So what does Cleveland do about Gordon?
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No... you send a message to the rest of the locker room.
"we want you for your athletic talent, and you can screw up
3 times, 4 times, and we still won't have the nads to dump
you off this team."
I'm all for second chances, but this ignorant, entitled, enabled guy
needs to go.
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Some of us are talking like Josh just "made a mistake" and everyone deserves a second chance.
Hey, I believe in second chances--I wouldn't be where I am in life without a couple of second chances
over the years.
Here's the problem: this shit has been going on since October 2010 when he fell asleep in the
drive-thru of a Taco Bell and police found weed in his car. I've read the accounts of his fuck-ups
and in every single one he says he has learned his lesson and is going to apply himself and how
tough it is to watch his teammates on the field blah, blah, blah. His recent heart-warming letter is
just more of the same---"I've made bad choices, I need to grow up, I won't let you down, etc., etc.
The ONLY reason to keep him around is that he won't cost us anything, but how much time do we spend
spinning our wheels, running in place with this guy? Does anyone, based on his past conduct, honestly
expect him to suddenly change? I'm sorry, I just see more and more and more of the same in the
future for Josh Gordon.
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Douche,
About the only place I disagree with your last 3 posts is that I am NOT yet ready to throw the towel in on Johnny. We'll see what happens there.
As far as Josh goes, in a nutshell, your statement "Getting rid of him is addition by subtraction" is exactly what I feel. People are thinking that not cutting him costs us nothing. BULLCRAP! Keeping him costs us FAR MORE than "immediate" money.Keeping him perpetuates the widespread negative perception of the Browns that still exists. Let's get rid of the negative & go forward
As Farmer indicated about Johnny, "talk's cheap". Haven't we heard Gordon's talk long enough?
I'm for sending a strong message that athleticism is only PART of what is needed for success. Maybe Johnny will get it, but it's too late for Gordon. Cutting Gordon also may send a message to Johnny that talent isn't enough.
CUT Josh Gordon now, please.
Mike
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I just want to see what happens with Johnny, but on a very short leash. While he must be responsible for his actions, our new offensive coaches CANNOT allow an entire season go by without holding him accountable. Apparently, his week to week progress (lack of) was NOT monitored. This TC, it's "put up or shut up" time for Johnny.
The cutting of Gordon will, at least IMO), send the message.
We'll see, but I think we basically agree...You can't be healthy as a Family without taking the trash out as needed.
Mike
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I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks.
Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents.
Patriots:
Amendola - undrafted
Edelman - 7th round
LaFell - 3rd round
Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who?
Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who?
EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer.
2015 draft:
First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE.
The more labels you have for yourself, the dumber they make you. "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." Paul Brown -
I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks.
Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents.
Patriots:
Amendola - undrafted
Edelman - 7th round
LaFell - 3rd round
Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who?
Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who?
EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer.
2015 draft:
First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE.
I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks.
Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents.
Patriots:
Amendola - undrafted
Edelman - 7th round
LaFell - 3rd round
Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who?
Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who?
EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer.
2015 draft:
First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE.
this was from the draft simulator thread. even though i have a wr in the first it still meets all the criteria of filling the essential holes and depth.
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This is a no brainer, you keep him. His value might be greatly diminished but he still has value.
Best case: he gets his shit straight, comes back and produces, creates more value or both. The players see that the FO actually cares about them and are willing to work with them. Win-win.
Worst case: he keeps fucking up and can only play for us. If he wants redemption, it has to be for us. The players see that the FO isn't going to fuck around and they need to keep their noses clean. We lose out on the talent but send a strong message to the players that the FO will ruin your career if you fuck with them.
The only message you send by cutting him is that the FO has no spine and will grant you the opportunity to continue your career elsewhere if you cause enough trouble.
Would you give away a 1964 1/2 Mustang because it had a couple dents in it?
This is a no brainer, you keep him. His value might be greatly diminished but he still has value.
Best case: he gets his shit straight, comes back and produces, creates more value or both. The players see that the FO actually cares about them and are willing to work with them. Win-win.
Worst case: he keeps fucking up and can only play for us. If he wants redemption, it has to be for us. The players see that the FO isn't going to fuck around and they need to keep their noses clean. We lose out on the talent but send a strong message to the players that the FO will ruin your career if you fuck with them.
The only message you send by cutting him is that the FO has no spine and will grant you the opportunity to continue your career elsewhere if you cause enough trouble.
Would you give away a 1964 1/2 Mustang because it had a couple dents in it?
If the 1964 1/2 Mustang costs you $1.6 million dollars in 2015 and won't be running...yeah, probably.
I think your definition of "a couple dents" differs from everyone else. Do "a couple dents" keep the Mustang parked for 1/3 of it's life?
