Has the Browns inability to win over 2 decades cause you to lose interest?
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By the way, congratulations on spelling 'lose' correctly, unlike most young dummies spelling it 'loose'.
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Anyone who would respond that way would be an idiot. We are all hurting. I loved reading this thread. Such as D Bone, I too subscribed to the 'Browns News Illustrated' back in the 80's. I moved away to Detroit back in 85' at the age of about 18, and we didn't have the Internet, didn't have NFL Network. You had 3 main channels and with Detroit being an NFC team, I rarely got to see the Browns. My car radio received the best reception on Game Days and I would drive around for four hours listening to the games. Most times I would end up in Toledo by games end, I suppose I should have just drove to Cleveland (although practically did every weekend anyhow, except had to work in Detroit early on Monday mornings). I would receive that Browns News Illustrated Newspaper in the mail and go straight to the shitter and read it cover-to-cover. Funny, without the existence of the Internet I still knew EVERY player on the roster and the entire depth chart, I assume from that rag magazine.
I orchestrated the move of our family business back to Cleveland in 96' most certainly mainly for the Browns ... should have saw the writing on the wall right then and there, as they announced they were moving to Baltimore shortly after I settled in here.
I took to these forums at that time as the Internet was just taking hold. We hand typed most all local articles on the Browns to out-of-town Browns fans who weren't privy to what was going on with the expansion or relocation of an existing team (Note: News wasn't readily available at those early days of the internet). We debated the owners race, and dissected the hell out of the 1999 Draft awaiting our Browns to take the field once again.
Met a lot of great people on these forums that I called friends. we were celebrating on the North Shore on Game Days without a care in the World ... then the losing continued, the NFL got worse and worse as a whole. The Browns continued to disappoint like Groundhog day and nothing we could do could fix the next day from being like the last. Years turned into a decade, a decade into another ... friends dwindled, camaraderies lost ... this don't feel like that team I fell in love with. I miss games sometimes ... no, I'm talking I miss games ... as in I catch up on work and crap or go on weekend vacations without missing seeing the brown and orange play.
Not sure when the bottom will totally give out ... or has it?
Browns News Illustrated, thought I was the only one that subscribed. Long time Browns fans are suffocating.
Browns News Illustrated, thought I was the only one that subscribed. Long time Browns fans are suffocating.
For those who don't know what we are talking about, the Browns use to have their own Newspaper subscriptions. Cover-to-cover Browns news and great insight interviews.
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Worth a read...
"There was enough bad on Sunday to reach across the building in Berea, from the coaching staff to the front office. Scheme, roster construction, everything led to one of the most embarrassing losses this team has suffered in a two-year span that has been full of them.
There has to come a point where progress is no longer an abstract. It's not an unfair expectation to want tangible evidence that this plan will work. No one is demanding a 10-2 run to finish the season and fight for the playoffs. Most reasonable people looked at this team and saw four to five wins at best."
Worth a read...
"There was enough bad on Sunday to reach across the building in Berea, from the coaching staff to the front office. Scheme, roster construction, everything led to one of the most embarrassing losses this team has suffered in a two-year span that has been full of them.
There has to come a point where progress is no longer an abstract. It's not an unfair expectation to want tangible evidence that this plan will work. No one is demanding a 10-2 run to finish the season and fight for the playoffs. Most reasonable people looked at this team and saw four to five wins at best."
Larry, my friend, let me ask you something. Before the pre-season, I posted that the 2017 team would be worse than the 2016. I was blasted for it, and even you told me that I didn't understand football. Those of you who thought I was trolling, insisted to me that a combination of the draft, a new OL, Hue, Williams, and our "accumulation of assets" had the team on the right track. You guys insisted I was off base.
But now, you quote an "expert" who can be quoted as saying "The 2017 team is worse than the 2016 version".
Now, if we are being completely honest, it is people like you, Zomblow and Flugel who are the true trolls, because, and I say this with respect to you as my friend, you have stubbornly gone on and on and one, clench-fisted INSISTING that this fauking team is building for the future. In addition, now you are saying the very exact things I said 24 weeks ago.
Now, is my message bitter? Yeah, it is. But is it over the top and off base? No Larry, it isn't. None of the Sheet I have been posting here looms ridiculous, and in fact, the place is a ghost town because many here can't bear to come in after only 4 weeks and say, "schidt" Ghoolie was right about all this crap.
So, for the past 24 weeks, I am the troll, but now, with everyone echoing what I have been saying all along.....this talk is NOW, the expert talk?
Sorry man............I fortold all this schidt all along. Before anyone. And I am telling you................. mark it here and follow it back......................
