No Love for Quinn
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@inspecta said:
Not only does DA have multiple shortcomings in his passing game but the guy has cement shoes. He's about as mobile as stephen hawking in a mud pit.That and he has absolutely no charisma to rally the troops when needed. If you get down in a game and need to come from behind you want a QB your team can get behind and get excited about. The Oaf just stands there with this sheepish green and doesn't really say much. His teammates stand around wondering if the guy is stoned or legally Retarded.
Like I've said a million times, he's a very good backup and will win you a few games if you don't have any pressure or expectations on him.
nice try, very passionate.
Too bad DA has a half a dozen come from behind wins on his resume to prove your post is nothing but BQ lovin bullshit.
Hey nice finish by BQ in the Denver game BTW. 4 straight incomplete passes with the game on the line. Blasted one over KIIs head on 4th down. That's a troop rallier if there ever was one.
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that position has been known to take awhile for guys to develop, especially w/out a quality vet to mentor from. neither of our current guys have had that. the top 10 QB's in the league still make mistakes regularly, yet everyone overlooks it (except Philly fans). similar to how the league values Braylon more than CLE seems to. our situation might require the better guy to play, even if he won't be the better guy forever.
i like our QB situation and hope we keep them both--as i've said before iron sharpens iron and those guys have shown they can coexist.
it's fan opinion that seems to be the problem. even if BQ starts and falters many will want to give him a two-year leash it seems. i'm ok with the best guy playing regardless and trust the staff to evaluate the talent for me. let the weaker choice develop on the practice field.
that position has been known to take awhile for guys to develop, especially w/out a quality vet to mentor from. neither of our current guys have had that. the top 10 QB's in the league still make mistakes regularly, yet everyone overlooks it (except Philly fans). similar to how the league values Braylon more than CLE seems to. our situation might require the better guy to play, even if he won't be the better guy forever.
i like our QB situation and hope we keep them both--as i've said before iron sharpens iron and those guys have shown they can coexist.
it's fan opinion that seems to be the problem. even if BQ starts and falters many will want to give him a two-year leash it seems. i'm ok with the best guy playing regardless and trust the staff to evaluate the talent for me. let the weaker choice develop on the practice field.
You develop by playing the game. Watching will only carry so far. At some point you have to get reps.
Playing the guy who is better now because the other guy needs to develop is counter-productive. Not to mention, the other guy actually ISN'T better now.
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that position has been known to take awhile for guys to develop, especially w/out a quality vet to mentor from. neither of our current guys have had that. the top 10 QB's in the league still make mistakes regularly, yet everyone overlooks it (except Philly fans). similar to how the league values Braylon more than CLE seems to. our situation might require the better guy to play, even if he won't be the better guy forever.
i like our QB situation and hope we keep them both--as i've said before iron sharpens iron and those guys have shown they can coexist.
it's fan opinion that seems to be the problem. even if BQ starts and falters many will want to give him a two-year leash it seems. i'm ok with the best guy playing regardless and trust the staff to evaluate the talent for me. let the weaker choice develop on the practice field.
You develop by playing the game. Watching will only carry so far. At some point you have to get reps.
Playing the guy who is better now because the other guy needs to develop is counter-productive. Not to mention, the other guy actually ISN'T better now.
You develop by playing the game. Watching will only carry so far. At some point you have to get reps.
Playing the guy who is better now because the other guy needs to develop is counter-productive. Not to mention, the other guy actually ISN'T better now.
Aikman has always said this. You can't learn to throw by studying throwing, your need to actually throw. Same for quarterbacking. Get in there, take your lumps, and learn on the job.
Amen brother.
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You develop by playing the game. Watching will only carry so far. At some point you have to get reps.
Playing the guy who is better now because the other guy needs to develop is counter-productive. Not to mention, the other guy actually ISN'T better now.
Aikman has always said this. You can't learn to throw by studying throwing, your need to actually throw. Same for quarterbacking. Get in there, take your lumps, and learn on the job.
Amen brother.
Aikman has always said this. You can't learn to throw by studying throwing, your need to actually throw. Same for quarterbacking. Get in there, take your lumps, and learn on the job.
Amen brother.
After 3 years pf play, Aikman had thrown 31 TDs and 46 INTS.... most of guys on this board would have never let him play year 4 and have the career he had.
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Aikman has always said this. You can't learn to throw by studying throwing, your need to actually throw. Same for quarterbacking. Get in there, take your lumps, and learn on the job.
