Jonathan Paul Manziel
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Haden and Thomas are not Quarterbacks, fyi.
TouchΓ©. tbf, I didn't read the questions particularly thoroughly.
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Now have I done any Manziel bashing lately? BTW so were Tim Tebow, Troy Smith, Matt Leinart, Jason White, Eric Crouch and Chris Weinke. Just winning the Heisman is no automatic ticket to NFL stardom. Just sayin'.
But you literally just said rookie QB's succeed in the NFL because they're the best of the best. Or was that wrong?
But you literally just said rookie QB's succeed in the NFL because they're the best of the best. Or was that wrong?
You're the one who threw Manziel's Heisman into the equation. Based on pro potential, JF got drafted about exactly where he should have. That stupid statue don't mean crap when you get to the pros. Some HOfers- as well as some monumental busts have won it. History says about 30% of first round picks are out of football within 3 years. You arguing just for the sake of arguing? Great college players- especially Heisman quarterbacks don't necessarily cut it in the pros. If the Heisman was the only criteria for NFL greatness Archie Griffin would be the greatest NFL running back of all time.
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@everlastingxxx said:
You guys like using straw man arguments. I doubt you will find a single person that would say that winning the heisman guarantees NFL success. Please find me this person you are using as your example.
I think TC is just trying to give me a hard time. This personal debate has turned into a circular argument- mostly based on using the exception (on TC's part) and using nit picking semantics to try and make me look bad.
Ergo- me: best of the best succeed the NFL
TC: rookie qbs that succeed are best of best, inferring Heisman winners are exactly that.
JF: Heisman= best of best
me: Heisman does not always = best of best of best in pros.
I think we really need to lock this thread and start JF II, it's gotten far too long.
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The dude played with 2 top 10 first round pick on the offensive side of the ball.
Quick, when was the last time a Heisman winner played with 2 top 10 picks?
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The dude played with 2 top 10 first round pick on the offensive side of the ball.
Quick, when was the last time a Heisman winner played with 2 top 10 picks?
The dude played with 2 top 10 first round pick on the offensive side of the ball.
Quick, when was the last time a Heisman winner played with 2 top 10 picks?
2012, Johnny Manziel!
What's my prize?
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@everlastingxxx said:
You guys like using straw man arguments. I doubt you will find a single person that would say that winning the heisman guarantees NFL success. Please find me this person you are using as your example.
I think TC is just trying to give me a hard time. This personal debate has turned into a circular argument- mostly based on using the exception (on TC's part) and using nit picking semantics to try and make me look bad.
Ergo- me: best of the best succeed the NFL
TC: rookie qbs that succeed are best of best, inferring Heisman winners are exactly that.
JF: Heisman= best of best
me: Heisman does not always = best of best of best in pros.
I think we really need to lock this thread and start JF II, it's gotten far too long.
I think TC is just trying to give me a hard time. This personal debate has turned into a circular argument- mostly based on using the exception (on TC's part) and using nit picking semantics to try and make me look bad.
Ergo- me: best of the best succeed the NFL
TC: rookie qbs that succeed are best of best, inferring Heisman winners are exactly that.
JF: Heisman= best of best
me: Heisman does not always = best of best of best in pros.
I think we really need to lock this thread and start JF II, it's gotten far too long.
Agree:
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Do you think there's a billion threads on the Redskins forum about Alfred Morris? What about Brian Orakpo?
Do you think there's a billion threads on the Colts forum about Coby Fleener?
Do you think there's a billion threads on the Jaguars forum about Toby Gerhardt?
You guys pine for a big name quarterback, then bitch when he's the only thing that everyone talks about. It's absolutely fucking hilarious.
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yep he's a big name QB, in name only, so far.
the only people bitching are the fans that think if someone doesn't post manziel as the best thing since sliced bread they think it's a negative attack.
the guy said they should lock THIS thread. not that you couldn't start a new one.
lost that sense of humor. someone run over your dog?
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that can't be me cuz i know shit about football, but i am well versed in sarcasm and wit.
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@everlastingxxx said:
You guys like using straw man arguments. I doubt you will find a single person that would say that winning the heisman guarantees NFL success. Please find me this person you are using as your example.
I think TC is just trying to give me a hard time. This personal debate has turned into a circular argument- mostly based on using the exception (on TC's part) and using nit picking semantics to try and make me look bad.
Ergo- me: best of the best succeed the NFL
TC: rookie qbs that succeed are best of best, inferring Heisman winners are exactly that.