Myles Garrett is garbage. He is physically weak, and he is mentally weaker. Admitting he doesn't play hard every down, asking Jones to make him a Cowboy? THIS is what you think is going to provide leadership, role modeling and fire to the Browns?
Larry, you need to have a few drinks and go watch some Sipe era Browns films. Really my brother, you have honestly lost touch. You really have.
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I'm still a fan, just beat down. Yesterday was probably the most pissed off feeling I had in a long long time leaving the,stadium.
I love the fall & football season. I'm not sure if I want to renew my tickets next year.
I'm still a fan, just beat down. Yesterday was probably the most pissed off feeling I had in a long long time leaving the,stadium.
I love the fall & football season. I'm not sure if I want to renew my tickets next year.
I'm not even pissed anymore guess I have kinda gotten used to it kinda like a prisoned rape victim
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wow. I was fully expecting, "screw off, Soju! This board is for REAL fans! But, I AM a real fan. Just down trodden and left in despair. I'm sort of comforted in a way knowing that even BIGGER Browns fans are feeling like me.
Anyone who would respond that way would be an idiot. We are all hurting. I loved reading this thread. Such as D Bone, I too subscribed to the 'Browns News Illustrated' back in the 80's. I moved away to Detroit back in 85' at the age of about 18, and we didn't have the Internet, didn't have NFL Network. You had 3 main channels and with Detroit being an NFC team, I rarely got to see the Browns. My car radio received the best reception on Game Days and I would drive around for four hours listening to the games. Most times I would end up in Toledo by games end, I suppose I should have just drove to Cleveland (although practically did every weekend anyhow, except had to work in Detroit early on Monday mornings). I would receive that Browns News Illustrated Newspaper in the mail and go straight to the shitter and read it cover-to-cover. Funny, without the existence of the Internet I still knew EVERY player on the roster and the entire depth chart, I assume from that rag magazine.
I orchestrated the move of our family business back to Cleveland in 96' most certainly mainly for the Browns ... should have saw the writing on the wall right then and there, as they announced they were moving to Baltimore shortly after I settled in here.
I took to these forums at that time as the Internet was just taking hold. We hand typed most all local articles on the Browns to out-of-town Browns fans who weren't privy to what was going on with the expansion or relocation of an existing team (Note: News wasn't readily available at those early days of the internet). We debated the owners race, and dissected the hell out of the 1999 Draft awaiting our Browns to take the field once again.
Met a lot of great people on these forums that I called friends. we were celebrating on the North Shore on Game Days without a care in the World ... then the losing continued, the NFL got worse and worse as a whole. The Browns continued to disappoint like Groundhog day and nothing we could do could fix the next day from being like the last. Years turned into a decade, a decade into another ... friends dwindled, camaraderies lost ... this don't feel like that team I fell in love with. I miss games sometimes ... no, I'm talking I miss games ... as in I catch up on work and crap or go on weekend vacations without missing seeing the brown and orange play.
Not sure when the bottom will totally give out ... or has it?
Anyone who would respond that way would be an idiot. We are all hurting. I loved reading this thread. Such as D Bone, I too subscribed to the 'Browns News Illustrated' back in the 80's. I moved away to Detroit back in 85' at the age of about 18, and we didn't have the Internet, didn't have NFL Network. You had 3 main channels and with Detroit being an NFC team, I rarely got to see the Browns. My car radio received the best reception on Game Days and I would drive around for four hours listening to the games. Most times I would end up in Toledo by games end, I suppose I should have just drove to Cleveland (although practically did every weekend anyhow, except had to work in Detroit early on Monday mornings). I would receive that Browns News Illustrated Newspaper in the mail and go straight to the shitter and read it cover-to-cover. Funny, without the existence of the Internet I still knew EVERY player on the roster and the entire depth chart, I assume from that rag magazine.
I orchestrated the move of our family business back to Cleveland in 96' most certainly mainly for the Browns ... should have saw the writing on the wall right then and there, as they announced they were moving to Baltimore shortly after I settled in here.
I took to these forums at that time as the Internet was just taking hold. We hand typed most all local articles on the Browns to out-of-town Browns fans who weren't privy to what was going on with the expansion or relocation of an existing team (Note: News wasn't readily available at those early days of the internet). We debated the owners race, and dissected the hell out of the 1999 Draft awaiting our Browns to take the field once again.
