RG3 Signs with the Browns
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Going all the way back to 1990, the following were QBs taken in Round one who started a Super Bowl:
Peyton Manning
Cam Newton
Joe Flacco
Eli Manning
Aaron Rodgers
Ben R.
Rex Grossman
Donovan McNabb
Steve McNair
Kerry Collins
Trent Dilfer
John Elway
Drew Bledsoe
Troy Aikman
Steve Young
Jim Kelly
The following were NON first round draft picks to start a Super Bowl:
Tom Brady
Russell Wilson
Colin Kaepernick
Drew Brees
Kurt Warner
Matt Hasselback
Jake Delhomme
Rich Gannon
Brad Johnson
Chris Chandler
Brett Favre
Neil O'Donnell
Stan Humphries
Mark Rypien
Jeff Hostetler
Joe Montana
That is actually 15 first rounders.....and 16 non first rounders.
For what that's worth.
The following were NON first round draft picks to start a Super Bowl:Tom Brady
Russell Wilson
Colin Kaepernick
Drew Brees
Kurt Warner
Matt Hasselback
Jake Delhomme
Rich Gannon
Brad Johnson
Chris Chandler
Brett Favre
Neil O'Donnell
Stan Humphries
Mark Rypien
Jeff Hostetler
Joe Montana
That is actually 15 first rounders.....and 16 non first rounders.
For what that's worth.
Not to be a butthead Gip, but looking at that list, how many of those non first rounders were consistently great? Montana is in the HOF, Farve joins him this year, Brady is a lock, and Brees is a probable.
Other than that- a lot of one and done-s. Some because their respective defenses were all world. Even first rounder Trent Dilfer owes that SB win to Ray Lewis and Company.
I suppose I can settle for "Just one before I die". But wouldn't it be nice for a change to have a decade of greatness with a Otto Graham clone running the show? Otto retired 61 years ago. I'd say the Browns are long overdue for another HOF quarterback.
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Would it be fair to say Andy Dalton = Vinnie Testaverde?
Not really. I think Dalton has been better than that. Vinny only went to the playoffs 5 times in his long career. Dalton has already been there in his first 4 years in the league.
Plus I think Dalton's completion pct. and int. pct are quite a bit better than Vinny's.
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The following were NON first round draft picks to start a Super Bowl:
Tom Brady
Russell Wilson
Colin Kaepernick
Drew Brees
Kurt Warner
Matt Hasselback
Jake Delhomme
Rich Gannon
Brad Johnson
Chris Chandler
Brett Favre
Neil O'Donnell
Stan Humphries
Mark Rypien
Jeff Hostetler
Joe Montana
That is actually 15 first rounders.....and 16 non first rounders.
For what that's worth.
Not to be a butthead Gip, but looking at that list, how many of those non first rounders were consistently great? Montana is in the HOF, Farve joins him this year, Brady is a lock, and Brees is a probable.
Other than that- a lot of one and done-s. Some because their respective defenses were all world. Even first rounder Trent Dilfer owes that SB win to Ray Lewis and Company.
I suppose I can settle for "Just one before I die". But wouldn't it be nice for a change to have a decade of greatness with a Otto Graham clone running the show? Otto retired 61 years ago. I'd say the Browns are long overdue for another HOF quarterback.
Not to be a butthead Gip, but looking at that list, how many of those non first rounders were consistently great? Montana is in the HOF, Farve joins him this year, Brady is a lock, and Brees is a probable.
Other than that- a lot of one and done-s. Some because their respective defenses were all world. Even first rounder Trent Dilfer owes that SB win to Ray Lewis and Company.
I suppose I can settle for "Just one before I die". But wouldn't it be nice for a change to have a decade of greatness with a Otto Graham clone running the show? Otto retired 61 years ago. I'd say the Browns are long overdue for another HOF quarterback.
I am only basically giving raw data here. About as many of the first rounders were "one and done" as were the non first rounders....and some of the non first rounders were clearly around for a decade of greatness.
The two QBs probably considered the greatest of all were the non first rounders: Brady/Montana.
Odds are certainly better in getting a franchise QB in the first round.....But the other rounds do produce to occasional superstar.
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Would it be fair to say Andy Dalton = Vinnie Testaverde?
