O-line Draft Class of 2015

Naberius_Cerbera

For the life of me, I'd like to understand DJ Humphries inclusion in some reputable mockers' Top 10 overall.

Tour, you have him the 20th ranked Tackle at a 7th round value. Why would some teams being falling in love with DJ Humphries?

(enough to perpetuate rumor he may be first Tackle to go...crazy?)

Naberius_Cerbera

Tour, would you applaud Tre Jackson wearing Brown & Orange with pick #43?

I like him there if Clemmings, Erving & Flowers are gone and O-line has yet to be addressed in the draft.

Also, does Odighizuwa/DE fit our 3-4 scheme, in your opinion?

Tour2ma

@naberius_cerbera said:

For the life of me, I'd like to understand DJ Humphries inclusion in some reputable mockers' Top 10 overall.

Tour, you have him the 20th ranked Tackle at a 7th round value. Why would some teams being falling in love with DJ Humphries?

(enough to perpetuate rumor he may be first Tackle to go...crazy?)

The rankings are DraftScouts, not mine. I haven't gotten to Humphrey's tape yet. From what I understand of his story, it's a mix of youth, potential and injury. Post-combine he has risen to the #10 slot.

@naberius_cerbera said:

Tour, would you applaud Tre Jackson wearing Brown & Orange with pick #43?

I like him there if Clemmings, Erving & Flowers are gone and O-line has yet to be addressed in the draft.

Also, does Odighizuwa/DE fit our 3-4 scheme, in your opinion?

Not a lot of work in on Jackson, but as of now I'd say no... too heavy-footed for the ZBS.

D-line is not my focus, but I don't see Odigh in Pet's hybrid... too much of a tweener.

TexasAg1969

@tour2ma said:

Big kid? Or another in what seems like a line of smallish, but quick, Missou D-line?

Brantley looks like a 3-4 DE of the future...

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=122161&draftyear=2017&genpos=DT

This is how he is listed anyway.

Terry Beckner Jr.

Video | Scouts Report

DT East Saint Louis, IL

East St. Louis High School 6'4'' 298

Tour2ma

Finally got around to DJ. Good prospect, but I don't see first round talent. That said a lot of folks must see potential as he has shot up DraftScout's OT list from #20 initially with a 7th round grade to #7 now with a 2nd...

DJ Humphries: Florida (03-18-15) vs LSU/ FSU - no kick, but good chop; fires high at times; waist leaner in pass pro and can get pulled off bal/ ripped; fluid to 2nd level, but not real effective when gets there; once ripped inside is set to be beat by speed out; looks to have good head.... no errors, missed assignments, etc.

Flugel

@tour2ma said:

Offensive Tackle Reviews

LTs:

Brandon Scherff: Iowa (02-02-15) vs. IND/Maryland - No kick dropstep - shuffles; good feet; good hands, but high. Prone to getting bulled by power and faked by speed. Good accel, no drive. Do not run his way much. Head? Strength? Athletic, but fundamentally weak

Andrus Peat: Stanford (02-02-15) vs. ND - fldgling kick step; great posture; power, agility, looks to be head of the class by more than a little, NFL ready

La'el Collins: LSU (02-09-15) vs. Wis/Auburn/BAMA/OleMiss - Good movement, but lacks fluidity of top prospect, good angles, Power?; most determined game vs. Ole Miss Reaction time? Raw, no drop step;

Erick Flowers: Miami (02-10-15) vs. FSU/UVA/S.Car - Fluid w/ signs of technique vs. FSU; choppier v SC, but still effective. Does not destroy 2nd level.

Cameron Erving: FSU (02-11-15) vs. OK St/ND - no kick; lotta waist bend; feet look heavy; fires out on run blocks; focus? Head? ND's DE Sheldon Day gave fits with low edge rush. I can see as an interior prospect, but would like to see tape on him there.