Met a lot of great people on these forums that I called friends. we were celebrating on the North Shore on Game Days without a care in the World ... then the losing continued, the NFL got worse and worse as a whole. The Browns continued to disappoint like Groundhog day and nothing we could do could fix the next day from being like the last. Years turned into a decade, a decade into another ... friends dwindled, camaraderies lost ... this don't feel like that team I fell in love with. I miss games sometimes ... no, I'm talking I miss games ... as in I catch up on work and crap or go on weekend vacations without missing seeing the brown and orange play.
Not sure when the bottom will totally give out ... or has it?
Stan,
here is when the bottom will give out. In 12 months I will be living in N Vegas. Property, pool, all the comforts of having "fauhk you money"...............season tickets up front and close to the Las Vegas Raiders............................So when you come, you get to see the games. Will we ever have that kind of old time Browns passion? Of course not, it isn't just that team that is gone, the times have changed. You have butt clowns like Wargogay supporting the team now. Dude, there will never be a connection between fans like us, and these paper butt dildoes. FUN? That is the missing ingredient. The Las Vegas Raiders, surrounded by the wonders of the strip, scantily clad women and a 24/7 tailgate.....................we can have fun again.
Can you imagine the looks on the faces of Hoorta, Zomblow, Mike, and the other guys who went to that game? Do you think they had fun? Really? Outside of drinking, and shooting the breeze, what fun is a Browns game? As you joked to me, and as I pray for, the best thing that oculd happen for a real Browns fan............not these newbie Dikcheads, is for Haslam to sell the team, for it to be moved, and renamed.
The absolute best thing that could happen for a die hard fan, is for this franchise to be eliminated, to no longer exist. In honor of those times you refer to, I want this team to lose, suffer injuries, humiliation and financial ruin. Honestly, the fake Browns, version 2.0 needs to go. When I told you the new team should get it's own name, you thought I was nuts. But now, now look. Look at how horrible this is.
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As if being a Browns fan isn't depressing enough, ESPN is now running a segment chronicling Marty Schottenheimer now struggling with Alzheimer's.
Goddamn.
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Browns News Illustrated, thought I was the only one that subscribed. Long time Browns fans are suffocating.
For those who don't know what we are talking about, the Browns use to have their own Newspaper subscriptions. Cover-to-cover Browns news and great insight interviews.
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Browns News Illustrated, thought I was the only one that subscribed. Long time Browns fans are suffocating.
For those who don't know what we are talking about, the Browns use to have their own Newspaper subscriptions. Cover-to-cover Browns news and great insight interviews.
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This is the wrong place to ask that question. We are die-hards and what happens in here is not reflective of the real world.
The answer you seek however, is available to you; not in discussion, but in real tangible data. That is, if you are willing to face the reality. Here would be my response.
- Someone recently showed the distribution of team specific fans across the US. While expectedly regional, what stood out is that the Browns base is small. Shrinking? We don't know because we didn't have this data 5 or 10 years ago to compare. Also, looking at it in terms of total numbers is misleading because all teams have increased the population of their fans. However, this is a result of NFL growth and not team growth. What does stand out as a marker, is that in past years you would never find Steeler fans in downtown Cleveland. Today, this is the case.
- The popularity of NFL merchandise sales is another strong indicator. One might argue that fans are fickle and winning spurs sales. Partly, this is true, however, it is also true that there is a fixed component of merchandise sales that represents the overall health and strength of a brand. Here in the South, Memphis, Nashville, Birmingham, Little Rock,, even up to St. Louis, few stores, if any carry Browns merchandise. You can however still find merchandise of other shitty teams pretty easily. It isn't just winning that brings popularity, it is also having iconic stars who fans can relate to. For instance, there are a ton of NY Giants fans down here. Southerners make fun of NYC, but they love the Mannings. The Browns miss on both points, no team excitement, and not even one player who makes the headlines that the fans identify with. Joe Thomas jersey, anyone?
- Tradition has an expiration date. People here get mad at me for this, but there is just no market or popularity value in talking about the days of Otto and PB. Nobody outside of this board gives a Sheet, and if we are being honest, the only reason we even talk about that Sheet is because we have nothing else to hold on to.
So yes, the answer to your question is an emphatic yes. Viewership and interest in Browns football is diminished and growing more so. The stadium is emptying out earlier and earlier, it is becoming infested with more opposing fans, and as witnessed by what a ghost town this place is after game day, the force of decreasing Browns fan-ship is inevitable and sadly, perhaps now, unstoppable.
There will be no turnaround with this current group of execs. We are fast approaching the point where someone will have to be sacrificed. Inside the FO it is every man for himself. Hue will be the first head to fall because it give the guys upstairs another 18 months of job security. Fire Hue, name Williams as interim. Then there is no pressure to succeed, because we jst have an interim and the FO will get another chance to find the right guy. Unfortunately, the same jackoffs who have fucked up our draft are going to pick the new HC, so the chances of success with that can't be too good.