So are you spoiled, stupid or just merely allow your emotions to govern how you act, or more aptly, react?
I don't give shit away for free. No person who understands the concept of value does. It's called capitalism and it's kind of a big deal around these parts.
No person who understands NFL contracts deeper than "don't give away good players" sits on a WR who's failed multiple drug tests and can't stay on the field.
If they can use the multiple suspensions to re-sign him to a bargain basement contract, then it would be stupid to release him. However, if he even asks for Top 25 - money, it's not worth it.
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I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks.
Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents.
Patriots:
Amendola - undrafted
Edelman - 7th round
LaFell - 3rd round
Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who?
Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who?
EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer.
2015 draft:
First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE.
I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks.
Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents.
Patriots:
Amendola - undrafted
Edelman - 7th round
LaFell - 3rd round
Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who?
Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who?
EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer.
2015 draft:
First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE.
The key difference between us and them is that they have a QB who is more than capable of turning those WR's into stars.
We do not.
Someone has to bail someone out on one side. Either a top WR target to bail out a less than average QB or a talented QB to bail out his less than average WR's.
(I'd also like to note that the play style of Wilson allows for Seattle to have less talented WR's, since it's nearly impossible for a corner to cover a WR for more than 5-6 seconds. If Johnny could replicate that, I would be all for us following Seattle's model.)
Gordon is going to have to be resigned before he plays another down. I don't think the argument is cutting him today, it's more do we trade him or sign him to a new contract even though he will play as many downs next season as Franklin D. Roosevelt.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
@douche-nozzle said:
The reason to cut him yesterday is simple. The Browns have been a dysfunctional organization for a long time and the only way they will shed that image is to get rid of the junk (including little Johnny) and build a real team. Keeping him on the off chance, against all odds, that he will get his shit together is like keeping junk cars in your yard in case they become worth something and then wondering why your neighbors think you are a loser.
Keeping him is a bright shining example that the Cleveland Browns simply don't know what they are doing.
Clinches it... I am now positive we must keep Josh.
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I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks.
Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents.
Patriots:
Amendola - undrafted
Edelman - 7th round
LaFell - 3rd round
Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who?
Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who?
EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer.
2015 draft:
First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE.
The key difference between us and them is that they have a QB who is more than capable of turning those WR's into stars.
We do not.
Someone has to bail someone out on one side. Either a top WR target to bail out a less than average QB or a talented QB to bail out his less than average WR's.
(I'd also like to note that the play style of Wilson allows for Seattle to have less talented WR's, since it's nearly impossible for a corner to cover a WR for more than 5-6 seconds. If Johnny could replicate that, I would be all for us following Seattle's model.)
Gordon is going to have to be resigned before he plays another down. I don't think the argument is cutting him today, it's more do we trade him or sign him to a new contract even though he will play as many downs next season as Franklin D. Roosevelt.
Gordon is going to have to be resigned before he plays another down. I don't think the argument is cutting him today, it's more do we trade him or sign him to a new contract even though he will play as many downs next season as Franklin D. Roosevelt.
not really.....
because of his 2015 suspension, we now have him under contract through 2016......AND.....
because he was suspended for that final game(plus the 10 others) he now cannot meet the playing time standard for UFA, meaning at the end of 2016 he will be RFA....
so, we got him as long as we want him really....
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Gordon is going to have to be resigned before he plays another down. I don't think the argument is cutting him today, it's more do we trade him or sign him to a new contract even though he will play as many downs next season as Franklin D. Roosevelt.
not really.....
because of his 2015 suspension, we now have him under contract through 2016......AND.....
because he was suspended for that final game(plus the 10 others) he now cannot meet the playing time standard for UFA, meaning at the end of 2016 he will be RFA....
so, we got him as long as we want him really....
not really.....
because of his 2015 suspension, we now have him under contract through 2016......AND.....
because he was suspended for that final game(plus the 10 others) he now cannot meet the playing time standard for UFA, meaning at the end of 2016 he will be RFA....
so, we got him as long as we want him really....
Ah, I thought 2014 was his contract year, not 2015, and that's why that last game suspension was ultra-shifty. Turns out it was only marginally less shifty.
So now we have an entire year to sit on Gordon while his suspension plays out. This situation is much different than what I originally imagined, however still not ideal. Worst case scenario is that Gordon returns from his suspension, has a Pro Bowl season, signs a huge contract and then gets suspended again. Best case scenario is that Gordon comes back, has a pedestrian season, signs a franchise-friendly contract, then tears it up for the next 10 years.
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exactly......and if he's good in 2016, I still doubt anyone trusts him enough to offer an outrageous amount.....and well be closer to the situation, so I think well be in a good position to know how he's coming along AND to get him at a fair value.........
HA!...and it's all 2 years out and he's never even gone a year w/o trouble.......so, well see........not holding my breath
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