Jonathan Paul Manziel
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We have not seen anything that really looks like a QB in a Cleveland Browns Jersey since Kosar...I am beginning to think they are an endangered species. We have, perhaps the worst draft history, EVER! Cut the Johnny lovers a little slack, part of the defense of Johnny has to do with this draft fact and the reality that once again we have made the wrong pick. Hell blind squirrels throwing acorns (or buckeyes) at the draft board would have done better. Now it is time to face facts, Johnny is not our guy.
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We have not seen anything that really looks like a QB in a Cleveland Browns Jersey since Kosar...I am beginning to think they are an endangered species. We have, perhaps the worst draft history, EVER! Cut the Johnny lovers a little slack, part of the defense of Johnny has to do with this draft fact and the reality that once again we have made the wrong pick. Hell blind squirrels throwing acorns (or buckeyes) at the draft board would have done better. Now it is time to face facts, Johnny is not our guy.
We have not seen anything that really looks like a QB in a Cleveland Browns Jersey since Kosar...I am beginning to think they are an endangered species. We have, perhaps the worst draft history, EVER! Cut the Johnny lovers a little slack, part of the defense of Johnny has to do with this draft fact and the reality that once again we have made the wrong pick. Hell blind squirrels throwing acorns (or buckeyes) at the draft board would have done better. Now it is time to face facts, Johnny is not our guy.
Gruden could be tempted to come to the Browns with him as QB and fix everything else around him. Does not take a genius to read between the lines here.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/11/jon_gruden_on_johnny_manziel_h.html
And here's a thought. Why go QB shopping when there is already a JM clone on the team in Conner Shaw? Build a team around that. QB position is not the problem with or without a sober JM.
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you can keep the six. I know you need it.
hey who doesn't need a six pack?
bible-thumpers? people who don't drink? fairy boys? queefs that prefer wine? recovering alcoholics/addicts?......oops, sorry. didn't mean to bring up your boy johnny.
still won't bet cuz you have no balls or no belief in your convictions?
hey who doesn't need a six pack?
queefs that prefer wine?
Alright you bastard, them's fightin' words! Can see I need to take you for a trip to Bordeaux to taste some of them fine red premier crus or sweet Sauternes. Stayed here once. No tv's, no beer and an open, free wine fridge full of their best years. Doesn't get any better'n that.
PS-so you will feel more at home mik, we can take these along to use in tastings.
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Am I the only who remembers how bad Hoyer looked at mid season last year? Considering our lack of playmakers,and targets,Josh,and Johnny have both done very well this year. We simply do not have any talent. So sad to say that,because this team needs a complete overhaul.
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In all of the ongoing soap opera that is Johnny Manziel, I keep coming back to Draft Night 2014.
We had just given the 4th pick to Buffalo, clearing the way for us to make our direction changing
pick of Justin Gilbert. Buffalo had just selected Sammy Watkins and Jon Gruden was almost in
tears because no one had selected Johnny.
Ron Jaworski said that the argument over Manziel wasn't whether his game would translate to the NFL.
Rather, it would turn on what would happen when JM walked into an NFL locker room as a pro. Jaws
said that it would no longer be a case of "Hey, are you going to the kegger at the frat house after the game
Saturday?" No it will now be a matter of walking into a room full of men. Men who have families, mortgages,
obligations and responsibilities. Men for whom the game is their livelihood. And those men will be looking to
him as the one who is going to lead them. Will he be able to live up to THOSE expectations.
And thus far I would say, No, he has not lived up to those expectations. I haven't heard a lot of support for
JM coming from the locker room. It really doesn't matter fuck-all whether Johnny impresses me or not. But there
are 52 men in that locker room looking at Johnny and they don't appear to be impressed.
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In all of the ongoing soap opera that is Johnny Manziel, I keep coming back to Draft Night 2014.
We had just given the 4th pick to Buffalo, clearing the way for us to make our direction changing
pick of Justin Gilbert. Buffalo had just selected Sammy Watkins and Jon Gruden was almost in
tears because no one had selected Johnny.
Ron Jaworski said that the argument over Manziel wasn't whether his game would translate to the NFL.