If you guys want to be self-smug about Cleveland will never lose the Browns, you go ahead and enjoy your bubble, but I am here to tell you, the unthinkable is not as unrealistic as you think. Haslam is not going to keep going like this. Browns fanship is decreasing, it may be that the only way to get an invigorated fan base is to move and rename the team.
Is there an NFL brand now that has less value than the Browns?
If you guys want to be self-smug about Cleveland will never lose the Browns, you go ahead and enjoy your bubble, but I am here to tell you, the unthinkable is not as unrealistic as you think. Haslam is not going to keep going like this. Browns fanship is decreasing, it may be that the only way to get an invigorated fan base is to move and rename the team.
Is there an NFL brand now that has less value than the Browns?
This is the scary part. The whole region, even nationally, fought so hard to get the team back. 22 years later tons of apathy, gimmicks like a free ticket to Cedar Point for attending.
Yeah, I worry about it, thought about it even 3 years ago when we got the annual Christmas beat down from the Squealers, with around 75% of the crowd wearing black and gold.
Things need to turn around. I would think Haslam has a pride factor, he doesn't want his team to suck....but, he's not from here. Probably somewhere in the back of his mind he thinks about pulling a Modell or Kroenke. That would totally suck for long time die-hards.
Karlis Missed -
25 years of season seats.....40 years as a die hard.....and the last 2 years have pushed me over the edge......I used to subscribe to, read, search for every Browns bit I could find....LIVED for Sundays....etc etc etc....
....anymore?....I barely give a Sheet.....and, in a lot of ways, I am just pissed and feel like the Browns have flipped us the bird......
Clearly.....winning isnt the top priority of this regime.....
25 years of season seats.....40 years as a die hard.....and the last 2 years have pushed me over the edge......I used to subscribe to, read, search for every Browns bit I could find....LIVED for Sundays....etc etc etc....
....anymore?....I barely give a Sheet.....and, in a lot of ways, I am just pissed and feel like the Browns have flipped us the bird......
Clearly.....winning isn't the top priority of this regime.....
Oh but it is Mud- we've just changed the time table for that happening. Like you calling them as I see 'em. Had faint hope before the season, but 0-4 and looking bad against the Bengals changed that. If we can't beat the Jets, yawn- time to crank up the draft threads. Sad.
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was reading earlier - Troy Aikman said he was 0-11 in his rookie year? well, Kizer has only played four games.
But I would still start Hogan vs the Jets.
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I've had many years to ponder why this team can be so bad for so long. We change the players constantly, the coaches every couple years, and even the owners. The team still looks about the same, no matter what. This defies logic, and has now put me in a state of mind, where I really don't give a crap anymore. I've gone from listening to the 1964 championship game on a 3 transistor radio, with an earphone, to this, in 53 years. I hate Sashi Brown, and Hue Jackson. I hate Paul Brown, because I've now I've become so demented, I'm pretty sure he put a permanent curse on the Browns when he died. This team has turned me into one crabby old bastard. I hope Haslam fires all their asses, and continues with the Groundhog Day process. Has there ever been another NFL coach with a 1 - 19 record to start? All you morons who call me a fair weather fan can go screw yourselves.
I've had many years to ponder why this team can be so bad for so long. We change the players constantly, the coaches every couple years, and even the owners. The team still looks about the same, no matter what. This defies logic, and has now put me in a state of mind, where I really don't give a crap anymore. I've gone from listening to the 1964 championship game on a 3 transistor radio, with an earphone, to this, in 53 years. I hate Sashi Brown, and Hue Jackson. I hate Paul Brown, because I've now I've become so demented, I'm pretty sure he put a permanent curse on the Browns when he died. This team has turned me into one crabby old bastard. I hope Haslam fires all their asses, and continues with the Groundhog Day process. Has there ever been another NFL coach with a 1 - 19 record to start? All you morons who call me a fair weather fan can go screw yourselves.
Chuck Noll came pretty close. 1969 Steelers won their first game that year, and did not win another game until week 4 in 1970; something like 17 or so straight weeks without a win, spanning two seasons. Ended up making it to the AFC championship game in '72. Not saying Hue is nearly as good a coach as Noll was in the early 70's, but weirder Sheet has happened, I suppose.
