Running back 2009 Draft Preview
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I hope the Browns stay away from this group. Don't burn a high draft pick on a RB when you you haven't given a player like Harrison a shot at getting 70% of the carries. This is a rebuilding year so let's see if Harrison can be that quality every down back that we no longer have in Lewis. If he works out then we won't have to worry too much about the position except for depth purposes.
If Harrison doesn't work out then you can look at the 2010 draft which is loaded with big, quality backs.
The Browns are not going to get everything they need in one draft. Let's fill more immediate needs. Defense. Linebacker's, DE and Safety.
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@inspecta said:
I completely agree with Oldcows assesment of the RB situation. Harrison needs the full workload to see what he really has.I wouldn't take a RB with any of our first three picks, I might take a flier on a guy in the 4th round if he's a good prospect that for whatever reason dropped on draft day. That's about it. Like cow, I say defense defense defense!
Of course Rich disagrees with this and says we should take a RB, but I don't agree with that considering we have a really good one already on the roster, he just wasn't given the workload last year.
I think if we just switched to a tandem backfield and split the carries between JL and JH we will be fine. Jamal still got over 1,000 yards last year......
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i like ian johnson as a late-round/UDFA back. he's been productive throughout his career, has had 2 thousand-yard seasons, has a career average of 5.5 YPC, is a good receiver and is a character guy. plus, he posted good combine numbers. he's done nothing but be successful his entire career. at the very least, he's a good 3rd down back/3rd RB in a RBBC.
if we stick with lewis and harrison this year, johnson would be a good guy to bring in to complete our rotation. he'll be available late, will be a good complimentary player, and selecting him will allow us to focus on areas of greater need and more immediate impact without wasting a higher pick in what people are calling a weak RB draft.
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@shepwrite said:
BTW, Brown has been timed as low as 4.38 electronically and usually runs in the 4.4s. It's his explosion (hence the sick vertical) and nimble feet that scouts love. I fear he'll rise into round 1... but if he were there at 36, I'd be all over that. He's better than Forte.I look at Brown as a Jerome Harrison clone. They are the same size. Brown is an inch taller and 5 pounds heavier.
Harrison ran a mid 4.4 coming out of College. Neither are really strong in the upper frame.....They remind me so much of each other!
The biggest difference is Brown's vertical.
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I like Brown a lot, but I also like Sutton later on if we can address other things. To me, the argument about him being the same back as Harrison doesn't wash, what does it matter? Where is it written that you have to have one big back and one smaller one? If they can play, they can play, plus Sutton can catch the shit out of the rock and play specials while picking up the blitz.
Keep one thing in mind guys ie. JD, if Lewis is still around, he will not be cool about Harrison getting the bulk of the carries. I really foresee him being a cancer unless he's number one.
I really want to move on from him, but that's just me.
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@shepwrite said:
BTW, Brown has been timed as low as 4.38 electronically and usually runs in the 4.4s. It's his explosion (hence the sick vertical) and nimble feet that scouts love. I fear he'll rise into round 1... but if he were there at 36, I'd be all over that. He's better than Forte.I look at Brown as a Jerome Harrison clone. They are the same size. Brown is an inch taller and 5 pounds heavier.
Harrison ran a mid 4.4 coming out of College. Neither are really strong in the upper frame.....They remind me so much of each other!
The biggest difference is Brown's vertical.
oldcow1945 said:
I look at Brown as a Jerome Harrison clone. They are the same size. Brown is an inch taller and 5 pounds heavier.I think DeAngelo Williams is a better comparison for Donald Brown. Like Shep, I think he's a late Round 1 guy. The Eagles would make a lot of sense.
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i, too, want lewis gone and can't understand why the FO has kept him around as long as they have unless they're planning on sacrificing some cap room this year to not tip our hand in the draft, which is a shitty, stupid move.
not only may lewis become a clubhouse cancer if he's not getting the work he thinks he deserves, but he'll also leave yards on the field every time he touches the ball.
the only current problem with getting rid of lewis is that it leaves us with harrison and patrick allen as our only RBs, but having him on the roster is worse than getting rid of him, which is why i don't understand why he's not gone yet.
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oldcow1945 said:
I look at Brown as a Jerome Harrison clone. They are the same size. Brown is an inch taller and 5 pounds heavier.I think DeAngelo Williams is a better comparison for Donald Brown. Like Shep, I think he's a late Round 1 guy. The Eagles would make a lot of sense.
Aloysius said:
I think DeAngelo Williams is a better comparison for Donald Brown. Like Shep, I think he's a late Round 1 guy. The Eagles would make a lot of sense.Really? I guess to each his own. I see Williams as being much thicker below the waist than the other two.
I think these two are very close. 1 inch and 5 lbs difference
I'm not sure if the guy on the right is going to give you so much more than the on the left that it's worth burning a high second round pick on.
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Those two pics kind of look alike. But if you found the right pics, you could put a picture of the just barely 200 pound guy we drafted in '06 next to the 205-210 pound running back on our roster and say, "Look, Jerome Harrison is much bigger than Jerome Harrison. I don't get why you're comparing Jerome Harrison to Jerome Harrison."