Tyrus Thompson: Oklahoma (02-13-15) vs. WVU - Slow, no tech.. no kick drop; no fireout, awkward

Ty Sambrailo: Colorado St. (02-13-15) vs. SanJose St/BC - fledgling kick, good chop steps, decent posture, unchallenged by SJ, runs well and under control, reminds of Bito; conditioning? some fall off late 1st half vs. BC, can pull. Good discipline, quick decisions. Strength?

RTs:
T.J.Clemmings: Pitt (02-09-15) vs. Duke/Mia/UVA/VaTech - has kick-drop; latches on; can move; good fire and turn; stays with OG; calm, good decisions; comp level? Can he move to Left side?

Daryl Williams: Oklahoma (02-13-15) vs. WVU - fledgling kick, ugly chop with bit wide stance and lean, mild fire a bit upright, crosses feet in retreat

Nice work Tour - thanks for putting that all that together!

Is there a guy you'd like our front office to strongly consider in round 1 or do you think we have more pressing needs at this time?

I didn't realize Ereck Flowers had surgery on a torn meniscus during last season and returned later in the year. I just got this information in the Draft Guide I bought this weekend. It also says he's adept at getting to the second level; but I agree with your assessment he doesn't destroy it. In fact, the NC matchup I'll link below is from 2 seasons ago which shows a lot of what you found in other matchups above. He has a bad habit of putting his head down when he's downfield so he misses a lot of very doable blocks on smaller bodied guys. That shouldn't be impossible to correct wherever he goes. I once thought he'd be somebody I'd be okay with in round 1 but I've cooled off on that.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+videos+of+ereck+flowers&FORM=VIRE3#view=detail&mid=059011F03FB4D09F1E33059011F03FB4D09F1E33

In this draft I think I'd rather have us go oline in round 3 or 4. I like your guy Ali Marpet somewhere in this part of the draft. I'm hoping the position and small school thing keeps him out there until round 4 or so.

Mudfly

@tour2ma said:

Finally got around to DJ. Good prospect, but I don't see first round talent. That said a lot of folks must see potential as he has shot up DraftScout's OT list from #20 initially with a 7th round grade to #7 now with a 2nd...

DJ Humphries: Florida (03-18-15) vs LSU/ FSU - no kick, but good chop; fires high at times; waist leaner in pass pro and can get pulled off bal/ ripped; fluid to 2nd level, but not real effective when gets there; once ripped inside is set to be beat by speed out; looks to have good head.... no errors, missed assignments, etc.

so what is your final thought on where he should go....7th round to the 2nd round is quite a jump....

and do you have ideas on these 2 centers I keep seeing(and picking) in the 4th-5tth roundish area....Finney and Gallik?.....either one a C/G prospect or potential Mack replacement(forgive the suggestion).....

ballpeen

@mudfly said:

and do you have ideas on these 2 centers I keep seeing(and picking) in the 4th-5tth roundish area....Finney and Gallik?.....either one a C/G prospect or potential Mack replacement(forgive the suggestion).....

But it needs to be made. I have in another thread. I think the odds are good Mack opts out.

I'd like to stay ahead of the 8ball here and bring in a good prospect this year.....that gives us options.

Tour2ma

@mudfly said:

so what is your final thought on where (Marpet) should go....7th round to the 2nd round is quite a jump....

and do you have ideas on these 2 centers I keep seeing(and picking) in the 4th-5tth roundish area....Finney and Gallik?.....either one a C/G prospect or potential Mack replacement(forgive the suggestion).....

I do not think Marpet will be there for our 3rd Rnd pick. Too much promise there, but it's tough to take him so high based upon a Sr. Bowl and a Combine.

Among Centers I keep going back to Dismukes (Auburn). He seems as balanced as any C in the draft. But there is no Mack that I see. The speed guys (Grasu, Finney) lack power and the power guys (Gallik) lack speed. Of course the speed guys might develop the power where the power guys...

Erving might be a good one, but I've seen no tape on him playing Center. His OT tape showed why a move inside was a better bet for his Pro prospects because it could not have hurt them.

Tour2ma

@flugel said:

Nice work Tour - thanks for putting that all that together!

Is there a guy you'd like our front office to strongly consider in round 1 or do you think we have more pressing needs at this time?