Rather, it would turn on what would happen when JM walked into an NFL locker room as a pro. Jaws
said that it would no longer be a case of "Hey, are you going to the kegger at the frat house after the game
Saturday?" No it will now be a matter of walking into a room full of men. Men who have families, mortgages,
obligations and responsibilities. Men for whom the game is their livelihood. And those men will be looking to
him as the one who is going to lead them. Will he be able to live up to THOSE expectations.
And thus far I would say, No, he has not lived up to those expectations. I haven't heard a lot of support for
JM coming from the locker room. It really doesn't matter fuck-all whether Johnny impresses me or not. But there
are 52 men in that locker room looking at Johnny and they don't appear to be impressed.
" No it will now be a matter of walking into a room full of men. Men who have families, mortgages,
obligations and responsibilities. Men for whom the game is their livelihood. And those men will be looking to
him as the one who is going to lead them. Will he be able to live up to THOSE expectations.
And thus far I would say, No, he has not lived up to those expectations. I haven't heard a lot of support for
JM coming from the locker room. It really doesn't matter fuck-all whether Johnny impresses me or not. But there
are 52 men in that locker room looking at Johnny and they don't appear to be impressed.
There it is......how are guys like Joe Thomas, Alex Mack and Carlos Dansby gonna be led by an entitled kid who is less mature than a lot of high school kids?
Johnny, a leader of men?......hahahahaha.........that is freaking hilarious....(and a complete joke)
Heck, Johnnys best friend and biggest supporter on the Browns is Josh Gordon.....so THAT says lot right there.........
Dude has completely jerked his fans, team mates and coaches around for 2 years now( he just doesnt give a shit)......and is setting the whole team back, because NOW we still dont even know what we have and we are 2 years in......
so how many YEARS are we supposed to kiss his entitled spoiled ass before he gives us something back????
He'll probably just jerk us around for another year or 2, then sign and play elsewhere anyway.....
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" No it will now be a matter of walking into a room full of men. Men who have families, mortgages,
obligations and responsibilities. Men for whom the game is their livelihood. And those men will be looking to
him as the one who is going to lead them. Will he be able to live up to THOSE expectations.
And thus far I would say, No, he has not lived up to those expectations. I haven't heard a lot of support for
JM coming from the locker room. It really doesn't matter fuck-all whether Johnny impresses me or not. But there
are 52 men in that locker room looking at Johnny and they don't appear to be impressed.
There it is......how are guys like Joe Thomas, Alex Mack and Carlos Dansby gonna be led by an entitled kid who is less mature than a lot of high school kids?
Johnny, a leader of men?......hahahahaha.........that is freaking hilarious....(and a complete joke)
Heck, Johnnys best friend and biggest supporter on the Browns is Josh Gordon.....so THAT says lot right there.........
Dude has completely jerked his fans, team mates and coaches around for 2 years now( he just doesnt give a shit)......and is setting the whole team back, because NOW we still dont even know what we have and we are 2 years in......
so how many YEARS are we supposed to kiss his entitled spoiled ass before he gives us something back????
He'll probably just jerk us around for another year or 2, then sign and play elsewhere anyway.....
There it is......how are guys like Joe Thomas, Alex Mack and Carlos Dansby gonna be led by an entitled kid who is less mature than a lot of high school kids?
Johnny, a leader of men?......hahahahaha.........that is freaking hilarious....(and a complete joke)
Heck, Johnnys best friend and biggest supporter on the Browns is Josh Gordon.....so THAT says lot right there.........
Dude has completely jerked his fans, team mates and coaches around for 2 years now( he just doesnt give a shit)......and is setting the whole team back, because NOW we still dont even know what we have and we are 2 years in......
so how many YEARS are we supposed to kiss his entitled spoiled ass before he gives us something back????
He'll probably just jerk us around for another year or 2, then sign and play elsewhere anyway.....
My best hope is that with smoke and mirrors the FO can get more than a can of sardines in a trade.