DeAngelo Williams is a tad thicker, but I'd hope that Brown would put on at least a little bulk once he gets in an NFL weight room.
Plus, I was focusing more on running style than height/weight measurements. Williams and Brown both lack elite long speed, but they make up for it with great cutting ability and the strength to gain yardage after contact. Both of them are more physical runners than Harrison; I love that Harrison is a fall-forward kind of back, but he doesn't have the same bowling ball & stiff arm ability that Brown has.
The comparison also extends to intangibles: both Williams and Brown are intelligent, charismatic guys who work well in front of the camera. There's a
of some of Brown's teammates trying to mess him up during an interview on media day. When Williams was coming out in the draft, it seemed like he was on ESPN every other day. And because neither are big ego types, that intelligence only raises their value to teams, as well as the likelihood that they'll succeed in the NFL.To be sure, the comparison isn't one to one. Brown isn't as patient a runner as Williams - then again, some people criticized Williams for not being aggressive enough early in his career. And as you noted, Williams is a little bit stockier.
But I think the comparison holds true. When I first watched Cedric Peerman play, I thought to myself, "This guy's a poor man's Tiki Barber." DeAngelo Williams was the first name that came to mind when I watched Connecticut's bowl game, and the more I've watched of him, the more convinced I've become that the "poor man's" disclaimer isn't necessary. Brown may not be as good a pro as Williams, but he could come pretty close.
Anyway, Chic John's the guy who should be telling all of us about Brown. He's seen a lot more of him than we have, and he likes the Williams comparison. Zombo's Curtis Martin comparison is also interesting.
If we end up drafting Donald Brown, I think I'd be cool with anything within the Williams-Martin range
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Brown is intriguing, but he will surely go in the late first round in a weak class of rb's.
Moreno will probably go about mid-first round.
I believe Terry Pluto said on Bruce Brennan's show tonight... that the Browns
can probably get two second round picks for DA.
Then you would be in great shape. Pluto also said they need two lb's, a db with their first three picks.
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This is a great thread. Good job Cal providing the list of RB's. I am going to try my best to decide which of those RB's is worthy of our one pick. I will make the recommendation later. Like I said in the "Question for Rich Thread" right now I have Wells on my list but that can change.
And yes Inspecta we agree to disagree about drafting a RB. The Browns have stank since the eighties for the most part and have never had a threat at running back since the dynamic duo. Lero Hoard had his moments be fumbles and Willie Green did the dupa dance well and Droughns was well pedestrian as indicated by Rich from the gitgo and Jamal Lewis should be on Dancing with the Stars in a feature tap dance.
A team with only one serviceable back and unproven at that and zero offense needs to look hard at getting a feature running back.
Lewis should be traded for a draft pick or released paying him 6 million as his career winds down is not smart football
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Those two pics kind of look alike. But if you found the right pics, you could put a picture of the just barely 200 pound guy we drafted in '06 next to the 205-210 pound running back on our roster and say, "Look, Jerome Harrison is much bigger than Jerome Harrison. I don't get why you're comparing Jerome Harrison to Jerome Harrison."
DeAngelo Williams is a tad thicker, but I'd hope that Brown would put on at least a little bulk once he gets in an NFL weight room.
Plus, I was focusing more on running style than height/weight measurements. Williams and Brown both lack elite long speed, but they make up for it with great cutting ability and the strength to gain yardage after contact. Both of them are more physical runners than Harrison; I love that Harrison is a fall-forward kind of back, but he doesn't have the same bowling ball & stiff arm ability that Brown has.
The comparison also extends to intangibles: both Williams and Brown are intelligent, charismatic guys who work well in front of the camera. There's a
of some of Brown's teammates trying to mess him up during an interview on media day. When Williams was coming out in the draft, it seemed like he was on ESPN every other day. And because neither are big ego types, that intelligence only raises their value to teams, as well as the likelihood that they'll succeed in the NFL.To be sure, the comparison isn't one to one. Brown isn't as patient a runner as Williams - then again, some people criticized Williams for not being aggressive enough early in his career. And as you noted, Williams is a little bit stockier.
But I think the comparison holds true. When I first watched Cedric Peerman play, I thought to myself, "This guy's a poor man's Tiki Barber." DeAngelo Williams was the first name that came to mind when I watched Connecticut's bowl game, and the more I've watched of him, the more convinced I've become that the "poor man's" disclaimer isn't necessary. Brown may not be as good a pro as Williams, but he could come pretty close.
Anyway, Chic John's the guy who should be telling all of us about Brown. He's seen a lot more of him than we have, and he likes the Williams comparison. Zombo's Curtis Martin comparison is also interesting.
If we end up drafting Donald Brown, I think I'd be cool with anything within the Williams-Martin range
Aloysius said:
DeAngelo Williams is a tad thicker, but I'd hope that Brown would put on at least a little bulk once he gets in an NFL weight room.I think this is the concern for him. That his frame will not allow him to gain much bulk. He's a big as he's going to get.