"That which can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence”. - Christopher Hitchens "The universe is under no obligation to make sense to you". - Neil deGrasse Tyson -
If you guys want to be self-smug about Cleveland will never lose the Browns, you go ahead and enjoy your bubble, but I am here to tell you, the unthinkable is not as unrealistic as you think. Haslam is not going to keep going like this. Browns fanship is decreasing, it may be that the only way to get an invigorated fan base is to move and rename the team.
Is there an NFL brand now that has less value than the Browns?
This is the scary part. The whole region, even nationally, fought so hard to get the team back. 22 years later tons of apathy, gimmicks like a free ticket to Cedar Point for attending.
Yeah, I worry about it, thought about it even 3 years ago when we got the annual Christmas beat down from the Squealers, with around 75% of the crowd wearing black and gold.
Things need to turn around. I would think Haslam has a pride factor, he doesn't want his team to suck....but, he's not from here. Probably somewhere in the back of his mind he thinks about pulling a Modell or Kroenke. That would totally suck for long time die-hards.
This is the scary part. The whole region, even nationally, fought so hard to get the team back. 22 years later tons of apathy, gimmicks like a free ticket to Cedar Point for attending.
Yeah, I worry about it, thought about it even 3 years ago when we got the annual Christmas beat down from the Squealers, with around 75% of the crowd wearing black and gold.
Things need to turn around. I would think Haslam has a pride factor, he doesn't want his team to suck....but, he's not from here. Probably somewhere in the back of his mind he thinks about pulling a Modell or Kroenke. That would totally suck for long time die-hards.
Bob, here are a few more thoughts. I am a simple man, like most folks here. I grew up in a steel town, went to college and everything I ave accomplished has been done, like probably most here, organically, as a plow horse. Knocking on one door at a time, pulling the plow, planting seeds and working like a dog. I never really inderstood wall street and the world of huge finance.
That is until I got married a second time. Through personal and professional contacts I have made through her, I have learned a lot. Hedge fun managers, VC groups and banks don't think like you and I do. hey are different animals. They don't grow things organically.........they don't pull the plow and plant seeds. Instead, they just buy all new farms, automated technology and look to modern day marketing to make sure their ventures fly.
Haslam, and really no multi millionaire is going to have interest in waiting, building, and trying to recapture the popularity and support that once was. This takes too long, and for these kinds of people, time really is money. They are more likely to drop $500 million to start a new shiny venture, than they are to spend $25 million to try in repair something that there is no guarantee can be fixed.
Based on a shrinking brand, shrinking fan support, and accordingly a shrinking market price; based on apathy, losing and ridicule, if this trend continues, Haslam will get out. But rest assured, the new guy who spends $1.2 billion? He is going to want a shiny new start, and if Cleveland is not a ragingly successful and vibrant market, Cleveland will again see the team moved. When that happens, and it will, Cleveland will not again be an NFL city.
The Cleveland Browns have the hardest hit players in the NFL -
I've had many years to ponder why this team can be so bad for so long. We change the players constantly, the coaches every couple years, and even the owners. The team still looks about the same, no matter what. This defies logic, and has now put me in a state of mind, where I really don't give a crap anymore. I've gone from listening to the 1964 championship game on a 3 transistor radio, with an earphone, to this, in 53 years. I hate Sashi Brown, and Hue Jackson. I hate Paul Brown, because I've now I've become so demented, I'm pretty sure he put a permanent curse on the Browns when he died. This team has turned me into one crabby old bastard. I hope Haslam fires all their asses, and continues with the Groundhog Day process. Has there ever been another NFL coach with a 1 - 19 record to start? All you morons who call me a fair weather fan can go screw yourselves.
Chuck Noll came pretty close. 1969 Steelers won their first game that year, and did not win another game until week 4 in 1970; something like 17 or so straight weeks without a win, spanning two seasons. Ended up making it to the AFC championship game in '72. Not saying Hue is nearly as good a coach as Noll was in the early 70's, but weirder Sheet has happened, I suppose.
Chuck Noll came pretty close. 1969 Steelers won their first game that year, and did not win another game until week 4 in 1970; something like 17 or so straight weeks without a win, spanning two seasons. Ended up making it to the AFC championship game in '72. Not saying Hue is nearly as good a coach as Noll was in the early 70's, but weirder Sheet has happened, I suppose.
Not an accurate picture of Noll. Prior to his arrival, the Steelers were a losing team. His record for his first 4 years was 1 - 13, 5 - 9 , 6-8, 11-3. He also got rid of the entire team and started from scratch. Do you think Hue is going to go from 1 win to 5 wins by game 14? Hue is the worst HC in the league and also the worst to ever coach the Browns.
