Reasons to believe the Browns have turned the corner into turning into a winning TEAM
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VesnaKociper said:
That draft would have produced results.
Who said Bosa was playing QB? All I said is the Browns fucked up passing on him. WHich, they did.
Naa, your #1 opinion & something we actually agree on. It's always about the QB, I total agree. Think we agree with your Tarkington on board, Wentz was not that option either? So was Philly the only one we could rob with all those picks is my only unanswered question I guess. We gave up a bunch from #3 to #7 & I thought Buckner playing in a 3-4 was our biggest need over any of them. The trade from 8 to 15 was a win with C.Coleman. You can't teach nor coach speed & quickness. I know you like Doctson but his 4.50 to Coleman's 4.37 40 is something I like in Coleman. Now can we get somebody to get him the rock at that speed? Was it RG3 that made Desean Jackson a star? Lets See..
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Bosa=Bust
Any player named Joey is a turd licker.
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might be off topic but who cares (?!?)...
why don't the browns and other teams sink money into finding a great GM and a scouting team rather than throwing money at some over-rated hot-shot coach? i mean wasn't chip kelly supposed to be the next big thing? how much did laurie splurge on that asshole (reminds me of lerner/holmgren)? what big name coach has won anything in the past decade if not for his GM drafting the right players? gary kubiak a great coach? GTFO!
i say get the friggin best GM, let him get the best players and hand them off to rumplestilskin who could do just as good as tomlin, coughlin or mclovin at this point.
the whole model is screwed backwards IMO.
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So, on Wed, we were at a pool party. Our friends, "adopted sister-in-laws" etc, one of em have a real nice place,
swimming pool near a golf course, etc.
I went in to get a plate of food, and on my way out, at the top of the granite stairs of the
top patio, I slipped on a grape on the right side of the stairs, put my right foot back down to keep
my balance, and half my foot was on the stairs, and it slipped over the edge.
it was "save new titanium knee" time, and I plowed into the granite patio, left shoulder wise,
and the Correlware plate exploded into maybe ten thousand sharp fragments. The gals were trying
to keep me still, thinking I was badly hurt, but I rolled over and got up and said "well, that was stupid...."
Trouble was, they were also trying to keep me from rolling on the sharp needle fragments.
New right knee - still excellent.
Right hand - 3 scratches/ cuts... 1 nasty one that needed a bandaid.
Right Leg - calf cut pretty good, needed two bandaids.
Bruised/scraped left knee
2 wet paper towels to stop the bleeding.
But I was fine. I know they were really worried, because I was the object of their jokes for ten minutes.
and THAT was more fun than reading most of Ghoulish's threads.
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might be off topic but who cares (?!?)...
why don't the browns and other teams sink money into finding a great GM and a scouting team rather than throwing money at some over-rated hot-shot coach? i mean wasn't chip kelly supposed to be the next big thing? how much did laurie splurge on that asshole (reminds me of lerner/holmgren)? what big name coach has won anything in the past decade if not for his GM drafting the right players? gary kubiak a great coach? GTFO!
i say get the friggin best GM, let him get the best players and hand them off to rumplestilskin who could do just as good as tomlin, coughlin or mclovin at this point.
the whole model is screwed backwards IMO.
why don't the browns and other teams sink money into finding a great GM and a scouting team rather than throwing money at some over-rated hot-shot coach?
I've often pondered this same question. If I were the owner of an NFL franchise, my first priority would be to get a great GM. I would go after someone like Ozzie Newsome or a Kevin Colbert. This is the single most important position on the team, the person responsible for bringing in a crop of talented footballs players year after year. In 2015 the Browns had the #31st ranked roster in the NFL, I hope the Harvard grads do a better job than Farmer.
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why don't the browns and other teams sink money into finding a great GM and a scouting team rather than throwing money at some over-rated hot-shot coach?
I've often pondered this same question. If I were the owner of an NFL franchise, my first priority would be to get a great GM. I would go after someone like Ozzie Newsome or a Kevin Colbert. This is the single most important position on the team, the person responsible for bringing in a crop of talented footballs players year after year. In 2015 the Browns had the #31st ranked roster in the NFL, I hope the Harvard grads do a better job than Farmer.
