Who is the best in the AFCN
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That's fair. I can't argue Megatron that's for sure. He's a generational talent. Julio is great too. AB isn't big but he makes up for it with quickness and superior skill. He rarely drops the ball and runs great routes. And another thing about Gordon, don't you guys get irritated with his laziness and poor attitude? Maybe it's me but he always looks likes he's bothered to even be on the field.
I would put Johnson and AJ Green over both of them.
As for Gordon....his issues in what you say were only exhibited last year when he came back off suspension.
Was there something wrong there? Sure. Are we irritated? Sure. Especially considering that the one thing this team desperately needs are some offensive playmakers and he was on track to be one of the best in the game.
Will he be able to come back to perform at that level? Again, Who knows.
But he is too much of a talent to be given up on. And sorry, quite frankly the NFL's approach to players smoking a little dope is completely draconian and antiquated.
To put it in perspective for you: If Leveon Bell gets nabbed again for smoking a little dope....you lose him for a whole year.
If that happens then he joins the Gordon in the same canoe, stranded in the middle of a big lake.
I would put Johnson and AJ Green over both of them.
You must have missed the Bengal game Monday night when John Gruden did a whole segment on how too many of Dalton's interceptions have come while throwing to AJ Green (27) and how so many of them were Green's fault. This was right after Green dropped a pass that was intercepted. He showed 3 or 4 examples where Green either dropped it, didn't run the right route or didn't execute the route the way it should have been and the play resulted in a pick. He's talented for sure but he makes a ton of mistakes that cost his team dearly. AB is better and so is Julio.
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Ahm, I think Gordon is more talented and CAN be better....no....he WAS better than AB the year he was fully available and productive. (And Brown has had 2 good years)
As for records...Gordon has his share:
He has the highest YPG avg. in a season next only to some early AFL players and 1950s Ram receivers.
He is the only person in history with two consecutive 200 yard receiving games. I suspect there may be more.
Might he have dropped a few passes....sure....I suggest if you go back you will see Brown having dropped his share of passes. His talent overcame that.
Is he a complete knucklehead? Obviously.
Can he return someday to be the performer he is capable of? Who really knows.
You pitty pat dropped passes as if they almost don't matter. They matter a lot and mean a lot when talking about who is better. The Steelers drafted Sammy Coates this year and I keep hearing how "talented" he is. Well so what? He's dropped half the passes thrown to him so far. He's taller than AB, probably faster. He's not half the receiver AB is.
You seem to want to cherry pick Gordan's good qualities and minimize his bad one's when arguing he's better that AB. To me if you consider both it's not close. It's not a if-then thing to me. AB is just better. His statistics have improved every year and he's a good kid. Gordan is a mess who had one really good year. Unfortunately for you, you have to keep excusing everything that's wrong with the dude while trying to champion him at the same time. When you consider everything, AB is better.
You pitty pat dropped passes as if they almost don't matter.
They matter if that is all that the player does. But, when he averages 117 yards per game...and numerous TD catches.
They matter a lot and mean a lot when talking about who is better. The Steelers drafted Sammy Coates this year and I keep hearing how "talented" he is. Well so what? He's dropped half the passes thrown to him so far. He's taller than AB, probably faster. He's not half the receiver AB is.
You seem to want to cherry pick Gordan's good qualities and minimize his bad one's when arguing he's better that AB.
And you want to do the exact opposite.....cherry pick his bad qualities and minimize his good ones when arguing that AB is better.
To me if you consider both it's not close. It's not a if-then thing to me. AB is just better.
His statistics have improved every year and he's a good kid. Gordan is a mess who had one really good year. Unfortunately for you, you have to keep excusing everything that's wrong with the dude while trying to champion him at the same time. When you consider everything, AB is better.
The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
So, OK, for that reason only.....the best ability being availability, sure Brown is showing up and playing. If he needed a walker and he could go out there he would still be better than Gordon.
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I would put Johnson and AJ Green over both of them.
