Obama picks Sotomayor for Supreme Court
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Give me an example of my Democratic dogma.
Give me an example of my Democratic dogma.
One?
This discussion is about institutionalized reverse descrimination and a desire to make that constitutional.
(Well the half that isn't about Sodemayer's qualifications which I never questioned.)
So while you defend that you attack Thomas because he's Black.
Chapter and verse in the Dem playbook.
WSS
~I'm predicting the response~
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“It’s pretty disturbing,” said Levey. “It’s one thing to say that occasionally a judge will despite his or her best efforts to be impartial ... allow occasional biases to cloud impartiality.
"But it’s almost like she’s proud that her biases and personal experiences will cloud her impartiality.”
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“It’s pretty disturbing,” said Levey. “It’s one thing to say that occasionally a judge will despite his or her best efforts to be impartial ... allow occasional biases to cloud impartiality.
"But it’s almost like she’s proud that her biases and personal experiences will cloud her impartiality.”
Is Sotomayor a Racist?
That's pretty funny coming from you, T. Being an admitted bigot and all.
Being able to see things from a more personal perspective (Sotomayor) is vastly different than hating someone because they were born black, gay or Mexican (you).
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I attacked Thomas because he was black?
I thought I pointed out that Thomas wasn't particularly qualified to be on the Supreme Court, and that his race played a role in his appointment.
Again, try to argue what I'm saying, not the straw man.
Want to try again?
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Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, 1993, unanimous well-qualified.
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Thanks, Al, but I'd take O'Conner or Thomas and a whole bunch of others
over Ginsburg, who is a total waste on the court.
And if anybody tells me that the ABA is totally above putting politics into their
votes, I'll go roll all across ten plowed and disced acres after a hard rain, RIM,LMAO.
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Is Sotomayor a Racist?
That's pretty funny coming from you, T. Being an admitted bigot and all.
Being able to see things from a more personal perspective (Sotomayor) is vastly different than hating someone because they were born black, gay or Mexican (you).
mz. said:
That's pretty funny coming from you, T. Being an admitted bigot and all.Being able to see things from a more personal perspective (Sotomayor) is vastly different than hating someone because they were born black, gay or Mexican (you).
I see your still into name calling.
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mz. said:
That's pretty funny coming from you, T. Being an admitted bigot and all.Being able to see things from a more personal perspective (Sotomayor) is vastly different than hating someone because they were born black, gay or Mexican (you).
I see your still into name calling.
I see your still into name calling.
As long as you're into bigotry, something you have never denied IIRC, I'll call 'em as I see 'em.
Explain it?
Fine. I will.
Conservative critics have latched onto the speech as evidence that Sotomayor is an “activist judge,” who will rule on the basis of her personal beliefs instead of facts and law.
That's what you are grabbing onto, as Rush would (I assume) tell you to. I maintain that she is an impartial yet left-leaning judge (duh) according to everything I've read.
So what's the problem here, other than the fact she doesn't lean in your direction?
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Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, 1993, unanimous well-qualified.
**************************************************
Thanks, Al, but I'd take O'Conner or Thomas and a whole bunch of others
over Ginsburg, who is a total waste on the court.
And if anybody tells me that the ABA is totally above putting politics into their
votes, I'll go roll all across ten plowed and disced acres after a hard rain, RIM,LMAO.
Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, 1993, unanimous well-qualified.
**************************************************
Thanks, Al, but I'd take O'Conner or Thomas and a whole bunch of others
over Ginsburg, who is a total waste on the court.
There's a difference between judging ideology and judging whether a nominee's qualified for the job. That's why Heck can say Obama should have voted for Alito & Roberts, and why both conservatives and liberals at the ABA agreed that Alito, Roberts, Breyer, and Ginsburg, etc. were well-qualified for the job, whereas Thomas and, to a lesser extent, O'Connor didn't have the same kind of experience (IIRC, O'Connor had only been a state court judge).
Ginsburg had been an federal appeals court judge for thirteen years when Clinton put her on the SCt. That made her eminently qualified for the job, and I don't think anyone credible has said that she's been a failure as a justice. You linked to Jeffrey Rosen's article on Sotomayor; he also wrote a glowing article on his one of his favorite candidates, Diane Wood, in which he compared her to Ginsburg. No one questions the quality of her opinions, and she's been a thoroughly positive influence on the internal workings of the court. She & Justice Scalia co-host a Christmas/Chanuka party every year, which is a testament to how good she is at keeping things civil.
