Jonathan Paul Manziel
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I'm not a Manziel fan / supporter, but I'm curious. I would like to see him play...get a fair chance to develop. This latest situation is completely blown out of proportion in my opinion. He had no control of what his idiot girlfriend did to cause all this. If he blatantly screws up...again...cut him. He's in control of his own destiny....but don't discipline him for something this stupid.
I'm not a Manziel fan / supporter, but I'm curious. I would like to see him play...He had no control of what his idiot girlfriend did to cause all this.
Im not a "fan"(at all), though I did try to be a supporter, but have grown very tired of his schtick......and I DO think he had plenty of control over whether or not she/he were out drinking on a monday afternoon....
In re to the poll....Id vote to trade him in a hot second(if that was a lone category)(and if someone would give us something)....but Im not an advocate of just cutting or waiving him ......unfortunately, he's worthless on the open market and no one else would give anything for him....so, I guess keep him for the season or until he's suspended or whatever happens next.....
And what a difference 2 weeks makes......last poll had 60% saying he should be the starter immediately.....now it's 11%......hahahaha.......hilarious....
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I'm not one of the fans that are saying Johnny should be starting while we're still technically in playoff contention, but like most analysts have said, eventually we have to see what we have in our first round selection. In his one start, Johnny made some big plays, but certainly didn't look like the second coming of Russell Wilson. He is still plagued by ball control issues, his accuracy can be suspect, and he is still figuring out when to run and when to throw. Even though I can appreciate him doing a better job of staying in the pocket, there were times against the Titans where he left some big chunks of running yards on the table. He had a few amazing jaunts against the Jets, but most of those runs were negated by terrible penalties. I didn't like the pick when we made it, and I certainly didn't like us moving up to get him, but we're stuck with him for now, and we don't have anyone else. Was I screaming for Derek Carr? Why yes, yes I was. Would I have been content with Mr. Bridgewater? Certainly.
But Manziel is who we have, and at some point we need to see what he can do. If our team performed like we were built to (with a killer defense and good rushing attack), I think McCown was the best to start, and he gave us the best chance to win. But despite their high pedigree, and despite what some metrics say, our offensive line isn't cutting the mustard. Against good defenses, we don't have enough time to throw, and we don't create lanes to run. Would a highly mobile quarterback help to negate some of that Bronco pass rush, or would it have resulted in more turnovers? I went back and looked at the game, and there were several times where McCown could've JOGGED for 15 yards. I think if we lose the next two games, it might be time to put the kid in. For some weird reason, I think we beat the Rams this weekend (I know, I know...I'm an idiot). So at 3-4, it won't be time to put Johnny in as the starter. But I think we lose to the Cardinals, and we all know how we usually do in our conference games, so 3-7 might be just around the corner. At that point...it's time.
Another concern I have is placing Manziel in as the starter when the games really don't mean anything. Will the players still give their all when we're out of the hunt? Are the players really ok with all of the drama this kid brings to the table? I'm obviously not in the locker room, but I have to believe that the veteran players are getting fed up with this charade, right? Was it just a coincidence our defense attacked the Titans' quarterback with Manziel in the game? Does he bring an extra step to everyone because of his style? I honestly don't know, but I think most Browns fans will agree that at some point, it's time to see what we have...if anything...with our precious first round pick. Is he just another Weeden or Brady Quinn? Or is it finally time for us to strike gold at a position where we have historically failed to get right?
But Manziel is who we have, and at some point we need to see what he can do.
I went back and looked at the game, and there were several times where McCown could've JOGGED for 15 yards.
Another concern I have is placing Manziel in as the starter when the games really don't mean anything. Will the players still give their all when we're out of the hunt? Are the players really ok with all of the drama this kid brings to the table? I'm obviously not in the locker room, but I have to believe that the veteran players are getting fed up with this charade, right?
First, if there were several runs available to McC, then they must have been in the 2nd half. I finished the first-half yesterday and saw none. Also not seen... repeatedly holding the ball too long. Only saw this once and it was on a 3rd and long. The resulting sack had zero impact on the game.
Second, if the locker room is sick of the drama, then there's no need to see what JM can do.
Third, pros play for pay. Meaningless games late in a lost season are auditions to keep their jobs. That plus pride generally keep the level of effort high enough. As high as if they were in a fight for the playoffs? Doubtful... after all they are human... but more than high enough to support a QB audition.
Fourth, and last, at some point folks beating the "see what he can do" drum have to understand that the Browns staff see this five days a week. If last year did not prove this, however, then I do not know what will.
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mik throws up a good post every once in a while to keep us off balance...
You should try it.
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Let's meet our other QB's ladies:
Natalie McCown & the four McCown kids:
Austin Davis' wife Heather, they were college sweethearts.
Not really seeing any coke whores ... so that's a good sign.
Zombo
Zombo said:
Let's meet our other QB's ladies:
Natalie McCown & the four McCown kids:
Austin Davis' wife Heather, they were college sweethearts.
