you've got to be showing *major* promise/upside in year 2 in the nfl.....
-
I sat Melvin Gordon and played Woodhead on my fantasy team. Because I knew! Last week I played Carr and Murray. It's so obvious it is sickening. No excuses anymore.mthey had no wide receivers and three offensive linemen out. My God?
But I disagree why they don't play Manziel. Pettine would not be worried about his job playing Manziel because technically he's still a rookie until he's played a full year. No, Pettine dislikes Manziel. It's personal not professional.
If Weeden loses tonight I still predict a trade to Dallas.
DAMN THE TORPEDOES! FULL SPEED AHEAD! -
Well we can't fire pettine so that's that. We just have to give him "YEARS" to build "HIS" team. We simply can't change coaches every 2 years and say here's your guys see what you can do with them. This is what i feel is happening with this team, they are a mismatch for what he does. He built that defense in Buffalo so i'm completely willing to let him build that here, Rex is getting too cute with that D which is why they're underperforming a bit. When those guys line up base 4 man down they do just fine. It's when they all stand up and wander around asking each other for directions to the stadium and get all gimmicky that they get in trouble.
-
since the other way doesn't work, i'm willing to accept a couple more years of suck if we start to see the foundations to a "real" team start to get built.
-
I don't want Pettine fired either. If he's fired we start all over again. You're right he built a good defense and Rex Ryan will reap the rewards. But can we at least get an offensive coordinator? And coaches that have eye for detail? How many penalties were there? My Gosh this is the NFL and they keep shooting themselves in the foot. It's so embarrassing and disappointing to be a Browns fan.
-
I had high hopes for Pettine & Farmer. But now, I'm not so sure. Unless things turn around, I find it difficult to accept the text-gate and poor draft choices from Farmer and the failure to make progress from Pettine. I can give Pettine the opportunity to fix things by firing his defensive coordinator (perhaps more) but Farmer needs replacement at the end of the season - or we need a President to oversee things and decide what's right for the organization.
Farmer - you can't blow 3/4 of your first round draft choices, not sign any playmakers (except Hawkins), sign players like Bowe and keep your job. The Bowe move really pisses me off. Farmer would rather sign an aging veteran off a terrible year to an expensive contract than use a high draft choice to get WR talent.
Anyway, he comes to work on Monday - let's see what he's made off. He needs to cut Bowe. Do something !!
-
and Im just not seeing it. We're going in the wrong direction if anything.
Year 2 of the pettine(who the **** is mike pettine says 90% of the nfl) regime isn't showing any progress or signs of hope. Our ancient career journeyman qb has been surprisingly not too far below average this year(which is a plus because he's been decidedly below average most of his decade plus long career), but it's not like there is any future there even if he were to get to being average. Our backup qb is very young and *may* have some upside, but our no name hc is already into self preservation mode and will do anything to win an extra game now(because7-9 is so much better than 6-10) to maybe preserve his job for another year.....even if there is no good end game in doing so(what is mccown actually going to start next year too?)
the team also doesnt look well coached....im not an xs and os guy, but it seems like our players are rarely in position. Pettine didnt take over a disastrous situation...we didnt have a great roster, but it wasnt godawful. the nfl is not college football- you dont go into long 4 and 5 year rebuilding plans....you get some people in there and start winning. Thats why new teams make the playoffs every year. Pettine just hasnt done anything to show me he deserves a third year unless there are some major changes the 2nd, 3rd and 4th qtr of the year, which is unlikely considering the first quartern of the year was our 'easy' part of the schedule.
This is a great analysis. And you hit the nail on the head about Pettine not wanting to develop JFF because it may cost him some wins when the season ends that could mean his job.and Im just not seeing it. We're going in the wrong direction if anything.
Year 2 of the pettine(who the **** is mike pettine says 90% of the nfl) regime isn't showing any progress or signs of hope. Our ancient career journeyman qb has been surprisingly not too far below average this year(which is a plus because he's been decidedly below average most of his decade plus long career), but it's not like there is any future there even if he were to get to being average. Our backup qb is very young and *may* have some upside, but our no name hc is already into self preservation mode and will do anything to win an extra game now(because7-9 is so much better than 6-10) to maybe preserve his job for another year.....even if there is no good end game in doing so(what is mccown actually going to start next year too?)
the team also doesnt look well coached....im not an xs and os guy, but it seems like our players are rarely in position. Pettine didnt take over a disastrous situation...we didnt have a great roster, but it wasnt godawful. the nfl is not college football- you dont go into long 4 and 5 year rebuilding plans....you get some people in there and start winning. Thats why new teams make the playoffs every year. Pettine just hasnt done anything to show me he deserves a third year unless there are some major changes the 2nd, 3rd and 4th qtr of the year, which is unlikely considering the first quartern of the year was our 'easy' part of the schedule.