Amen brother.
After 3 years pf play, Aikman had thrown 31 TDs and 46 INTS.... most of guys on this board would have never let him play year 4 and have the career he had.
After 3 years pf play, Aikman had thrown 31 TDs and 46 INTS.... most of guys on this board would have never let him play year 4 and have the career he had.
Hey! Look at the straw man over there!
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Aikman's career TD/INT ratio is lower than DA's is now, and that's after years of improving play.
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And Aikman was a first round draft choice and given a Manning level amount of time to develop.
If he were a 6th round draft choice and a first round draft choice was on the bench, then he would have been yanked halfway though year #2.
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And Aikman was a first round draft choice and given a Manning level amount of time to develop.
If he were a 6th round draft choice and a first round draft choice was on the bench, then he would have been yanked halfway though year #2.
And Aikman was a first round draft choice and given a Manning level amount of time to develop.
If he were a 6th round draft choice and a first round draft choice was on the bench, then he would have been yanked halfway though year #2.
Guys, stop attacking the Straw Man. D&S doesn't have a leg to stand re:Derek-bear's performance, so he's going to pull the old switcheroo and try and deflect the convo.
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And Aikman was a first round draft choice and given a Manning level amount of time to develop.
If he were a 6th round draft choice and a first round draft choice was on the bench, then he would have been yanked halfway though year #2.
Guys, stop attacking the Straw Man. D&S doesn't have a leg to stand re:Derek-bear's performance, so he's going to pull the old switcheroo and try and deflect the convo.
Guys, stop attacking the Straw Man. D&S doesn't have a leg to stand re:Derek-bear's performance, so he's going to pull the old switcheroo and try and deflect the convo.
DA's performance was just plain not that bad. There are guys here drooling over first rounders and saying they should be given time, years if necessary, to improve to DA's level or beyond of play. He's had some poor games, and some very good games, but he's been the most successful QB the Browns have had in years. Apparently if he'd been drafted 140 picks earlier none of this supposed controversy would exist.
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You partially answered your own question...mangini wants to trade quinn obviously even for a second rounder which i find unacceptable and then there is the quinn smear campaign thats being waged against him originating from an unknown source likely mangini himself...mangini wasnt high on quinn as the jets coach and obviously still isnt..
I guess those 3 games bq started in were not real because he most certainly looked like a real nfl qb to me especially for his first starts..im really starting to question mangini's reasoning and motives on this issue..its unlikely any qb we get from the draft will measure up to quinn with sanchez having the best chance to be as good but its a gamble..and im going to be pissed if mangina starts DA or brings in a crappy vet...
Im on the verge of giving up on this club permanently as far as ever winning again its to early to tell but mankok may be a bigger bust then savage/crennel from a different prospective..savage wanted an exciting team mankok appears to want a drab vanilla and losing team with his own questionable leftover jets talent applied from the get go..
Right now we have to give them the benifit of doubt but doubt is quickly becoming the word as in i have no confidence at this point that mankok can build us a winner..i dont care for their choices in FA and predict i will feel the same throughout the draft and into the season..but who knows i could be way wrong its just a hunch..
Wake up dude and stop believeing everything you read from MaryKay Grossi. Mangini told the media todya the he expects Anderson and Quinn to be competing for the starting QB job when camp opens. He has said he isn't trying to trade Quinn. He told Quinn he isn't trying to trade him and that comes from Quinn himself so why do you believe these media hacks over the HC.
Wake up dude and stop believeing everything you read from MaryKay Grossi. Mangini told the media todya the he expects Anderson and Quinn to be competing for the starting QB job when camp opens. He has said he isn't trying to trade Quinn. He told Quinn he isn't trying to trade him and that comes from Quinn himself so why do you believe these media hacks over the HC.
Would you supply a link or explain how you came by this inside info.
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Wake up dude and stop believeing everything you read from MaryKay Grossi. Mangini told the media todya the he expects Anderson and Quinn to be competing for the starting QB job when camp opens. He has said he isn't trying to trade Quinn. He told Quinn he isn't trying to trade him and that comes from Quinn himself so why do you believe these media hacks over the HC.
Would you supply a link or explain how you came by this inside info.
Would you supply a link or explain how you came by this inside info.
Mangini released a statement through the team PR guys and he told Quinn that and Quinn told it to the media. I'm not searching for links. You believe it or not. But his initials are Zac Jackson.