Not sure how that makes her "a total waste on the court."
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Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, 1993, unanimous well-qualified.
**************************************************
Thanks, Al, but I'd take O'Conner or Thomas and a whole bunch of others
over Ginsburg, who is a total waste on the court.
There's a difference between judging ideology and judging whether a nominee's qualified for the job. That's why Heck can say Obama should have voted for Alito & Roberts, and why both conservatives and liberals at the ABA agreed that Alito, Roberts, Breyer, and Ginsburg, etc. were well-qualified for the job, whereas Thomas and, to a lesser extent, O'Connor didn't have the same kind of experience (IIRC, O'Connor had only been a state court judge).
Ginsburg had been an federal appeals court judge for thirteen years when Clinton put her on the SCt. That made her eminently qualified for the job, and I don't think anyone credible has said that she's been a failure as a justice. You linked to Jeffrey Rosen's article on Sotomayor; he also wrote a glowing article on his one of his favorite candidates, Diane Wood, in which he compared her to Ginsburg. No one questions the quality of her opinions, and she's been a thoroughly positive influence on the internal workings of the court. She & Justice Scalia co-host a Christmas/Chanuka party every year, which is a testament to how good she is at keeping things civil.
Not sure how that makes her "a total waste on the court."
Aloysius said:
Not sure how that makes her "a total waste on the court."Some folks like cal simply cannot process the idea someone being qualified to serve on the court while not agree with their personal ideology or leanings. As in: I believe Justice Scalia is certainly qualified to serve as a judge but I do not agree with his ideology.
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I attacked Thomas because he was black?
I thought I pointed out that Thomas wasn't particularly qualified to be on the Supreme Court, and that his race played a role in his appointment.
Again, try to argue what I'm saying, not the straw man.
Want to try again?
I attacked Thomas because he was black?
I thought I pointed out that Thomas wasn't particularly qualified to be on the Supreme Court, and that his race played a role in his appointment.
Again, try to argue what I'm saying, not the straw man.
Want to try again?
Try again?
That'd be two hits in a row.
Though you love that straw man no one ever accused Thomas of racial bias.
(He's an Uncle Tom for not doing it. And I've not heard you call him that)
No doubt it's Democrat dogma Heck.
Scream racism at every turn while pimping your own version of it.
Probably in tthe first chapter.
Wait....
No?
(sorry)
WSS
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Again, where are you suggesting I'm following some Democratic dogma? You're making the point that Democratic dogma is such and such.
What's your example? Want to try again?
And what does this mean?
"Though you love that straw man no one ever accused Thomas of racial bias."
It seems that you don't know what a straw man is. Which shouldn't surprise anyone.
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W.H. to Sotomayor critics: Be 'careful'
http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uui...8A635EC42D96D1A
By: Alexander Burns
May 27, 2009 02:33 PM EST
White House press secretary Robert Gibbs issued a pointed warning to opponents of Judge Sonia Sotomayor’s Supreme Court nomination Wednesday, urging critics to measure their words carefully during a politically charged confirmation debate.
“I think it is probably important for anybody involved in this debate to be exceedingly careful with the way in which they’ve decided to describe different aspects of this impending confirmation,” Gibbs said.
He was replying to a question from CBS’s Chip Reid about a blog post by former House Speaker Newt Gingrich accusing Sotomayor of imposing identity politics on the bench and declaring: “A white man racist nominee would be forced to withdraw. A Latina woman racist should also withdraw.”
In 2001, then-White House press secretary Ari Fleischer drew criticism in the press for suggesting Americans “need to watch what they say” in the overheated aftermath of the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks.
You vill do vat you are told and you vill confirm her and you vill not ask too many questions.....OR you vill be eliminated.
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Now some info is rolling in....
May 26, 2009
Sotomayor: Gender, ethnicity should influence judges
From CNN Political Research Director Robert Yoon, CNN Supreme Court Producer Bill Mears
WASHINGTON (CNN) — Supreme Court nominee Sonia Sotomayor said in a 2001 speech that a judge's gender and ethnicity does, and should, influence his or her decision-making on the bench.
Sotomayor made the comments on October 26, 2001, at a University of California-Berkeley symposium marking the 40th anniversary of the first Latino named to the federal district court.
"I wonder whether by ignoring our differences as women or men of color we do a disservice both to the law and society," she said at the event, sponsored by the law school. "I further accept that our experiences as women and people of color affect our decisions. The aspiration to impartiality is just that — it's an aspiration because it denies the fact that we are by our experiences making different choices than others."
