Jonathan Paul Manziel
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That's exactly it Mark.
Let's look at the the possibilities I've come up with.
1) the "Conspiracy " scenario. Manziel did this on purpose, because he can't stand Pettine, and wants to buy his ticket out of town. In that case, mission accomplished. But why bother to go to rehab for 11 weeks? You could have just continued to be a jerk, and got booted before Training Camp.
2) the corollary to that would be he doesn't respect authority- and hasn't "grown up" yet.
3) (Most likely) he's a serious alky- and can't control himself. As my Counselor friend has on the blackboard in letters a foot high "YET"
Yo, TCPO I'm old- but not old enough to remember Otto playing. A I see it- the coaching staff was trying to protect Manziel from himself. They know why Johnny went to rehab. They (meaning Haslam) sign his paychecks. Sure as hell they can set conditions as to what he can or can't do- especially if (to them) he has a known booze problem. If you watch the initial Pettine interview- he was obviously distraught, and disappointed about the situation.
You're as good as your word- and Manziel "promised" he wouldn't be a distraction. Whoops, wrong.
If I had a million dollar a year job, and my boss told me stay out of bars- or else, you think I wouldn't get the message? Apparently Johnny either doesn't give a damn, or can't help himself.
Pettine != Haslam. Pettine has zero say on what Manziel can do, he can only choose to bench him...at the risk of losing his own job.
Pettine has already admitted to making the change without acknowledging Haslam - he only did so after the fact.
There was no "sit down and come to Jesus" at the beginning of the week. It was probably like "hey, don't fuck up this weekend." and Johnny said "okay, man. Sure. I'll relax." And that's exactly what he did. He didn't do anything out of the ordinary. He did what 75% of the league does on their bye.
Pettine is fired. He knows it. He's going out his way - with the guy he wants at QB. That's all there is to it.
And if you don't think other QB's go out during the season - you're insanely naive. I've seen Cam out on a Friday night two days before a game...and he's not the only one.
I think there are plenty of QB's who have a few drinks more than once a week. I am unaware of any of them needing 11 weeks in rehab though. If he worked for me and I saw him headed down the path that already hurt my business in the prior year I'd discipline him too. They are essentially having to raise a substance abusing childPettine != Haslam. Pettine has zero say on what Manziel can do, he can only choose to bench him...at the risk of losing his own job.
Pettine has already admitted to making the change without acknowledging Haslam - he only did so after the fact.
There was no "sit down and come to Jesus" at the beginning of the week. It was probably like "hey, don't fuck up this weekend." and Johnny said "okay, man. Sure. I'll relax." And that's exactly what he did. He didn't do anything out of the ordinary. He did what 75% of the league does on their bye.
Pettine is fired. He knows it. He's going out his way - with the guy he wants at QB. That's all there is to it.
And if you don't think other QB's go out during the season - you're insanely naive. I've seen Cam out on a Friday night two days before a game...and he's not the only one.
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hey who doesn't need a six pack?
queefs that prefer wine?
Alright you bastard, them's fightin' words! Can see I need to take you for a trip to Bordeaux to taste some of them fine red premier crus or sweet Sauternes. Stayed here once. No tv's, no beer and an open, free wine fridge full of their best years. Doesn't get any better'n that.
PS-so you will feel more at home mik, we can take these along to use in tastings.
Alright you bastard, them's fightin' words! Can see I need to take you for a trip to Bordeaux to taste some of them fine red premier crus or sweet Sauternes. Stayed here once. No tv's, no beer and an open, free wine fridge full of their best years. Doesn't get any better'n that.
PS-so you will feel more at home mik, we can take these along to use in tastings.
HA! don't get me wrong i love me some wine. depends on the circumstance. italian dinner with red sauce....red wine. some light seafood......a white. i'm more the sauv blanc or pinot grigio than the pinot noir or cab but will drink all whenever offered. my fave white is this:
http://www.monkeybay.co.nz/sauvignonblanc.html
i'm a cocktails type of guy. beer is cool but it fills me up too quick and feel bloated. a nice gin and tonic or a vodka martini are more my style.....with a cohiba puff outside between commercial breaks.
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It'll be a one or two game non-reported, still-suited-out suspension, like I've said all along. And I think it's a solid move.
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It'll be a one or two game non-reported, still-suited-out suspension, like I've said all along. And I think it's a solid move.
It'll be a one or two game non-reported, still-suited-out suspension, like I've said all along. And I think it's a solid move.
Here is the real question though, what kind of aftercare and for what duration will it be required of him from this point forward? Without that a relapse is damn near guaranteed. He needs a real action plan overseen by professionals or his chances for success will be minimal.
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Do we have an in house support network for people with this kind of problem? I'm guessing it might have helped puffy stay on the field as well if we did, and maybe even Davone Bess...ok maybe not.