In this draft I think I'd rather have us go oline in round 3 or 4. I like your guy Ali Marpet somewhere in this part of the draft. I'm hoping the position and small school thing keeps him out there until round 4 or so.

Thanks and you're welcome...

I see only two first round worthy O-linemen in the draft, Peat and Clemmings. I don't think either OT fills a pressing need for us.

I see our need as a nearly starter quality OG. With one on the bench I believe we can shuffle our line to cover any single injury.

Clearly Marpet fills that need, but another I like as well, or maybe a tad better, is Ty Sambrallo. Ty is a 2nd round-ish OT destined for the interior line. He reminds me a lot of Bito... and he worked out pretty well.

Of course the above is with no knowledge of how good Painter and Bowie are... maybe this year we find out.

calfoxwc

Thanks, Tour. Obviously, so many different opinions....

I had DJ Humphries in my mock at the 2nd round, and got fussed at

about it, that he was a top 15 pick. And to see their rating of him being

at #20 on the list.

It's crazy. And Humphries - "they" say he will need to develop strength before

he's a starter...but has the tools otherwise.

I think the Browns need somebody who can step in at LT in case Joe Thomas has

to sit out because of an injury, which we all hope never happens. I'm thinkin there

isn't anybody right now, regardless of the depth chart...

Tour2ma

@calfoxwc said:

Thanks, Tour. Obviously, so many different opinions....

I think the Browns need somebody who can step in at LT in case Joe Thomas has

to sit out because of an injury, which we all hope never happens. I'm thinkin there

isn't anybody right now, regardless of the depth chart...

Thanks, cal, and agree... many different opinions. Would be boring if we all agreed...

I thought last year that our best LT option to back up Joe was Bito. I still think that is the case and it is why I think a back up OG is our best path short term. So IMO a player we can drop in at LG or RG (in case we have to replace Mack again with Greco) makes it work for one injury.

Two or more injuries to starters? I'll get back to you...

gumby73

Anybody evaluate C Greg Mancz out of Toledo. Kiper has this kid ranked high all year and now a steal in 6-7th round. Not a Kiper Believer in all I hear...

wargograw

@miktoxic said:

OL U is still wisconsin IMO.

[/b]

Not anymore

wargograw

True, Jarvis Harrison thoughts? Here's tape against Mississippi State from last year. This may have been the biggest and strongest 4-3 D line in the country last year.

wargograw

Buddy of mine started for Pitt the last two years at DE. I'm gonna ask him his thoughts on Scherff ,they played in non-con), Clemmings, and the FSU and Miami guys. Will try to report back. He also transferred from Ohio State so he has that perspective as well.

Tour2ma

Great... will look forward to it.

As you may have read I don't get the Scherff hype at all. Even in a bit on him on NFL Live yesterday they showed footage of him moving, but not accomplishing anything...

Flugel

@tour2ma said:

Thanks and you're welcome...

I see only two first round worthy O-linemen in the draft, Peat and Clemmings. I don't think either OT fills a pressing need for us.

I see our need as a nearly starter quality OG. With one on the bench I believe we can shuffle our line to cover any single injury.

Clearly Marpet fills that need, but another I like as well, or maybe a tad better, is Ty Sambrallo. Ty is a 2nd round-ish OT destined for the interior line. He reminds me a lot of Bito... and he worked out pretty well.

Of course the above is with no knowledge of how good Painter and Bowie are... maybe this year we find out.

I haven't had much luck finding highlights of Peat until I was looking for an OT from Duke and got Andrus Peat's high school highlights instead. I wanted to see more than his ND highlights because I read his areas he needs to improve upon are: plays too upright in pass protection, sacrificing balance and strength. He especially struggles with counter moves - the kind of which he will see more of in the pros - as he too often overextends himself. I basically copied page 50 of the Pro Football Draft Guide word for word on that. In spite of all that, the former scout that wrote the article still ranks him at #2 overall at OT so he doesn't exactly think Peat sucks..

