A Growing Suspicion...
-
He's been a serious jerk in hs and college.
been there, done that. Take Wentz. Character matters.
He's been a serious jerk in hs and college.
been there, done that. Take Wentz. Character matters.
When his Uncle Jim first showed up to Western, NY and hit the college bars with teammates - he wasn't exactly a great kid either. My step mom was the VP of Nursing at a hospital that treated Kelly's girlfriend at the time (now his wife) for facial and body cuts and bruises (more than once) at the emergency room that had domestic violence written all over it after hours on the weekends when alcohol use was heavy. That was right around the time Buffalo was known as the Bickering Bills prior to their period where they won 4 Consecutive AFC Championships. I would have said this was kept pretty quiet (especially outside of Buffalo) about Jim; but my buddy who bounced at a popular night club in Buffalo said Kelly wasn't well liked and often seen screaming at his girlfriend and pushing/pulling her around.
Kids CAN grow up and learn from their mistakes and immaturity. Kelly ended up being really generous to community charities and the episodes of anger seemed to disappear. That prolly meant this Irish kid and his girlfriend/wife had to stop the alcohol in order to stop their on-going War of the Roses. One way to do that is to become a workaholic to the extent you can orchestrate your own no huddle offense calling your own plays as the QB, which happened. You can't do that without putting the time into film study and all the stuff on the field to extent QB and teammates are all on the same page.
How many of us did stupid things when we were between the ages of 18 and 22 especially when alcohol was in the picture? Where would we be if every future employer said "Nope, you were a knucklehead in high school/college so the best we can give you here is Broom Closet Coordinator?"
-
If we do not end up taking one of the two top QBs in this draft, then I think the reason is named Chad Kelly. Just have a feeling he is in the evaluation mix with this class... and I think he compares well.
He is a running QB, which I hate, but looks really at home in the pocket. While he tends to take off under pressure, depending on the escape route he will look to throw on the run.
Arm may be a notch behind either Goff or Wentz, but Kelly has the guts of a burglar... he consistently throws into tighter windows than either 2016 prospect. Yet because many of the throws are on fades and back-shoulders, when only his WR knows they are coming, he still manages to take care of the ball.
Kelly gives up a couple inches... but other than Goff's pocket mastery, if you take the best of Goff and Wentz and mix it together, what you would come up with would look a lot like Kelly.
Add in the fact that we look to be headed for the #1 overall in 2017....
The following is a highlight video, so take it with a grain of salt, but there's a real prospect here.
If we do not end up taking one of the two top QBs in this draft, then I think the reason is named Chad Kelly. Just have a feeling he is in the evaluation mix with this class... and I think he compares well.
He is a running QB, which I hate, but looks really at home in the pocket. While he tends to take off under pressure, depending on the escape route he will look to throw on the run.
Arm may be a notch behind either Goff or Wentz, but Kelly has the guts of a burglar... he consistently throws into tighter windows than either 2016 prospect. Yet because many of the throws are on fades and back-shoulders, when only his WR knows they are coming, he still manages to take care of the ball.
Kelly gives up a couple inches... but other than Goff's pocket mastery, if you take the best of Goff and Wentz and mix it together, what you would come up with would look a lot like Kelly.
Add in the fact that we look to be headed for the #1 overall in 2017....
Despite the tough crowd greeting to your thinking outside the box - I don't think this would be such a bad idea especially if our plan is to go defense first. I thought you made a lot of good points to back your idea. Once upon a time when RG3 was Mr Gotta-have at #2 overall in the mock draft consensii - Kirk Cousins came later in the same draft right? Who was Washington more sorry about drafting? We have 11 picks where a significant portion of our fans wouldn't mind drafting defense first so this idea enables us to do that while Washington reminds us we don't have to draft just 1 QB right? In fact, what are the chances a front office group drafting together for their very first time nails all 11 picks?
The only similarity to Manziel I somewhat care about is Kelly beating Alabama during their National Championship season when nobody else could. That says something about what he and his leadership can accomplish in terms of elevating the play around him. If you want to be the best - you gotta beat the best?
When it comes time to project what carries over to the next level and what doesn't - I like to look at stats so I can weed out the Spergon Wynns ahead of time. Here's Chad Kelly's stats in 2015:
Passing: 298 comp 458 att 65.1 comp% 4042 yards 8.8 ypc 31 TD 13 INT
Rushing: 107 att 500 yards 4.7 avg 10 TD
Kelly had 2 first round talents helping him in 2015, LT Tunsil and WR Treadwell.