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Here's the thing about Manziel....if he was a great player, or showed great potential, there could be an argument for pampering him, and holding his hand, and looking the other way when he makes you look foolish. Some of you must have seen something that I've never seen from him. I'm no hater, but last season, he was as bad or worse than any rookie qb I've seen...including Charlie Frye, Brady Quinn, etc. He has definitely improved, but still not nearly to a mediocre level. We all get on here and bitch about how bad we are, and hope we see a winning Browns team in our life time, yet we want to waste another season hoping Manziel will develop? I hate rolling the dice on another qb in the draft. I would rather have kept Hoyer, if it would have been possible, then move forward looking for the right guy. I sincerely hope Manziel succeeds, but I doubt if it will be here. I've seen enought to deduct that he is no Drew Brees, Doug Flutie, or Russel Wilson.
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If they said otherwise, would anyone give them anything for Johnny? I mean if they said fuck this guy, than anybody interested in JM realizes we're cutting him and will just wait.
Not to mention if the other two quarterbacks are hurt or just can't play they probably wouldn't start Mingo as quarterback.If they said otherwise, would anyone give them anything for Johnny? I mean if they said fuck this guy, than anybody interested in JM realizes we're cutting him and will just wait.
Even the hardcore haters would look askance at the coach if he purposely tanked the rest of the season just to show his disapproval. Maybe?
Still I don't see this move as tanking the season yet, just putting the future in a bit of Jeopardy. Josh McCown has done well. And this really is a winnable game.
WSS
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I don't think we are either. I literally think this is his "last chance", and if he doesn't get it right, he's toast. Coach didn't just demote him to backup, he sent him all the way down the roster. He wants to see how Johnny responds, and so far, Johnny appears to be doing what is asked of him. Several Browns players stated that Johnny did well in practice, and appears to be taking his demotion in stride.
But here's the thing...we saw what happened to Johnny when he had a couple of days off. What the hell is he going to do when he has an entire offseason? Does anybody on this board REALLY believe that he will keep his nose clean for multiple months? That he won't get drunk at a club and get another video taken? I would like for it to happen, but as of right now, I think it's safe to say that he'd screw it up. I hope I'm wrong.
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Well who cares about the off season if he's ready to go in spring? Alex Mack goes to South America or Costa Rica. I can't imagine the debauchery available down there to a multi millionaire young American athlete could be eclipsed by a bunch of stupid drunken college kids in an Austin disco...
I'd imagine that would be similar to comparing a snuff film with a deck of playing cards with dirty pictures.
WSS
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I saw track marks all over his arms in the picture. He has a fatty liver and yellow eyes. Kids is toast. The sky is falling. Get out Daddy Pettine to lash out more discipline.
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Do we have an in house support network for people with this kind of problem? I'm guessing it might have helped puffy stay on the field as well if we did, and maybe even Davone Bess...ok maybe not.
Do we have an in house support network for people with this kind of problem? I'm guessing it might have helped puffy stay on the field as well if we did, and maybe even Davone Bess...ok maybe not.
Employee Assistance Programs (EAPs) are a commonly contracted benefit in the states. I would think the Browns have one covering their entire organization. But entry into them is voluntary.
We were one of the early organizations to hire a staffer just for the purpose of counseling players. IIRC back in the Rutigliano we hired former Cowboy and Brown RB, Calvin Hill. Among others he was added to mentor Charles White, our prized, young RB who had a bit of a "coke" problem.
Well who cares about the off season if he's ready to go in spring? Alex Mack goes to South America or Costa Rica. I can't imagine the debauchery available down there to a multi millionaire young American athlete could be eclipsed by a bunch of stupid drunken college kids in an Austin disco...
Not sure where that attempted parallel sprang from, but clearly you've never been to Austin.
Pretty sure that JM just assured his off-season behavior will be under closer scrutiny than it has been.
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What Johnny needs are a couple of big ugly babysitters......A. to keep all the partyers away from him, and B. to keep him in line. Like these guys:
Jimmy Haslam would not have to go far from his Tennessee home to find them.
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Tour I have most certainly been to Austin.
I have not been to South America but I have heard tales. I have been to Mexico and though I didn't go was offered a ride to the dog and pony show.
I did play in a successful rock and roll band for nearly two decades during the pinnacle in Cleveland and across the US and Canada before going solo.
WSS
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Guys, with all dur respect and no offense to anyone, this kid is an alcoholic. He's not going to get better with a demotion to 3rd string. It's not going to be a wake up call. That call already came and he drank right through it. Screw pro-football, he needs more rehab, more help, etc. It's not, however, the Browns' job to make all this happen. It's all on Johnny and, hopefully, his family. I think professional football is just a fond memory.
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Guys, with all dur respect and no offense to anyone, this kid is an alcoholic. He's not going to get better with a demotion to 3rd string. It's not going to be a wake up call. That call already came and he drank right through it. Screw pro-football, he needs more rehab, more help, etc. It's not, however, the Browns' job to make all this happen. It's all on Johnny and, hopefully, his family. I think professional football is just a fond memory.
Guys, with all dur respect and no offense to anyone, this kid is an alcoholic. He's not going to get better with a demotion to 3rd string. It's not going to be a wake up call. That call already came and he drank right through it. Screw pro-football, he needs more rehab, more help, etc. It's not, however, the Browns' job to make all this happen. It's all on Johnny and, hopefully, his family. I think professional football is just a fond memory.
Chris Carter put it well. His body is allergic to alcohol and cannot process it in the same way a normal human can. One drink is too many!
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