I've often pondered this same question. If I were the owner of an NFL franchise, my first priority would be to get a great GM. I would go after someone like Ozzie Newsome or a Kevin Colbert. This is the single most important position on the team, the person responsible for bringing in a crop of talented footballs players year after year. In 2015 the Browns had the #31st ranked roster in the NFL, I hope the Harvard grads do a better job than Farmer.
I don't believe you can 100% effectively coach players that are chosen FOR you without your input. I believe the coach MUST have significant input regarding players who fit his system. While I agree about having a strong GM, even more important is to have a GM & HC who communicate well & are on the same page. Football is a TEAM game & that applies to FO & Coaching staff as well.
Mike
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So, on Wed, we were at a pool party. Our friends, "adopted sister-in-laws" etc, one of em have a real nice place,
swimming pool near a golf course, etc.
I went in to get a plate of food, and on my way out, at the top of the granite stairs of the
top patio, I slipped on a grape on the right side of the stairs, put my right foot back down to keep
my balance, and half my foot was on the stairs, and it slipped over the edge.
it was "save new titanium knee" time, and I plowed into the granite patio, left shoulder wise,
and the Correlware plate exploded into maybe ten thousand sharp fragments. The gals were trying
to keep me still, thinking I was badly hurt, but I rolled over and got up and said "well, that was stupid...."
Trouble was, they were also trying to keep me from rolling on the sharp needle fragments.
New right knee - still excellent.
Right hand - 3 scratches/ cuts... 1 nasty one that needed a bandaid.
Right Leg - calf cut pretty good, needed two bandaids.
Bruised/scraped left knee
2 wet paper towels to stop the bleeding.
But I was fine. I know they were really worried, because I was the object of their jokes for ten minutes.
and THAT was more fun than reading most of Ghoulish's threads.
... and THAT was more fun than reading most of Ghoulish's threads.
lol... was wondering what the payoff to the story was going to be...
I've often pondered this same question. If I were the owner of an NFL franchise, my first priority would be to get a great GM. I would go after someone like Ozzie Newsome or a Kevin Colbert. This is the single most important position on the team, the person responsible for bringing in a crop of talented footballs players year after year. In 2015 the Browns had the #31st ranked roster in the NFL, I hope the Harvard grads do a better job than Farmer.
Sounds easy... but how do you ID GM talent? Remember how "smart" we were to retain Farmer when the Fins wanted him? How Ray was an integral part of all the recent personnel success in KC?
Since you can't tamper with clubs' GMs, the only way to go is promote a promising prospect from within. Even then it's far from foolproof. Maybe Farmer was great in a role in KC... even in CLE as we apparently thought. Then he became "the GM" and.... no... not so much.
Can't say for sure, but I've a feeling that most of the GM talent in the league was "found" within the FO they now head. It feels like we have deepened and widened our FO talent pool with this reorg under Sashi. Hopefully we spawn and grow our future talent in it.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
VesnaKociper said:
So, what you are telling me is that you agree with my Santa Claus message. You are agreeing with me that this team had a horrible draft and is on a path to another shit season. Your objection is that I am telling the truth?
Speaking of Santa, When I was 5 I told my Mom that there was no such thing as Santa. When it comes ot detecting bullshit, I am THE REAL, cousin Vinny.
2 - 14 +/- 1 win.
I got your REAL Cousin Vinny right here. The kid that told me there was no such thing as Santa Claus ended up with a bloody nose. I'm Irish which means swing first and ask questions later.
To prevent the Ghoolosh from sounding foolosh in paraphrase - let me be responsible for what I say. In this case, I have a very good feeling about this draft for us. I LIKED how they not only looked for explosiveness in the edge rushers but they found guys where the fitness carried over to productivity on the gridiron. There were some occasional head scratchers but they also found some decorated resumes as late as Scooby. There was also an understanding the WR position and edge rushers are important in a passing era, which moves us light years ahead of Farmer's prehistoric philosophy about the WR position.
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VesnaKociper said:
So, what you are telling me is that you agree with my Santa Claus message. You are agreeing with me that this team had a horrible draft and is on a path to another shit season. Your objection is that I am telling the truth?