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Chuck Noll came pretty close. 1969 Steelers won their first game that year, and did not win another game until week 4 in 1970; something like 17 or so straight weeks without a win, spanning two seasons. Ended up making it to the AFC championship game in '72. Not saying Hue is nearly as good a coach as Noll was in the early 70's, but weirder Sheet has happened, I suppose.
Not an accurate picture of Noll. Prior to his arrival, the Steelers were a losing team. His record for his first 4 years was 1 - 13, 5 - 9 , 6-8, 11-3. He also got rid of the entire team and started from scratch. Do you think Hue is going to go from 1 win to 5 wins by game 14? Hue is the worst HC in the league and also the worst to ever coach the Browns.
Not an accurate picture of Noll. Prior to his arrival, the Steelers were a losing team. His record for his first 4 years was 1 - 13, 5 - 9 , 6-8, 11-3. He also got rid of the entire team and started from scratch...
True, but couldn't you make the argument that the Browns are in a similar situation to the '69 Steelers? In theory, the Browns are executing the beginning steps to begin turning this franchise around:
- Replacing some aging vets, whose skills were beginning to diminish, with younger players to clear up cap space
- Trading others away to accumulate draft capital with which to rebuild.
These moves are the smart way to rebuild and maintain a successful franchise. The Browns' problem is that they take the resources from these steps and bungle it up. One of my biggest critiques of this team - and one of yours, I believe, is that the Browns consistently fail to acquire playmakers in the skill positions that they badly need. Our biggest deficit right now is WR, imo. Withoutt a potent downfield threat, opposing D's stack the box and lock down our running game. Good WR's could also help mediate the growing pains that Kizer or whatever rookie QB we may/may not start in the future.
...Do you think Hue is going to go from 1 win to 5 wins by game 14? Hue is the worst HC in the league and also the worst to ever coach the Browns.
He's for sure not a top tier coach in the league of Billy B in NE, but he's for sure not the worst HC we've had; that honor belongs to RAC or Pat Schur-loss.
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Lose interest...lol, what a joke. Here in beautiful northeast Ohio, there seems to be little or no interest in the Browns anymore. I have seen zero homes with Browns gear displayed. Very few people wear the shirts and the ones you see are like ancient, you know...number 19 jerseys. On TV and radio they are only covered minimally. They've lost the locals. We know they're a joke. But we follow the home team and hope. But that's all they get from the hometown.. Hope! We got a real wish sandwich going ...plenty of $read but no meat to spend it on. Dear Jimmah, go jump in lake Erie and stay there..... Please!
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This is the scary part. The whole region, even nationally, fought so hard to get the team back. 22 years later tons of apathy, gimmicks like a free ticket to Cedar Point for attending.
Yeah, I worry about it, thought about it even 3 years ago when we got the annual Christmas beat down from the Squealers, with around 75% of the crowd wearing black and gold.
Things need to turn around. I would think Haslam has a pride factor, he doesn't want his team to suck....but, he's not from here. Probably somewhere in the back of his mind he thinks about pulling a Modell or Kroenke. That would totally suck for long time die-hards.
Bob, here are a few more thoughts. I am a simple man, like most folks here. I grew up in a steel town, went to college and everything I ave accomplished has been done, like probably most here, organically, as a plow horse. Knocking on one door at a time, pulling the plow, planting seeds and working like a dog. I never really inderstood wall street and the world of huge finance.
That is until I got married a second time. Through personal and professional contacts I have made through her, I have learned a lot. Hedge fun managers, VC groups and banks don't think like you and I do. hey are different animals. They don't grow things organically.........they don't pull the plow and plant seeds. Instead, they just buy all new farms, automated technology and look to modern day marketing to make sure their ventures fly.
Haslam, and really no multi millionaire is going to have interest in waiting, building, and trying to recapture the popularity and support that once was. This takes too long, and for these kinds of people, time really is money. They are more likely to drop $500 million to start a new shiny venture, than they are to spend $25 million to try in repair something that there is no guarantee can be fixed.
Based on a shrinking brand, shrinking fan support, and accordingly a shrinking market price; based on apathy, losing and ridicule, if this trend continues, Haslam will get out. But rest assured, the new guy who spends $1.2 billion? He is going to want a shiny new start, and if Cleveland is not a ragingly successful and vibrant market, Cleveland will again see the team moved. When that happens, and it will, Cleveland will not again be an NFL city.
Haslam, and really no multi millionaire is going to have interest in waiting, building, and trying to recapture the popularity and support that once was. This takes too long, and for these kinds of people, time really is money. They are more likely to drop $500 million to start a new shiny venture, than they are to spend $25 million to try in repair something that there is no guarantee can be fixed.