I stll don't think the value you'd get with Brown at #36 could be compared to the defensive players available at #36. Especially when you consider that we just don't know what we have in Harrison as the main ball carrier. Harrison has shown flashes of briliance and deserves the chance to be the main guy. I think most would agree with that. That being the case, why would we want to burn a high #2 on yet another back?
I've stated before that with this being a rebuilding year, wouldn't it make more sense to wait and see what we have with Harrison? If he isn't the guy that is going to carry the load for the Browns then go after a back in the 2010 draft which is deeper. Two guys that may be available in round two in 2010 is Legarrette Blount and the Scott kid from LSU. Both of whom I like better than Brown.
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Well, my hope was that Andre Brown or Cedric Peerman would slide to us in Round 4, but that doesn't seem likely after both of them lit up the Combine. Whether or not I'd be happy with Donald Brown at #36 would depend on which defensive players were available at that spot. Either way, I don't expect him to get out of Round 1.
And I'm not sure about Harrison being the "main guy" - yes, he should get more touches, but would bringing in a RB in the 2nd Round to split time with him be such a bad thing? If Lewis is cut and/or Harrison gets hurt, would you be satisfied with Jason Wright toting the rock 25 times a game? Or a Day 2 guy like P.J. Hill or Arian Foster? We really need to find out whether Jamal's sticking around before we reject the idea of taking a RB at #36.
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Yes, I know; I was assuming that if Lewis were cut or one of the backs got hurt, he might be a guy we'd turn to.
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Yes, I know; I was assuming that if Lewis were cut or one of the backs got hurt, he might be a guy we'd turn to.
Aloysius said:
Yes, I know; I was assuming that if Lewis were cut or one of the backs got hurt, he might be a guy we'd turn to.I don't see any reason to even risk harrison as the feature back. We need a bruiser / slasher tandem. Just frickin keep jamal. We can talk about drafting a big back to groom, or wait till next year and just replace jamal. But its not like the guy can't play football anymore.
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Aloysius said:
Yes, I know; I was assuming that if Lewis were cut or one of the backs got hurt, he might be a guy we'd turn to.I don't see any reason to even risk harrison as the feature back. We need a bruiser / slasher tandem. Just frickin keep jamal. We can talk about drafting a big back to groom, or wait till next year and just replace jamal. But its not like the guy can't play football anymore.
AdaM said:
I don't see any reason to even risk harrison as the feature back. We need a bruiser / slasher tandem. Just frickin keep jamal. We can talk about drafting a big back to groom, or wait till next year and just replace jamal. But its not like the guy can't play football anymore.This is what I'd like to see happen as well. Give Harrison 180 to 200 carries. If he ends up being a solid #1 back he could get a few more. Lewis could get 100 to 150 carries depending on Harrison's success.
Speaking of big brusing type of backs, it's why I like the Scott kid from LSU. Or Blount out of Oregon. He's a monster.
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Well, my hope was that Andre Brown or Cedric Peerman would slide to us in Round 4, but that doesn't seem likely after both of them lit up the Combine. Whether or not I'd be happy with Donald Brown at #36 would depend on which defensive players were available at that spot. Either way, I don't expect him to get out of Round 1.
And I'm not sure about Harrison being the "main guy" - yes, he should get more touches, but would bringing in a RB in the 2nd Round to split time with him be such a bad thing? If Lewis is cut and/or Harrison gets hurt, would you be satisfied with Jason Wright toting the rock 25 times a game? Or a Day 2 guy like P.J. Hill or Arian Foster? We really need to find out whether Jamal's sticking around before we reject the idea of taking a RB at #36.
Aloysius said:
Well, my hope was that Andre Brown or Cedric Peerman would slide to us in Round 4, but that doesn't seem likely after both of them lit up the Combine. Whether or not I'd be happy with Donald Brown at #36 would depend on which defensive players were available at that spot. Either way, I don't expect him to get out of Round 1.And I'm not sure about Harrison being the "main guy" - yes, he should get more touches, but would bringing in a RB in the 2nd Round to split time with him be such a bad thing? If Lewis is cut and/or Harrison gets hurt, would you be satisfied with Jason Wright toting the rock 25 times a game? Or a Day 2 guy like P.J. Hill or Arian Foster? We really need to find out whether Jamal's sticking around before we reject the idea of taking a RB at #36.
I really do think it would be a bad thing considering the huge holes we have on defense and considering some of the really good defensive players that will be there at #36a nd at #50
I'm not a huge fan of an elite tailback being necessary for taking you to the promised land. Neither of these two teams in this year's super bowl had an elite type back. The Patriot teams were solid but never elite with the likes of an aging Corey Dillon or Kevin Faulk. Defense, defense, defense.
As I have said, I'd look for the second tailback in 2010.
Ther are any number of guys I like there. Kruger, Barwin, Maybin, Hood, Laurinaitis, English, Chung.
Actually a combination of any of these two would thrill me at #36 and #50. Barwin at #36 and Hood at #50?
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