Hall of Fame QB win percentages
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Now, my purpose in this post is to do this....insert other NON HOFers into their slots amongst the Hall of Famers:
Otto Graham .840
Darryl Lamonica .784
Tom Brady .773
Roger Staubach .746
Joe Montana .713
Peyton Manning .699
Jim McMahon .691
Bob Waterfield .685
Aaron Rodgers .680
Terry Bradshaw .677
Danny White .674
Frank Ryan .672
Ben Roethlisberger .671
Ken Stabler .661
Steve Young .657
John Unitas .645
Pat Haden .645
John Elway .643
Jack Kemp .633
Jim Kelly .631
Norm Van Brocklin .629
Earl Morrall. .626
Brett Favre .624
Charley Conerly .624
Joe Theisman .621
Bob Griese .619
Bart Starr .618
Len Dawson .616
Jeff Hostetler .614
Dan Marino .613
Donovan McNabb .612
Randall Cunningham .611
Mark Rypien .603
YA Tittle .596
Kurt Warner .578
Brad Johnson .578
Troy Aikman .570
Bobby Layne .568
Eli Manning .545
Fran Tarkenton .531
George Blanda .514
Trent Dilfer .513
Dan Fouts .506
Warren Moon .502
Jim Plunkett .500
Joe Namath .496
Sonny Jurgenson .487
So? Who should go from red to black on this list?
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Now, my purpose in this post is to do this....insert other NON HOFers into their slots amongst the Hall of Famers:
Otto Graham .840
Darryl Lamonica .784
Tom Brady .773
Roger Staubach .746
Joe Montana .713
Peyton Manning .699
Jim McMahon .691
Bob Waterfield .685
Aaron Rodgers .680
Terry Bradshaw .677
Danny White .674
Frank Ryan .672
Ben Roethlisberger .671
Ken Stabler .661
Steve Young .657
John Unitas .645
Pat Haden .645
John Elway .643
Jack Kemp .633
Jim Kelly .631
Norm Van Brocklin .629
Earl Morrall. .626
Brett Favre .624
Charley Conerly .624
Joe Theisman .621
Bob Griese .619
Bart Starr .618
Len Dawson .616
Jeff Hostetler .614
Dan Marino .613
Donovan McNabb .612
Randall Cunningham .611
Mark Rypien .603
YA Tittle .596
Kurt Warner .578
Brad Johnson .578
Troy Aikman .570
Bobby Layne .568
Eli Manning .545
Fran Tarkenton .531
George Blanda .514
Trent Dilfer .513
Dan Fouts .506
Warren Moon .502
Jim Plunkett .500
Joe Namath .496
Sonny Jurgenson .487
So? Who should go from red to black on this list?
Now, my purpose in this post is to do this....insert other NON HOFers into their slots amongst the Hall of Famers:
Otto Graham .840
Darryl Lamonica .784
Tom Brady .773
Roger Staubach .746
Joe Montana .713
Peyton Manning .699
Jim McMahon .691
Bob Waterfield .685
Aaron Rodgers .680
Terry Bradshaw .677
Danny White .674
Frank Ryan .672
Ben Roethlisberger .671
Ken Stabler .661
Steve Young .657
John Unitas .645
Pat Haden .645
John Elway .643
Jack Kemp .633
Jim Kelly .631
Norm Van Brocklin .629
Earl Morrall. .626
Brett Favre .624
Charley Conerly .624
Joe Theisman .621
Bob Griese .619
Bart Starr .618
Len Dawson .616
Jeff Hostetler .614
Dan Marino .613
Donovan McNabb .612
Randall Cunningham .611
Mark Rypien .603
YA Tittle .596
Kurt Warner .578
Brad Johnson .578
Troy Aikman .570
Bobby Layne .568
Eli Manning .545
Fran Tarkenton .531
George Blanda .514
Trent Dilfer .513
Dan Fouts .506
Warren Moon .502
Jim Plunkett .500
Joe Namath .496
Sonny Jurgenson .487
So? Who should go from red to black on this list?
Kurt Warner.
Z
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Well, here is an argument for The Snake to be HOF:
Ken Stabler: played 15 years
Steve Young: played 15 years
Stabler: 96-49-1 regular season record. .661 win pct. 7-5 postseason record. Played in and won one SB
Efforts to win more thwarted by better team in 70s Steelers
Young: 94-49-0 regular season record. .657 win pct. 8-6 postseason record. Played in and won one SB
Efforts to win more thwarted by better team in 90s Cowboys.