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We have not seen anything that really looks like a QB in a Cleveland Browns Jersey since Kosar...I am beginning to think they are an endangered species. We have, perhaps the worst draft history, EVER! Cut the Johnny lovers a little slack, part of the defense of Johnny has to do with this draft fact and the reality that once again we have made the wrong pick. Hell blind squirrels throwing acorns (or buckeyes) at the draft board would have done better. Now it is time to face facts, Johnny is not our guy.
Gruden could be tempted to come to the Browns with him as QB and fix everything else around him. Does not take a genius to read between the lines here.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/11/jon_gruden_on_johnny_manziel_h.html
And here's a thought. Why go QB shopping when there is already a JM clone on the team in Conner Shaw? Build a team around that. QB position is not the problem with or without a sober JM.
First, on BH vs. DA... wrong argument. Put BH's head on DA's shoulders and you'd have something.
Gruden could be tempted to come to the Browns with him as QB and fix everything else around him. Does not take a genius to read between the lines here.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/11/jon_gruden_on_johnny_manziel_h.html
And here's a thought. Why go QB shopping when there is already a JM clone on the team in Conner Shaw? Build a team around that. QB position is not the problem with or without a sober JM.
Gruden won't be tempted anywhere, thank God... he is simply in town for the weekend.
When did Shaw become a "JM clone"?
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
First, on BH vs. DA... wrong argument. Put BH's head on DA's shoulders and you'd have something.
Gruden could be tempted to come to the Browns with him as QB and fix everything else around him. Does not take a genius to read between the lines here.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/11/jon_gruden_on_johnny_manziel_h.html
And here's a thought. Why go QB shopping when there is already a JM clone on the team in Conner Shaw? Build a team around that. QB position is not the problem with or without a sober JM.
Gruden won't be tempted anywhere, thank God... he is simply in town for the weekend.
When did Shaw become a "JM clone"?
When did Shaw become a "JM clone"?
I wish that JM was a Shaw clone.......(but he's not)
Shaw is sober, mature, hard working, focused, prepared, committed, trust worthy, concerned, team oriented, etc etc etc.....
If JM was like Shaw....then he would already be on year 2 of wrecking this league.....instead of year 2 of wrecking his career......
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First, on BH vs. DA... wrong argument. Put BH's head on DA's shoulders and you'd have something.
Gruden could be tempted to come to the Browns with him as QB and fix everything else around him. Does not take a genius to read between the lines here.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/11/jon_gruden_on_johnny_manziel_h.html
And here's a thought. Why go QB shopping when there is already a JM clone on the team in Conner Shaw? Build a team around that. QB position is not the problem with or without a sober JM.
Gruden won't be tempted anywhere, thank God... he is simply in town for the weekend.
When did Shaw become a "JM clone"?
First, on BH vs. DA... wrong argument. Put BH's head on DA's shoulders and you'd have something.
Gruden won't be tempted anywhere, thank God... he is simply in town for the weekend.
When did Shaw become a "JM clone"?
They can both similarly make something from nothing, have escapability when needed and throw well on the run. Not talking about the immaturity issue at all-totally different there.
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When did Shaw become a "JM clone"?
I wish that JM was a Shaw clone.......(but he's not)
Shaw is sober, mature, hard working, focused, prepared, committed, trust worthy, concerned, team oriented, etc etc etc.....
If JM was like Shaw....then he would already be on year 2 of wrecking this league.....instead of year 2 of wrecking his career......
You forgot to add NOT GOING TO WIN YOU ANY GAMES!I wish )
Shaw is sober, mature, hard working, focused, prepared, committed, trust worthy, concerned, team oriented, etc etc etc.....
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You forgot to add NOT GOING TO WIN YOU ANY GAMES!
I'd agree with that....cause I dont see either of them as franchise QB's or the answer here....
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So Mud, as to the leader of men bit.
1 do you think Joe or Carlos or any other veteran is going to play poorly because Johnny went out and got drunk? Or do you think they will do their best?
2 how many of the other 20 somethings, all athletes all millionaires, care one way or the other about a night out?
Or are you projecting your dissatisfaction on others?
3 if the rumors are true, and that's all we are dealing with here, there are plenty of guys on the team that wish he was the starter. So by your own logic will they slack off on the field because Josh or the mighty Austin is under center?
WSS
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So Mud, as to the leader of men bit.