Treadwell, coming off a brutal injury during his 9th game in 2104, enjoyed the best season of his college football career by a lot in 2015 with 82 receptions 1153 yards 14.1 ypc 11 TD. I'd like to think some of that is a reflection of a more reliable QB than he had previously.
-
Thanks, Flugs.... interesting anecdotes on Uncle Jim from the Flugle network...
Off-field the difference I see in Chad and Johnny is in a word: denial. Johnny is clearly still in it; Chad seems to have shed his.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
VesnaKociper said:
You would never find a POS like Cam Newton or Johnny Manziel appearing in a self-depricating ad.
How soon they forget Johnny Jamboogie.
-
VesnaKociper said:
You would never find a POS like Cam Newton or Johnny Manziel appearing in a self-depricating ad.
How soon they forget Johnny Jamboogie.
How soon they forget Johnny Jamboogie.
-
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
-
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
Mik,
I really have no idea what will happen next as this new approach is different & unpredictable, but I'm with you. Take the best QB (Goff or Wentz), OR the one left, at #2. For once, I would like us to stay with our original spot & use it well. We ARE after all in a good spot this year.
Next year?...When will we pick, who will be available, what will our needs be?
What the hell do I know?.....
Mike
-
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
This is because the rosters a mess, and unlike other years where we generally have some semblance of optimism regarding the upcoming season, we can all generally agree this season will end with us picking top 5 yet again. If we dont draft a QB at 2, the chances go up that we will pick a QB first next year. Go Browns....why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
-
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
I think the flirtation with Kaep has some questioning how highly the FO regards the top two QB's this year and as such will start pondering about what's available next year considering most assume we will be picking high next year again.
That's a lot of assumptions but I can see how the dots were connected.
-
hue jackson's wanting to draft kaep while in oakland has everything to do with that, but that's where it ends. if jackson wanted him that bad it'd be done already (unless there is something planned for draft day).
you got the number 2 pick, with 2 so-called franchise QBs sitting there, use it to pick the most important position on a football team.
the sooner he's in, the sooner he learns.
thought it'd work the other way around but it hasn't so............
-
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
LMFAO!
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
It's not a prescriptive thread, mik. It's a hypotheical.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
why are we even talking other QBs? there are only 2 that the browns should even consider this year and they'd have to use their 2nd pick on him.
any other option for QB i'd say no. not until next year and people are already talking chad freekin kelly?
It's not a prescriptive thread, mik. It's a hypotheical.
It's not a prescriptive thread, mik. It's a hypotheical.
Some people's hypothetcals are other people's nightmares.
-
Some people's hypothetcals are other people's nightmares.
They don't have to be Mik.
The fact that we're reading names like Kaepernick and RG's3-30 means the FO isn't looking for an immediate starter at QB from the college draft as well as knowing how much the Cowboys like Wentz enough to trade up to #1. It also means they're not catering to popular opinion at all. Actions speak louder than words and the only reason Kaepernick isn't a Cleveland Brown right now is the decimated roster. Makes sense when you think about it considering when SF started losing offensive starters to FA and injury as well as aging receivers losing a step or 2 (Boldin in 2015 and Davis in 2014) - Kaep stopped playing like a starter.
Now the same RG3 that said he didn't want to be drafted by Cleveland suddenly needs Cleveland. And it's being reported he's in Cleveland for 2 days with our decision makers. If that doesn't tell you to be prepared for the unpreparable, nothing will.
If anyone remembers 2015 at all - was the QB position the difference between winning and losing or was it the pathetic defense we got sentenced to? Every time I watched Denver play, their defense had to save their QB's ass. That makes for a nice margin of error for the QB. Look at the career of Manning with all those MVP seasons without a SB win. 1 of the 2 times he did win it, his season looked a lot more like Trent Dilfer's SB season than an MVP QB. All that being the case, is it possible our new way of thinking at the top will go defense first?
I'm not going to pretend I know the first thing about how analytics will get applied to football but it doesn't sound at all like a follow the crowd criteria or reasoning. Right now our roster is decimated enough to the extent BPA matches glaring need virtually anywhere. The other possibility is our front office will do deep enough research to know what QB they feel best about taking especially if Jerry Jones trades up to get their first choice of QB. It's totally possible they're not as enamored with the next QB as they might be with addressing a defense ranking with anchors. So here we are talking alternatives.
-
I am trying not to read into any of the Browns moves at this time. I think that they are going to go BPA through the draft this year even if it does not make sense to us when they do. Or they could surprise me and just do the same things we always do.
-
I am trying not to read into any of the Browns moves at this time. I think that they are going to go BPA through the draft this year even if it does not make sense to us when they do. Or they could surprise me and just do the same things we always do.
