Get ready to have your mind blown...

Tour2ma

@tiamat63 said:
What I saw of King last night I liked. He looks like one of those compact, hard hitting corners. First player that came to mind in comparison was Hargreves (spell check) from Tampa.

As you've probably read... I agree. There is, however, a little "me me me" alarm that King manages to set off when I watch him.. at least this year. I don't remember that in past years.

Not necessarily a disqualifier, but is an alarm.

wargograw

My guess is you'll see that in a lot of corners. PFF loves them some King.

Clevfan4life

ok so has PFF officially now jumped the shark for you guys? Like seriously announcers laugh during the replays of our preposterous attempts at tackling the ballcarrier. But don't worry guys, PFF has us rated as decent tacklers..it's all a mirage. OMFG i hate PFF. Seriously how any of you take those clowns seriously anymore. We know what we're seeing every sunday. Trust your eyes. Trust the reality of the outcomes so far. We're going 0-16 and our QB's are getting mauled as hard as tehy ever have. PFF is trolling the Cleveland fanbase hard. Paz the #1 RT in football...omfg someone needs beaten. Holy fuck. Hey look that RT got a hand on his edge rusher that time...he's really good. Totally the QB's fault for holding the ball .8 seconds can't put that on the OL.

Tour2ma

Lighten up Francis...

PFF rates us middling at tackling only compared to the league...

And Paz was playing better... especially run blocking and handling pure speed rushes in PassPro. BLT exposed his susceptibility to the inside move. We'll see if that continues.

D Bone

Not a PFF fan myself.

tiamat63

@d-bone said:
Not a PFF fan myself.

Their ratings have to be taken into context like everything else. There is no definitive 'stat' that makes any one player good at their position.

D Bone

@tiamat63 said:

Their ratings have to be taken into context like everything else. There is no definitive 'stat' that makes any one player good at their position.

I'll take the win column for 16 Alex.

gftChris

@tour2ma said:

Lighten up Francis...

PFF rates us middling at tackling only compared to the league...

And Paz was playing better... especially run blocking and handling pure speed rushes in PassPro. BLT exposed his susceptibility to the inside move. We'll see if that continues.

I went through the first half of our drives, focusing almost exclusively on the OL (and seeing what happened to corey coleman), and basically the conclusion is, the other four guys on the line will get beat here and there but generally hold their own, while Cam is consistently turning around, giving the 'look out block' and then is the first to help Crow or whoever to his feet.

There was one play, I forget which, where there's a DT lined up in the A gap to Cam's right; he snaps the ball, and lunges to the defender; defender's first step is sideways away from Cam, and he goes unabated to the backfield; meanwhile, Cam is literally sprawled out on the floor. I'll see if I can find the play later.

As for other things - Kessler doesn't seem to be taking what's there at this point, as if he's wanting other things to develop. One play, a first and ten, and he has the receiver open for maybe a seven yard yard. Throw, catch, pick up the yards, put yourself in manageable position of 2nd-and-3. Instead, he waits to see what happens downfield, the receiver gets covered, so he rolls out to his right (wrong way), and forces it to Telfer or someone, behind the LoS, who is then dropped for a three yard loss.

Another time (could even be the same play) the lines parts like the red sea in front of him. He could have picked up five yards before the nearest defender gets close, and instead he bails out round the back of the pocket and we lose yardage again.

On Coleman, it seems like he's getting open, but the throw just isn't being made, or he isn't being led to gain extra yards. His first catch was so high (and slightly late) he had to go up and high point it, despite it just being a seven yard comeback/hitch. If it's in his belly, he can get the ball with half a step more, maybe make the defender miss and pick up chunk yardage.

gftChris

Found it, Q1, 5:32 to play. Crowell for -2 yards. Here:

PreSnap

First step/lunge

Second step/fall over

Cam's guy gets the tackle

For those wondering, #78 is Michael Pierce, a UDFA out of Samford (not Stanford).

Suggs is coming around the edge unblocked but by the time the tackle is made, Crow is ahead of him, as Suggs is apparently designated to cover Hogan on the read option.

Another day, another Erving whiff.

TexasAg1969

@d-bone said:

I'll take the win column for 16 Alex.

Kudos. LOL!

The Gipper

A tab of acid would help with this mind blow.