"Our gender and national origins may and will make a difference in our judging. Justice [sandra Day] O'Connor has often been cited as saying that a wise old man and wise old woman will reach the same conclusion in deciding cases. I am also not so sure that I agree with the statement," she added. "First, as Professor [Martha] Minnow has noted, there can never be a universal definition of wise. Second, I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experience would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn't lived that life."
A university media affairs representative confirmed the comments to CNN.
President Obama announced Tuesday his intention to nominate Sotomayor to the high court. She would become the first Hispanic and third female justice in Supreme Court history.
The richness of ones experience has nothing to do with defining the constitution.
Has a white man said "I would hope that a wise Caucasian man with the richness of his experience would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a Latino female who hasn't lived that life."
Not only is she racist, she is sexist.
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Again, where are you suggesting I'm following some Democratic dogma? You're making the point that Democratic dogma is such and such.
What's your example? Want to try again?
And what does this mean?
"Though you love that straw man no one ever accused Thomas of racial bias."
It seems that you don't know what a straw man is. Which shouldn't surprise anyone.
Again, where are you suggesting I'm following some Democratic dogma? You're making the point that Democratic dogma is such and such.
What's your example? Want to try again?
You can read I assume.
And what does this mean?
Mean? It means your points are weakened by a too powerful love of party.
Not that necessarily makes you wrong.
"Though you love that straw man no one ever accused Thomas of racial bias."
It seems that you don't know what a straw man is. Which shouldn't surprise anyone.
Ahh the tried and not true.
I know you fancy your little high school debate topics.
I got my pittance of a scholarship for N.F.L. points.
Yes Heck, a straw man is where you take an argument I never made usually by re arranging one or changing the subject and arguing against it.
See Thomas and Sodemayor may have gotten breaks based on race.
You attack me for supporting Thomas.
But their race is not and never was the reason I question Sodemayor.
See?
WSS
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Ginsburg is a blatant liberal sexist.
Though her opinions on some important matters of discrimination against women are notably valid,
she is a Dem and if it isn't a sex oriented case (she headed up the ACLU's women's rights org)
she votes with conservatives on other issues with little or no opinion.
By her own admission, she often has opinions that get lost in terms of other Justices'
work, and complains that she is not understood because she's a woman.
I would say, she is ignored a bit because of her narrow focus of concern:
women's rights alone. Then she whines that her and O'Conner disagreed on issues, because
O'Conner is "truly a Republican". She's an arrogant liberal with an extremely narrow
area she cares about, or has expertise in.
I didn't say she wasn't technically qualified, but a lot of the time, she is a liberal and a woman first,
and a Supreme Court Justice second.
O'Connor was just a terrific Supreme Court Justice who happened to be a woman with the insights women have.
Heck and mz the pussy won't see the difference.
Obama's nominee is historically blatantly Hispanic and woman first, and judge responsibilties come second.
As a Supreme Court nominee, that's a bad thing.
Meanwhile, the Republicans voted for technical qualifications, and the Democrats vote for
the results of "litmus tests" that they can install in one fashion or another.
I want the Republicans to do the same as the Dems have.
And maybe, we can watch Heck and mz the pussy go ballistic when the Reps do.
http://www.oyez.org/justices/ruth_bader_ginsburg
This was the case, yet to be ruled upon, that Ginsburg felt repeated Ledbetter. That 5-4 opinion written by conservative Justice Samuel Alito — who succeeded O'Connor — rejected the notion that pay discrimination is harder to detect than other job bias and dismissed the "policy" argument that the law allows more flexibility for suing in such situations.
Ginsburg was so incensed by the decision that she took the unusual step of reading her dissenting opinion from the bench and called on Congress to reverse the court.
Congressional legislation, signed into law by Obama as one of his first official acts, gave workers far more freedom to sue for pay bias long after it began.
Ginsburg said in an interview that she believed some of her male colleagues had trouble understanding the difficulty of getting pay-disparity information and the general reluctance of women to claim a workplace policy is unfair.
"As often as Justice O'Connor and I have disagreed, because she is truly a Republican from Arizona, we were together in all the gender discrimination cases," said Ginsburg, a Brooklyn, N.Y., native and Democrat. "I have no doubt that she would have understood Lilly Ledbetter's situation."
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Ginsburg is a blatant liberal sexist.
Though her opinions on some important matters of discrimination against women are notably valid,
she is a Dem and if it isn't a sex oriented case (she headed up the ACLU's women's rights org)
she votes with conservatives on other issues with little or no opinion.