Stabler: 2270/3793 for 27,938 yards. 59.8 completion pct
Young: 2667/4149 for 33124 yards. 64.3 completion pct. (in a much more pass happy offense)
Stabler: 194 TDs 5.1 TD pct.
Young: 232 TDs 5.6 TD pct.
Stabler: 7.4 ypa, 12.3 ypc, 151.8 ypg
Young: 8.0 ypa, 12.4 ypc, 196.0 ypg
Stabler: 75.3 rating
Young: 96.8 rating
Honestly: where is the big difference between them? The QB rating? That's about it. Everyone knows that the WCO played in by Young was a far more amenable offense to passer rating than the "Mad Bomber" offense that Stabler played in. Other than that these two QBs are pretty statistically even, yet Young is in and Stabler is not.
It could be argued that Stabler's stats may be more impressive given the era (bump and run) and offense he played in vs. that of Young (no touchy feely on the WRs.)
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I think what hurts Kenny is his interception numbers and the rapid decent of his career. He didn't become a starter until he was 28 and his last good year was when he was 34. Didn't take care of his body.
Some guys aren't Hall of Famers, but will always be legends.
Here are Steve Young's passer ratings from the years he was a starter: 101.8, 107.0, 101.5,112.8, 92.3,97.2, 104.7, 101.1
In only eight years as a starter he was the highest rated QB in the league six times. Made the Pro Bowl seven consecutive years, first team All-Pro 3 consectutive years and League MVP once.
Oh ... and he RAN for 4,239 yards and 43 TDs.
Best QB of his era ... and it was a good era with Favre & Aikman in their peak and Elway and Marino still getting it done.
Zombo
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I think what hurts Kenny is his interception numbers and the rapid decent of his career. He didn't become a starter until he was 28 and his last good year was when he was 34. Didn't take care of his body.
Some guys aren't Hall of Famers, but will always be legends.
Here are Steve Young's passer ratings from the years he was a starter: 101.8, 107.0, 101.5,112.8, 92.3,97.2, 104.7, 101.1
In only eight years as a starter he was the highest rated QB in the league six times. Made the Pro Bowl seven consecutive years, first team All-Pro 3 consectutive years and League MVP once.
Oh ... and he RAN for 4,239 yards and 43 TDs.
Best QB of his era ... and it was a good era with Favre & Aikman in their peak and Elway and Marino still getting it done.
Zombo
Zombo said:
Oh ... and he RAN for 4,239 yards and 43 TDs.
Best QB of his era ... and it was a good era with Favre & Aikman in their peak and Elway and Marino still getting it done.
I agree...Youngs always on my short list of the greatest QB's I ever watched.......and as much as I liked Stabler, he doesn't even get close to Young on my all timers list....sorry Gip, but Id say Stabler was a great player, but not HOF......
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I think what hurts Kenny is his interception numbers and the rapid decent of his career. He didn't become a starter until he was 28 and his last good year was when he was 34. Didn't take care of his body.
Some guys aren't Hall of Famers, but will always be legends.
Here are Steve Young's passer ratings from the years he was a starter: 101.8, 107.0, 101.5,112.8, 92.3,97.2, 104.7, 101.1
In only eight years as a starter he was the highest rated QB in the league six times. Made the Pro Bowl seven consecutive years, first team All-Pro 3 consectutive years and League MVP once.
Oh ... and he RAN for 4,239 yards and 43 TDs.
Best QB of his era ... and it was a good era with Favre & Aikman in their peak and Elway and Marino still getting it done.
Zombo
Zombo said:
I think what hurts Kenny is his interception numbers and the rapid decent of his career. He didn't become a starter until he was 28 and his last good year was when he was 34. Didn't take care of his body.
Some guys aren't Hall of Famers, but will always be legends.
Here are Steve Young's passer ratings from the years he was a starter: 101.8, 107.0, 101.5,112.8, 92.3,97.2, 104.7, 101.1
In only eight years as a starter he was the highest rated QB in the league six times. Made the Pro Bowl seven consecutive years, first team All-Pro 3 consectutive years and League MVP once.
Oh ... and he RAN for 4,239 yards and 43 TDs.
