Benjamin to sign.....Mack out then in ?
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Time to get on the phone to the Wiz I guess.
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Browns are sort of stuck. We're already paying Joe Thomas top money. Can we afford to do the same with Mack and Schwartz? Alex obviously wants to be the highest paid center, and The Schwartz is looking for left tackle money to play right tackle.
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Browns are sort of stuck. We're already paying Joe Thomas top money. Can we afford to do the same with Mack and Schwartz? Alex obviously wants to be the highest paid center, and The Schwartz is looking for left tackle money to play right tackle.
Browns are sort of stuck. We're already paying Joe Thomas top money. Can we afford to do the same with Mack and Schwartz? Alex obviously wants to be the highest paid center, and The Schwartz is looking for left tackle money to play right tackle.
I would like to see Schwartz back but he wants a lot for sure. Mack...meh.
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Browns are sort of stuck. We're already paying Joe Thomas top money. Can we afford to do the same with Mack and Schwartz? Alex obviously wants to be the highest paid center, and The Schwartz is looking for left tackle money to play right tackle.
Browns are sort of stuck. We're already paying Joe Thomas top money. Can we afford to do the same with Mack and Schwartz? Alex obviously wants to be the highest paid center, and The Schwartz is looking for left tackle money to play right tackle.
We're not really paying him top money - he's on about $8m per year, top tackles in the league are getting $12m. Either way, if you have a long term, top tier left tackle, you're paying him that much. If you don't, you're not likely to be competing.
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Actually Joe is right at $10mm/yr... Here are his cap numbers for the last 3-years of his contract.
2016 $9,500,000
2017 $10,000,000
2018 $10,000,000
Extension time in 2017?
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Actually Joe is right at $10mm/yr... Here are his cap numbers for the last 3-years of his contract.
2016 $9,500,000
2017 $10,000,000
2018 $10,000,000
Extension time in 2017?
Actually Joe is right at $10mm/yr... Here are his cap numbers for the last 3-years of his contract.
2016 $9,500,000
2017 $10,000,000
2018 $10,000,000
Extension time in 2017?
Probably. Or even this year. Offer him $10m for five years, fully guaranteed, he retires a brown, doesn't cost loads, everyone's happy. Except ghoolie.
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Cam Erving...........
Maybe we can trade cam for a first, and draft that C kelly?
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Watching NFL Network this morning they indicated that Benjamin was the top wide receiver FA though their list had him around he 31st best FA overall. But they also rate this draftable WR class as a "C" compared to the back to back "A+" classes the last 2 years. Analytics is gonna kill us off if it's not tempered with common sense.
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Watching NFL Network this morning they indicated that Benjamin was the top wide receiver FA though their list had him around he 31st best FA overall. But they also rate this draftable WR class as a "C" compared to the back to back "A+" classes the last 2 years. Analytics is gonna kill us off if it's not tempered with common sense.
Watching NFL Network this morning they indicated that Benjamin was the top wide receiver FA though their list had him around he 31st best FA overall. But they also rate this draftable WR class as a "C" compared to the back to back "A+" classes the last 2 years. Analytics is gonna kill us off if it's not tempered with common sense.
Analytics generally tends to confirm common sense in my experience as a bioinformatics analyst. One of the reasons the Browns have sucked at drafting in the past is because a disregard for analytics by the previous regimes. Manziel was not an analytics decision, that was an emotional one (Bridgewater would've been the analytics decision). What analytics won't help you much with is understanding a player's character and mental fortitude. Analytics can also mislead you if you aren't asking the right questions with it. That's why smart teams use analytics as one of many important tools in the eval process along with tape, interviews, the combine, and pro days (and that's in order of importance).
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Watching NFL Network this morning they indicated that Benjamin was the top wide receiver FA though their list had him around he 31st best FA overall. But they also rate this draftable WR class as a "C" compared to the back to back "A+" classes the last 2 years. Analytics is gonna kill us off if it's not tempered with common sense.
Analytics generally tends to confirm common sense in my experience as a bioinformatics analyst. One of the reasons the Browns have sucked at drafting in the past is because a disregard for analytics by the previous regimes. Manziel was not an analytics decision, that was an emotional one (Bridgewater would've been the analytics decision). What analytics won't help you much with is understanding a player's character and mental fortitude. Analytics can also mislead you if you aren't asking the right questions with it. That's why smart teams use analytics as one of many important tools in the eval process along with tape, interviews, the combine, and pro days (and that's in order of importance).