Speaking of Santa, When I was 5 I told my Mom that there was no such thing as Santa. When it comes ot detecting bullshit, I am THE REAL, cousin Vinny.
2 - 14 +/- 1 win.
I got your REAL Cousin Vinny right here. The kid that told me there was no such thing as Santa Claus ended up with a bloody nose. I'm Irish which means swing first and ask questions later.
To prevent the Ghoolosh from sounding foolosh in paraphrase - let me be responsible for what I say. In this case, I have a very good feeling about this draft for us. I LIKED how they not only looked for explosiveness in the edge rushers but they found guys where the fitness carried over to productivity on the gridiron. There were some occasional head scratchers but they also found some decorated resumes as late as Scooby. There was also an understanding the WR position and edge rushers are important in a passing era, which moves us light years ahead of Farmer's prehistoric philosophy about the WR position.
I got your REAL Cousin Vinny right here. The kid that told me there was no such thing as Santa Claus ended up with a bloody nose. I'm Irish which means swing first and ask questions later.
To prevent the Ghoolosh from sounding foolosh in paraphrase - let me be responsible for what I say. In this case, I have a very good feeling about this draft for us. I LIKED how they not only looked for explosiveness in the edge rushers but they found guys where the fitness carried over to productivity on the gridiron. There were some occasional head scratchers but they also found some decorated resumes as late as Scooby. There was also an understanding the WR position and edge rushers are important in a passing era, which moves us light years ahead of Farmer's prehistoric philosophy about the WR position.
You mean Farmer Flintstone?
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... and THAT was more fun than reading most of Ghoulish's threads.
lol... was wondering what the payoff to the story was going to be...
I've often pondered this same question. If I were the owner of an NFL franchise, my first priority would be to get a great GM. I would go after someone like Ozzie Newsome or a Kevin Colbert. This is the single most important position on the team, the person responsible for bringing in a crop of talented footballs players year after year. In 2015 the Browns had the #31st ranked roster in the NFL, I hope the Harvard grads do a better job than Farmer.
Sounds easy... but how do you ID GM talent? Remember how "smart" we were to retain Farmer when the Fins wanted him? How Ray was an integral part of all the recent personnel success in KC?
Since you can't tamper with clubs' GMs, the only way to go is promote a promising prospect from within. Even then it's far from foolproof. Maybe Farmer was great in a role in KC... even in CLE as we apparently thought. Then he became "the GM" and.... no... not so much.
Can't say for sure, but I've a feeling that most of the GM talent in the league was "found" within the FO they now head. It feels like we have deepened and widened our FO talent pool with this reorg under Sashi. Hopefully we spawn and grow our future talent in it.
I haven't spoke with Rick Spielman since Sonny's (his dad) funeral about 10 years ago. If I happen to run across him, I'll take a chance on the anti tampering rule and see if he wants to come back home. Unfortunately, Haslam will have to be involved.Since you can't tamper with clubs' GMs, the only way to go is promote a promising prospect from within.
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It IS possible that we've turned a corner and are on a strait-a-way in the right direction. But we can't know that right now.
Things we DO know:
We don't have that pompous dope Farmer around. Mr. 'I don't draft WR's because they don't handle the ball enough. I sign midget free agents instead'. Mr. 'I don't need to go to QB pro days'...and then draft Manziel.
We go from that to the Geek Squad who identifies the problem and drafts 4 WR's. - That is a major corner turned!
We don't have Pettine and his bewildering defense and his genius of kicking a 60 yard field goal to Devin Hester standing in the middle of the end zone....TWICE. (I don't think I ever saw him coach anyone up)
We go from that to Hue...who's probably already coached up more players. And Hue brought in a seasoned and respected bunch of coaches. - To me, that's another corner turned. (I thought we had some pieces in place when we had Norv Turner on offense and Horton on D...but we decided to careen off of that course)
We've turned a corner on the field also by letting some starters walk in free agency and bringing in younger guys.