You must have missed the Bengal game Monday night when John Gruden did a whole segment on how too many of Dalton's interceptions have come while throwing to AJ Green (27) and how so many of them were Green's fault. This was right after Green dropped a pass that was intercepted. He showed 3 or 4 examples where Green either dropped it, didn't run the right route or didn't execute the route the way it should have been and the play resulted in a pick. He's talented for sure but he makes a ton of mistakes that cost his team dearly. AB is better and so is Julio.
You must have missed the Bengal game Monday night when John Gruden did a whole segment on how too many of Dalton's interceptions have come while throwing to AJ Green (27) and how so many of them were Green's fault. This was right after Green dropped a pass that was intercepted. He showed 3 or 4 examples where Green either dropped it, didn't run the right route or didn't execute the route the way it should have been and the play resulted in a pick. He's talented for sure but he makes a ton of mistakes that cost his team dearly. AB is better and so is Julio.
You are arguing about the results in a preseason game?
Bottom line: If I am putting a team together from scratch....I am taking AJ Green over either Brown or Jones.
Again, this is no disparagement to those two necessarily.....I just think Green...and Johnson are better.
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Attack of the Gip...
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You pitty pat dropped passes as if they almost don't matter.
They matter if that is all that the player does. But, when he averages 117 yards per game...and numerous TD catches.
They matter a lot and mean a lot when talking about who is better. The Steelers drafted Sammy Coates this year and I keep hearing how "talented" he is. Well so what? He's dropped half the passes thrown to him so far. He's taller than AB, probably faster. He's not half the receiver AB is.
You seem to want to cherry pick Gordan's good qualities and minimize his bad one's when arguing he's better that AB.
And you want to do the exact opposite.....cherry pick his bad qualities and minimize his good ones when arguing that AB is better.
To me if you consider both it's not close. It's not a if-then thing to me. AB is just better.
His statistics have improved every year and he's a good kid. Gordan is a mess who had one really good year. Unfortunately for you, you have to keep excusing everything that's wrong with the dude while trying to champion him at the same time. When you consider everything, AB is better.
The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
So, OK, for that reason only.....the best ability being availability, sure Brown is showing up and playing. If he needed a walker and he could go out there he would still be better than Gordon.
The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
No, like I said before Gordan drops way too many passes. He was famous for it WHEN HE WAS ACTUALLY PLAYING.
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You must have missed the Bengal game Monday night when John Gruden did a whole segment on how too many of Dalton's interceptions have come while throwing to AJ Green (27) and how so many of them were Green's fault. This was right after Green dropped a pass that was intercepted. He showed 3 or 4 examples where Green either dropped it, didn't run the right route or didn't execute the route the way it should have been and the play resulted in a pick. He's talented for sure but he makes a ton of mistakes that cost his team dearly. AB is better and so is Julio.
You are arguing about the results in a preseason game?
Bottom line: If I am putting a team together from scratch....I am taking AJ Green over either Brown or Jones.
Again, this is no disparagement to those two necessarily.....I just think Green...and Johnson are better.
You are arguing about the results in a preseason game?
Bottom line: If I am putting a team together from scratch....I am taking AJ Green over either Brown or Jones.
Again, this is no disparagement to those two necessarily.....I just think Green...and Johnson are better.
Preseason game or not, it was a drop. The pass came right to him, his hands touched it, the ball went through them, then it was intercepted. It also preceded a long discussion by John Gruden about how that happens way too often when the ball is thrown to AJ Green. He didn't say it happens when throwing to AB or Julio, he said it happens (27 times) too often when Dalton throws to Green. That being said, you opinion is your opinion. I'm just defending mine.