1 do you think Joe or Carlos or any other veteran is going to play poorly because Johnny went out and got drunk? Or do you think they will do their best?
2 how many of the other 20 somethings, all athletes all millionaires, care one way or the other about a night out?
Or are you projecting your dissatisfaction on others?
3 if the rumors are true, and that's all we are dealing with here, there are plenty of guys on the team that wish he was the starter. So by your own logic will they slack off on the field because Josh or the mighty Austin is under center?
WSS
So Mud, as to the leader of men bit.
1 do you think Joe or Carlos or any other veteran is going to play poorly because Johnny went out and got drunk? Or do you think they will do their best?
I think, on the field, those guys would play their best. Yes. But I also think if players who dont do the work are rewarded with starters jobs(when they haven't earned it) then players WOULD slack off and not buy into working hard....after all, why work hard, when thats not what it takes to get the job? And if players are allowed to do whatever they want, whenever they want....and there are NO repercussions, then the whole team could turn to shit pretty fast...
2 how many of the other 20 somethings, all athletes all millionaires, care one way or the other about a night out?
Or are you projecting your dissatisfaction on others?
Anyone that still thinks this is about "a night out" is either willfully ignorant or clueless.....how many people can lie to their boss(eye to eye) and keep their jobs?>......not too many....just the entitled ones
3 if the rumors are true, and that's all we are dealing with here, there are plenty of guys on the team that wish he was the starter. So by your own logic will they slack off on the field because Josh or the mighty Austin is under center?
And, according to "fact", there are plenty of guys on the team that are supporting the Coaches ad backing McCown. Why should McC lose his job to Manziel? There are plenty of pros that see it that way too.....
Steve...I dont honestly think you'll give this a fair answer, but lets try......
What if you hired a new lead guitar....and paid him in advance for a year.....and then he didnt show up to practice on time.....and didnt bother to learn the songs.....and, then, at the first few gigs, totally screwed up your set.....THEN, you talked to him and he PROMISED he'd learn the songs and get it right.....and the next week you see him out at the bars partying and getting wasted....then he shows up to practice late(and hungover) and still doesnt know the songs......(but rest assured, he will....and when he does, he;ll be great).....and gig after gig he still aint getting it done....and people are laughing at you, because you're dumb enough to keep paying him......then you have a huge gig coming up and you BEG him, please dont mess this up...and he looks you in the eye and says THIS weekend Im staying in, learning the songs and will commit 100% to the band......and then he doesnt, he gets wasted instead....and when you ask him about it, he lies to you....
So.....How many bad gigs, lies or years would you deal with that????
WSS
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According to the facts, as you call it, I can't imagine any player on any team badmouthing whichever quarterback might start. I don't doubt for a minute that almost all the guys like Josh and support him. And who is going to say they don't support the coach? And did any of them say they didn't support Johnny when he was named the starter?
That's a fair question. Still I think it refers more to last season.
Because that guitar player has apparently changed his ways as far as preparing to play the show. He's no longer missing rehearsals, or showing up hungover for gigs. He has at the very least work hard learn the songs and has played well whatever we are on stage. And the fans love him, or many of them do.
So if I give him the boot because I catch him making out with some chick I was hitting on is that good for the band or not
And I have repeatedly said the insubordination is a bad thing and I can't support it. But punishing the team and the fans for a transcription that had nothing to do with his ability to play or his game preparation... Well I know you've made your decision.
WSS
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According to the facts, as you call it, I can't imagine any player on any team badmouthing whichever quarterback might start. I don't doubt for a minute that almost all the guys like Josh and support him. And who is going to say they don't support the coach? And did any of them say they didn't support Johnny when he was named the starter?
That's a fair question. Still I think it refers more to last season.
Because that guitar player has apparently changed his ways as far as preparing to play the show. He's no longer missing rehearsals, or showing up hungover for gigs. He has at the very least work hard learn the songs and has played well whatever we are on stage. And the fans love him, or many of them do.
So if I give him the boot because I catch him making out with some chick I was hitting on is that good for the band or not
And I have repeatedly said the insubordination is a bad thing and I can't support it. But punishing the team and the fans for a transcription that had nothing to do with his ability to play or his game preparation... Well I know you've made your decision.
