Jonathan Paul Manziel
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Well, Mike probably was more candid than he needed to be.
If you listen late night to Freddie Coleman on ESPN he has a segment- "what they said, what I heard." Allow me to translate Pettine's comment. "We f**ked up majorly taking JFF, and we're almost for certain going to have to hit the reset button on quarterback in 2015- again. "
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Reset on the position. Watch u takin bout willis
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Pretty sure he meant they did not realize the extent of JM's problems when they took him. To be honest I don't think JM even realized that. Now he does. Will that change the way he approaches the new season and his ability to adapt to the NFL game? Who knows. Obviously MP does not yet know and has to presume he needs at least one backup plan.
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Johnny Manziel deserves a fair chance, and he'll make good
February 18, 2015 7:28 pm ET
INDIANAPOLIS -- Six quarters. That's it.
You want to call a career dead after six quarters of football? That's what many in the media are doing by banging on Cleveland Browns quarterback Johnny Manziel. Yes, Manziel has issues, ones he's trying to fix, but to just label him a bust after not even playing two full games is just shortsighted.
Yet judging by the thinking of the masses, and especially many in the media, Manziel's career is over before it even really started.
That's just foolish.
Manziel's rookie season in 2014 was anything but smooth, but to think he's a complete bust based on six quarters of football is absurd. Manziel is addressing his issues now with his decision to go to a rehab facility, which is a step in the right direction.
Manziel's partying was no secret to the league's evaluators when he came out of Texas A&M. What was is the extent of it, which is why he's smart to get the help he needs.
The Browns don't sound like a team moving on from him, despite his issues. Coach Mike Pettine talked with the media here at the NFL combine on Wednesday and said he recentlywent to visit Manziel in rehab.
"There were some issues that at the end of the year he felt he needed to address," Pettine said. "He stepped forward and said, 'I need help,' and went ahead and initiated it."
The Browns didn't send him there. He went on his own. That's a good sign.
"To respect his privacy, he's in a much better place now than before he went in," Pettine said. "He's very determined to come out of it in a much better way."
When Manziel was coming of college, his partying ways were all over the Internet. He was a TMZ regular. General managers told me leading up to the draft that he would have to slow down -- just to be a capable NFL starter.
It wasn't that Manziel wasn't smart from a football standpoint. In fact, he was just the opposite, according to several league sources. He was a football savant.
But being able to do it on the board and taking it to the field are two different things. It takes work, time and effort. That means after practice and at home. Clearly that was not the case for Manziel.
He needs to eat, sleep and breathe quarterback rather doing it half-ass. That's what a stint in rehab can do for him, make him focus on playing the position the right way.
Manziel was bad in his two starts, which ended with him injured with a hamstring issue, and it was apparent that he wasn't ready for the responsibilities that go along with playing the position.
His mechanics were awful, which is why his passes fluttered.
He looked jumpy. He looked flustered. But that comes with preparation, which he clearly pushed aside for his nightlife ways.
Manziel's arm is plenty good enough. His size will always be an issue, but we see Russell Wilson playing in two Super Bowls and he can't see much better over the line than Manziel can.
Big difference: Wilson loves it and lives it. Manziel has to get to that. That's the unknown, which is why Cleveland will look to bring in other quarterbacks.
"That's probably accurate just because you look at the uncertainty of where he is," Pettine said "Just given the small sample size we still don't know based on what he was going through whether or not he is that answer. There's too much unknown. I'd obviously be scared if we had a game this weekend."
The good news for the Browns is they don't play a game that matters until September, which means Manziel has seven months to get himself right and get himself in the mindset to be an NFL quarterback.
I talked to several coaches and general managers Wednesday who all indicated that we, as a whole, rush to call these quarterbacks failures. Give it time. Let it marinate. In a year or so, then we will know for sure.
But after six quarters, with a kid fighting some personal demons? That's way too early.
"I wanted to go visit him and see how he's doing and let him know that we're proud of him for the decision he made to go in and obviously he has our full support," Pettine said.
If Manziel comes to camp the same person and player, then the Browns will have big problems. But I am making a prediction now: Manziel will be the Browns openingday starter, and he will be a different man and quarterback. I am not going to sit here and say he will be the next franchise passer, but he will be good enough to win the job.
Johnny PartyBoy will be part of his past.
Johnny Football will be back. Wait and see.
Mike Pettine says he recently visited Johnny Manziel in rehab. (USATSI)
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Possible location of JFFs rehab: the Interval Brotherhood Home. S. Main St. Akron (Portage Lakes area). I have been there a time or two to see clients. It is a sprawling camp like campus. Not luxurious by any means.
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"Manziel will be the Browns openingday starter, and he will be a different man and quarterback.
Johnny PartyBoy will be part of his past.
Johnny Football will be back. Wait and see."
Slope of hope.
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"Manziel will be the Browns openingday starter, and he will be a different man and quarterback.