Analytics generally tends to confirm common sense in my experience as a bioinformatics analyst. One of the reasons the Browns have sucked at drafting in the past is because a disregard for analytics by the previous regimes. Manziel was not an analytics decision, that was an emotional one (Bridgewater would've been the analytics decision). What analytics won't help you much with is understanding a player's character and mental fortitude. Analytics can also mislead you if you aren't asking the right questions with it. That's why smart teams use analytics as one of many important tools in the eval process along with tape, interviews, the combine, and pro days (and that's in order of importance).
So in hindsight Bilgewater is the number 1 quarterback you would want out of that draft? If you could go back in time and take one?
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
Analytics generally tends to confirm common sense in my experience as a bioinformatics analyst. One of the reasons the Browns have sucked at drafting in the past is because a disregard for analytics by the previous regimes. Manziel was not an analytics decision, that was an emotional one (Bridgewater would've been the analytics decision). What analytics won't help you much with is understanding a player's character and mental fortitude. Analytics can also mislead you if you aren't asking the right questions with it. That's why smart teams use analytics as one of many important tools in the eval process along with tape, interviews, the combine, and pro days (and that's in order of importance).
So in hindsight Bilgewater is the number 1 quarterback you would want out of that draft? If you could go back in time and take one?
WSS
So in hindsight Bilgewater is the number 1 quarterback you would want out of that draft? If you could go back in time and take one?
WSS
If memory serves, Haslem paid for an analytics report that said Bridgewater was the best pick available in that 22nd spot. He opted to listen to the advice of a guy who lives in a shopping cart over said report.
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So in hindsight Bilgewater is the number 1 quarterback you would want out of that draft? If you could go back in time and take one?
WSS
If memory serves, Haslem paid for an analytics report that said Bridgewater was the best pick available in that 22nd spot. He opted to listen to the advice of a guy who lives in a shopping cart over said report.
If memory serves, Haslem paid for an analytics report that said Bridgewater was the best pick available in that 22nd spot. He opted to listen to the advice of a guy who lives in a shopping cart over said report.
That has nothing to do with my question pal. In our newfound zeal over analytics I'm asking that if that study was as it has been reported is Bilgewater the best quarterback of that draft or not? In hindsight.
You'd rather have him than any other?
WSS
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Analytics generally tends to confirm common sense in my experience as a bioinformatics analyst. One of the reasons the Browns have sucked at drafting in the past is because a disregard for analytics by the previous regimes. Manziel was not an analytics decision, that was an emotional one (Bridgewater would've been the analytics decision). What analytics won't help you much with is understanding a player's character and mental fortitude. Analytics can also mislead you if you aren't asking the right questions with it. That's why smart teams use analytics as one of many important tools in the eval process along with tape, interviews, the combine, and pro days (and that's in order of importance).
So in hindsight Bilgewater is the number 1 quarterback you would want out of that draft? If you could go back in time and take one?
WSS
So in hindsight Bilgewater is the number 1 quarterback you would want out of that draft? If you could go back in time and take one?
WSS
I'd certainly have taken him over Manziel. Their were four first-round QBs available and the Browns managed to pick the only that turned out to be a bust. Knowing what we know now, maybe I go back and take Carr over Bridgewater, but I don't think many people would complain about any of the other three QBs from that draft.
If you sentiment is that we shouldn't all be bowing to the analytics gods and using analytics as the sole piece of evidence for composing a draft board, I agree with you 100%. But nobody is doing that anyway. It's the Cleveland media that is making it out that analytics is the end-all-be-all, not the team itself. Listen to how the team talks about it, it's very different than how the media does.
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So in hindsight Bilgewater is the number 1 quarterback you would want out of that draft? If you could go back in time and take one?
WSS
I'd certainly have taken him over Manziel. Their were four first-round QBs available and the Browns managed to pick the only that turned out to be a bust. Knowing what we know now, maybe I go back and take Carr over Bridgewater, but I don't think many people would complain about any of the other three QBs from that draft.
