garopollo, et al. take off with receivers open.
Nobody is doubting that he can't continue that style of play in the NFL. That's why he won't be playing like that in the NFL. Same way Shaw won't be taking 95% of his snaps from shotgun in the NFL. Of course Manziel will be asked to change his game. But having that scrambling ability is still a great asset.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
I think he is just pretending and is actually straight. He just wanted to be drafted and knew he wasn't very good. That and he wants to be the spokesman for Skittles.
I think he is just pretending and is actually straight. He just wanted to be drafted and knew he wasn't very good. That and he wants to be the spokesman for Skittles.
For a first team all SEC selection, and the co-Defensive SEC POTY, he has to be at least somewhat talented...
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