-
Pettine did inherit a disastrous situation when he took on the Browns HC job. Can you think of any other club in the NFL more disastrous since 99? I can't.
Even though I haven't been happy with the performance in the last 2 losses in both those losses we were in those games until the final seconds. Unfortunately we are finding ways to lose these games instead of winning them.
McCown has come here and done what he is supposed to do. I thought he played well against the Chargers. It is our defense that has been the huge disappointment. It was our defense that lost the game to the Chargers. Our defense that could not take advantage of all the injuries on the Chargers offensive line. Our defense that kept giving up the big plays.
Pettine said he would be more involved on the offense this year but he needs to get more involved with our defense. He chewed out the defense last week against the Raiders saying they looked like the scout team and this week they were even worse.
-
Can't fire Pettine for years, will keep saying it as long as people don't get it. Ownership shot itself in the dick when it kept firing staff after 1-2 years. Pettine would have to resign for "personal reasons" and be paid well i'm assuming to never break story that he was in essence asked to resign.
And this team is shit for talent, i'm sorry to break that to some of you. They don't do some of the basics that people learned in HS. Watch our pass rushers, the moves they make, than go compare them to pass rushers on a some of the top defense's. That will clarify to you what some of the thigns Pettine has to deal with. Than go look at top tier or even middle of the road ILB"ers if you want to be further frustrated. See how routinely they meet runners in the hole or even in the backfield. Teo and Perryman are nowhere near the top of the shelf as ILB"ers, Teo has serious fundamental tackling problems, yet both of them were way more around the ball and kept the ball carriers infront of them more. We still made decent yards on the ground yesterday, because those LB'ers are avg at best. But they still outperformed us.
-
Pettine did inherit a disastrous situation when he took on the Browns HC job. Can you think of any other club in the NFL more disastrous since 99? I can't.
Even though I haven't been happy with the performance in the last 2 losses in both those losses we were in those games until the final seconds. Unfortunately we are finding ways to lose these games instead of winning them.
McCown has come here and done what he is supposed to do. I thought he played well against the Chargers. It is our defense that has been the huge disappointment. It was our defense that lost the game to the Chargers. Our defense that could not take advantage of all the injuries on the Chargers offensive line. Our defense that kept giving up the big plays.
Pettine said he would be more involved on the offense this year but he needs to get more involved with our defense. He chewed out the defense last week against the Raiders saying they looked like the scout team and this week they were even worse.
Im tired of this garbage excuse . . .Even though I haven't been happy with the performance in the last 2 losses in both those losses we were in those games until the final seconds. Unfortunately we are finding ways to lose these games instead of winning them.
This isn't peewee football, there's no trophy for participation. Well coached teams find ways to win. Let's just get real . . . this season was a prayer before it ever started, but now it's over. No defense, no running game, same old garbage at the QB position. Our only hope is Benjamin returns three punts in some game.
So here is where we should really start to judge Pettine . . . How are we going to learn from our mistakes? What are you going to do differently from here on out.
He needs to completely take over the defense, because O'neil is in over his head. Maybe do something different on defense, we've done the same thing over and over with not very much success . . . Do you know the definition of insanity? While I despise belicheat, one thing he does is adapt. So Mike think outside your box.
He also needs to see what he has in Johnny in order to prepare for next year . . . and a four game stretch when the team is playing not to get hurt at the end of this disaster is not a good sample. He only needs to look at the Browns recent history to realize that pinning the hopes of a franchise on an aging backup journeyman is not the answer and never will be. I give McCown credit he played better than I expected, and if he was 26 and not 36 then it would be a different story. This is a business and it's not always fair . . . Johnny better or worse needs to be starting over you Josh, because in the long run it's better for the franchise. Bummer you didn't play this well during the rest of your time in the league. If Johnny can't handle being put on a bad situation he's not gonna be able to handle being a QB in this league. Most rookie QB's don't get plugged into a great situation . . . They rise to the occasion and lead their team to victories.
He's got to put some foot in asses over all these penalties . . . It's unacceptable. What is this "I appreciate the effort" bullshit? Stay behind the fucking line til the ball is snapped dude who is getting paid millions of dollars to be a professional football player. Pettine seems to favor the veterans to a fault, and needs to start holding them accountable.