Johnny PartyBoy will be part of his past.
Johnny Football will be back. Wait and see."
Slope of hope.
"Manziel will be the Browns openingday starter, and he will be a different man and quarterback.
Johnny PartyBoy will be part of his past.
Johnny Football will be back. Wait and see."
Slope of hope.
Keep dreaming.
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Pretty sure he meant they did not realize the extent of JM's problems when they took him. To be honest I don't think JM even realized that. Now he does. Will that change the way he approaches the new season and his ability to adapt to the NFL game? Who knows. Obviously MP does not yet know and has to presume he needs at least one backup plan.
Pretty sure he meant they did not realize the extent of JM's problems when they took him. To be honest I don't think JM even realized that. Now he does. Will that change the way he approaches the new season and his ability to adapt to the NFL game? Who knows. Obviously MP does not yet know and has to presume he needs at least one backup plan.
Well Ag- I think someone put else in in perspective. Just before the Titanic sank- the Captain said- " I didn't realize 90% of the iceberg was under water." We were going full steam ahead too.
I am pulling for the guy to get it right. It's a new season.
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Pretty sure he meant they did not realize the extent of JM's problems when they took him. To be honest I don't think JM even realized that. Now he does. Will that change the way he approaches the new season and his ability to adapt to the NFL game? Who knows. Obviously MP does not yet know and has to presume he needs at least one backup plan.
Well Ag- I think someone put else in in perspective. Just before the Titanic sank- the Captain said- " I didn't realize 90% of the iceberg was under water." We were going full steam ahead too.
I am pulling for the guy to get it right. It's a new season.
Well Ag- I think someone put else in in perspective. Just before the Titanic sank- the Captain said- " I didn't realize 90% of the iceberg was under water." We were going full steam ahead too.
I am pulling for the guy to get it right. It's a new season.
Well hopefully we have only seen 10% of what he can do on a field and get to see the other 90% from this point on.
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didn't like the pick, didn't like most of the poser fans that came along with it (even though we got a couple of keepers out of the bunch...AG1969...
) but who doesn't root for the underdog?if all it takes is a stint in rehab to bring out the player that he was in college, then hell kid stay until TC.
too bad there is no crystal ball for a GM/coach to look into in order for them to slate their draft board. hopefully they take the safe route and bring in some raggy old vet to hold the team down for another year. worse record (schedule), time to evaluate manziel again, and see how the draft picks work out and then decide if manziel is the man going forward or is out the door...... and they go all in on cardale next year.
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didn't like the pick, didn't like most of the poser fans that came along with it (even though we got a couple of keepers out of the bunch...AG1969...
) but who doesn't root for the underdog?if all it takes is a stint in rehab to bring out the player that he was in college, then hell kid stay until TC.
too bad there is no crystal ball for a GM/coach to look into in order for them to slate their draft board. hopefully they take the safe route and bring in some raggy old vet to hold the team down for another year. worse record (schedule), time to evaluate manziel again, and see how the draft picks work out and then decide if manziel is the man going forward or is out the door...... and they go all in on cardale next year.
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I think he's the only one still here!
cuz he's an actual browns fan. others were just here to catch the johnny show, which unfortunately for us all, bombed.
maybe the sequel will be better.
(i would mention the historically horrid JF fans by name but i'm afraid in doing so they'd come knocking on the door again).
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This post may rank in the top five for "Most Flameworthy Post of All-Time", especially given how hard I've been on Mariota recently. This post isn't a personal endorsement of the player, just a way for me to kill time during lunch.
Speculation: Marcus Mariota is going to be a Cleveland Brown.
We'll start with Mary Kay Cabot's article a few days ago. In it Mary Kay talks about how Farmer was enamored with Mariota last season and that they continued to scout him this season. Not much more than common sense, but something.
Second, the quote from Pettine today that states the Browns are looking at the draft and free agency with the mindset they have to find a starting quarterback.
The third, and most convincing reason, is Kevin O'Connell. Obviously, O'Connell worked with Mariota throughout the pre-draft process. That's been discussed. Then, there's this:
"What I don't think the fans and media understand is that all these guys like Mariota, (Johnny) Manziel and (Bryce) Petty are all pure projection players. We can see certain characteristics on tape, but they don't play the same game that we play in the NFL so we can't see things we need to on tape. We have to make calculated guesses. I know this, I wouldn't bet against Mariota. He's a good football player." -- AFC QB coach
The aforementioned quote is on Marcus Mariota's NFL.com scouting profile. It's also clearly a quote from Kevin O'Connell... the only AFC North QB coach who has ties to all three of the quarterbacks mentioned in that quote (Mariota, Manziel and Petty). On it's own, nothing special. Combined with everything else, it is interesting.The fourth reason is the hire of John DeFillippo as OC. Flip is credited with developing Derek Carr in Oakland. Carr, a 6'3", 210 lb. freakishly athletic quarterback himself, also had many concerns about his transition due to the offensive system that he ran in college. Flip was able to turn Carr into a viable NFL QB in his rookie year, maybe he was brought to Cleveland not only because of his ties with Pettine and the area, but also because of what he'll need to do with Mariota?Speculation: Manziel to the Eagles?There's been a lot of talk about what the Browns could do with Johnny Manziel, especially if they are indeed looking to draft a QB this year. Obviously, we could keep him and have the quarterbacks battle it out this offseason. But, there could also be a trade with Philadelphia in the works. Chip Kelly has already stated that Manziel is more or less "the one that got away".“When I coached at Oregon, he was tailor made for [the system],” Kelly said to CSNPhilly. “He broke my heart. I love the kid. I think he's a hell of a football player,” Kelly added.