Best QB of his era ... and it was a good era with Favre & Aikman in their peak and Elway and Marino still getting it done.
Zombo
You think it is running that put Young in over Stabler? And Steve Young came to starting late as did Stabler because Young was behind Montana as Stabler was behind Lamonica. As for best QB of his era, who besides Bradshaw and Staubach could you put ahead of Stabler?
Stabler came to play with bad teams at the end of his career, The declining Oilers then the Saints. I don't know if he declined so much or was it the teams around him.
But no, he did not have Young's legs.
And the interceptions were a matter of the era. Bradshaw, Namath etc. all had "bad" int. numbers compared to these days.
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Zombo said:
Oh ... and he RAN for 4,239 yards and 43 TDs.
Best QB of his era ... and it was a good era with Favre & Aikman in their peak and Elway and Marino still getting it done.
I agree...Youngs always on my short list of the greatest QB's I ever watched.......and as much as I liked Stabler, he doesn't even get close to Young on my all timers list....sorry Gip, but Id say Stabler was a great player, but not HOF......
I agree...Youngs always on my short list of the greatest QB's I ever watched.......and as much as I liked Stabler, he doesn't even get close to Young on my all timers list....sorry Gip, but Id say Stabler was a great player, but not HOF......
But, Young's passing numbers and Stablers aren't far off.....unless you to are give all that credence to his legs.
And look at the "winning"....Stabler even a scoche better.
And, in my view, he isn't even close on the "greatest" QBs of his own era. He is of the same era as Elway, Marino, Kelly et al.
If you are to say that Stabler was only 3rd/4th best of his era, the same has to be said of Young.
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Zombo said:
I think what hurts Kenny is his interception numbers and the rapid decent of his career. He didn't become a starter until he was 28 and his last good year was when he was 34. Didn't take care of his body.
Some guys aren't Hall of Famers, but will always be legends.
Here are Steve Young's passer ratings from the years he was a starter: 101.8, 107.0, 101.5,112.8, 92.3,97.2, 104.7, 101.1
In only eight years as a starter he was the highest rated QB in the league six times. Made the Pro Bowl seven consecutive years, first team All-Pro 3 consectutive years and League MVP once.
Oh ... and he RAN for 4,239 yards and 43 TDs.
Best QB of his era ... and it was a good era with Favre & Aikman in their peak and Elway and Marino still getting it done.
Zombo
You think it is running that put Young in over Stabler? And Steve Young came to starting late as did Stabler because Young was behind Montana as Stabler was behind Lamonica. As for best QB of his era, who besides Bradshaw and Staubach could you put ahead of Stabler?
Stabler came to play with bad teams at the end of his career, The declining Oilers then the Saints. I don't know if he declined so much or was it the teams around him.
But no, he did not have Young's legs.
And the interceptions were a matter of the era. Bradshaw, Namath etc. all had "bad" int. numbers compared to these days.
You think it is running that put Young in over Stabler? And Steve Young came to starting late as did Stabler because Young was behind Montana as Stabler was behind Lamonica. As for best QB of his era, who besides Bradshaw and Staubach could you put ahead of Stabler?
Stabler came to play with bad teams at the end of his career, The declining Oilers then the Saints. I don't know if he declined so much or was it the teams around him.
But no, he did not have Young's legs.
And the interceptions were a matter of the era. Bradshaw, Namath etc. all had "bad" int. numbers compared to these days.
No, I didn't think it was the running that put him in over Stabler, that was an "oh by the way" ... I added that after I posted Young's passing accomplishments.Did you read that or just skip to the last part?
You must have done too many bong hits in the 70's if you don't remember Kenny Stabler's decline. Houston was a very good team when he got there. His knees were shot and he didn't take care of himself. Al Davis got rid of him at the right time.
Somehow you left off Bob Griese and Fran Tarkenton as QBs from the 70's that were better than Stabler.
From 1975-1980 Stabler threw 118 TDs to 141 INTs
Greise 78-69
Tark 76-67
Staubach 101-63
Bradshaw 99-82
Those guys all became much more efficient passers in the late 70s while Stabler became more careless.
Stabler led his league in passing just once, while Young led his 6 times
Young clearly the better passer.
But if you want to mention running ... Stabler ran for 93 yards in his career, Young did that in one play (or so it seemed ...)