If it remains business as usual I won't expect anything out of this team for several years, but if Pettine can get out of his own way, make some changes and take command of the situation then I will be a little more optimistic.
-
@douche-nozzle said:
It's a catch 22. If you fire anybody, you are simply going to fill his position with another no-name coach. Stability is probably the ONLY thing that is going to change the fact that proven players and coaches simply aren't coming to Cleveland.
Even if this collection of coaches and players may not be what you want, history has proven that constant change will maintain the problem that prevents the Browns from improving. If the Browns FO demonstrates that they are willing to build a system, and keep the coaches they have, it will help in the long run; the problem is that Browns fans and media are not interested in the long term. So......in reality, the fans and media are getting what they want......a steady stream of attempts to fix it all this year. It's like playing the lottery as a financial plan.
This is one of the times I appreciate an outsiders point of view and it is the correct one.
-
Pettine did inherit a disastrous situation when he took on the Browns HC job. Can you think of any other club in the NFL more disastrous since 99? I can't.
Even though I haven't been happy with the performance in the last 2 losses in both those losses we were in those games until the final seconds. Unfortunately we are finding ways to lose these games instead of winning them.
McCown has come here and done what he is supposed to do. I thought he played well against the Chargers. It is our defense that has been the huge disappointment. It was our defense that lost the game to the Chargers. Our defense that could not take advantage of all the injuries on the Chargers offensive line. Our defense that kept giving up the big plays.
Pettine said he would be more involved on the offense this year but he needs to get more involved with our defense. He chewed out the defense last week against the Raiders saying they looked like the scout team and this week they were even worse.
Pettine did inherit a disastrous situation when he took on the Browns HC job. Can you think of any other club in the NFL more disastrous since 99? I can't.
Even though I haven't been happy with the performance in the last 2 losses in both those losses we were in those games until the final seconds. Unfortunately we are finding ways to lose these games instead of winning them.
McCown has come here and done what he is supposed to do. I thought he played well against the Chargers. It is our defense that has been the huge disappointment. It was our defense that lost the game to the Chargers. Our defense that could not take advantage of all the injuries on the Chargers offensive line. Our defense that kept giving up the big plays.
Pettine said he would be more involved on the offense this year but he needs to get more involved with our defense. He chewed out the defense last week against the Raiders saying they looked like the scout team and this week they were even worse.
Amen-this is not on Josh or the O-it's on the 3rd rate D.
-
I'm not convinced our massive problems on defense boils down to talent. There's definitely some coaching problems.
-
I'm not convinced our massive problems on defense boils down to talent. There's definitely some coaching problems.
-
I see the Browns playing intensely to WIN.
But I wonder if the systems are so complicated, that they
take more time to implement successfully than they planned.
Players like gilbert, and bowe, and a few others, who don't really
give a damn to work and learn, and just want their paycheck.
It will take more time to fix that next year in the draft and FA.
Rivers kept having wr's or TE's get open quickly, often.
Mccown - more like, kept having receivers not get open quickly,
except for Travis - who I think they kept double covering...
and Hartline - who got hurt.
Right now, Bowe is a disaster, anyone on this board, well, except for "why(*", and soju, and
doofus schnozzle (although schnozzle did have a good post his last post....
), a few other trolls, could haverun that play with a hell of a lot more enthusiam than Bowe did. His body language was really bad for the Browns.
-
I'm not convinced our massive problems on defense boils down to talent. There's definitely some coaching problems.
There are easier ways to collect a check than returning kick-offs. I'm not willing to lump Gilbert in with Bowe... yet.
I'm not convinced our massive problems on defense boils down to talent. There's definitely some coaching problems.
Misapplying the talent we have? Again, I have to ask: where are the examples of "the system" being adapted to our players?
-
Does anyone really think a different scheme would make that big of a difference? I know I've said in the past few weeks that we look to be built more for a 4-3, and maybe we'd see some slight improvement but I doubt it for one major reason...our LB'ers. We might see some slightly better play out of our front 4 if they were rotated properly and kept fresh. But with the exception of Robertson, who's that stud MLB that's gonna fly up into the gap and crush the RB? That guy just isn't on the team. I'd like to see Tank start to get more reps at ILB'er, just to see where he's at. He's been here a long time now, was it Mangini's last year or Shurms first? In any case I heard Pet talking him up so put him out there. We need someone to step up and form tackle runners in the hole, not slough after them once they've broke through the seam. I think our DL makes more pursuit tackles in the run game at this point than our LB'ing corp. I'm sick of this.
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login