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OK, I mistated a bit when I said that Josh Gordon had the best ypg average since the 1960s. Here are the actual records for most average yards per game receiving in a season:
1. Wes Chandler 1982 Chargers 129.0 ypg......Quarterback throwing to him Hall of Famer Dan Fouts
2. Charley Henningan 1961 Oilers 124.7 ypg....Quarterback: Hall of Famer George Blanda
3. Elroy "Crazy Legs" Hirsch 1951 LA Rams 124.6 ypg....Quarteback: Hall of Famer Norm Van Brocklin
4. Calvin Johnson 2012 Lions 122.8 ypg....Quarterback: Matt Stafford
5. Jim Benton 1945 Cleveland Rams 118.6 ypg....Quarterback: Hall of Famer Bob Waterfield
6. Josh Gordon 2013 Browns 117.6 ypg....Quarterbacks: Brandon Weeden, Jason Campbell, Brian Hoyer
(not your HOF/All Pro list, needless to say)
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The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
No, like I said before Gordan drops way too many passes. He was famous for it WHEN HE WAS ACTUALLY PLAYING.
The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
No, like I said before Gordan drops way too many passes. He was famous for it WHEN HE WAS ACTUALLY PLAYING.
He was famous for having one of the best season ever in history by a Wide Receiver....for being the only WR in history with back to back 200 yard games.
In the words of Sherlock Holmes: If I could in anyway be assured of the former eventuality, I would cheerfully accept the latter.
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You are arguing about the results in a preseason game?
Bottom line: If I am putting a team together from scratch....I am taking AJ Green over either Brown or Jones.
Again, this is no disparagement to those two necessarily.....I just think Green...and Johnson are better.
Preseason game or not, it was a drop. The pass came right to him, his hands touched it, the ball went through them, then it was intercepted. It also preceded a long discussion by John Gruden about how that happens way too often when the ball is thrown to AJ Green. He didn't say it happens when throwing to AB or Julio, he said it happens (27 times) too often when Dalton throws to Green. That being said, you opinion is your opinion. I'm just defending mine.
Preseason game or not, it was a drop. The pass came right to him, his hands touched it, the ball went through them, then it was intercepted. It also preceded a long discussion by John Gruden about how that happens way too often when the ball is thrown to AJ Green. He didn't say it happens when throwing to AB or Julio, he said it happens (27 times) too often when Dalton throws to Green. That being said, you opinion is your opinion. I'm just defending mine.
You are being obsequious in defense of your boy.
Ooh, Gordon and Green are no good because they dropped a few passes! Whoop de fucking do.
You know, Jerry Rice admitted to cheating by using stickum.....are you going to say he should not be considered the greatest?
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And look at this: 10 minutes of Rice dropping passes. He must have sucked bad, eh?
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The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
No, like I said before Gordan drops way too many passes. He was famous for it WHEN HE WAS ACTUALLY PLAYING.
The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
No, like I said before Gordan drops way too many passes. He was famous for it WHEN HE WAS ACTUALLY PLAYING.
Except Brown drops exactly the same amount as Gordon.....so, if your gonna argue a point, its best to argue a valid one.....
2012 Brown had 4 drops to Gordons same 4 drops.....
2013 Brown had 8 drops to Gordons 9 drops.....
so 1 more dropped ball by Gordon....HUGE difference, eh?...
lest we forget that Gordon gained 5 yards more per catch X 100+ catches = 500 extra yards of production o the same #of catches...
which is almost 2 whole games of offense...less 1 drop.....so there's that too.....
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On PFR I do not see where they even keep "Drops" as a statistic for WRs. Where do you go to find that stat?
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On PFR I do not see where they even keep "Drops" as a statistic for WRs. Where do you go to find that stat?
On PFR I do not see where they even keep "Drops" as a statistic for WRs. Where do you go to find that stat?
PFF....where else?
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The ONLY thing that makes AB better is that he hasn't fucked up like Gordon has.
No, like I said before Gordan drops way too many passes. He was famous for it WHEN HE WAS ACTUALLY PLAYING.
Except Brown drops exactly the same amount as Gordon.....so, if your gonna argue a point, its best to argue a valid one.....
2012 Brown had 4 drops to Gordons same 4 drops.....
2013 Brown had 8 drops to Gordons 9 drops.....
so 1 more dropped ball by Gordon....HUGE difference, eh?...
lest we forget that Gordon gained 5 yards more per catch X 100+ catches = 500 extra yards of production o the same #of catches...
which is almost 2 whole games of offense...less 1 drop.....so there's that too.....