Obviously, there are tons of reports about how Philadelphia will risk nothing to move up in the draft and take Mariota. However, a simple compromise could be getting the guy he originally wanted to run his offense in Oregon, along with someone else, without having to give up everything to do it.
Speculation: Crazy three-way trade scenario.
Because of the above scenarios, I've decided to just lump them all together and form a three-way trade. So, here goes:
Cleveland trades Johnny Manziel and Josh Gordon to Philadelphia and, in return, receives #52.
Philadelphia trades Nick Foles to Tampa Bay.
Tampa Bay trades Cleveland the #1 overall and, in return, receives Cleveland's #12 and #19.
Cleveland Gives: Manziel, Gordon, #12, #19
Cleveland Receives: Mariota, #52
Tampa Bay Gives: #1
Tampa Bay Receives: Nick Foles, #12, #19
Philadelphia Gives: Nick Foles, #52
Philadelphia Receives: Johnny Manziel, Josh Gordon
In this scenario, all three teams get what they are looking for. Tampa gets the tall, strong armed quarterback that Lovie Smith likes. And, as an added benefit, he has also proven to be successful in the NFL. In addition they are getting two first round picks to address other needs. On paper, Tampa Bay may come out the best in this deal.
Philadelphia gets the athletic, playmaking quarterback that Kelly salivates over and, as an added bonus, they're getting a freakishly talented WR who could go on to be a future HOFer, and they are only getting him at the cost of a second round pick.
Cleveland gets the quarterback they wanted in Mariota without having to completely break the bank to get him, plus they receive a second round pick as well, giving them picks #43, #52, #77, #108, #112 in the first four rounds.
(For the sake of expedition, I only factored in draft picks for this year. It would be more likely that there would be future draft picks involved as well.)
TL;DR: Mariota to Browns. Manziel to Eagles. Gordon to Eagles. Foles to Tampa.
This thread is meant to house any and every sort of fantastical draft trade scenario over the upcoming few weeks, rather than have them interspersed in random threads about other things. Have at it, tear mine apart and create your own.
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If JM had never stepped foot on the field this year and wouldn't currently be residing in rehab...this could theoretically happen if Tampa Bay's FO thought that Foles upside was infinitely greater than either Mariota or Winston. Despite the fact I don't really care that much for either Winston or Mariota, something tells me the Tampa fan base would go Islamic State on the Bucs FO if they pulled that.
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I also doubt the eagles want fuck all to do with Josh Gordon.
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If I was a Tampa bay fan and they turned the number one pick into a young, proven QB AND picked up two picks in the top twenty, I'd jump for joy; that's one hell of a first round.
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My problem would be this: Why would we trade these guys at their all-time lowest value?
Gordon: Let him sit out for a year. That's a no-brainer. He'll be worth more next year when he can actually play for somebody and has made it through his suspension. No is trading anything for a guy that needs to serve out a suspension, and it does not cost us anything to keep him around.
Manziel: The kid is sitting in rehab. Totally unproven player with two horrible starts under his belt who is probably going to be battling as a recovering alcoholic/addict for the rest of his career. Nobody wants him now. You bring him back, you let him prove his sobriety, play some preseason, than maybe he is worth something.
You are trying to trade guys that are practically untradeable right now. They both need to come back and get on the football field again and show promise before we can use either as trade bait.
Zombo
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This thread is meant to house any and every sort of fantastical draft trade scenario over the upcoming few weeks, rather than have them interspersed in random threads about other things. Have at it, tear mine apart and create your own.
This thread is meant to house any and every sort of fantastical draft trade scenario over the upcoming few weeks, rather than have them interspersed in random threads about other things. Have at it, tear mine apart and create your own.
This thread is meant to house any and every sort of fantastical draft trade scenario over the upcoming few weeks, rather than have them interspersed in random threads about other things. Have at it, tear mine apart and create your own.
This thread is meant to house any and every sort of fantastical draft trade scenario over the upcoming few weeks, rather than have them interspersed in random threads about other things. Have at it, tear mine apart and create your own.
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That ^ actually wasn't supposed to happen.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride
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