Zombo
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I agree...Youngs always on my short list of the greatest QB's I ever watched.......and as much as I liked Stabler, he doesn't even get close to Young on my all timers list....sorry Gip, but Id say Stabler was a great player, but not HOF......
But, Young's passing numbers and Stablers aren't far off.....unless you to are give all that credence to his legs.
And look at the "winning"....Stabler even a scoche better.
And, in my view, he isn't even close on the "greatest" QBs of his own era. He is of the same era as Elway, Marino, Kelly et al.
If you are to say that Stabler was only 3rd/4th best of his era, the same has to be said of Young.
But, Young's passing numbers and Stablers aren't far off.....unless you to are give all that credence to his legs.
And look at the "winning"....Stabler even a scoche better.
And, in my view, he isn't even close on the "greatest" QBs of his own era. He is of the same era as Elway, Marino, Kelly et al.
If you are to say that Stabler was only 3rd/4th best of his era, the same has to be said of Young.
This article I would say is the generally accepted rankings of QBs of by decade:
Stabler 5th best of the 70s (Staubach, Bradshaw, Griese, Tarkenton)
Young #1 QB of the 90s (over Favre, Aikman, Marino, Elway, Kelly and Moon)
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs07/columns/story?columnist=chadiha_jeff&id=3199634
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You think it is running that put Young in over Stabler? And Steve Young came to starting late as did Stabler because Young was behind Montana as Stabler was behind Lamonica. As for best QB of his era, who besides Bradshaw and Staubach could you put ahead of Stabler?
Stabler came to play with bad teams at the end of his career, The declining Oilers then the Saints. I don't know if he declined so much or was it the teams around him.
But no, he did not have Young's legs.
And the interceptions were a matter of the era. Bradshaw, Namath etc. all had "bad" int. numbers compared to these days.
No, I didn't think it was the running that put him in over Stabler, that was an "oh by the way" ... I added that after I posted Young's passing accomplishments.Did you read that or just skip to the last part?
You must have done too many bong hits in the 70's if you don't remember Kenny Stabler's decline. Houston was a very good team when he got there. His knees were shot and he didn't take care of himself. Al Davis got rid of him at the right time.
Somehow you left off Bob Griese and Fran Tarkenton as QBs from the 70's that were better than Stabler.
From 1975-1980 Stabler threw 118 TDs to 141 INTs
Greise 78-69
Tark 76-67
Staubach 101-63
Bradshaw 99-82
Those guys all became much more efficient passers in the late 70s while Stabler became more careless.
Stabler led his league in passing just once, while Young led his 6 times
Young clearly the better passer.
But if you want to mention running ... Stabler ran for 93 yards in his career, Young did that in one play (or so it seemed ...)
Zombo
Zombo said:
No, I didn't think it was the running that put him in over Stabler, that was an "oh by the way" ... I added that after I posted Young's passing accomplishments.Did you read that or just skip to the last part?
You must have done too many bong hits in the 70's if you don't remember Kenny Stabler's decline. Houston was a very good team when he got there. His knees were shot and he didn't take care of himself. Al Davis got rid of him at the right time.
Somehow you left off Bob Griese and Fran Tarkenton as QBs from the 70's that were better than Stabler.
From 1975-1980 Stabler threw 118 TDs to 141 INTs
Greise 78-69
Tark 76-67
Staubach 101-63
Bradshaw 99-82
Those guys all became much more efficient passers in the late 70s while Stabler became more careless.
Stabler led his league in passing just once, while Young led his 6 times
Young clearly the better passer.
But if you want to mention running ... Stabler ran for 93 yards in his career, Young did that in one play.
Zombo
Bottom line: Stabler had his teams in their scrapping for the championship as much or more as Young. Stabler's legs went out from under him, Young's brain went out from under him...at about the same age. Maybe it could be said that Young became just as reckless and careless as Stabler, from a personal protection point of view.
I don't see Young as necessarily a "better passer". He threw a lot lot more of the short crossing patterns that the WCO called for ..allowing him to have a better completion pct.....that Stabler's down field passing philosophy didn't utilize as much.
I will give you that Tarkenton was probably a better QB, but not necessarily Griese. Way different styles.
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But, Young's passing numbers and Stablers aren't far off.....unless you to are give all that credence to his legs.
And look at the "winning"....Stabler even a scoche better.
And, in my view, he isn't even close on the "greatest" QBs of his own era. He is of the same era as Elway, Marino, Kelly et al.
