The... I am batting (maybe alone) for the front office thread
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Wow..... In my everyday life for 49yrs I know how hard it is to get just three people to agree on anything, much less 5, 8, 11.... Guess we should look for many more trades throughout the life of The Process.
FWIW, it was Sashi himself who said he had 'final say' when Hue was hired/introduced in what seems like a lifetime ago....
"Wow"... after all this time you still cannot grasp the concept of consensus decision making. I have no idea what the 2nd half of your opening means.
BTW... that concept does not exclude the idea of the process empowering a person with the "final say"... it simply defines the placement of that say and what it is based upon. The statement by Sashi, one which you are fond of recalling, simply says that he, not Hue, leads the player selection process in which Hue has a role, but for which Hue does not have responsibility.
As for the number of people... best I can tell it is likely capped at 5 rather than starting at 5.
"Wow"... after all this time you still cannot grasp the concept of consensus decision making. I have no idea what the 2nd half of your opening means.
BTW... that concept does not exclude the idea of the process empowering a person with the "final say"... it simply defines the placement of that say and what it is based upon. The statement by Sashi, one which you are fond of recalling, simply says that he, not Hue, leads the player selection process in which Hue has a role, but for which Hue does not have responsibility.
I guess I don't grasp it T.... Never said I did though, and that's why I was asking questions about what you think it means because I have no idea.
2nd half means that I'm expecting a lot more trades because in my life, consensuses are hard to come by and usually result in everyone saying "someone just make a decision"! Maybe it's just me and everyone around me?
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lol... getting a lil frayed here... sorry if I throw undeserved testy your way from time to time.
Part of the beauty of the process is that decisions are not easy. Picking Wheezy was "easy"... ditto for JFF... living with results of those picks was not. The goal, our goal, Sashi's goal, is to continuously increase the quality of the decisions the process produces.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
lol... getting a lil frayed here... sorry if I throw undeserved testy your way from time to time.
Part of the beauty of the process is that decisions are not easy. Picking Wheezy was "easy"... ditto for JFF... living with results of those picks was not. The goal, our goal, Sashi's goal, is to continuously increase the quality of the decisions the process produces.
lol... getting a lil frayed here... sorry if I throw undeserved testy your way from time to time.
Part of the beauty of the process is that decisions are not easy. Picking Wheezy was "easy"... ditto for JFF... living with results of those picks was not. The goal, our goal, Sashi's goal, is to continuously increase the quality of the decisions the process produces.
Never any worries T, as I take nothing personal and the Browns could even make Gandhi irate....
Give me your opinion on the following regarding a player acquisition:
FO Dude 1: I Love him! (Sashi)
FO Dude 2: I hate him! (Hue)
FO Dude 3: Whatever (Dude)
FO Dude 4: He's pretty good (Dude)
FO Dude 5: He's not very good (Dude)
^ Extreme example I know, and I also know that if this was my friends and me, we would probably just play rock, paper, scissors, lizard, spock..... but what do you think happens in this case? I'm guessing that the Browns would sign him since Sashi loves him?
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Well, it may not be the method per se.....but it is certainly the execution of the method.
You can input all the analytics you want into this situation. YOu still have to evaluate and pick proper talent after you have applied the analytics. And this group wouldn't know talent if it came up and gave them a forearm shiver.
^^^Garrett was a no brainer. +1.
Holmgren (30+ years NFL experience) - 5-11, 4-12, 5-11
Lombardi (30 years NFL experience) - 4-12
Farmer (former player, 10 years NFL experience) - 7-9, 3-13
Yeah, having a "football guy in charge" really made a ton of difference...
I swear to God, you guys are dumb as hell.
That failed TC, so we put a lawyer and a baseball guy in charge- BRILLIANT!!! If that doesn't work try the NHL (or NBA) next for talent evaluators.... 5-11 this year is a pipe dream, if that comes to pass I'll damn near be dancing in the street I'll be so happy.
The younger the fan, the more patience they have......... I remember going to bed the night of January 11, 1987 and thinking "Well, today really sucked, but by the time I'm my dad's age, the Browns will have a couple of Super Bowl wins".
I am now approaching my Dad's age at that time - 50 in three weeks, and now honestly wonder if I will ever see another Browns playoff game again...... and I'm not trying to be funny either, as I seriously don't know if I will ever see one before my lights go out.
