DA price tag = Day 2 pick?
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So you would wash 5 million because its in the "past".... really. You would go ahead and bet the bank on a kid with 3 games when you have another similar age qb who did win 10 games in a season..... I like how people talk about 5 million like it does not matter anymore moving forward when the qb position between bq and da is well within normal budget for that position.
As for Stallworth if I were forced to pay him and could not get equal value for the amount I had to pay out I would definately keep him. He is not toxic to the team in the locker room and does have talent and potential.
So you would wash 5 million because its in the "past".... really. You would go ahead and bet the bank on a kid with 3 games when you have another similar age qb who did win 10 games in a season..... I like how people talk about 5 million like it does not matter anymore moving forward when the qb position between bq and da is well within normal budget for that position.
It's not only about this year, it's about the contract escalating even further next year.
Ever hear the saying "don't throw good money after bad"? Well, this regime didn't give out these asinine contracts and they don't much care what's happened before. They're looking to field the best team moving forward, and everyone is fair game, be it to play a role actively on this team in '09 or be moved for picks to get us players who actually CAN contribute in '09.
As for "banking on a kid with 3 games", good Lord, is this ever the most tired -- and frankly, stupid -- argument against playing Quinn.
Following your logic, sev, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco never should have seen the field this year, right? What fools those Falcons and Ravens were for having the AUDACITY to play their #1 draft pick, top rated QBs. Obviously, their decision had disastrous consequences, both for the teams and the players, right?
In all honesty, at this point, I don't care who gets traded. I just want a competent football team on the field in '09 and so far I like what what ManKok is doing with the roster. They obviously are not guys to get wrapped up in drama or emotion so it's safe to say they will do whatever is truly best for the football team as a whole.
That being said, when it comes to Quinn, people like you are totally blinded by, well, I don't know what. If Quinn was on any other team, no one would be having this absolutely ridiculous and tired argument. ANY other organization (except maybe the Lions) would have committed to him by now because of the caliber of prospect he is and because of the pick invested in him.
So say what you want about playing first round QBs, THEY MUST PLAY at some point to justify their draft position and for the organization to see what it drafted.
That's the way the system works. This current situation with DA should not change that one bit.
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So you would wash 5 million because its in the "past".... really. You would go ahead and bet the bank on a kid with 3 games when you have another similar age qb who did win 10 games in a season..... I like how people talk about 5 million like it does not matter anymore moving forward when the qb position between bq and da is well within normal budget for that position.
It's not only about this year, it's about the contract escalating even further next year.
Ever hear the saying "don't throw good money after bad"? Well, this regime didn't give out these asinine contracts and they don't much care what's happened before. They're looking to field the best team moving forward, and everyone is fair game, be it to play a role actively on this team in '09 or be moved for picks to get us players who actually CAN contribute in '09.
As for "banking on a kid with 3 games", good Lord, is this ever the most tired -- and frankly, stupid -- argument against playing Quinn.
Following your logic, sev, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco never should have seen the field this year, right? What fools those Falcons and Ravens were for having the AUDACITY to play their #1 draft pick, top rated QBs. Obviously, their decision had disastrous consequences, both for the teams and the players, right?
In all honesty, at this point, I don't care who gets traded. I just want a competent football team on the field in '09 and so far I like what what ManKok is doing with the roster. They obviously are not guys to get wrapped up in drama or emotion so it's safe to say they will do whatever is truly best for the football team as a whole.
That being said, when it comes to Quinn, people like you are totally blinded by, well, I don't know what. If Quinn was on any other team, no one would be having this absolutely ridiculous and tired argument. ANY other organization (except maybe the Lions) would have committed to him by now because of the caliber of prospect he is and because of the pick invested in him.
So say what you want about playing first round QBs, THEY MUST PLAY at some point to justify their draft position and for the organization to see what it drafted.
That's the way the system works. This current situation with DA should not change that one bit.
It's not only about this year, it's about the contract escalating even further next year.
Ever hear the saying "don't throw good money after bad"? Well, this regime didn't give out these asinine contracts and they don't much care what's happened before. They're looking to field the best team moving forward, and everyone is fair game, be it to play a role actively on this team in '09 or be moved for picks to get us players who actually CAN contribute in '09.