WSS
And I have repeatedly said the insubordination is a bad thing and I can't support it. But punishing the team and the fans for a transcription that had nothing to do with his ability to play or his game preparation... Well I know you've made your decision.
WSS
Yeah..I have....I think we all have really......
There are those that think it's just a few drinky poos, no big deal.....nothing more, nothing less....(and if it was just that, then I dont understand why Johnny went to rehab for 11 weeks....do you???....)
And there are others(me) who think its more than that...its professional ethics....and a team "trying" to get away from being a disfunctional laughing stock, while their QB makes them look just that way......
If they just let Johnny do whatever he wants and then lie about....then just put him out there, ahead of other guys working harder(and PLAYING better)....then that sends a terrible message to the other 52 players.....
Pettine did the right thing.....
Now.....I think its funny that Johnny himself can say he has a problem....Johnny himself can go to rehab......Johnny himself stands up(repeatedly) and says he's fucking up and will stop doing what he's doing.....but so many fans dont see that.....Just Johnny, his coaches and us "squares" who dont get it.....
And lemme tell ya....I partied my ass off, but also knew when to take care of business and knew I had to make some personal sacrifices to get ahead in my career.......
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And I have repeatedly said the insubordination is a bad thing and I can't support it. But punishing the team and the fans for a transcription that had nothing to do with his ability to play or his game preparation... Well I know you've made your decision.
WSS
Yeah..I have....I think we all have really......
There are those that think it's just a few drinky poos, no big deal.....nothing more, nothing less....(and if it was just that, then I dont understand why Johnny went to rehab for 11 weeks....do you???....)
And there are others(me) who think its more than that...its professional ethics....and a team "trying" to get away from being a disfunctional laughing stock, while their QB makes them look just that way......
If they just let Johnny do whatever he wants and then lie about....then just put him out there, ahead of other guys working harder(and PLAYING better)....then that sends a terrible message to the other 52 players.....
Pettine did the right thing.....
Now.....I think its funny that Johnny himself can say he has a problem....Johnny himself can go to rehab......Johnny himself stands up(repeatedly) and says he's fucking up and will stop doing what he's doing.....but so many fans dont see that.....Just Johnny, his coaches and us "squares" who dont get it.....
And lemme tell ya....I partied my ass off, but also knew when to take care of business and knew I had to make some personal sacrifices to get ahead in my career.......
WSSYeah..I have....I think we all have really......
There are those that think it's just a few drinky poos, no big deal.....nothing more, nothing less....(and if it was just that, then I dont understand why Johnny went to rehab for 11 weeks....do you???....)
β no I don't. Apparently neither does anyone. According to the HIPAA laws we're not allowed to know anything. Not you not me Tony fucking Grossi.
Was it even alcohol? Was it blow? Was it gambling? And did he check himself in or go in through a Browns sponsored or league sponsored session? Are there any restrictions? We have no idea.β
And there are others(me) who think its more than that...its professional ethics....and a team "trying" to get away from being a disfunctional laughing stock, while their QB makes them look just that way......
β we look even more dysfunctional because of the way we handle it.β
If they just let Johnny do whatever he wants and then lie about....then just put him out there, ahead of other guys working harder(and PLAYING better)....then that sends a terrible message to the other 52 players.....
β but he is working harder and playing better.β
Pettine did the right thing.....
β if you were a high school coach that might be true. Maybe his hands were tied by his own restrictions. Too late to change that now.
What is the best interest of the team were the focus, we've blown two things. First we will be sitting with a top 5 pick probably no matter what. Do we get Joey Bosa or are we stuck spending hey hi pic on another quarterback roll of the dice?
Or if the plan is to trade him at the end of the season you let him play hope he looks good enough for Jerry Jones to part with a usable draft pick. Then you could use that to draft Lynch, because he is, like, really tall.
βNow.....I think its funny that Johnny himself can say he has a problem....Johnny himself can go to rehab......Johnny himself stands up(repeatedly) and says he's fucking up and will stop doing what he's doing.....but so many fans dont see that.....Just Johnny, his coaches and us "squares" who dont get it.....