Tour2ma

@gftchris said:

Found it, Q1, 5:32 to play. Crowell for -2 yards. Here:

Cam's guy gets the tackle. Another day, another Erving whiff.

Nice... and love the "spoiler" unveiling...

The frame above says it all. Brings the old, Sesame Street bit to mind: "One of these things is not like the others".

Feet together... bent waist... head down... apparently groping for power contact he will never find while the rest of the line seems to be forming a ZBS conga line where every OL needs to at least chip his opposite to set up his compadre' coming from their left.

There are other failures to point out as well in this and other stills, e.g., Greco gets stacked by #90, but Cam's is the most egregious fail.

I would like to point out how much further Joe T has moved to his assignment. His "get off the ball" is so exceptional... compare it to the TE... and the Center. At least the TE has the excuse of distance from the ball...

The Gipper

@tour2ma said:

Nice... and love the "spoiler" unveiling...

The frame above says it all. Brings the old, Sesame Street bit to mind: "One of these things is not like the others".

Feet together... bent waist... head down... apparently groping for power contact he will never find while the rest of the line seems to be forming a ZBS conga line where every OL needs to at least chip his opposite to set up his compadre' coming from their left.

There are other failures to point out as well in this and other stills, e.g., Greco gets stacked by #90, but Cam's is the most egregious fail.

I would like to point out how much further Joe T has moved to his assignment. His "get off the ball" is so exceptional... compare it to the TE... and the Center. At least the TE has the excuse of distance from the ball...

That is how he hurt himself.....he tried to plow head down, head first to make a block. The defender simply stepped aside and allowed Erving's own momemtum to power dive himself, head first into the dirt.

Is this not something that can be coached out of him....or is he hopelessly useless?

Tour2ma

Can it? Sure... any bad habit can be coached out of a player given enough time and reps.

Will it? Doubtful... the CBA-limited-practice-time NFL is just not structured for remedial education. But why should it be? You can't get more basic than "see what you hit".

Does it matter/ would it do any good? I don't think so. Cam reacts so slowly... and you can't coach reaction time.

gftChris

I'm not sure if it's mental or physical reaction time, probably both, buy he seemed to do OK when he had one guy straight up, with some space between them. When someone lined up over him, less so. When there were stunts, less so.

Tour2ma

I honestly think it's both, Chris... although his lack of agility could be masquerading as physical reaction time.

His mental reaction lag is demonstrated by delays in even turning his head in recognition to DL stunts to him or away from him.

flyingfooldoug

@tiamat63 said:

Their ratings have to be taken into context like everything else. There is no definitive 'stat' that makes any one player good at their position.

Agreed! And that is exactly why I am so skeptical/cynical about the whole plan

gftChris

@tour2ma said:

I honestly think it's both, Chris... although his lack of agility could be masquerading as physical reaction time.

His mental reaction lag is demonstrated by delays in even turning his head in recognition to DL stunts to him or away from him.

Obviously you know more than I do on the topic, but from my untrained eye, he seems slow to react physically, slow to process mentally, and makes bad decisions once he has processed. When engaged he seems OK, apart from when being outright bull-rushed by a big guy (Geno Atkins etc). Once he has processed the information, any new information doesn't seem to get in, so late blitzers don't get picked up, people running across his face don't get picked up.

TexasAg1969

@gftchris said:
Obviously you know more than I do on the topic, but from my untrained eye, he seems slow to react physically, slow to process mentally, and makes bad decisions once he has processed. When engaged he seems OK, apart from when being outright bull-rushed by a big guy (Geno Atkins etc). Once he has processed the information, any new information doesn't seem to get in, so late blitzers don't get picked up, people running across his face don't get picked up.

I still can't see anything that most of the draft sites were seeing in him to make him a 1st rounder. They all seemed to have whiffed just as badly as he does every week. It's either that or we have the poorest OL coach in all the NFL. Or maybe both.

gumby73

It's just seems like Hue can pull the plug on his guy Kessler, but until the 9'er can stretch our lead to 2 games for the #1 pick, the 2015 draft talent evaluations will continue. Durango needs to stay beside JT(mentor) & we paid Bailey/Cooper so evaluate them at RG & keep Paz at RT to determine his worth..Greco at C calling line schemes gives Huejax best chance to win. but go 49'ers?