Based on a shrinking brand, shrinking fan support, and accordingly a shrinking market price; based on apathy, losing and ridicule, if this trend continues, Haslam will get out. But rest assured, the new guy who spends $1.2 billion? He is going to want a shiny new start, and if Cleveland is not a ragingly successful and vibrant market, Cleveland will again see the team moved. When that happens, and it will, Cleveland will not again be an NFL city.
I'm simple as hell too, and I don't really grasp this (orange highlight).
He dropped his $500 million (or so, I don't recall the buying price), came here as a minority shareholder from Pittsburgh (a successful franchise), and somehow he has gone backwards. Now, being patient but disgruntled, the fan in me says "how come you can't fix it now?"
He screwed up early on, finally listened to some folks, and allowed a total blow-up to happen beginning last year. Surely the jury is still out on this regime (not looking too good yet), but damnit don't blame the fans for poor attendance etc. when your business model has been bad.
I do understand your take on the modern businessman. Just don't punish a great football fan base region for self-ineptitude.
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Haslam, and really no multi millionaire is going to have interest in waiting, building, and trying to recapture the popularity and support that once was. This takes too long, and for these kinds of people, time really is money. They are more likely to drop $500 million to start a new shiny venture, than they are to spend $25 million to try in repair something that there is no guarantee can be fixed.
Based on a shrinking brand, shrinking fan support, and accordingly a shrinking market price; based on apathy, losing and ridicule, if this trend continues, Haslam will get out. But rest assured, the new guy who spends $1.2 billion? He is going to want a shiny new start, and if Cleveland is not a ragingly successful and vibrant market, Cleveland will again see the team moved. When that happens, and it will, Cleveland will not again be an NFL city.
I'm simple as hell too, and I don't really grasp this (orange highlight).
He dropped his $500 million (or so, I don't recall the buying price), came here as a minority shareholder from Pittsburgh (a successful franchise), and somehow he has gone backwards. Now, being patient but disgruntled, the fan in me says "how come you can't fix it now?"
He screwed up early on, finally listened to some folks, and allowed a total blow-up to happen beginning last year. Surely the jury is still out on this regime (not looking too good yet), but damnit don't blame the fans for poor attendance etc. when your business model has been bad.
I do understand your take on the modern businessman. Just don't punish a great football fan base region for self-ineptitude.
I'm simple as hell too, and I don't really grasp this (orange highlight).
He dropped his $500 million (or so, I don't recall the buying price), came here as a minority shareholder from Pittsburgh (a successful franchise), and somehow he has gone backwards. Now, being patient but disgruntled, the fan in me says "how come you can't fix it now?"
He screwed up early on, finally listened to some folks, and allowed a total blow-up to happen beginning last year. Surely the jury is still out on this regime (not looking too good yet), but damnit don't blame the fans for poor attendance etc. when your business model has been bad.
I do understand your take on the modern businessman. Just don't punish a great football fan base region for self-ineptitude.
You aren't simple as hell. You are a regular, reasonable man, but let me help you grasp the highlight.
Let me take a short diversion. I recently invented and developed a new water technology. To sell it for its full potential, instead of marketing it now, I decided to seek some venture capital to build a testing facility and really create an industry buzz. I took on a legal/financial partner as they understand the wold of capital and assets. So, my partner and I asked for a certain sum of money, in return for a 10% interest in the company. Just this past week a major interest told us that they are interested but afraid to invest for fear that we are not asking for enough up front capital. WTF? I said to myself. So, as it turns out, for the same financial interest, they are working up an offer that is 15 times what we asked for. Their reasoning? In the event we under-budgeted they don't want to have to go back through the due dilligence process to obtain more interest in return for more money. So, we are going to accept 15 times what we wanted. Goofy, eh?
Here is the deal, people with money, Real money, Haslam money, don't do anything that causes them to get their fingers dirty. They don't want fan involvement, they don't want media attention, they just don't want to interact with the every day BS of what you and I experience as normal life.
So too with a football team. Haslam is not going to get his hands dirty. What you see now, is as involved as he will ever get. People like this isolate themselves. Modell is an example of a rich guy who was not of the wealth caliber Haslam is, but Haslam would NEVER subject himself to airing dirty laundry. When he has his fill, and I have to think he is close, he will wash his hands of the Browns, and the new owner? DO you really think another millionaire is going to want to acquire a new NFL team and then have to get down into the mud to try and fix it?
I believe the clock is ticking and I believe if Kizer does not magically rise to greatness, Hue is gone before the season is over.