If you are to say that Stabler was only 3rd/4th best of his era, the same has to be said of Young.
This article I would say is the generally accepted rankings of QBs of by decade:
Stabler 5th best of the 70s (Staubach, Bradshaw, Griese, Tarkenton)
Young #1 QB of the 90s (over Favre, Aikman, Marino, Elway, Kelly and Moon)
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs07/columns/story?columnist=chadiha_jeff&id=3199634
Zombo said:
This article I would say is the generally accepted rankings of QBs of by decade:
Stabler 5th best of the 70s (Staubach, Bradshaw, Griese, Tarkenton)
Young #1 QB of the 90s (over Favre, Aikman, Marino, Elway, Kelly and Moon)
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs07/columns/story?columnist=chadiha_jeff&id=3199634
I don't know about "generally accepted". That seems to be one person's opinion.....I would NOT put Young over any of those guys except Moon.
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Zombo said:
No, I didn't think it was the running that put him in over Stabler, that was an "oh by the way" ... I added that after I posted Young's passing accomplishments.Did you read that or just skip to the last part?
You must have done too many bong hits in the 70's if you don't remember Kenny Stabler's decline. Houston was a very good team when he got there. His knees were shot and he didn't take care of himself. Al Davis got rid of him at the right time.
Somehow you left off Bob Griese and Fran Tarkenton as QBs from the 70's that were better than Stabler.
From 1975-1980 Stabler threw 118 TDs to 141 INTs
Greise 78-69
Tark 76-67
Staubach 101-63
Bradshaw 99-82
Those guys all became much more efficient passers in the late 70s while Stabler became more careless.
Stabler led his league in passing just once, while Young led his 6 times
Young clearly the better passer.
But if you want to mention running ... Stabler ran for 93 yards in his career, Young did that in one play.
Zombo
Bottom line: Stabler had his teams in their scrapping for the championship as much or more as Young. Stabler's legs went out from under him, Young's brain went out from under him...at about the same age. Maybe it could be said that Young became just as reckless and careless as Stabler, from a personal protection point of view.
I don't see Young as necessarily a "better passer". He threw a lot lot more of the short crossing patterns that the WCO called for ..allowing him to have a better completion pct.....that Stabler's down field passing philosophy didn't utilize as much.
I will give you that Tarkenton was probably a better QB, but not necessarily Griese. Way different styles.
Bottom line: Stabler had his teams in their scrapping for the championship as much or more as Young. Stabler's legs went out from under him, Young's brain went out from under him...at about the same age. Maybe it could be said that Young became just as reckless and careless as Stabler, from a personal protection point of view.
I don't see Young as necessarily a "better passer". He threw a lot lot more of the short crossing patterns that the WCO called for ..allowing him to have a better completion pct.....that Stabler's down field passing philosophy didn't utilize as much.
I will give you that Tarkenton was probably a better QB, but not necessarily Griese. Way different styles.
I admire your defense of Stabler.
But I am truly stunned of your lack of appreciation of Steve Young.
Where were you in the 90's?
He is one of the greatest QBs I have ever seen.
If we're throwing out WCO QBs I guess we can throw Montana and Favre on that scrap heap too. All they did was throw darts and win.
Zombo
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Zombo said:
This article I would say is the generally accepted rankings of QBs of by decade:
Stabler 5th best of the 70s (Staubach, Bradshaw, Griese, Tarkenton)
Young #1 QB of the 90s (over Favre, Aikman, Marino, Elway, Kelly and Moon)
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs07/columns/story?columnist=chadiha_jeff&id=3199634
I don't know about "generally accepted". That seems to be one person's opinion.....I would NOT put Young over any of those guys except Moon.
I don't know about "generally accepted". That seems to be one person's opinion.....I would NOT put Young over any of those guys except Moon.
For just the 90's??
Young was the QB of the decade. I'm sorry you somehow missed it.