Not really seeing any coke whores ... so that's a good sign.
Zombo
Wish they were....I'ld get an 8 ball and set a single game YAK record! OUU-LA-LA
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@douche-nozzle said:
I think it's pretty clear what he has.
A playground mentality.....on and off the field.
A lack of talent at this level.
Perhaps.
My concern is that if they really want to dump JFF.....then they need something to replace him. So we have Josh starting for now. A potential guy with Austin Davis.....certainly nothing proven. So that means they have to go get someone to replace him. And I guess that means we do something in the draft.
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When he's good enough to win the job.
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It should also be clear that Cardale is a project as well
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oh I god pls no Cardale. Cardale is a bigger project than JM at this point. That dude's regressed considerably. I want no part of him. Only Buckeyes at this point I would really want on the team are Bosa, Zeke and maybe Braxton (as a WR). Remains to be seen if Barrett is NFL material...that's gonna get sorted out here shortly.
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2005
The Packers went 4-12, with a 36-year old Favre at the helm, the year they drafted Rodgers. He threw 16 passes, 9 of which were caught. He also threw one interception. I'm sure the fans were calling for their rookie first round QB plenty, yet he barely saw the field.
2006
Sherman gets fired after that season and McCarthy takes over. Instead of starting his shiny new hood ornament, he puts Rodgers in QB school for six hours a day. Rodgers barely plays at all again this season, despite the Packers being 8-8 and Favre having one of his worst seasons as Green Bay Packer.
2007
Favre decides to return for one more year, despite 2005 and 2006 being two of his worst four years in Green Bay. Rodgers plays decent in spot duty.
Josh McCown is no Brett Favre, I understand that. And Manziel is no Aaron Rodgers, I understand that too. But the point remains the same - Favre wasn't playing up to his normal standard, the team wasn't winning, yet the FO stayed the course with Rodgers.
McCown, on the other hand, is playing completely out of character, we're losing close games to good teams, and people are still yearning for Manziel?
Just shut the hell up and watch the games...that's it.
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Zombo said:
Let's meet our other QB's ladies:
Natalie McCown & the four McCown kids:
Austin Davis' wife Heather, they were college sweethearts.
Not really seeing any coke whores ... so that's a good sign.
Zombo
Wish they were....I'ld get an 8 ball and set a single game YAK record! OUU-LA-LA
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@douche-nozzle said:
I think it's pretty clear what he has.
A playground mentality.....on and off the field.
A lack of talent at this level.
Uh oh, I agree with a Steeler fan.
If Johnny was so good, he would have won the job by now. He can sit as far as I'm concerned, McCown is playing well.
Karlis Missed -
I'd trade him for whatever we can get and move forward without the controversy. But I'm not a gm. I'm just some guy.
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@douche-nozzle said:
I think it's pretty clear what he has.
A playground mentality.....on and off the field.
A lack of talent at this level.
Uh oh, I agree with a Steeler fan.
If Johnny was so good, he would have won the job by now. He can sit as far as I'm concerned, McCown is playing well.
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@douche-nozzle said:
True.....but like I said in another post, get rid of the things that perpetuate the "dysfunctional" label. And his on field talent wouldn't be hard to replace. I will give you $50 to take Vick?
Browns could have had Vick if they wanted him....for less than $50.00.
But....here is the clue: who knows which things here are the dysfunctional things and which are not. (In terms of team management, not players). In the past the people brought in to solidify things....to get rid of the dysfunction, only poured gas on the flames......like Banner/Lombardi/Savage/Holmgren etc. etc.
Of course part of their dysfunction has been in selecting the wrong players...in the draft and elsewhere.
Picking Gilbert and JFF in the draft.....signing Dwayne Bowe? Not a good resume for Farmer and his talent evaluation skills. But what? Fire him and go get another guy. Switch gears again for the umpteenth time?
Farmer and Pettine are supposed to be the antidote.....but are they?
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@douche-nozzle said:
I like what I see and hear with Pettine but that and $1.50 will buy you a cup of coffee. There is enough evidence to support a change at GM, Farmer is one of the dysfunctions.
Smart move on theBrowns part, Vick is just terrible! He was never really a quality QB but the NFL's incessant drive to find an elite black QB kept him in the hunt.
Well, if you are talking 2001....maybe the league was looking for an elite black QB.....but not 2015. They have Russell Wilson, Colin Kaepernick, Bridgewater, Winston, Newton, maybe another one or two quality Af-Am QBs. They don't need Vick for that, at all.
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It isn't a legitimate question.
So there's that.
WSS
38 replies. 40 votes and thread labeled hot. So then there's that. Don't hate. It totally a legit question.
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I normally loathe reading Tony Grossi, but at least he's asking the same question I am.
Where in the hell was Farmer, Haslam, or even Scheiner Monday afternoon while the HC is being grilled about JM?
Let's face it, Pettine isn't the guy responsible for bringing the circus to town.
Great read. . .
http://www.espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&post_id=50661
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