BTW, my son works for a local ESPN radio affiliate and also writes some and does source verification for Scouts.com. They usually check out their rumors before they print a story, unlike MaryKay Grossi.
Some of the OBR articles are just writers opinions but those are what they are, but when Fred Greetham puts something out, he has checked the sources and there are some facts behind it.
I'm not saying you have to believe anything, take it for what it's worth.
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Guys, stop attacking the Straw Man. D&S doesn't have a leg to stand re:Derek-bear's performance, so he's going to pull the old switcheroo and try and deflect the convo.
DA's performance was just plain not that bad. There are guys here drooling over first rounders and saying they should be given time, years if necessary, to improve to DA's level or beyond of play. He's had some poor games, and some very good games, but he's been the most successful QB the Browns have had in years. Apparently if he'd been drafted 140 picks earlier none of this supposed controversy would exist.
DA's performance was just plain not that bad. There are guys here drooling over first rounders and saying they should be given time, years if necessary, to improve to DA's level or beyond of play. He's had some poor games, and some very good games, but he's been the most successful QB the Browns have had in years. Apparently if he'd been drafted 140 picks earlier none of this supposed controversy would exist.
Let's see...ummm..yeah. 1st rounders usually GET years because you are PAYING them for years regardless. That's what sucks about it. You're essentially held hostage hoping a guy will improve (see Michael Vick). If Aikman had been a 6th rounder, he wouldn't have made it past year 1 before he would have been replaced.
The difference here is that OUR first rounder has never had the chance to show that he sucks. He's been in the league for 2 years, but the opportunity to start wasn't granted until the team was in complete chaos. It's pretty damn similar to the Rodgers situation, except Favre was still playing at a high level.
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DA's performance was just plain not that bad. There are guys here drooling over first rounders and saying they should be given time, years if necessary, to improve to DA's level or beyond of play. He's had some poor games, and some very good games, but he's been the most successful QB the Browns have had in years. Apparently if he'd been drafted 140 picks earlier none of this supposed controversy would exist.
Let's see...ummm..yeah. 1st rounders usually GET years because you are PAYING them for years regardless. That's what sucks about it. You're essentially held hostage hoping a guy will improve (see Michael Vick). If Aikman had been a 6th rounder, he wouldn't have made it past year 1 before he would have been replaced.
The difference here is that OUR first rounder has never had the chance to show that he sucks. He's been in the league for 2 years, but the opportunity to start wasn't granted until the team was in complete chaos. It's pretty damn similar to the Rodgers situation, except Favre was still playing at a high level.
The difference here is that OUR first rounder has never had the chance to show that he sucks.
plus the 6th rounder now makes more money than the 1st rounder, so the tables are turned in that regard.
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Guys, stop attacking the Straw Man. D&S doesn't have a leg to stand re:Derek-bear's performance, so he's going to pull the old switcheroo and try and deflect the convo.
DA's performance was just plain not that bad. There are guys here drooling over first rounders and saying they should be given time, years if necessary, to improve to DA's level or beyond of play. He's had some poor games, and some very good games, but he's been the most successful QB the Browns have had in years. Apparently if he'd been drafted 140 picks earlier none of this supposed controversy would exist.
DA's performance was just plain not that bad. There are guys here drooling over first rounders and saying they should be given time, years if necessary, to improve to DA's level or beyond of play. He's had some poor games, and some very good games, but he's been the most successful QB the Browns have had in years. Apparently if he'd been drafted 140 picks earlier none of this supposed controversy would exist.
It's not about DA's draft position, D&S, it's about Quinn's.
Like it or not, a first round pick was used to draft Quinn and an organization cannot afford to waste those picks on players who never even see the field. Having a guy bust is one thing, having him never play for no good reason is another entirely.
And a first round QB with Quinn's pedigree certainly should not be kept off the field for "just plain not that bad". A first round pick is selected to PLAY, and ideally to improve the team. What you and Lum fail to realize is that DA is NOT improving the team with his "not that bad" play, and therefore he's gotta go.
Finally, if it takes Quinn -- or any other player, for that matter -- to "improve" to DA's level of "just plain not that bad", then we will never get past being "just plain not that bad" as a franchise.
Not exactly the heights I'm shooting for.
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DA's performance was just plain not that bad. There are guys here drooling over first rounders and saying they should be given time, years if necessary, to improve to DA's level or beyond of play. He's had some poor games, and some very good games, but he's been the most successful QB the Browns have had in years. Apparently if he'd been drafted 140 picks earlier none of this supposed controversy would exist.