If you sentiment is that we shouldn't all be bowing to the analytics gods and using analytics as the sole piece of evidence for composing a draft board, I agree with you 100%. But nobody is doing that anyway. It's the Cleveland media that is making it out that analytics is the end-all-be-all, not the team itself. Listen to how the team talks about it, it's very different than how the media does.
I'd certainly have taken him over Manziel. Their were four first-round QBs available and the Browns managed to pick the only that turned out to be a bust. Knowing what we know now, maybe I go back and take Carr over Bridgewater, but I don't think many people would complain about any of the other three QBs from that draft.
So in hindsight the analytical report, at least in your opinion, was bullshit?
(sorry, let me rephrase that not quite as accurate as it should have been for the money.
)WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
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I'd certainly have taken him over Manziel. Their were four first-round QBs available and the Browns managed to pick the only that turned out to be a bust. Knowing what we know now, maybe I go back and take Carr over Bridgewater, but I don't think many people would complain about any of the other three QBs from that draft.
So in hindsight the analytical report, at least in your opinion, was bullshit?
(sorry, let me rephrase that not quite as accurate as it should have been for the money.
)WSS
So in hindsight the analytical report, at least in your opinion, was bullshit?
(sorry, let me rephrase that not quite as accurate as it should have been for the money.
)WSS
I'm not sure how you arrived at that conclusion other than deciding that's what I meant based on your dislike for him. He's a very good quarterback. If a report tells me he is the best choice and he turns out to be very good, I'm not going to feel too bad that in hindsight that he didn't get turn out to be the best QB available.
He has, in my opinion, the highest floor but also the lowest ceiling of the four available QBs. I'm pretty sure that's what the analytics said, too. He has it when it comes to the most important skill of a QB: the ability to quickly process a defense and make the correct decision with the ball.
The reason we have the FO we have today is to correct the poor process that was in place with Farmer and Pettine: a process that disregarded analytics, disregarded the character issues of Manziel and Gilbert, and bought into the Manziel hype train. When people talk about Sashi's primary trait being a consensus-builder, that tells you all you need to know about Farmer and Pettine's regime. They were not about building a consensus, they were about taking their flavor of the week.
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I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
You are speaking as if the team has ultimate authority on the issue. Every FA this year knows their is a ton of money to be had especially after the salary cap increase. Keeping Benjamin requires Benjamin wanting to be kept, and he'll only stay in Cleveland if Cleveland overpays for him. And if a guy is good enough to overpay for, he's good enough to franchise tag, and Benjamin is a #3 wide receiver on any other team in this league. He's not worth a tag, and he's not worth overpaying for.
Common sense also suggests that Hue Jackson has a pretty good chance attracting Marvin Jones and/or Mohammed Sanu to Cleveland. I'm pretty sure we'll have Josh Gordon back, too. Would it be nice to keep Benjamin? Sure. Is he a must-keep, no way. I'd much rather the effort is expended on retaining Gipson, Mack, or Schwartz.
"I said, 'I need someone who's going to want to get on the roller coaster with me knowing that it's not always going to be fun,'" -Paul DePodesta -
I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
Um...im not sure whats up with Benjiman, but I thought we were trying to sign him.....
At the same time....you cant break the bank on average talent.....dont know the #'s, but everyone has their price and Im starting to think Benji must be asking too much.....and Im not on the Benji love train.....one OK season out of 4 is just that......
I see a lot of folks tearing up gordon for his "slacker play" and taking plays off in those 4-5 games he played last year....yet, even as a presumed drug addict slacker taking plays off, he produced(in 5 games) the same #'s Benji did over 16 games....
Example....in 4 years, Benji has 109 catches for 1685 yards......... an average of 27 catches for 421 yds.....
and in only 3 years. Greg Little had 155 catches for 1821 yds.....an average of 51 catches for 607 yds.....
and Little sucked....we ran him out and is out of the league.....sooooo.....why would we pay big $$ for a guy with crap numbers???
So........to me, he's only worth keeping "at the right price"....but, second/third receivers are dime a dozen.....
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I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
I think you are sugar coating the report.
This has nothing to do with whether you love Johnny or hate him only the worth of the analytical report.
WSS
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