Zombo
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Here we go....I will add this feature here......These are the most "Productive QBs" of each era broken down as follows: QBs drafted in each decade ranked by their PFR career Production average. I acknowledge certainly that this stat does not say who the "Best QBs" are, only most productive over their careers. And one thing it does not do is rank undrafted QB. So Kurt Warner and a few others may not show up here. But it is at least one thing to look at:
QBs drafted 1950-1959
1.John Unitas
2. Len Dawson
3. Sonny Jurgenson
4. John Brodie
5. Bart Starr
6. Frank Ryan
7. Jack Kemp
8. Earl Morrall
9. Babe Parilli
10. Milt Plum
11. Billy Wade
12. Cotton Davidson
13. Ed Brown
14. Rudy Bukich
15. Jim Ninowski
QBs drafted 1960-1969:
1. Fran Tarkenton
2. Roger Staubach
3. Bob Griese
4. John Hadl
5. Roman Gabriel
6. Ken Stabler
7. Joe Namath
8. Norm Snead
9. Craig Morton
10. Greg Landry
11. Charley Johnson
12. Darryl Lamonica
13. Billy Kilmer
14. Don Meredith
15. Bill Nelsen
QBs drafted 1970-1979:
1. Joe Montana
2. Dan Fouts
3. Ken Anderson
4. Terry Bradshaw
5. Phil Simms
6. Steve Grogan
7. Joe Theismann
8. Jim Plunkett
9. Danny White
10. Ron Jaworski
11. Bert Jones
12. Joe Ferguson
13. Steve DeBerg
14. Brian Sipe
15. Archie Manning
QBs drafted 1980-1989:
1. Dan Marino
2. John Elway
3. Steve Young
4. Randall Cunningham
5. Boomer Esiason
6. Jim Kelly
7. Rich Gannon
8. Troy Aikman
9. Vinny Testaverde
10. Jim Everett
11. Jim Harbaugh
12. Chris Chandler
13. Ken O'Brien
14. Neil Lomax
15. Steve Beurlein
16. Bernie Kosar
QBs drafted between 1990 and 1999:
1. Peyton Manning
2. Brett Favre
3. Donovan McNabb
4. Drew Bledsoe
5. Steve McNair
6. Mark Brunell
7. Trent Green
8. Daunte Culpepper
9. Matt Hasselback
10. Kerry Collins
11. Jake Plummer
12. Brad Johnson
13. Jeff Blake
14. Aaron Brooks
15. Jeff George
QBs drafted between 2000-2009:
1. Tom Brady
2. Drew Brees
3. Phillip Rivers
4. Aaron Rodgers
5. Ben Roethlisberger
6. Eli Manning
7. Michael Vick
8. Carson Palmer
9. Matt Ryan
10. Jay Cutler
11. Joe Flacco
12. Matt Schaub
13. David Garrard
14. Alex Smith
15. Marc Bulger
QBs drafted between 2010-2014 (10 listed):
1. Cam Newton
2. Russell Wilson
3. Andy Dalton
4. Andrew Luck
5. Colin Kaepernick
6. Robert Griffin III
7. Ryan Tannehill
8. Sam Bradford
9. Christian Ponder
10. Nick Foles
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Bottom line: Stabler had his teams in their scrapping for the championship as much or more as Young. Stabler's legs went out from under him, Young's brain went out from under him...at about the same age. Maybe it could be said that Young became just as reckless and careless as Stabler, from a personal protection point of view.
I don't see Young as necessarily a "better passer". He threw a lot lot more of the short crossing patterns that the WCO called for ..allowing him to have a better completion pct.....that Stabler's down field passing philosophy didn't utilize as much.
I will give you that Tarkenton was probably a better QB, but not necessarily Griese. Way different styles.
I admire your defense of Stabler.
But I am truly stunned of your lack of appreciation of Steve Young.
Where were you in the 90's?
He is one of the greatest QBs I have ever seen.
If we're throwing out WCO QBs I guess we can throw Montana and Favre on that scrap heap too. All they did was throw darts and win.
Zombo
Zombo said:
I admire your defense of Stabler.
But I am truly stunned of your lack of appreciation of Steve Young.
Where were you in the 90's?
He is one of the greatest QBs I have ever seen.
If we're throwing out WCO QBs I guess we can throw Montana and Favre on that scrap heap too. All they did was throw darts and win.
Zombo
I was there for every bit of what Steve Young did. He was a good QB....but no, I don't place him above Elway/Marino/Kelly or Favre.
And in comparison to Stabler, I guess I am simply looking at their records at winning things....and I say Stabler and Young are almost identical: Stabler was the starting QB for 7 playoff teams....same number as Young. Stabler won a SB, Young won one. Stabler had 4 other conference title game appearances, Young had 5.