I get that the younger dudes are more "wait until next year, and you'll see" - hell, I was there too.............. but, be careful what you wish for, as 'next year' never comes and in the blink of an eye, you're past the 1/2 way point of your time on this planet.
Exactly- and I predate 1964. I'm running out of "next years"-fast. I mean like how totally disgusting is it to see- teams like the Panthers make the SB, go into the pits, retool and get there again while the Browns continue to suck, and suck bad is a testament it's not impossible to turn a franchise around in less than-what is it now going on 20 years? The millenials have no F**cking clue on what it was like to have a team that was in playoff contention every year. To their credit, they've stuck with this doo-doo show longer than would reasonably been expected. Us oldsters know this is a bad, bad team. Hell, the 1999 and few years after expansions Browns didn't look this lousy, and the dysfunctionality of the entire organization at this point is truly breathtaking.
the dysfunctionality of the entire organization at this point is truly breathtaking.
Maybe the fact that they couldn’t get the trade done for a 4th backup qb could read as disfunctionality, but apart from that I feel that this team has been doing everything they’ve set out to do. They said it would be a few years before they’d be able to compete, and that they were more focused on building a team that is easier to play QB for. This defense has been improving, the team is solid in the trenches on both sides due to the moves this FO Has made. Mid round guys like Coleman and Drango are holding their own. acquiring Tretter and Zeitler has also worked out. Ogbah is the highest rated DE for stopping the run, Garrett is a legit star even though , God forbid, he’s had to deal with a minor injury (still some are drowning in dreadful snotty tears that the Browns didn’t draft the guy who blew his leg up by running on grass). Ogunjobi, Collins, Calhoun, Mccourty, Njoku etc.
while there are certainly the growing pains that everyone expected, this team is still a far better environment for the QB, it just isn’t showing yet because literally every team on the browns schedule this season has a shitload more experience than the Browns. I know we all want these 21-22 year old kids to come into the league and outplay second-third contract players who know what it takes to win in the NFL, but that’s the equivalent of playing the lottery in lieu of a retirement fund.
The latest presser the FO said that they would be aggressive in solving the QB situation, and now it’s time. If they can deliver the QB everything will be fine and no one will admit to crying for a house cleaning. The truth is the great Belicheck stumbled butt first into a franchise QB and then drafted a shitload of guys who don’t belong in the league, that’s how it goes. This team is doing things the same way as belicheck except they haven’t lucked into a 6th round HOF QB. That really is the line in the sand that separates belicheck getting his salad tossed by ESPN 24/7 and a bunch of entitled children complaining because they miss rooting for a 3 win team. If the FO can’t make good in their goal to bring in a QB, then we can go back to the tried and true method of bringing in janitors and coffee fetchers to restore the luster of 4-12 seasons as far as the eye can see.
BTW, while I turned 32 last Monday, I still probably only have about 8-9 years left in the tank, so I’m in the same boat as a lot of you old heads.
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Royce, are you dying? I’ll be praying for you if so.
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lol... getting a lil frayed here... sorry if I throw undeserved testy your way from time to time.
Part of the beauty of the process is that decisions are not easy. Picking Wheezy was "easy"... ditto for JFF... living with results of those picks was not. The goal, our goal, Sashi's goal, is to continuously increase the quality of the decisions the process produces.
Never any worries T, as I take nothing personal and the Browns could even make Gandhi irate....
Give me your opinion on the following regarding a player acquisition:
FO Dude 1: I Love him! (Sashi)
FO Dude 2: I hate him! (Hue)
FO Dude 3: Whatever (Dude)
FO Dude 4: He's pretty good (Dude)
FO Dude 5: He's not very good (Dude)
^ Extreme example I know, and I also know that if this was my friends and me, we would probably just play rock, paper, scissors, lizard, spock..... but what do you think happens in this case? I'm guessing that the Browns would sign him since Sashi loves him?
Never any worries T, as I take nothing personal and the Browns could even make Gandhi irate....
Give me your opinion on the following regarding a player acquisition:
FO Dude 1: I Love him! (Sashi)
FO Dude 2: I hate him! (Hue)
FO Dude 3: Whatever (Dude)
FO Dude 4: He's pretty good (Dude)
FO Dude 5: He's not very good (Dude)
^ Extreme example I know, and I also know that if this was my friends and me, we would probably just play rock, paper, scissors, lizard, spock..... but what do you think happens in this case? I'm guessing that the Browns would sign him since Sashi loves him?
Sashi doesn’t voice his opinion on players as far as I know. He would trade in this situation.