It's not about DA's draft position, D&S, it's about Quinn's.
Like it or not, a first round pick was used to draft Quinn and an organization cannot afford to waste those picks on players who never even see the field. Having a guy bust is one thing, having him never play for no good reason is another entirely.
And a first round QB with Quinn's pedigree certainly should not be kept off the field for "just plain not that bad". A first round pick is selected to PLAY, and ideally to improve the team. What you and Lum fail to realize is that DA is NOT improving the team with his "not that bad" play, and therefore he's gotta go.
Finally, if it takes Quinn -- or any other player, for that matter -- to "improve" to DA's level of "just plain not that bad", then we will never get past being "just plain not that bad" as a franchise.
Not exactly the heights I'm shooting for.
It's not about DA's draft position, D&S, it's about Quinn's.
Like it or not, a first round pick was used to draft Quinn and an organization cannot afford to waste those picks on players who never even see the field. Having a guy bust is one thing, having him never play for no good reason is another entirely.
And a first round QB with Quinn's pedigree certainly should not be kept off the field for "just plain not that bad". A first round pick is selected to PLAY, and ideally to improve the team. What you and Lum fail to realize is that DA is NOT improving the team with his "not that bad" play, and therefore he's gotta go.
Finally, if it takes Quinn -- or any other player, for that matter -- to "improve" to DA's level of "just plain not that bad", then we will never get past being "just plain not that bad" as a franchise.
Not exactly the heights I'm shooting for.
That's all nice and dandy, but what if after you get the first rounder in, you realize your 6th rounder is playing at a higher level and you want to win now? Do you play the first rounder because he's a first rounder, or do you play the guy you genuinely think gives you the best chance to win???
So many people here seem to think this scenario hasn't existed... well folks, either it did, or the last coaching and management staff was just screwing with you personally even though their careers would be jeopardized.
It'll be interesting to see what the new group does.
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@inspecta said:
Lumnuts, as much as you are despised here, I have to admit, you usually make me laugh at least once a day.Great argument there corky, DA makes more money, so that must be proof he should be the starter.
Tell me again, where is the guy who gave him this contract?
Oh yeah, he's in the soup line asking for 2nds....
LOL@ you asshat....
If you'd have actually paid attention: In "Lumnuts/corky" defense (believe me, I've no intention of defending him specifically), he was responding to lemosley01 who said "1st rounders usually GET years because you are PAYING them for years regardless.". Lumbergh obviously made the mistake of not including that quote. You can ignore that and pretend he was responding to air if you want, but it wouldn't be accurate.
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You are right, the people that started DA are out of work. Where are the people that drafted BQ? Oh, the same people that are out of work. Does not really matter but I thought I would just point that out when people mention that the people that started DA got fired.
Not talking about this board really, but I have seen lots of people responding to news articles and on other sites saying that if the Browns trade BQ then they are done with the Browns. That is not from a only here to support DA guy like Lum but from people that claim to be real Browns fans. It may not be the party line here but it sounds like the vocal minority really are more BQ fans than Browns fans on other sites and news article responses.
And I don't get it. What has BQ done to garner such support? He was the 22nd pick in the first round or something close, not the number one pick or even top 10. How does that mean that he should get his chance on the field? It means he is on the team and should compete for his chance on the field.
It is a new regime and you should be able to throw away all descriminations that rac had against BQ and have a true open competition. If everybody on this board is right then DA will fold to the pressure and BQ will rise above it all and show the "it" factor.
It is not me that has said BQ is a leader and DA is not. If that is true then who cares if it is a open competition for the job, because BQ will win it easily, he rises to the occasion and DA folds. If you talk pedigree, BQ has won all the big games he has played and DA hasn't. I mean look at thier bowl record, look at thier record against USC and look at thier head to head record. I mean it all points to BQs pedigree being unquestioned.
I mean forget where the QB is drafted, let them prove it on the field. If DA is traded let the backup challenge BQ for the job and if BQ is traded let the backup challenge DA. It does not matter who we think is better, it really only matters who the coaches think gives them the best shot to compete now and in the future. Niether QB is this regimes guy. The regime that brought in these two QBs are out of work, not just started DA but the ones that drafted BQ also.
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You are right, the people that started DA are out of work. Where are the people that drafted BQ? Oh, the same people that are out of work. Does not really matter but I thought I would just point that out when people mention that the people that started DA got fired.