By her own admission, she often has opinions that get lost in terms of other Justices'
work, and complains that she is not understood because she's a woman.
I would say, she is ignored a bit because of her narrow focus of concern:
women's rights alone. Then she whines that her and O'Conner disagreed on issues, because
O'Conner is "truly a Republican". She's an arrogant liberal with an extremely narrow
area she cares about, or has expertise in.
I didn't say she wasn't technically qualified, but a lot of the time, she is a liberal and a woman first,
and a Supreme Court Justice second.
O'Connor was just a terrific Supreme Court Justice who happened to be a woman with the insights women have.
Heck and mz the pussy won't see the difference.
Obama's nominee is historically blatantly Hispanic and woman first, and judge responsibilties come second.
As a Supreme Court nominee, that's a bad thing.
Meanwhile, the Republicans voted for technical qualifications, and the Democrats vote for
the results of "litmus tests" that they can install in one fashion or another.
I want the Republicans to do the same as the Dems have.
And maybe, we can watch Heck and mz the pussy go ballistic when the Reps do.
http://www.oyez.org/justices/ruth_bader_ginsburg
This was the case, yet to be ruled upon, that Ginsburg felt repeated Ledbetter. That 5-4 opinion written by conservative Justice Samuel Alito — who succeeded O'Connor — rejected the notion that pay discrimination is harder to detect than other job bias and dismissed the "policy" argument that the law allows more flexibility for suing in such situations.
Ginsburg was so incensed by the decision that she took the unusual step of reading her dissenting opinion from the bench and called on Congress to reverse the court.
Congressional legislation, signed into law by Obama as one of his first official acts, gave workers far more freedom to sue for pay bias long after it began.
Ginsburg said in an interview that she believed some of her male colleagues had trouble understanding the difficulty of getting pay-disparity information and the general reluctance of women to claim a workplace policy is unfair.
"As often as Justice O'Connor and I have disagreed, because she is truly a Republican from Arizona, we were together in all the gender discrimination cases," said Ginsburg, a Brooklyn, N.Y., native and Democrat. "I have no doubt that she would have understood Lilly Ledbetter's situation."
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Steve, give me a break. You mentioned affirmative action - and your distaste for it - in multiple posts. And you've mentioned it even more over the years.
And that's why I'm asking you why the nomination of Thomas, a clear instance where race was a major factor in the decision to nominate - if not the primary one, as Thomas wasn't terribly qualified - doesn't bother you, but the nomination of Sotomayor because she's a Hispanic woman does.
How do you reconcile the two if they're both race-conscious hires? Since in your world it's all about who is the most qualified, and you wouldn't mind if that ended up being nine blacks or nine whites?
If you're against affirmative action hires, why weren't you against Thomas? Is this one of those instances where "your points are weakened by a too powerful love of party?"
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Steve, give me a break. You mentioned affirmative action - and your distaste for it - in multiple posts. And you've mentioned it even more over the years.
And that's why I'm asking you why the nomination of Thomas, a clear instance where race was a major factor in the decision to nominate - if not the primary one, as Thomas wasn't terribly qualified - doesn't bother you, but the nomination of Sotomayor because she's a Hispanic woman does.
How do you reconcile the two if they're both race-conscious hires? Since in your world it's all about who is the most qualified, and you wouldn't mind if that ended up being nine blacks or nine whites?
If you're against affirmative action hires, why weren't you against Thomas? Is this one of those instances where "your points are weakened by a too powerful love of party?"
Steve, give me a break. You mentioned affirmative action - and your distaste for it - in multiple posts. And you've mentioned it even more over the years.
We're talking about this post Heck.
We're talking about the remarks of a jurist that, if uttered by a Republican, would be grounds for you to demand he step aside.
And no, Im not a fan of affirmitive action especially if a less able person gets a promotion.
I'd think that person or group would rightly be embarrassed. You?
And that's why I'm asking you why the nomination of Thomas, a clear instance where race was a major factor in the decision to nominate - if not the primary one, as Thomas wasn't terribly qualified - doesn't bother you, but the nomination of Sotomayor because she's a Hispanic woman does.
Again with the straw man.
I NEVER said that Sodomeayor's race made her unfit.
Did I?
If she plans to bestow special privileges on minority groups that would make her unfit.
Am I wrong to think that? Do historical injustices qualify one for extra benefits?
How do you reconcile the two if they're both race-conscious hires?