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lol... getting a lil frayed here... sorry if I throw undeserved testy your way from time to time.
Part of the beauty of the process is that decisions are not easy. Picking Wheezy was "easy"... ditto for JFF... living with results of those picks was not. The goal, our goal, Sashi's goal, is to continuously increase the quality of the decisions the process produces.
Never any worries T, as I take nothing personal and the Browns could even make Gandhi irate....
Give me your opinion on the following regarding a player acquisition:
FO Dude 1: I Love him! (Sashi)
FO Dude 2: I hate him! (Hue)
FO Dude 3: Whatever (Dude)
FO Dude 4: He's pretty good (Dude)
FO Dude 5: He's not very good (Dude)
^ Extreme example I know, and I also know that if this was my friends and me, we would probably just play rock, paper, scissors, lizard, spock..... but what do you think happens in this case? I'm guessing that the Browns would sign him since Sashi loves him?
Never any worries T, as I take nothing personal and the Browns could even make Gandhi irate....
Give me your opinion on the following regarding a player acquisition:
FO Dude 1: I Love him! (
Sashi)FO Dude 2: I hate him! (Hue)
FO Dude 3: Whatever (Dude)
FO Dude 4: He's pretty good (Dude)
FO Dude 5: He's not very good (Dude)
^ Extreme example I know, and I also know that if this was my friends and me, we would probably just play rock, paper, scissors, lizard, spock..... but what do you think happens in this case? I'm guessing that the Browns would sign him since Sashi loves him?
Just lost a growing write up... too late too tired to restart it now. See ya in the AM... but a partial preview is in the strikethru above and these links...
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Royce, are you dying? I’ll be praying for you if so.
I’m just guessing because I’m 6’10 and have spent most of my life burning my candle at both ends. There’s probably a heart attack or stroke waiting around the corner. Furthermore, if I suffer a serious injury or disease I’ll probably just run the car in the garage and cut class early, but I’ll be hoping the browns can turn it around until that happens.
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the dysfunctionality of the entire organization at this point is truly breathtaking.
Maybe the fact that they couldn’t get the trade done for a 4th backup qb could read as disfunctionality, but apart from that I feel that this team has been doing everything they’ve set out to do. They said it would be a few years before they’d be able to compete, and that they were more focused on building a team that is easier to play QB for. This defense has been improving, the team is solid in the trenches on both sides due to the moves this FO Has made. Mid round guys like Coleman and Drango are holding their own. acquiring Tretter and Zeitler has also worked out. Ogbah is the highest rated DE for stopping the run, Garrett is a legit star even though , God forbid, he’s had to deal with a minor injury (still some are drowning in dreadful snotty tears that the Browns didn’t draft the guy who blew his leg up by running on grass). Ogunjobi, Collins, Calhoun, Mccourty, Njoku etc.
while there are certainly the growing pains that everyone expected, this team is still a far better environment for the QB, it just isn’t showing yet because literally every team on the browns schedule this season has a shitload more experience than the Browns. I know we all want these 21-22 year old kids to come into the league and outplay second-third contract players who know what it takes to win in the NFL, but that’s the equivalent of playing the lottery in lieu of a retirement fund.
The latest presser the FO said that they would be aggressive in solving the QB situation, and now it’s time. If they can deliver the QB everything will be fine and no one will admit to crying for a house cleaning. The truth is the great Belicheck stumbled butt first into a franchise QB and then drafted a shitload of guys who don’t belong in the league, that’s how it goes. This team is doing things the same way as belicheck except they haven’t lucked into a 6th round HOF QB. That really is the line in the sand that separates belicheck getting his salad tossed by ESPN 24/7 and a bunch of entitled children complaining because they miss rooting for a 3 win team. If the FO can’t make good in their goal to bring in a QB, then we can go back to the tried and true method of bringing in janitors and coffee fetchers to restore the luster of 4-12 seasons as far as the eye can see.
BTW, while I turned 32 last Monday, I still probably only have about 8-9 years left in the tank, so I’m in the same boat as a lot of you old heads.
BTW, while I turned 32 last Monday, I still probably only have about 8-9 years left in the tank, so I’m in the same boat as a lot of you old heads.
Just gave my son-in-law his 40th birthday card this weekend. It was all black with white lettering which on the outside read "Everyone gets to be young just once in their life". Inside it read, "Your turn is over". LOL!