Not really. I think Dalton has been better than that. Vinny only went to the playoffs 5 times in his long career. Dalton has already been there in his first 4 years in the league.
Plus I think Dalton's completion pct. and int. pct are quite a bit better than Vinny's.
Not really. I think Dalton has been better than that. Vinny only went to the playoffs 5 times in his long career. Dalton has already been there in his first 4 years in the league.
Plus I think Dalton's completion pct. and int. pct are quite a bit better than Vinny's.
I was going to ask h to ask again in 5 or 10 years...
Vinny spent much of his career being his team's best offensive player. Hardly the case with Andy...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Not really. I think Dalton has been better than that. Vinny only went to the playoffs 5 times in his long career. Dalton has already been there in his first 4 years in the league.
Plus I think Dalton's completion pct. and int. pct are quite a bit better than Vinny's.
I was going to ask h to ask again in 5 or 10 years...
Vinny spent much of his career being his team's best offensive player. Hardly the case with Andy...
I was going to ask h to ask again in 5 or 10 years...
Vinny spent much of his career being his team's best offensive player. Hardly the case with Andy...
Gipper is still mad about Vinny vs Bernie.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
Doesn't mean much. The 1st round picks tend to go to the worst teams.
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Not really. I think Dalton has been better than that. Vinny only went to the playoffs 5 times in his long career. Dalton has already been there in his first 4 years in the league.
Plus I think Dalton's completion pct. and int. pct are quite a bit better than Vinny's.
I was going to ask h to ask again in 5 or 10 years...
Vinny spent much of his career being his team's best offensive player. Hardly the case with Andy...
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Gipper is still mad about Vinny vs Bernie.
WSS
No, I actually liked them both. It was Bernie vs. Todd Philcox that got me mad.
And I always said that if you could combine Bernie's brain with Testaverde's arm and body you would have had the greatest QB ever.
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And I thought you hated them. Ironic ain't it?
Yep I like Johnny and I like Colt McCoy, the guy your buddy held a clipboard for.
The reason I gave up on Johnny finally, and it was a disappointmen, was when it was clear he didn't really want to be a Cleveland Brown or even play quarterback in the NFL.
I never liked RG3 and still don't. I think he was an arrogant asshole and probably the biggest bust of the decade. We gave pick number 22 for Johnny how much did Washington pay for RG3? And Johnny at least pretended he wanted to be here RG3 made it clear he didn't. So fuck him, he's Washington's problem anyway. Well up until recently.
Also he had a coaching staff falling all over themselves to write an offense around him while Johnny had a grumpy old prick who thought he was coaching High School and found a beer in a kid's Locker.
But this isn't about Johnny, Johnny is gone. It's more about Josh McCown, a quality player a stand-up guy and a man among men. He's not a guy who cries racism or points the finger at his teammates when he stinks up the field. And if you are taking Carson Wentz or Jared Goff Josh is the kind of guy you'd probably want, willing to share his vast knowledge of the league with a newcomer. Not a me first prick.
But whatever the agenda RG3 seems like he's coach Jackson's boy, and he's certainly young enough if the coach thinks he can transform his career. If that's the case I'm just guessing he wouldn't want to threaten him with a high pick. Certainly don't want another Brian Hoyer meltdown.
So I'm just speculating the same as everybody else. I can easily see the coach set his sights on some also-ran in the third round.
Since I don't know a damn thing, like most of us, and like many people who earn a good living making shit up, I could easily be wrong. It wouldn't be the first time and won't be the last.
If I'm wrong I will shrug my shoulders, if I'm right I'll gloat like a little bitch.
WSS
+1000
+1000
these fucking morons still blame mccowns int against denver for the loss...fucking morons.....
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+1000
these fucking morons still blame mccowns int against denver for the loss...fucking morons.....
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Link below to transcript of RG's Media Conference call...
Warning: Is oozing oversized ego...
http://espn.go.com/blog/cleveland-browns/post/_/id/18419/transcript-of-robert-griffin-iiis-media-conference-call"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Link below to transcript of RG's Media Conference call...
Warning: Is oozing oversized ego...
http://espn.go.com/blog/cleveland-browns/post/_/id/18419/transcript-of-robert-griffin-iiis-media-conference-callLink below to transcript of RG's Media Conference call...
Warning: Is oozing oversized ego...
You see what you look for, I guess...