As for "banking on a kid with 3 games", good Lord, is this ever the most tired -- and frankly, stupid -- argument against playing Quinn.
Following your logic, sev, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco never should have seen the field this year, right? What fools those Falcons and Ravens were for having the AUDACITY to play their #1 draft pick, top rated QBs. Obviously, their decision had disastrous consequences, both for the teams and the players, right?
In all honesty, at this point, I don't care who gets traded. I just want a competent football team on the field in '09 and so far I like what what ManKok is doing with the roster. They obviously are not guys to get wrapped up in drama or emotion so it's safe to say they will do whatever is truly best for the football team as a whole.
That being said, when it comes to Quinn, people like you are totally blinded by, well, I don't know what. If Quinn was on any other team, no one would be having this absolutely ridiculous and tired argument. ANY other organization (except maybe the Lions) would have committed to him by now because of the caliber of prospect he is and because of the pick invested in him.
So say what you want about playing first round QBs, THEY MUST PLAY at some point to justify their draft position and for the organization to see what it drafted.
That's the way the system works. This current situation with DA should not change that one bit.
Which is exactly why this all has to be smoke screen to keep DA's value as high as possible. If DA starts this year, the Browns ought to go into the Hall of Fame as the team who tried the hardest not to start a first round draft pick.
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DA was the victim of a bad coach a bad OC and a horrendous WR group and a terrible towel slinging qb coach..bq was quickly becoming a victim to all the same factors before he was removed from play because of his finger injury..
In 2007 DA was called on to replace Charlie Frye and with a new OC in place with what appeared to be a gung ho plan and big balls dynamics DA prospered in this system for 8 or so games...now enter poor defensive play and an abundance of nfl film footage of the browns non dynamic static gameplan and clever nfl calibur DCs...and the browns problems had just began...
2008 JJ out for the season..no changes were yet made to the offensive gameplan to compensate for last years known weaknesses the team comes in looking like a pee wee football club undisciplined and unprepared..we lose 3 games straight chud finally makes a few adjustments we win 2 games straight then more film is available and chuds changes are dealt with we win 2 games in the next 11 no relevant adjustments were made to our offensive gameplan..BE was consistantly blanketed in coverage and became frustrated..stallworth and steptoe were useless even with only one cover guy...
Bottomline..the pathetic management and coaching of this team was responsible for the poor gameplanning ,gameplay and outcome of this season..as a coach mangini has got to be intrigued with DA and his potential and while bq is a potential superstar his exact qualities are basicly unknown due to the same mismanagement that DA suffered through..frankly i dont see mankok handing the team over to BQ without a competition and DA will be that competition and deserves a fair shot at starting as does bq both these guys deserve our respect they are both winners that have endured possibly one of the worst coaching/management teams in nfl history and yet they both still want to be cleveland browns!
We have to respect that and may the best man win!
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Shaun Smith, DE - While I speculated that with the signing of Mosley that Smith could be let go, the Browns have not made a move on him. With the Broncos, Chiefs, and Packers all installing the 3-4 defense this season, he could be moved for a mid Day 2 selection.
In case it hasn't become clearer than a cloudless day in eastern Montana.....
anybody pining to trade Shaun Smith is doing so ONLY because he punched Lady Queen in the face.
In case it hasn't become clearer than a cloudless day in eastern Montana.....
anybody pining to trade Shaun Smith is doing so ONLY because he punched Lady Queen in the face.
- Lancelot
It's amazing to see the heroes you found on this team. A QB that throws more TD passes to opposing jerseys and a dlineman who can only hit QBs in the weight room.
Meanwhile, the street value of DA has now found itself at the warm fuzzy equivalent of a Luke McCown and Charlie Frye. Not something an intelligent person would consider worthy of a chest pounding session! When your best passes become throws out of bounds - it's nice to know there's a queer eye for that somewhere in America. This is a phenomenon we call "Cupid for the Stupid."