JF: Heisman= best of best
me: Heisman does not always = best of best of best in pros.
I think we really need to lock this thread and start JF II, it's gotten far too long.
I think we really need to lock this thread and start JF II, it's gotten far too long.I had a seconding motion on that- so done deal
Do you think there's a billion threads on the Redskins forum about Alfred Morris? What about Brian Orakpo?
Do you think there's a billion threads on the Colts forum about Coby Fleener?
Do you think there's a billion threads on the Jaguars forum about Toby Gerhardt?
You guys pine for a big name quarterback, then bitch when he's the only thing that everyone talks about. It's absolutely fucking hilarious.
TC, I want a winning team, if Manziel helps provide it, great.
@mike-h said:
The only people bitching are the ones who said he wasn't a 1st-round pick, and that the Browns wouldn't pick him. It's really sad. They will continue to discredit him until given proof on the field that they were wrong. Which is fine. But the lengths people will go to in order to protect their laughable and "alledged" football acumen are stubborn, egotistical, and childish.
Mike, I'm over it. True, I didn't want the Browns to draft Manziel- but they did, and there isn't a damn thing I can do about it. What do you mean discredit? He's a first round rookie quarterback- drafted in the same spot as Brady Quinn and Brandon Weeden- so excuse me if if long years of watching first round quarterbacks mega-bust has taught me to temper my enthusiasm. . I'm hoping for the best- so far, so good, the way JF has carried himself, and the way the Browns have handled the media circus. What's irked me is the guys who are putting him in the HOF before he even takes a snap in a regular season game. I'll save my cheering for when he actually does something.
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Johnny Douchebag
My work here is done
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Doubters lacking in knowledge? I'd ask you to try and enlighten us, but you've already done that to no avail. It's known who he is and what he's done, but it's different now at this level.
If Manziel is the one to lead us to the promised land...so be it...go Johnny go...
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i really do hope this guy is the fran tarkenton of our time, if not better.
i would just ask everyone who is a fan of the browns or of JF himself to let the coaches coach. i really doubt that the organization picked him to fail. i have faith in the coaching staff to evaluate and make the decision of who starts and who doesn't. doesn't mean any decision is set in stone.
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Yes, Manziel is taking over Cleveland, but that other thread had gotten FAR too long. Post away, from your Friendly Moderator team.
Yes, Manziel is taking over Cleveland, but that other thread had gotten FAR too long. Post away, from your Friendly Moderator team.
It would have been sacrilege for any thread to overtake the Hot Cheerleader thread, after all, no?
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Damn Johnny dick suckers.
Not enough that 1 thread is devoted to him, now he has two.
You cocksuckers obviously swallow.
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@everlastingxxx said:
Yes i am an excessive Johnny fan. Yes i am a Browns fan because of #2. Yes i believe he will start day 1. Yes i believe he will lead Cleveland to a winning record. Yes i think doubters are lacking in knowledge. Money Manziel fans unite! Be proud, be loud! lol
And what if none of that occurs? What if he, like all rookies should, spend at least half the season on the pine? What if Brian Hoyer actually looks good and has the team winning such that it appears that JFF stays on the bench for a while? Where will your rooting interest lie then?
Don't get us wrong....everyone wants JFF to succeed and lead the team to the promise land. I don't think this team drafted JFF in the first round for him to sit on the bench.
But we are not without knowledge...just confidence. We know that highly touted #22 overall QB draft choices can sink like the Titanic.....can you say Brady Quinn and Brandon Weeden. And I know, you are going to say that JFF is not Brandon Weeden or Brady Quinn. Well, I sure as fuck hope not. We have been burned going down that trail too many times.
Once, twice, three times bitten, a dozen times shy babe. (courtesies to Ian Hunter).
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Few more... I think...
2. The QB named John who is #17 in career TD passes (note: not Elway or Unitas) Brodie?
5. The John who is 4th all time in scoring: Carney (sp?) the kicker
7. The only WR named John who is in the Hall of Fame: Stallworth
8. The only TE named John who is in the HOF: Mackey
Few more... I think...
2. The QB named John who is #17 in career TD passes (note: not Elway or Unitas) Brodie? No, good guess though.
5. The John who is 4th all time in scoring: Carney (sp?) the kicker Check
7. The only WR named John who is in the Hall of Fame: Stallworth Check
8. The only TE named John who is in the HOF: Mackey Check
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