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Link below to transcript of RG's Media Conference call...
Warning: Is oozing oversized ego...
http://espn.go.com/blog/cleveland-browns/post/_/id/18419/transcript-of-robert-griffin-iiis-media-conference-callLink below to transcript of RG's Media Conference call...
Warning: Is oozing oversized ego...
Well, I do want him to exhibit some confidence.
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Flacco was lucky to step into a quality organization with talent already established. Again we are talking about the Browns. Who is the #1 WR on this team? The guy who sat out the year or the other guy.
I mean seriously- the best quarterbacks in the draft almost always go to talent depleted teams. Like the Tampa, the Jags and Titans were loaded when they took their franchise qbs? Only luck out was Rodgers who fell far enough to sit behind Farve. Andrew Luck was a fluke too, as you could almost say the Colts tanked.
It could be why we picked up Griffin, so whoever we draft @ #2- and I'm damn near certain it's going to be Wentz or Goff- gets to sit for at least 1\2 the season.
I mean seriously- the best quarterbacks in the draft almost always go to talent depleted teams. Like the Tampa, the Jags and Titans were loaded when they took their franchise qbs? Only luck out was Rodgers who fell far enough to sit behind Farve. Andrew Luck was a fluke too, as you could almost say the Colts tanked.
You're missing the point. I counted Wilson in the non first round QBs. Doesn't matter the teams that drafted Manning and Rothlisberger were having down years- you forget where they got drafted? Manning #1 overall. Ben #9. That is the point. Recent SB wining QBs in general were drafted high in the first round. Brady skews the stats, and there's the occasional outlier like Wilson or Warner.
You can count Wilson wherever you want but some best QBs, regardless of draft position, in the last decade weren't drafted to bad teams. Eli & Big Ben won because they were drafted into very good situations. Show me the top QB of the last 10 years drafted to a bottom feeding team that has won a Super Bowl? Probably have to go all the way back to Troy Aikman in 1989.
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I mean seriously- the best quarterbacks in the draft almost always go to talent depleted teams. Like the Tampa, the Jags and Titans were loaded when they took their franchise qbs? Only luck out was Rodgers who fell far enough to sit behind Farve. Andrew Luck was a fluke too, as you could almost say the Colts tanked.
You're missing the point. I counted Wilson in the non first round QBs. Doesn't matter the teams that drafted Manning and Rothlisberger were having down years- you forget where they got drafted? Manning #1 overall. Ben #9. That is the point. Recent SB wining QBs in general were drafted high in the first round. Brady skews the stats, and there's the occasional outlier like Wilson or Warner.
You can count Wilson wherever you want but some best QBs, regardless of draft position, in the last decade weren't drafted to bad teams. Eli & Big Ben won because they were drafted into very good situations. Show me the top QB of the last 10 years drafted to a bottom feeding team that has won a Super Bowl? Probably have to go all the way back to Troy Aikman in 1989.
You can count Wilson wherever you want but some best QBs, regardless of draft position, in the last decade weren't drafted to bad teams. Eli & Big Ben won because they were drafted into very good situations. Show me the top QB of the last 10 years drafted to a bottom feeding team that has won a Super Bowl? Probably have to go all the way back to Troy Aikman in 1989.
so if YOU want the browns to wait to have a good team to warrant a first round pick of their supposed franchise QB, WE should have to wait what......another 3<6 years?
no thank you.
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You can count Wilson wherever you want but some best QBs, regardless of draft position, in the last decade weren't drafted to bad teams. Eli & Big Ben won because they were drafted into very good situations. Show me the top QB of the last 10 years drafted to a bottom feeding team that has won a Super Bowl? Probably have to go all the way back to Troy Aikman in 1989.
so if YOU want the browns to wait to have a good team to warrant a first round pick of their supposed franchise QB, WE should have to wait what......another 3<6 years?
no thank you.
so if YOU want the browns to wait to have a good team to warrant a first round pick of their supposed franchise QB, WE should have to wait what......another 3<6 years?
no thank you.
No need to wait if you think you've got the next Andrew Luck. I'll be the first to admit I don't know anything other than surface facts on Goff & Wentz. I didn't watch too many Cal and North Dakota State games this year, as I'd wager many in here didn't. There are persons inside the organization whose job it is to perform that task and they will ultimately make the decision. As a fan I think drafting a QB in the top 10 because you have a need and you think a guy could be the one isn't the best plan when you have glaring needs all over your football team.