We're not looking for the Victoria's Secret QB here Loverboy. We're looking for a QB with the Victorious Secrets like Notre Dame found when Quinn was the winning ingredient to an otherwise forgettable program before and after he started there. Charlie Weis without Quinn = No dice. When you have the WRONG QB - Head Coaches and OCs get fired. When you have the RIGHT QB - offensive coordinators become Head Coaches in new cities while the Head Coaches get pay raises/contract extensions.
Maybe we should sweeten DA's trade value and throw in a box of Lucky Charms and a Rosary. I've had more more nightmares from that 4 INT game at Cincy than the Exorcist ever gave me. 5 scoreless adventures inside the Cincy 29 yard line isn't possible when you have the RIGHT QB. How did we handle it? We blamed Jim Sorgi and forgot the trend we were witnessing over the final 6 weeks with a regressing QB right before our eyes. It is what it is. GREAT QBs don't get worse with experience - they GAIN by showing an ability to LEARN from the experience. You don't want a Cinderella story with an early midnight. You want a Brian Sipe story where a kid LEARNS from the experience and accomplishes the unthinkable. Sipe had a 3 year period where he AVERAGED over 4000 yards passing in an era that was unheard of BECAUSE secondaries weren't handcuffed with new rules to improve scoring opportunites. Perhaps most significant of all was, when Sipe STARTED off with a bad day - he had the composure to FORGET it all when the game was on the line at the end and WIN most of the time. When DA starts off bad, it usually steamrolls into horrible. Don't shoot the mailman - just give Quinn the same number of starts and we're all set with a brighter future.
- Tom F. (Who REALLY needs a 3rd straight training camp to see that a red jersey means don't touch the QB so he can use GOOD mechanics and composure? If ONLY the Demarcus Ware types would cooperate with a our training camp policies on game day! Some HOFers were at their best when the pocket broke down while DA isn't and BQ is supposed to be)
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I am pretty sure this has been said many times in this thread.. and in others.. I know this because I have said it before... NO WAY DA leaves for a day 2 pick..He has WAY too much value to give him up for a day 2 pick. top 3 rounds or bust.. I don't know who this Luke guy is who wrote this article.. but he needs to keep his teething ring in his mouth for a while.. cuz he obviously is a football infant mentally. Just stupid to pay 5 mil and let a guy who is one season removed from the pro bowl for a day 2 pick..
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Shaun Smith, DE - While I speculated that with the signing of Mosley that Smith could be let go, the Browns have not made a move on him. With the Broncos, Chiefs, and Packers all installing the 3-4 defense this season, he could be moved for a mid Day 2 selection.
In case it hasn't become clearer than a cloudless day in eastern Montana.....
anybody pining to trade Shaun Smith is doing so ONLY because he punched Lady Queen in the face.
In case it hasn't become clearer than a cloudless day in eastern Montana.....
anybody pining to trade Shaun Smith is doing so ONLY because he punched Lady Queen in the face.
Are you going to follow DA to his new team? Rarely has there ever been a fan show his man love as much as you do.
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In case it hasn't become clearer than a cloudless day in eastern Montana.....
anybody pining to trade Shaun Smith is doing so ONLY because he punched Lady Queen in the face.
Are you going to follow DA to his new team? Rarely has there ever been a fan show his man love as much as you do.
Are you going to follow DA to his new team? Rarely has there ever been a fan show his man love as much as you do.
FAN-0-Steel.. You hit the nail (lumberg) on the head.. He has never been a browns fan..he only showed up here after DA was picked up here..when DA gets traded..Lum gets traded too hahah.. Then guys on the next teams board can abuse him too.
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If we gave DA up for a day two pick we would have to draft a QB with it anyway, whats the point of that. 1st or 2nd round or he's a Cleveland Brown next year.
1st Ezekiel Ansah, DE, BYU 3rd Darius Slay, CB, Mississippi State4th Landry Jones, QB, Oklahoma5th Earl Wolff, S, N.C. State6th Lucas Reed, TE, New Mexico -
I am pretty sure this has been said many times in this thread.. and in others.. I know this because I have said it before... NO WAY DA leaves for a day 2 pick..He has WAY too much value to give him up for a day 2 pick. top 3 rounds or bust.. I don't know who this Luke guy is who wrote this article.. but he needs to keep his teething ring in his mouth for a while.. cuz he obviously is a football infant mentally. Just stupid to pay 5 mil and let a guy who is one season removed from the pro bowl for a day 2 pick..