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Just heard on the 92.3 morning show that Daryl Ruiter (he's the Browns beat writer) tweeted out "Help is on the way!" he said he couldn't say anything but after the guys pushed him on it he said it was "help for the organization" so sounds like a front office addition?
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I still don't see any football experts with criteria to tell the difference between a Kessler and a Prescott or a Wentz vrs a trade down...
The player evaluators are called "scouts" and, no, you can't see them...
The "vs.tradedown" becomes a consideration only when the scouts are not able to agree/consense with the other evaluation tools on the worth of a prospect... any prospect... commensurate with the pick available.
In the case of a FA, it is worth commensurate with price.
The player evaluators are called "scouts" and, no, you can't see them...
The "vs.tradedown" becomes a consideration only when the scouts are not able to agree/consense with the other evaluation tools on the worth of a prospect... any prospect... commensurate with the pick available.
In the case of a FA, it is worth commensurate with price.
Yay! We have cub scouts and boy scouts in charge of evaluating QB and WR talent. That explains 1-24 football with Legally Blind summarizing all their research in their final decisions. We have the worst QBs and WR situation of 32 teams in a passing era.
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Just heard on the 92.3 morning show that Daryl Ruiter (he's the Browns beat writer) tweeted out "Help is on the way!" he said he couldn't say anything but after the guys pushed him on it he said it was "help for the organization" so sounds like a front office addition?
Just heard on the 92.3 morning show that Darrell Ryder (he's the Browns beat writer) tweeted out "Help is on the way!" he said he couldn't say anything but after the guys pushed him on it he said it was "help for the organization" so sounds like a front office addition?
"Dear God. Please let it be Kubiac. He's our only hope"-Princess Leia
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Wow..... In my everyday life for 49yrs I know how hard it is to get just three people to agree on anything, much less 5, 8, 11.... Guess we should look for many more trades throughout the life of The Process.
FWIW, it was Sashi himself who said he had 'final say' when Hue was hired/introduced in what seems like a lifetime ago....
Maybe you've identified the real problem. Nobody makes decisions, and suffers the consequences, in the Browns organization.
Maybe you've identified the real problem. Nobody makes decisions, and suffers the consequences, in the Browns organization.
Peyton Manning will.
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Well with the Giants being ass raped by the 49ers....we are very nearly on the clock for the #1 overall pick.
Well with the Giants being butt raped by the 49ers....we are very nearly on the clock for the #1 overall pick.
Mason Rudolph?
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Royce, are you dying? I’ll be praying for you if so.
I suspect that his tolerance for the Browns losing is what is dying.
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Just heard on the 92.3 morning show that Darrell Ryder (he's the Browns beat writer) tweeted out "Help is on the way!" he said he couldn't say anything but after the guys pushed him on it he said it was "help for the organization" so sounds like a front office addition?
"Dear God. Please let it be Kubiac. He's our only hope"-Princess Leia
"Dear God. Please let it be Kubiac. He's our only hope"-Princess Leia
See the post immediately below yours.
But maybe we can find someone out of this organization:
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Royce, are you dying? I’ll be praying for you if so.
I’m just guessing because I’m 6’10 and have spent most of my life burning my candle at both ends. There’s probably a heart attack or stroke waiting around the corner. Furthermore, if I suffer a serious injury or disease I’ll probably just run the car in the garage and cut class early, but I’ll be hoping the browns can turn it around until that happens.
I’m just guessing because I’m 6’10
You can help Zombo with his street fights on the negative posters here if you need some meaning in your life
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I want FO and coaching to stay the course. Seems like every single regime gets to this point for the browns and the same knee jerk reaction happens.
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I want FO and coaching to stay the course. Seems like every single regime gets to this point for the browns and the same knee jerk reaction happens.
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One or the other has to change. He's a losing coach and is holding the team back.
I dunno. I said when they hired him they couldn't even start evaluation till last eight games of year 2, unless he loses the locker room. And as of now he hasn't. It's quite rediculous that coaches don't get more than 2 seasons in Cleveland let alone 2 seasons when they having to build it right. (Tear down all the trail mix).
Honestly I think it would set this team even further behind to clean house now than to deal with everyone for one more year.
IMO getting to the point where old personnel is being deemed more believable than the organization it's self. Browns show they can't get outta their own way with 90% of their firings since Haslem showed up.
"We are Americans. We don't quit doing something because it's wrong. We just keep doing the wrong thing till it turns out right." Browns maybe the most American Football team ever.
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