Not talking about this board really, but I have seen lots of people responding to news articles and on other sites saying that if the Browns trade BQ then they are done with the Browns. That is not from a only here to support DA guy like Lum but from people that claim to be real Browns fans. It may not be the party line here but it sounds like the vocal minority really are more BQ fans than Browns fans on other sites and news article responses.
And I don't get it. What has BQ done to garner such support? He was the 22nd pick in the first round or something close, not the number one pick or even top 10. How does that mean that he should get his chance on the field? It means he is on the team and should compete for his chance on the field.
It is a new regime and you should be able to throw away all descriminations that rac had against BQ and have a true open competition. If everybody on this board is right then DA will fold to the pressure and BQ will rise above it all and show the "it" factor.
It is not me that has said BQ is a leader and DA is not. If that is true then who cares if it is a open competition for the job, because BQ will win it easily, he rises to the occasion and DA folds. If you talk pedigree, BQ has won all the big games he has played and DA hasn't. I mean look at thier bowl record, look at thier record against USC and look at thier head to head record. I mean it all points to BQs pedigree being unquestioned.
I mean forget where the QB is drafted, let them prove it on the field. If DA is traded let the backup challenge BQ for the job and if BQ is traded let the backup challenge DA. It does not matter who we think is better, it really only matters who the coaches think gives them the best shot to compete now and in the future. Niether QB is this regimes guy. The regime that brought in these two QBs are out of work, not just started DA but the ones that drafted BQ also.
You are right, the people that started DA are out of work. Where are the people that drafted BQ? Oh, the same people that are out of work...
...because they didn't start BQ, some would argue, not because they drafted him.
And its a QB competition, but no where does it say its going to be fair. Most reports say BQ has the upper hand. But, I agree if BQ can't beat out DA, then tough.
Right now, this is all posturing to keep both of our QB's value as high as possible. If it works, then we'll all have helped Mangini's methods with our chatter - which is OK.
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You are right, the people that started DA are out of work. Where are the people that drafted BQ? Oh, the same people that are out of work. Does not really matter but I thought I would just point that out when people mention that the people that started DA got fired.
Not talking about this board really, but I have seen lots of people responding to news articles and on other sites saying that if the Browns trade BQ then they are done with the Browns. That is not from a only here to support DA guy like Lum but from people that claim to be real Browns fans. It may not be the party line here but it sounds like the vocal minority really are more BQ fans than Browns fans on other sites and news article responses.
And I don't get it. What has BQ done to garner such support? He was the 22nd pick in the first round or something close, not the number one pick or even top 10. How does that mean that he should get his chance on the field? It means he is on the team and should compete for his chance on the field.
It is a new regime and you should be able to throw away all descriminations that rac had against BQ and have a true open competition. If everybody on this board is right then DA will fold to the pressure and BQ will rise above it all and show the "it" factor.
It is not me that has said BQ is a leader and DA is not. If that is true then who cares if it is a open competition for the job, because BQ will win it easily, he rises to the occasion and DA folds. If you talk pedigree, BQ has won all the big games he has played and DA hasn't. I mean look at thier bowl record, look at thier record against USC and look at thier head to head record. I mean it all points to BQs pedigree being unquestioned.
I mean forget where the QB is drafted, let them prove it on the field. If DA is traded let the backup challenge BQ for the job and if BQ is traded let the backup challenge DA. It does not matter who we think is better, it really only matters who the coaches think gives them the best shot to compete now and in the future. Niether QB is this regimes guy. The regime that brought in these two QBs are out of work, not just started DA but the ones that drafted BQ also.
If you talk pedigree, BQ has won all the big games he has played and DA hasn't. I mean look at thier bowl record, look at thier record against USC and look at thier head to head record. I mean it all points to BQs pedigree being unquestioned.
Is this sarcasm?
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@inspecta said:
Lerner more than savage was the driving force behind drafting Quinn so that argument does not hold water. Also as far as people saying they are done with the Browns if we trade Quinn, I wouldn't give that too much credence, as I have said I don't know how many times in the past that if the Browns do X then I'm done with them. As you can see I'm still here.The people who want Quinn to have a shot are nothing like lumnuts, they are actual fans of the Browns and will stick with the team no matter who the QB is.
I agree. Football is supposed to be fun for the fans and players. To hope and be optimistic is the only way to get through the bad times. Football is a multi-billion dollar industry and you have hope that the right decisions are being made by the professionals.
QB is just part of the product.
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