NO WAY DA leaves for a day 2 pick..He has WAY too much value to give him up for a day 2 pick. top 3 rounds or bust.. I don't know who this Luke guy is who wrote this article.. but he needs to keep his teething ring in his mouth for a while.. cuz he obviously is a football infant mentally. Just stupid to pay 5 mil and let a guy who is one season removed from the pro bowl for a day 2 pick..
A high day two pick is nothing to sneeze about. You would not be giving him away.
When it comes to judging talent, past Pro Bowls are really meaningless. Brian Griese and Brad Johnson were back ups on Pro Bowl rosters. That is how meaningless this game has become.
I think a lot of fans want to believe this guy is worth more than he is. Based on one season in which the Browns played the worst schedule in the NFL.
There are so many negatives to his game. Lacks mobility. Tends to try and force a ball into coverage. No touch on a short pass....Actually, he cannot throw a short pas to save his life. His game is limited to standing in the pocket and throwing the ball downfield.
If I could get a high day two pick for him he'd be gone. With a high third rounder you could get a Derry Beckwith or Eric Wood. Either would be so much more valuable than Anderson. We are talking about a guy who could play every Sunday instead of a guy that sits on the bench every Sunday.
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If we gave DA up for a day two pick we would have to draft a QB with it anyway, whats the point of that. 1st or 2nd round or he's a Cleveland Brown next year.
nmills said:
If we gave DA up for a day two pick we would have to draft a QB with it anyway, whats the point of that. 1st or 2nd round or he's a Cleveland Brown next year.You wouldn't have to spend the third round pick you'd get for DA on a QB. You could draft a Rhett Bomar (Who I like a lot) or Nate Davis in rounds 4 to 5
There are also a lot of FA Qb's still out there too.
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So you would wash 5 million because its in the "past".... really. You would go ahead and bet the bank on a kid with 3 games when you have another similar age qb who did win 10 games in a season..... I like how people talk about 5 million like it does not matter anymore moving forward when the qb position between bq and da is well within normal budget for that position.
It's not only about this year, it's about the contract escalating even further next year.
Ever hear the saying "don't throw good money after bad"? Well, this regime didn't give out these asinine contracts and they don't much care what's happened before. They're looking to field the best team moving forward, and everyone is fair game, be it to play a role actively on this team in '09 or be moved for picks to get us players who actually CAN contribute in '09.
As for "banking on a kid with 3 games", good Lord, is this ever the most tired -- and frankly, stupid -- argument against playing Quinn.
Following your logic, sev, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco never should have seen the field this year, right? What fools those Falcons and Ravens were for having the AUDACITY to play their #1 draft pick, top rated QBs. Obviously, their decision had disastrous consequences, both for the teams and the players, right?
In all honesty, at this point, I don't care who gets traded. I just want a competent football team on the field in '09 and so far I like what what ManKok is doing with the roster. They obviously are not guys to get wrapped up in drama or emotion so it's safe to say they will do whatever is truly best for the football team as a whole.
That being said, when it comes to Quinn, people like you are totally blinded by, well, I don't know what. If Quinn was on any other team, no one would be having this absolutely ridiculous and tired argument. ANY other organization (except maybe the Lions) would have committed to him by now because of the caliber of prospect he is and because of the pick invested in him.
So say what you want about playing first round QBs, THEY MUST PLAY at some point to justify their draft position and for the organization to see what it drafted.
That's the way the system works. This current situation with DA should not change that one bit.
It's not only about this year, it's about the contract escalating even further next year.
As for "banking on a kid with 3 games", good Lord, is this ever the most tired -- and frankly, stupid -- argument against playing Quinn.
Following your logic, sev, Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco never should have seen the field this year, right? What fools those Falcons and Ravens were for having the AUDACITY to play their #1 draft pick, top rated QBs. Obviously, their decision had disastrous consequences, both for the teams and the players, right?