Fair or ignorant on my part is my initial reluctance with a guy of his size is why isn't he ranking like prior slam dunks such as Orlando Pace, Walter Jones, Joe Thomas, Jon Ogden and why am I hearing he needs to play meaner?

In the link I'm sharing that shows him ragdolling countless high school opponents - he stands almost straight up on pass protections to make me feel like the scouting report might carry quite a bit of weight. As Nate Solder once found out in his matchup against up a much shorter but explosive pass rusher off Cal's edge - there's going to be the types of explosiveness that Peat's high school opponents didn't possess to challenge him with. On the other hand, I thought he did better with pad height when it was time to drive block outmanned kids into a different time zone in the running game. Not only that, but he maintained a wide base with his feet to make it more difficult for a defender to shed him off to one side or the other in lieu of their John Deere Tractor rides. I didn't see this reluctance to be mean I heard about nor did any of his opponents. Unfortunately, I have very little to work with at his college level outside of your observations shared about his ND matchup. If you got this stubborn old bastard more intrigued - hats off to ya!

My guess is there anything that can't be corrected. Not only that, but adding another 30 pounds to that frame since this video prolly put quite a bit of horse power into Stanford's running game. The first half of the video is Peat on Offense. Here ya go man:

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=duke%27s+offensive+tackle+video&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=03E5B316FB4E563B6F5E03E5B316FB4E563B6F5E

wargograw

@tour2ma said:

Great... will look forward to it.

As you may have read I don't get the Scherff hype at all. Even in a bit on him on NFL Live yesterday they showed footage of him moving, but not accomplishing anything...

This is not an in-depth analysis of these guys by any means. But here are the quick, off the cuff comments I got.

Scherff-Great run blocker, very aggressive, mean. Finished folks. Not a great pass protector. Probably the most NFL ready on this list at the moment.

Clemmings-Got really good throughout last year and really found himself in the second half of the season. In the spring and in fall camp, my friend said he'd win about 60-70% of the battles with this guy as far as 1 on 1 pass rush . By midseason, he was lucky to win 20% and yet he still felt that he was getting better as a player. THAT's how much improved Clemmings was throughout the course of the season. A head fake and inside move was the most successful on him. That and managing to get Clemmings to slow/stop his feet. Basically stall and see if you can catch him sleeping.

Back when my friend was winning the majority of the battles, he could do a quick bull rush before making his move if he stayed low and extended fully, because Clemmings is a hair slow out of his stance (I saw this on tape too).

Not as NFL ready as Scherff but again, he's just hitting his stride. All the upside in the world. Not elite in pass pro yet and that's why he played the right side.

The guy from Va. Tech-My friend got a sack on him and this was his best game. Had several hurries. In short, this guy is not good.

Florida State guy-Pitt played them in the first game of 2013. This was my friend's first game as a starter and, as he told me, he "basically pissed down [his] leg," so his analysis on this kid may be a bit flawed. Also, we're assuming that the FSU kid in this draft was also starting last year. Maybe he wasn't, in which case you can disregard.

Anyway, my friend said this was the best he played. These guys were big and tough and they waxed Pitt. Front 7 got no penetration all game.

Andrew Norwell, for comparison (undrafted out of Ohio State last year, signed with the Panthers)-Not a technique guy or a combine guy, but just the nastiest SOB you will see. A guy that, for all his other flaws, gets it done in games which is all that matters. Norwell and my friend got in a well documented fight in camp as true freshmen.

Mike Adams-Pretty impossible to go against just because he was so big and long, but he wasn't very sound technically. I THINK that's been borne out in his NFL career? Someone will have to check his PFF grades.

Forgot to ask about the guy from Miami. I will next time. If you have any specific questions you want me to ask him about ACC guys or Scherff, let me know.

Tour2ma

@flugel said:
I haven't had much luck finding highlights of Peat

DraftBreakdown is a great place to start... most are links to youtube vids. Peat's 2014 ND vid is there.

Spoiler Alert: He kicked ass. http://draftbreakdown.com/players/

@wargograw said:
This is not an in-depth analysis of these guys by any means. But here are the quick, off the cuff comments I got.

Interesting perspectives... thanks.