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I mean seriously- the best quarterbacks in the draft almost always go to talent depleted teams. Like the Tampa, the Jags and Titans were loaded when they took their franchise qbs? Only luck out was Rodgers who fell far enough to sit behind Farve. Andrew Luck was a fluke too, as you could almost say the Colts tanked.
You're missing the point. I counted Wilson in the non first round QBs. Doesn't matter the teams that drafted Manning and Rothlisberger were having down years- you forget where they got drafted? Manning #1 overall. Ben #9. That is the point. Recent SB wining QBs in general were drafted high in the first round. Brady skews the stats, and there's the occasional outlier like Wilson or Warner.
You can count Wilson wherever you want but some best QBs, regardless of draft position, in the last decade weren't drafted to bad teams. Eli & Big Ben won because they were drafted into very good situations. Show me the top QB of the last 10 years drafted to a bottom feeding team that has won a Super Bowl? Probably have to go all the way back to Troy Aikman in 1989.
You can count Wilson wherever you want but some best QBs, regardless of draft position, in the last decade weren't drafted to bad teams. Eli & Big Ben won because they were drafted into very good situations. Show me the top QB of the last 10 years drafted to a bottom feeding team that has won a Super Bowl? Probably have to go all the way back to Troy Aikman in 1989.
That line of thinking doesn't mean diddly-doo. Duh- and great quarterbacks drafted to bad teams don't win right away. Don't know how old you are- but plenty of folks my age say Archie Manning could have won a couple Super Bowls if he had been playing on a team like Green Bay, instead of the paper bag on your head Aints. Cam Newton got drafted to an ostensibly horrible team, and made it to the Super Bowl. So you have to be drafted to a team only missing a qb & all the other pieces are in place? You just plain can't count on being that lucky. FWIW, the Browns should have drafted Ben. I live right down the road from Miami of Ohio, and I was screaming for the Browns to draft him. If you want to argue he would have flamed out in Cleveland- be my guest. Eli only went to the Giants because him and pops Archie refused to go to San Diego, hence the trade. At least the Chargers got a nice consolation prize in Phil Rivers out of that deal. PS Eli only won one of his Super Bowls because of the biggest miracle catch in the history of the NFL.
so if YOU want the browns to wait to have a good team to warrant a first round pick of their supposed franchise QB, WE should have to wait what......another 3<6 years?
no thank you.
Exactly Mik. I have no idea what the Brown's opinion of Goff or Wentz is- but if they see "franchise QB" they're going to draft one or the other. BTW, I didn't want Quinn, Wee-done or JFF. The odds say around 30%. It's time to roll the dice again, and hope we get lucky.
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And I thought you hated them. Ironic ain't it?
Yep I like Johnny and I like Colt McCoy, the guy your buddy held a clipboard for.
The reason I gave up on Johnny finally, and it was a disappointmen, was when it was clear he didn't really want to be a Cleveland Brown or even play quarterback in the NFL.
I never liked RG3 and still don't. I think he was an arrogant asshole and probably the biggest bust of the decade. We gave pick number 22 for Johnny how much did Washington pay for RG3? And Johnny at least pretended he wanted to be here RG3 made it clear he didn't. So fuck him, he's Washington's problem anyway. Well up until recently.
Also he had a coaching staff falling all over themselves to write an offense around him while Johnny had a grumpy old prick who thought he was coaching High School and found a beer in a kid's Locker.
But this isn't about Johnny, Johnny is gone. It's more about Josh McCown, a quality player a stand-up guy and a man among men. He's not a guy who cries racism or points the finger at his teammates when he stinks up the field. And if you are taking Carson Wentz or Jared Goff Josh is the kind of guy you'd probably want, willing to share his vast knowledge of the league with a newcomer. Not a me first prick.
But whatever the agenda RG3 seems like he's coach Jackson's boy, and he's certainly young enough if the coach thinks he can transform his career. If that's the case I'm just guessing he wouldn't want to threaten him with a high pick. Certainly don't want another Brian Hoyer meltdown.
So I'm just speculating the same as everybody else. I can easily see the coach set his sights on some also-ran in the third round.