I think Bq will be given the oppurtunity to compete and start. I just dont think its logical to pay a trade who clearly can compete and we can clearly afford him. IF you can have 2 guys for the qb spot and not have insane money tied up in the TOTAL qb position why not? I dont see the value of trading DA after we pay him only to sign more prospective talent to even more money this year. It really does not make ANY financial sense.
I hope Mangini basically does a Belichick and makes EVERYONE compete for their spot regardless of contract. It will only make us a better team.
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I think the guy who wrote that is all wet. I feel there are actual NFL folks out there enamored with DA's strong arm & who will look at paying 1.5 million rather than a horrendously HUGE contract for a rookie question mark. He becomes a bargain for an interested team after the bonus is paid & I think that actually RAISES his value.
To quote myself again...."We'll see".
Mike
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nmills said:
If we gave DA up for a day two pick we would have to draft a QB with it anyway, whats the point of that. 1st or 2nd round or he's a Cleveland Brown next year.You wouldn't have to spend the third round pick you'd get for DA on a QB. You could draft a Rhett Bomar (Who I like a lot) or Nate Davis in rounds 4 to 5
There are also a lot of FA Qb's still out there too.
oldcow1945 said:
You wouldn't have to spend the third round pick you'd get for DA on a QB. You could draft a Rhett Bomar (Who I like a lot) or Nate Davis in rounds 4 to 5There are also a lot of FA Qb's still out there too.
we dont have a 5th rounder so it would have to be a 4th. If we went and got a veteran QB in free agency you could get away with it but you already paid DA 5million that you aint getting back and it would only cost you 1.5million to keep him another year. If we trade him were still paying him 5mil and you gotta get a vet for say 4mil, and you have to draft a QB. It wouldnt be worth it to me for a 3rd rounder.
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oldcow1945 said:
You wouldn't have to spend the third round pick you'd get for DA on a QB. You could draft a Rhett Bomar (Who I like a lot) or Nate Davis in rounds 4 to 5There are also a lot of FA Qb's still out there too.
we dont have a 5th rounder so it would have to be a 4th. If we went and got a veteran QB in free agency you could get away with it but you already paid DA 5million that you aint getting back and it would only cost you 1.5million to keep him another year. If we trade him were still paying him 5mil and you gotta get a vet for say 4mil, and you have to draft a QB. It wouldnt be worth it to me for a 3rd rounder.
nmills said:
we dont have a 5th rounder so it would have to be a 4th. If we went and got a veteran QB in free agency you could get away with it but you already paid DA 5million that you aint getting back and it would only cost you 1.5million to keep him another year. If we trade him were still paying him 5mil and you gotta get a vet for say 4mil, and you have to draft a QB. It wouldnt be worth it to me for a 3rd rounder.Backup QB's in the NFL only cost around $1.5 - $2M a year...so it would be fine...and you would have a backup that would fit the system.
here is the issue:
We keep DA it costs $6.45M and we have no draft picks
We trade DA it costs $6-7M and we have a 2nd round draft pick (1st/3rd also possible)
so, we GAIN a player...have the SAME COST...and avoid having DA on a $7.5M contract in 2010 which will make him LESS VALUABLE than he is this year (after sitting the bench for 1.5 years).
If the FO decides DA is the guy...BQ is worth a low 1st or high 2nd as well (at worst...probably more)...so do THAT and guess what...it actually costs the Browns MORE!!!
BQ is dirt cheap this year ($700k) and his escalators aren't effective until 2010 (and he would STILL be cheaper than DA). So now you reduce your cap by only $700k and then have to sign a low first and a QB...so the cap hit is GREATER by trading BQ.
Just saying you need to look at MORE than just one part of the trade scenarios to get what is being considered.
The SMART MONEY is to write off the $5M bonus and do what is BEST FOR THE TEAM by getting more depth at key positions and fill in the backup QB spot with a career backup QB.
Trading DA cuts down on locker room drama...frees up cap space for NEXT YEAR...actually SAVES MONEY THIS YEAR...and brings in a player or two at positions of need THIS YEAR.