I don't .
Since in your world it's all about who is the most qualified, and you wouldn't mind if that ended up being nine blacks or nine whites?
But you would. Right?
Actually the president was serioulsy considering going out of academia for a nominee closer to the "people."
Wrong again in youyr view?
If you're against affirmative action hires, why weren't you against Thomas? Is this one of those instances where "your points are weakened by a too powerful love of party?"
Bexcause he didn't promise to make race an issue in deciding cases?
Because your hatred of Thomas amuses me?
Because he's as qualified as anyone to be a justice?
Because he doesn't seem to blame me or those who look like me as deserving of punishment?
Because I didn't bitch that your girl's race disqualified her?
(I doubt she's the most "qualkified" candidate in America even by the Heck meter.)
WSS
~here comes the "herrumph"~
WSS[/b]
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This is really telling stuff. So you don't mind that Thomas clearly was not the most qualified person, or even among the most qualified people, to get his nomination. You're willing to ignore that and say "he's as qualified as anyone to be a justice" when it's a matter of record that he wasn't. No fair-minded person would argue that Thomas was among the most qualified people to receive an appointment in 1991. But you're willing to ignore this fact.
Why? Because Thomas doesn't support race-based preferences. You "just don't recall Thomas boasting aboyut his color or vowing to punish the white man."
Except that the reason he became a justice was because of a race-based preference. Clearly, Bush wanted to appoint a black to replace Thurgood Marshall, and the bench of black conservative justices isn't that deep. So he went with the best he could find, which was Thomas, even though he didn't have the traditional resume.
Or as you say, "Im not a fan of affirmitive action especially if a less able person gets a promotion." Well, in this case a less able person got a promotion. Clearly. And you are a fan.
Why? Because Thomas doesn't want to "bestow minorities with special privileges." Also because when Republicans do it it's okay: "I'm sure (race) was" a factor in Thomas hiring, you wrote. "I'm sure the Republican party wants to get African Americans to start joining and thinking of themselves as Americans."
So here's what we're left with: affirmative action hires are okay if they don't like affirmative action. Just when they benefit from affirmative action. It's also okay when Republicans do it because they have the best interests of blacks in mind.
As for Sotomayor, you don't dispute that she's perfectly qualified. No one does. But you don't like how they used race and gender as a factor in her hiring: "And narrowing a search to women and Hispanics.....Well just imagine." And "her most important qualifications are race and sex." And why does this case of an admittedly qualified woman being tapped because of her race and gender bother you when a less qualified man who was tapped because of his race not bother you?
Because she made a ruling you disagree with, and because she made a statement you don't like.
This is the most ridiculous, ad hoc, and partisan position on affirmative action I've ever seen.
Of course, both of these issues with Sotomayor are the two main talking points issued by the Republican Party, and you were running with them within hours of her nomination. Because if there's one thing you can't stand, it's people who blindly follow their party.
Can you explain your inconsistencies? Do I have this wrong or do you? Are you against race-based preferences or are you not? Or are you only against them in cases where you like the person's views, specifically the one that says that they must hate the policy they just benefitted from?
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Sotomayor should remove her name from nomination for the court.
The reason is clearly explained by Justice Scalia's words from the past:
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From "The Political Thought of Justice Antonin Scalia" by James Brian Staab:
“More frequently, Scalia finds that American tradition does not support the right at hand,
And has been sharply critical of his colleagues for “inventing” rights through abstract legal tests
That erode traditional values and practices. In Court opinions, Scalia despairs about “elite” judges
Drawn from a “law-profession culture” who support the liberal agenda of secular humanism,
Abortion rights, affirmative action, opposition to the death penalty, and homosexual rights, and are willing to impose those values on the majority."
"Justice Scalia said:
'When judges test their individual notions of ‘fairness’ against an American
Tradition that is deep and broad and continuing, it is not tradition that is on trial, but the judges.'
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Now, Scalia was clearly speaking of the kind of nominee that is SOTOMAYOR.
The legislation of a liberal agenda from the bench is a breach of the intent of the Constitution to
safeguard our freedoms.
And, the Founding Fathers cannot be imagined to have figured that the Constitution was
a "living document" that could be twisted, deleted from and added to per contemporary political whims.
And, with Sotomayor being surely pro-abortion, it's time that Republicans started doing the litmus test
on nominees, like Dems have been doing for years.
So, with Sotomayor's intent to legislate from her own experiences and race...she is not qualified to be a justice,
per Justice Scalia's own words.
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