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I'm simple as hell too, and I don't really grasp this (orange highlight).
He dropped his $500 million (or so, I don't recall the buying price), came here as a minority shareholder from Pittsburgh (a successful franchise), and somehow he has gone backwards. Now, being patient but disgruntled, the fan in me says "how come you can't fix it now?"
He screwed up early on, finally listened to some folks, and allowed a total blow-up to happen beginning last year. Surely the jury is still out on this regime (not looking too good yet), but damnit don't blame the fans for poor attendance etc. when your business model has been bad.
I do understand your take on the modern businessman. Just don't punish a great football fan base region for self-ineptitude.
You aren't simple as hell. You are a regular, reasonable man, but let me help you grasp the highlight.
Let me take a short diversion. I recently invented and developed a new water technology. To sell it for its full potential, instead of marketing it now, I decided to seek some venture capital to build a testing facility and really create an industry buzz. I took on a legal/financial partner as they understand the wold of capital and assets. So, my partner and I asked for a certain sum of money, in return for a 10% interest in the company. Just this past week a major interest told us that they are interested but afraid to invest for fear that we are not asking for enough up front capital. WTF? I said to myself. So, as it turns out, for the same financial interest, they are working up an offer that is 15 times what we asked for. Their reasoning? In the event we under-budgeted they don't want to have to go back through the due dilligence process to obtain more interest in return for more money. So, we are going to accept 15 times what we wanted. Goofy, eh?
Here is the deal, people with money, Real money, Haslam money, don't do anything that causes them to get their fingers dirty. They don't want fan involvement, they don't want media attention, they just don't want to interact with the every day BS of what you and I experience as normal life.
So too with a football team. Haslam is not going to get his hands dirty. What you see now, is as involved as he will ever get. People like this isolate themselves. Modell is an example of a rich guy who was not of the wealth caliber Haslam is, but Haslam would NEVER subject himself to airing dirty laundry. When he has his fill, and I have to think he is close, he will wash his hands of the Browns, and the new owner? DO you really think another millionaire is going to want to acquire a new NFL team and then have to get down into the mud to try and fix it?
I believe the clock is ticking and I believe if Kizer does not magically rise to greatness, Hue is gone before the season is over.
You aren't simple as hell. You are a regular, reasonable man, but let me help you grasp the highlight.
Let me take a short diversion. I recently invented and developed a new water technology. To sell it for its full potential, instead of marketing it now, I decided to seek some venture capital to build a testing facility and really create an industry buzz. I took on a legal/financial partner as they understand the wold of capital and assets. So, my partner and I asked for a certain sum of money, in return for a 10% interest in the company. Just this past week a major interest told us that they are interested but afraid to invest for fear that we are not asking for enough up front capital. WTF? I said to myself. So, as it turns out, for the same financial interest, they are working up an offer that is 15 times what we asked for. Their reasoning? In the event we under-budgeted they don't want to have to go back through the due dilligence process to obtain more interest in return for more money. So, we are going to accept 15 times what we wanted. Goofy, eh?
Here is the deal, people with money, Real money, Haslam money, don't do anything that causes them to get their fingers dirty. They don't want fan involvement, they don't want media attention, they just don't want to interact with the every day BS of what you and I experience as normal life.
So too with a football team. Haslam is not going to get his hands dirty. What you see now, is as involved as he will ever get. People like this isolate themselves. Modell is an example of a rich guy who was not of the wealth caliber Haslam is, but Haslam would NEVER subject himself to airing dirty laundry. When he has his fill, and I have to think he is close, he will wash his hands of the Browns, and the new owner? DO you really think another millionaire is going to want to acquire a new NFL team and then have to get down into the mud to try and fix it?
I believe the clock is ticking and I believe if Kizer does not magically rise to greatness, Hue is gone before the season is over.
I have a feeling Hue is gone by mid season regardless...
Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~ -
please, Ghoolie. You're a formulaic troll. You Sheet on the Browns with tired generalities and absolutely zero football insight. You're not a mystic, you're a garden variety Sheet talker who never gets called on your revisionist history. Anyone who remembers your rants realizes that you know Shmuckall about football, but as long as you Sheet on the Browns at every step, you'll be able to say "I was right" until the Browns start to win.
im not even mad at you, I just don't understand how people buy into it. The "looks like ghoolie was right" crowd are the same Shmucks who put stock in astrology and fortune cookies: easily misguided mooks who don't understand that a troll who sticks to their guns can only "lose" once. I would say that day is coming, but with the way the Browns have been playing this millennium, you may be able to convince these rubes that you know what football is until you're in the ground.
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