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nmills said:
we dont have a 5th rounder so it would have to be a 4th. If we went and got a veteran QB in free agency you could get away with it but you already paid DA 5million that you aint getting back and it would only cost you 1.5million to keep him another year. If we trade him were still paying him 5mil and you gotta get a vet for say 4mil, and you have to draft a QB. It wouldnt be worth it to me for a 3rd rounder.Backup QB's in the NFL only cost around $1.5 - $2M a year...so it would be fine...and you would have a backup that would fit the system.
here is the issue:
We keep DA it costs $6.45M and we have no draft picks
We trade DA it costs $6-7M and we have a 2nd round draft pick (1st/3rd also possible)
so, we GAIN a player...have the SAME COST...and avoid having DA on a $7.5M contract in 2010 which will make him LESS VALUABLE than he is this year (after sitting the bench for 1.5 years).
If the FO decides DA is the guy...BQ is worth a low 1st or high 2nd as well (at worst...probably more)...so do THAT and guess what...it actually costs the Browns MORE!!!
BQ is dirt cheap this year ($700k) and his escalators aren't effective until 2010 (and he would STILL be cheaper than DA). So now you reduce your cap by only $700k and then have to sign a low first and a QB...so the cap hit is GREATER by trading BQ.
Just saying you need to look at MORE than just one part of the trade scenarios to get what is being considered.
The SMART MONEY is to write off the $5M bonus and do what is BEST FOR THE TEAM by getting more depth at key positions and fill in the backup QB spot with a career backup QB.
Trading DA cuts down on locker room drama...frees up cap space for NEXT YEAR...actually SAVES MONEY THIS YEAR...and brings in a player or two at positions of need THIS YEAR.
Backup QB's in the NFL only cost around $1.5 - $2M a year...so it would be fine...and you would have a backup that would fit the system.
here is the issue:
We keep DA it costs $6.45M and we have no draft picks
We trade DA it costs $6-7M and we have a 2nd round draft pick (1st/3rd also possible)
so, we GAIN a player...have the SAME COST...and avoid having DA on a $7.5M contract in 2010 which will make him LESS VALUABLE than he is this year (after sitting the bench for 1.5 years).
If the FO decides DA is the guy...BQ is worth a low 1st or high 2nd as well (at worst...probably more)...so do THAT and guess what...it actually costs the Browns MORE!!!
BQ is dirt cheap this year ($700k) and his escalators aren't effective until 2010 (and he would STILL be cheaper than DA). So now you reduce your cap by only $700k and then have to sign a low first and a QB...so the cap hit is GREATER by trading BQ.
Just saying you need to look at MORE than just one part of the trade scenarios to get what is being considered.
The SMART MONEY is to write off the $5M bonus and do what is BEST FOR THE TEAM by getting more depth at key positions and fill in the backup QB spot with a career backup QB.
Trading DA cuts down on locker room drama...frees up cap space for NEXT YEAR...actually SAVES MONEY THIS YEAR...and brings in a player or two at positions of need THIS YEAR.
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Third round picks are nothing to sneeze at, but I would think the Browns can get a second rounder for him if they do this right. It may be something that comes down on draft day though, which would suck for me to have to wait that long.
This guy has become an albatross to this franchise ever since he went batshit for a few early games in 2007 against a putrid schedule.
What a shame Phillip never pulled the trigger last year.
I can go and get me a backup anywhere for cheap. It's very rare that teams (unless they're dominant like NE) win after their starters go down anyway, so him as a valuable backup to me doesn't wash. Plus, he's a notorious cold starter and if he doesn't get the reps with the starters for a long period of time I think he'll be nothing but a big dumb buffoon rifling the ball downfield into coverage, completely oblivious to making turnovers because nobody could take his job at that point.
Get him outta here and get on with this thing, please.
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WPB how do you know that trading DA is best for the team? 7 million for a guy who can compete with BQ for the starter position or a 2nd round prospect who may wash out anyways?