β and yet they admit he's made great strides and improved by leaps and bounds and now we know he can play in the NFL. We didn't know that last year. Something has actually changedβ
And lemme tell ya....I partied my ass off, but also knew when to take care of business and knew I had to make some personal sacrifices to get ahead in my career.......
β again last year's news. This year nothing he has done has affected his practice or play.β
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On the other hand hoping he will look good enough to trade and he goes like 5 and 1 or 4 and 2 then coach looks like a dick head for cutting him or trading him at the end of the year.
WSS
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Pettine is an asshole who will be fired at the end of the year. His leadership ability sucks.
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And I have repeatedly said the insubordination is a bad thing and I can't support it. But punishing the team and the fans for a transcription that had nothing to do with his ability to play or his game preparation... Well I know you've made your decision.
WSS
Yeah..I have....I think we all have really......
There are those that think it's just a few drinky poos, no big deal.....nothing more, nothing less....(and if it was just that, then I dont understand why Johnny went to rehab for 11 weeks....do you???....)
And there are others(me) who think its more than that...its professional ethics....and a team "trying" to get away from being a disfunctional laughing stock, while their QB makes them look just that way......
If they just let Johnny do whatever he wants and then lie about....then just put him out there, ahead of other guys working harder(and PLAYING better)....then that sends a terrible message to the other 52 players.....
Pettine did the right thing.....
Now.....I think its funny that Johnny himself can say he has a problem....Johnny himself can go to rehab......Johnny himself stands up(repeatedly) and says he's fucking up and will stop doing what he's doing.....but so many fans dont see that.....Just Johnny, his coaches and us "squares" who dont get it.....
And lemme tell ya....I partied my ass off, but also knew when to take care of business and knew I had to make some personal sacrifices to get ahead in my career.......
Yeah..I have....I think we all have really......
There are those that think it's just a few drinky poos, no big deal.....nothing more, nothing less....(and if it was just that, then I dont understand why Johnny went to rehab for 11 weeks....do you???....)
And there are others(me) who think its more than that...its professional ethics....and a team "trying" to get away from being a disfunctional laughing stock, while their QB makes them look just that way......
If they just let Johnny do whatever he wants and then lie about....then just put him out there, ahead of other guys working harder(and PLAYING better)....then that sends a terrible message to the other 52 players.....
Pettine did the right thing.....
Now.....I think its funny that Johnny himself can say he has a problem....Johnny himself can go to rehab......Johnny himself stands up(repeatedly) and says he's fucking up and will stop doing what he's doing.....but so many fans dont see that.....Just Johnny, his coaches and us "squares" who dont get it.....
And lemme tell ya....I partied my ass off, but also knew when to take care of business and knew I had to make some personal sacrifices to get ahead in my career.......
Hope everyone had a good thanksgiving! I drank more than Manziel in a Houston nightclub that's for sure. Here's the thing to include what you're saying here, just my opinion here.
-The Browns ARE the biggest laughing stock in the NFL. IMO there is nothing that can make the reputation of this franchise worse, to include the decision of playing or not playing Manziel.
-If he lied (has that been confirmed btw?) that makes the more tricky I'll admit. But again, a coach and organizations job isn't to babysit players. According to everything we've heard, he shows up when he's supposed to. He practices well, and was beginning to show it on the field.
So the question becomes, how much does his reputation really matter? Dez Bryant yells at reporters and is a total douche but brings it on Sunday. Jerome Harrison has made a potential HOF career while being a hated man. The point is here, who the fuck cares about reputation over performance? Joe Thomas is a class act, how is that helping us? The Browns need play makers on the field and Manziel can easily be that dude. I love you mofos but McCown isn't that type of talent and never will be. So here we are, playing the guys who "work harder" but we literally are the worst team in the NFL and the joke of the professional sports world.
Honest question: Would you rather have a QB that snaps pictures at a nightclub but wins or have guys who try hard and suck it up? The NFL is a performance based league, not a "who is the nicest" league. Instead of seeing what we have, Pettine is sticking to his guns and will bury this franchise another 2-3 years. But I'll be damned if that isn't with good dudes!
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