Except Brown drops exactly the same amount as Gordon.....so, if your gonna argue a point, its best to argue a valid one.....
2012 Brown had 4 drops to Gordons same 4 drops.....
2013 Brown had 8 drops to Gordons 9 drops.....
so 1 more dropped ball by Gordon....HUGE difference, eh?...
lest we forget that Gordon gained 5 yards more per catch X 100+ catches = 500 extra yards of production o the same #of catches...
which is almost 2 whole games of offense...less 1 drop.....so there's that too.....
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/12/cleveland_browns_josh_gordon_o_1.html
Also, what's their drop rate? How many drops per target? Any difference?
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gotta back up what the dick troller says about AJ Green though....cause he drops a TON of passes.....way way more than both these guys together....plus, like he said, he gives up a ton more interceptions too.....
in 2013:
Drops = Brown 9,,,,Gordon 9....Green 11
Ints = Brown 3....Gordon 2....Green 12
TD's = Brown 8....Gordon 9....Green 11
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Except Brown drops exactly the same amount as Gordon.....so, if your gonna argue a point, its best to argue a valid one.....
2012 Brown had 4 drops to Gordons same 4 drops.....
2013 Brown had 8 drops to Gordons 9 drops.....
so 1 more dropped ball by Gordon....HUGE difference, eh?...
lest we forget that Gordon gained 5 yards more per catch X 100+ catches = 500 extra yards of production o the same #of catches...
which is almost 2 whole games of offense...less 1 drop.....so there's that too.....
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/12/cleveland_browns_josh_gordon_o_1.html
Also, what's their drop rate? How many drops per target? Any difference?
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/12/cleveland_browns_josh_gordon_o_1.html
Also, what's their drop rate? How many drops per target? Any difference?
Last year AB had 5 drops.....in 181 targets.
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Except Brown drops exactly the same amount as Gordon.....so, if your gonna argue a point, its best to argue a valid one.....
2012 Brown had 4 drops to Gordons same 4 drops.....
2013 Brown had 8 drops to Gordons 9 drops.....
so 1 more dropped ball by Gordon....HUGE difference, eh?...
lest we forget that Gordon gained 5 yards more per catch X 100+ catches = 500 extra yards of production o the same #of catches...
which is almost 2 whole games of offense...less 1 drop.....so there's that too.....
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/12/cleveland_browns_josh_gordon_o_1.html
Also, what's their drop rate? How many drops per target? Any difference?
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/12/cleveland_browns_josh_gordon_o_1.html
Also, what's their drop rate? How many drops per target? Any difference?
Less than 1% difference both years.....Gordon got one year...Brown got the other.....they are the exact same....
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gotta back up what the dick troller says about AJ Green though....cause he drops a TON of passes.....way way more than both these guys together....plus, like he said, he gives up a ton more interceptions too.....
in 2013:
Drops = Brown 9,,,,Gordon 9....Green 11
Ints = Brown 3....Gordon 2....Green 12
TD's = Brown 8....Gordon 9....Green 11
gotta back up what the dick troller says about AJ Green though....cause he drops a TON of passes.....way way more than both these guys together....plus, like he said, he gives up a ton more interceptions too.....
in 2013:
Drops = Brown 9,,,,Gordon 9....Green 11
Ints = Brown 3....Gordon 2....Green 12
TD's = Brown 8....Gordon 9....Green 11
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gotta back up what the dick troller says about AJ Green though....cause he drops a TON of passes.....way way more than both these guys together....plus, like he said, he gives up a ton more interceptions too.....
in 2013:
Drops = Brown 9,,,,Gordon 9....Green 11
Ints = Brown 3....Gordon 2....Green 12
TD's = Brown 8....Gordon 9....Green 11
In 2012 Gordon's catch rate was 53%. AB was 63%.
In 2013 Gordon's catch rate was 55%. AB was 66%.
IN 2014 Gordon's catch rate was 0.00%. AB was 71%
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