How is giving our team only one finite option at the qb position WHEN WE DONT HAVE TO best for the team? competition breeds strength, why just hand the reigns to him when you can force him to earn his job? Next year budgets? you are talking about value for next year? NO ONE has any idea if DA or anyones value next year due to the salary cap expiring. Thats ludicrous. To even project value of any player falling or rising for next season is voodoo magic at best.
You have no idea if he is going to sit the bench/start/relieve in the place of injury/beat bq in the eyes of Mangini... who knows so to project value without any of those and more variables is ludicrous.
The "smart" money is to write off 5 MILLION dollars? since when is that smart? The kid is young and not injured and that is smart? So the "smart" thing for Mangini and Kokinis is to pigeon hole themselves to one finite option when they dont have too. Yes that sounds "smart" when you are dealing with NFL injury possiblities on the toughest position to fill. We saw how "quality" backups of dorsey and company did this year...
The "smart" thing would be to let BQ who cost basically low caliber backup money this year to compete for the job with DA. I am sure Businesses would be interested in paying out 5 million dollars and get nothing in return for it...... Sounds like how wall street theory on how our economy crashed into the recession....
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@inspecta said:
Flugel I along with everybody else who has a set of two functional eyes agrees with your assessment of the situation. But if we are only looking at a 3rd or 4th rounder for DA is it really worth it? I mean if Brady goes down with an injury there is no other QB I want than DA. He absolutely flourishes in situations where nobody expects much from him. And that might be the most frustrating part about this kid. He has the tools, but lacks the mental fortitude to put it into action.Legit question - BUT if DA's performances since December of 07 leave people thinking a training camp assessment of a QB competition is the ONLY way to go 3 years into Quinn not getting a FAIR chance, let's FREAKIN wake up before rip Van Winkle returns from nap #2.
I've never seen 1 game where defenders aren't allowed to hit the QB unless it's Tom Brady. THEN I see wonderful mechanics, composure and accuracy until the Giants were able to become the exception to the rule. DA is always gonna look the part in training camp (and minicamps) just like Northcutt was always Jerry Rice when there was NO CONTACT or threat of it. Case in point, there's Alex Smith without pass rushers and corners impacting mechanics, time to throw and composure looking the part of #1 overall draft pick. So much so that "best workout ever" and "sure thing" was implied by many a watchful eye. Then came the NFL pass rush shortly after once upon a time and nobody cared about chapter 2 in that story. If DA was the next Brian Sipe, we'd either be wanting exchange value for Quinn OR there would have never been ANY need whatsoever to DRAFT Quinn.
Along the same lines, if Tom Landry followed the same training camp competition criteria some want to reward DA with for a 10th, 11th, 12th and 13th life to as a starter with - he would have NEVER played Roger Staubach and contended to be SAFE with Craig Morton. Point? Some guys are BETTER AFTER the pocket collapses and they escape it to cause trouble for the opponent. Example? How about Brian Sipe with that alleged weak arm that couldn't get him drafted until round 13? Would he EVER win a competition in CAMP based upon false positive mechanics WITHOUT live pass rushers (because of the RED jersey symbolizing not to be touched)???? We'd still be pretending Mike Phipps had what it took and Roger Staubach's NFL stardom would have never been born. We would have missed alot of good football memories in the process.
Let's be honest, ALL of last camp we heard how accurate DA appeared to be. It was one great outing after another and I felt like I was in the minority saying we're about to face a much tougher schedule than 07 and he didn't finish well enough for comfort.
BACKUPS are backups Inspecta. Trust me when I tell you we've had BETTER backups than Ken Dorsey and we had a chance to go after Chris Simms but could NOT do so because of DA being here. I haven't seen 1 team that went into a season undecided on the starting QB fare well immediately thereafter. It's never a good sign even though wishful thinkers want to pretend this is Disney instead of the Cleveland Browns. We've basically put DA on stage so much that NOBODY wants his overpaid ass, except for Loverboy.