Young's teams threw the ball a bit more, so he has a few more numbers.
Bottom line, looking at it historically, it was very close.
And in watching them live, Young did not wow me any more than Stabler at leading his team. Yes, his occasional runs were a bit more "wowing".
And then there was the "Cool factor". The Snake was just cooler than Young......and I gotta count that a bit.
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I don't know about "generally accepted". That seems to be one person's opinion.....I would NOT put Young over any of those guys except Moon.
For just the 90's??
Young was the QB of the decade. I'm sorry you somehow missed it.
Zombo
Zombo said:
For just the 90's??
Young was the QB of the decade. I'm sorry you somehow missed it.
Zombo
Maybe.....because I was seeing Kelly, Marino, Favre, Elway, Aikman doing it more and just as good or better than Young.
Aikman was battling Kelly for much of the first half of that decade for team supremacy.
Favre and Elway were battling each other for the last half of that decade.
Young got one year squeezed in there. Kind of as an afterthought, sorta.
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But, Young's passing numbers and Stablers aren't far off.....unless you to are give all that credence to his legs.
And look at the "winning"....Stabler even a scoche better.
And, in my view, he isn't even close on the "greatest" QBs of his own era. He is of the same era as Elway, Marino, Kelly et al.
If you are to say that Stabler was only 3rd/4th best of his era, the same has to be said of Young.
This article I would say is the generally accepted rankings of QBs of by decade:
Stabler 5th best of the 70s (Staubach, Bradshaw, Griese, Tarkenton)
Young #1 QB of the 90s (over Favre, Aikman, Marino, Elway, Kelly and Moon)
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs07/columns/story?columnist=chadiha_jeff&id=3199634
Zombo said:
Stabler 5th best of the 70s (Staubach, Bradshaw, Griese, Tarkenton)
Young #1 QB of the 90s (over Favre, Aikman, Marino, Elway, Kelly and Moon)
Yep, that ^^^^^^ sounds about right to me.....
It's completely subjective, but Id have Young as high as 5th or 6th on my GOAT list, whilst I see Stabler more like a top 50 type of player.....not sure where exactly he'd stand, but I counted 30 Id personally rank ahead of him before I stopped....
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Zombo said:
For just the 90's??
Young was the QB of the decade. I'm sorry you somehow missed it.
Zombo
Maybe.....because I was seeing Kelly, Marino, Favre, Elway, Aikman doing it more and just as good or better than Young.
Aikman was battling Kelly for much of the first half of that decade for team supremacy.
Favre and Elway were battling each other for the last half of that decade.
Young got one year squeezed in there. Kind of as an afterthought, sorta.
Maybe.....because I was seeing Kelly, Marino, Favre, Elway, Aikman doing it more and just as good or better than Young.
Aikman was battling Kelly for much of the first half of that decade for team supremacy.
Favre and Elway were battling each other for the last half of that decade.
Young got one year squeezed in there. Kind of as an afterthought, sorta.
You seem to be substituting QB names for team names.
It's a team sport and Dan Marino was a better QB than Eli Manning or Jim Plunkett.
Elway got a couple titles when he was less of a QB than he was earlier in his career because he was on better teams.
Steve Young was the starter for eight years and led the league in passing six times and made 7 Pro Bowls. Retired with the highest passer rating in the history of the NFL. But you are saying he was not the best QB of his era because his team only won one SB.
Well, Favre only one 1, Kelly won none, Marino won none, If John Elway retires two years earlier he gets none ... Troy Aikman must be your best QB of the era since he won those 3 rings all by himself.
Zombo
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you know what they say....QB's get too much credit when they win and too much blame when they lose.....
Never been a fan of how QB's(or other players, ftm) get propped up so high just because they landed on great teams. In my eye's, lots of the greatest woulda been closer to average on lesser or bad teams......
True greatness usually shines through and Marino is the perfect example. No SB and no doubt he's one of the best. Conversely, take Bradshaws super bowls away and give him Marino's record and is he still one of the best or in the HOF?......(no way).....
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Remember when SF was ridiculed for trading a 2nd and 4th to the Bucs for a USFL/NFL bust? All of Young's stats are diluted by 19 awful starts in Tampa.
For what it's worth PFF's Weighted Career AV for Young is 135 (15th overall since 1950).
Stabler's is 94 (180th overall since 1950)... not bad, but not Young.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196
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