Or they could surprise me and just do the same things we always do.
Never underestimate the power of the Browns gonna Brown.
-
I am trying not to read into any of the Browns moves at this time. I think that they are going to go BPA through the draft this year even if it does not make sense to us when they do. Or they could surprise me and just do the same things we always do.
I am trying not to read into any of the Browns moves at this time. I think that they are going to go BPA through the draft this year even if it does not make sense to us when they do. Or they could surprise me and just do the same things we always do.
The good news Joe - is right now pretty much any choice can have BPA matching glaring need.
I'm just a fan so at this time - I think my fave is Wentz with Goff being 1B (and some days they flip flop).
That said, it's kind of fun to consider what we would do if we did indeed draft defense first. Some of this could all be pre-draft poker to posture Jerry Jones from feeling like he needs to trade up for Wentz/Goff and then we pick the QB everybody feels is inevitable.
It's also worth reminding people that we're seeing the names Kaep and RG3 all of a sudden while McCown is here under contract. In a world where actions speak louder than words, there's been some real effort to sign one of these 2 vets which doesn't coincide with popular opinion at all today. All this could definitely point to a QB they don't feel they have to race into a starting job which changes their urgency to join the crowd feeling our only solution are the 2 mock draft darlings at the top today.
One thing I WILL do here is trust the direction Hue, Sashi and the 2 Harvards go via the research they put behind it - compatible with their philosophy. That's why I enjoy participating in discussions that remind us how many different directions are open to us from Defense first to trade back for more help to going with popular opinion.
How many of the current QBs frequenting Superbowls were the first or second QB taken in their draft classes?
Tom Brady
Russell Wilson
Ben Roethlisberger
-
How many of the current QBs frequenting Superbowls were the first or second QB taken in their draft classes?
Tom Brady
Russell Wilson
Ben Roethlisberger
Interesting question.....lets look at it. Since 2000, the following is the draft order of every Super Bowl starting QB (each player listed only once):
#1 Peyton Manning
#1 Cam Newton
#1 Eli Manning
#2 Donovan McNabb
#5 Kerry Collins
#6 Trent Dilfer
#11 Ben Roethlisberger
#18 Joe Flacco
#22 Rex Grossman
#24 Aaron Rodgers
#32 Drew Brees
#36 Colin Kaepernik
#75 Russell Wilson
#98 Rich Gannon
#187 Matt Hasselback
#199 Tom Brady
#227 Brad Johnson
UFA Kurt Warner
UFA Jake Delhomme
19 SB starters: 10 drafted in the first round (one other was #32...which would be first round today)
-
How many of the current QBs frequenting Superbowls were the first or second QB taken in their draft classes?
Tom Brady
Russell Wilson
Ben Roethlisberger
Interesting question.....lets look at it. Since 2000, the following is the draft order of every Super Bowl starting QB (each player listed only once):
#1 Peyton Manning
#1 Cam Newton
#1 Eli Manning
#2 Donovan McNabb
#5 Kerry Collins
#6 Trent Dilfer
#11 Ben Roethlisberger
#18 Joe Flacco
#22 Rex Grossman
#24 Aaron Rodgers
#32 Drew Brees
#36 Colin Kaepernik
#75 Russell Wilson
#98 Rich Gannon
#187 Matt Hasselback
#199 Tom Brady
#227 Brad Johnson
UFA Kurt Warner
UFA Jake Delhomme
19 SB starters: 10 drafted in the first round (one other was #32...which would be first round today)
How many of the current QBs frequenting Superbowls were the first or second QB taken in their draft classes?
Tom Brady
Russell Wilson
Ben Roethlisberger
Interesting question.....lets look at it. Since 2000, the following is the draft order of every Super Bowl starting QB (each player listed only once):
But, to answer your question....here is where each of these SB QBs were picked...in terms of all QBs picked in their drafts
#1 Peyton Manning #1
#1 Cam Newton #1
#1 Eli Manning #1
#2 Donovan McNabb #2
#5 Kerry Collins #2
#6 Trent Dilfer #2
#11 Ben Roethlisberger #3
#18 Joe Flacco #2
#22 Rex Grossman #4
#24 Aaron Rodgers #2
#32 Drew Brees #2
#36 Colin Kaepernik #6
#75 Russell Wilson #6
#98 Rich Gannon #7
#187 Matt Hasselback #7
#199 Tom Brady #7
#227 Brad Johnson #13
UFA Kurt Warner NA
UFA Jake Delhomme NA
19 SB starters: 10 drafted in the first round (one other was #32...which would be first round today)
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login