Patrick Ramsey was recently in Tennessee looking for a home as a backup. JP's Lostman would prolly make a solid backup at humble pricers now that he knows he's not a starter. Kitna just got signed by somebody right? Josh McCown might not be a bad idea. If we're THAT in love with an erratic QB - Kyle Boller is available at humble prices unless he's a Jet already. Notice NONE of the alleged teams that were gonna fight over Dumb Ass want the guy. That shouldn't equate to DESERVES a chance to win a starting job. I can't believe there are people tryinng to talk themselves into this guy. This isn't an opinion: I've never seen another Cleveland Brown QB throw as many INTs for TDs as DA.
It's IMPORTANT to understand who the receivers have the most trust in and best chemistry with. I saw 3 different recievers screaming at DA last year and it's NOT because they use their knee pads on Brady Quinn behind closed doors. It's because DA stinks. EVERY time our QBing isn't up to snuff, we oversensitize dropped passes. And WHY? Our subconscious doesn't believe the QB is reliable enough to get the NEXT pass there. Remember HOW MANY people couldn't wait to get rid of Antonio Bryant for his drops when Dilfer was the QB? Someone is going to correct me and say he had a bad attitude so that was why they wanted him gone; BUT 100% of the complaints about AB centered around his untimely drops. Drops are always more devastating when you can't trust your QB's accuracy a la Trent Dilfer, a la Tim Couch, a la Kelly Holcomb, a la Luke McCown, a la Charlie Frye. Guys dropped Sipe's passes too just like they dropped Kosar's passes but guess what? They were accurate QBs so drops weren't show stoppers. Remember when the IDEAL starting QB actually made people around him better? Kellen Winslow and Braylon Edwards were ELITE pass fetchers BEFORE they were Cleveland Browns. The ONLY thing standing in their way of a quicker NFL emergence was a surgery table not a QB. Neither kid's college QB is starting in the pros and ONE of those was Ken Dorsey right?
- Tom F.
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If we're THAT in love with an erratic QB - Kyle Boller is available at humble prices unless he's a Jet already.
Good lord you got me spitting up on that one Flugsy, that was some funny shit.
Very good post, one of your best. You pointed out so many things in here I can't begin to expound on them all, but let me go back to one I've been harping on for awhile now: DA is a very impressive player in the practice environment, but we've already seen what he does come game time.
It's time to see the Queen for those same amount of games we were forced to watch the Serial Drive Killer.
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If we're THAT in love with an erratic QB - Kyle Boller is available at humble prices unless he's a Jet already.
Good lord you got me spitting up on that one Flugsy, that was some funny shit.
Very good post, one of your best. You pointed out so many things in here I can't begin to expound on them all, but let me go back to one I've been harping on for awhile now: DA is a very impressive player in the practice environment, but we've already seen what he does come game time.
It's time to see the Queen for those same amount of games we were forced to watch the Serial Drive Killer.
Good lord you got me spitting up on that one Flugsy, that was some funny shit.
Very good post, one of your best. You pointed out so many things in here I can't begin to expound on them all, but let me go back to one I've been harping on for awhile now: DA is a very impressive player in the practice environment, but we've already seen what he does come game time.
It's time to see the Queen for those same amount of games we were forced to watch the Serial Drive Killer.
LOL! I hear ya. 31 other teams are telling us: "we don't want passing game by Dr Kevorkian but it sure looks good on you Cleveland. Thanks for volunteering again!" Look on the bright side, we're drafting right near the Detroit Lions for the umpteenth time. Maybe if we give DA another chance we can draft AHEAD of Detroit next year. Why progress from the first Trent Doofus when you don't have to right???
I'm reading ALOT of intelligent people trying to wishful think Dumb Ass into something he's not. He reads coverages the way I'd expect Ronnie Milsap to read coverages. How many more times do you need to see a spade before you call it a spade? If there's STILL some waiting for a Kurt Warner story to emerge - good luck with that!
And Riff, that new logo of Loverboy gettin naughty is FREAKIN hilarious!!! One of your alltime bests! While we're in the spirit: Do you know what's more limpwristed than roses on a piano? Lummy plantin his two lips on DA's organ.
- Tom F. (Roberta Flack should sing the theme song to our 2008 season in review video: "Killing me Softly")
.jpg.a1a2b9a0c33008fdaf4097d8fe2cfd64.jpg "Riffer X"){kind=avatar}
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