After all of these corners, we're currently in a tunnel....and we won't know if we're headed in the right direction until we emerge into the light. We have to SEE the quality in Hue as an offensive coordinator and HC. We have to see more of the Harvard Geek Squad and their visionary work. (I'm ok with trying the Harvard approach - I'm sick of dumb-ass 'football' people)
We've taken a lot of corners since '99. Are these the navigators who are turning us in the right directions? Time, our eyes and ears, will tell.
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It IS possible that we've turned a corner and are on a strait-a-way in the right direction. But we can't know that right now.
Things we DO know:
We don't have that pompous dope Farmer around. Mr. 'I don't draft WR's because they don't handle the ball enough. I sign midget free agents instead'. Mr. 'I don't need to go to QB pro days'...and then draft Manziel.
We go from that to the Geek Squad who identifies the problem and drafts 4 WR's. - That is a major corner turned!
We don't have Pettine and his bewildering defense and his genius of kicking a 60 yard field goal to Devin Hester standing in the middle of the end zone....TWICE. (I don't think I ever saw him coach anyone up)
We go from that to Hue...who's probably already coached up more players. And Hue brought in a seasoned and respected bunch of coaches. - To me, that's another corner turned. (I thought we had some pieces in place when we had Norv Turner on offense and Horton on D...but we decided to careen off of that course)
We've turned a corner on the field also by letting some starters walk in free agency and bringing in younger guys.
After all of these corners, we're currently in a tunnel....and we won't know if we're headed in the right direction until we emerge into the light. We have to SEE the quality in Hue as an offensive coordinator and HC. We have to see more of the Harvard Geek Squad and their visionary work. (I'm ok with trying the Harvard approach - I'm sick of dumb-ass 'football' people)
We've taken a lot of corners since '99. Are these the navigators who are turning us in the right directions? Time, our eyes and ears, will tell.
It IS possible that we've turned a corner and are on a strait-a-way in the right direction. But we can't know that right now.
Things we DO know:
We don't have that pompous dope Farmer around. Mr. 'I don't draft WR's because they don't handle the ball enough. I sign midget free agents instead'. Mr. 'I don't need to go to QB pro days'...and then draft Manziel.
We go from that to the Geek Squad who identifies the problem and drafts 4 WR's. - That is a major corner turned!
We don't have Pettine and his bewildering defense and his genius of kicking a 60 yard field goal to Devin Hester standing in the middle of the end zone....TWICE. (I don't think I ever saw him coach anyone up)
We go from that to Hue...who's probably already coached up more players. And Hue brought in a seasoned and respected bunch of coaches. - To me, that's another corner turned. (I thought we had some pieces in place when we had Norv Turner on offense and Horton on D...but we decided to careen off of that course)
We've turned a corner on the field also by letting some starters walk in free agency and bringing in younger guys.
After all of these corners, we're currently in a tunnel....and we won't know if we're headed in the right direction until we emerge into the light. We have to SEE the quality in Hue as an offensive coordinator and HC. We have to see more of the Harvard Geek Squad and their visionary work. (I'm ok with trying the Harvard approach - I'm sick of dumb-ass 'football' people)
We've taken a lot of corners since '99. Are these the navigators who are turning us in the right directions? Time, our eyes and ears, will tell.
Excellent post! Very solid points without going off the deep end. Welcome to the Board.
Mike
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But we DO have one major "belly acher", pain in the ass that he/it is. VK, is that all you can do, is bitch?
Complainers seem to never be "doers". Please tell us, specifically, what you would do to make us great? I mean, like WHO you would have drafted & when. Give us the whole 7 rounds too.
Mike
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VesnaKociper said:
Have already been through this. Look ass paste, my "bitching" is far less fucking annoying than listening to you jackoffs post about the team playing fucking laser tag as one of the reasons things are looking up.
Lmao right here
The problem the Browns have is NOT in the late rounds, the problem the Browns have is that they picked #2 and #32 overall and came away without one of the top 10 ranked players. Bosa, Lynch, Elliot, Doctson... even Wentz...................the rest is a crap shoot of even harder odds. Look man, when you have no QB WRs, RB, or pass rushers of note, it isn't being NEGATIVE to predict 2- 14 +/- one win. It is perfectly reasonable..........
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