Since I don't know a damn thing, like most of us, and like many people who earn a good living making shit up, I could easily be wrong. It wouldn't be the first time and won't be the last.
If I'm wrong I will shrug my shoulders, if I'm right I'll gloat like a little bitch.
WSS
Well, it sounds like we gave up on Johnny for the same reasons, I just saw it a year and half earlier.
Let's pretend Johnny is sober, three inches taller, with a rocket arm and wants to play in Cleveland ... we just signed that guy.
"Cries racism" ... Say What?? Griffin? When did RG3 cry racism?
I remember a lot of people on the outside crying racism ... I guess they like to do that. But never heard it from Griffin.
He comes from good people. His parents were both Army sergeants, he's a strong christian, a family man.
He was practically best friends with Dan Snyder, so I don't think he found him to be "racist".
He didn't get along with his coaches. He brooded.
People mature.
Brooding while being black is a turn off I guess. Meanwhile, our little shit was telling his teammates last year "Boy, I bet the weather is nice in Dallas!" in the middle of the season.
From all reports Griffin was a good teammate last year, accepted third string role and if you can find a quote directly from him, that shows he was ever racist, or was a bad teammate in the past year, I'd like to read it.
The reason he was third string and inactive behind McCoy was because the Redskins would have to pay him a huge buyout if he played and got injured, so, once they decided to start Cousins, they shelved RG3 all together. Turns out that was good for us, not only should he be humbled ... but his legs should be fresh.
But you are free not to like him. He did brood in his early 20's.
As for McCown, I love him too, but he's 37. His work is done here, you get a higher ceiling with Griffin. Low risk, high reward. Hue Jack is a QB guy, he's looking for younger raw material he can mold. He doesn't need a "mentor", that is what the coaching staff is for.
Zombo
Zombo said:
Well, it sounds like we gave up on Johnny for the same reasons, I just saw it a year and half earlier.
Let's pretend Johnny is sober, three inches taller, with a rocket arm and wants to play in Cleveland ... we just signed that guy.
"Cries racism" ... Say What?? Griffin? When did RG3 cry racism?
I remember a lot of people on the outside crying racism ... I guess they like to do that. But never heard it from Griffin.
He comes from good people. His parents were both Army sergeants, he's a strong christian, a family man.
He was practically best friends with Dan Snyder, so I don't think he found him to be "racist".
He didn't get along with his coaches. He brooded.
People mature.
Brooding while being black is a turn off I guess. Meanwhile, our little shit was telling his teammates last year "Boy, I bet the weather is nice in Dallas!" in the middle of the season.
From all reports Griffin was a good teammate last year, accepted third string role and if you can find a quote directly from him, that shows he was ever racist, or was a bad teammate in the past year, I'd like to read it.
The reason he was third string and inactive behind McCoy was because the Redskins would have to pay him a huge buyout if he played and got injured, so, once they decided to start Cousins, they shelved RG3 all together. Turns out that was good for us, not only should he be humbled ... but his legs should be fresh.
But you are free not to like him. He did brood in his early 20's.
As for McCown, I love him too, but he's 37. His work is done here, you get a higher ceiling with Griffin. Low risk, high reward. Hue Jack is a QB guy, he's looking for younger raw material he can mold. He doesn't need a "mentor", that is what the coaching staff is for.
Zombo
Pretty well sums up my feelings on the matter. The only drama surrounding RG3 last year was generated by the media. when a former ROY who cost his team several high draft picks isn't playing it's good talking point. He wasn't beating his girlfriend or showing up to practice drunk or wearing disguises to go to Vegas the night before a game.
As I see it, the only legitimate gripe is his ability to stay healthy, but McCown couldn't stay on the field last year either. The worst case scenario is the Browns pay a relative pittance for a guy who flames out. Do we expect the Browns to go anywhere this season anyway? If the Browns don't make the AFC title game, does that fall squarely on the shoulders of RG3?
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Link below to transcript of RG's Media Conference call...
Warning: Is oozing oversized ego...
You see what you look for, I guess...
You see what you look for, I guess...
I found this, the 2nd question, simply too hard to ignore....
Q: Where do you stand physically and mentally in terms of regaining the promise you once had in the NFL?
Griffin: I just feel like we’ve got a lot of work to do –
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196
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