Quinn at Browns camp ahead of Jamarcus at Raiders camp
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D&S was just trying to spin the facts so it would appear that BQ only became a Browns fan once he was drafted by them.
I never said he wasn't a fan of the Browns.... I wanted to say that people who say "He wants to play for the Browns" as if it's the team he's dreamed of leading all his life, especially his college years, is a bunch of BS. By his actions over the years (for example, charging kids 75 bucks for autographs before even signing an NFL contract, or holding out on the team he "wants to play for"), it appears to me that Quinn wants fame, success and money far more than a "good fit". If he ends up playing for someone else at some point in time, my guess is that community will hear how much he loves it thousands of times too.
I never said he wasn't a fan of the Browns.... I wanted to say that people who say "He wants to play for the Browns" as if it's the team he's dreamed of leading all his life, especially his college years, is a bunch of BS. By his actions over the years (for example, charging kids 75 bucks for autographs before even signing an NFL contract, or holding out on the team he "wants to play for"), it appears to me that Quinn wants fame, success and money far more than a "good fit". If he ends up playing for someone else at some point in time, my guess is that community will hear how much he loves it thousands of times too.
they know very well what you meant D&S, you said it clearly here:
I have seen outside claims that the Browns were his childhood favorite, and I don't doubt that, but he often claimed he wanted to be #1, even to the point of saying head to head he was more NFL ready than Russell.
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D&S was just trying to spin the facts so it would appear that BQ only became a Browns fan once he was drafted by them.
I never said he wasn't a fan of the Browns.... I wanted to say that people who say "He wants to play for the Browns" as if it's the team he's dreamed of leading all his life, especially his college years, is a bunch of BS. By his actions over the years (for example, charging kids 75 bucks for autographs before even signing an NFL contract, or holding out on the team he "wants to play for"), it appears to me that Quinn wants fame, success and money far more than a "good fit". If he ends up playing for someone else at some point in time, my guess is that community will hear how much he loves it thousands of times too.
I never said he wasn't a fan of the Browns.... I wanted to say that people who say "He wants to play for the Browns" as if it's the team he's dreamed of leading all his life, especially his college years, is a bunch of BS. By his actions over the years (for example, charging kids 75 bucks for autographs before even signing an NFL contract, or holding out on the team he "wants to play for"), it appears to me that Quinn wants fame, success and money far more than a "good fit". If he ends up playing for someone else at some point in time, my guess is that community will hear how much he loves it thousands of times too.
Quinn was purposely held out of the first camp as to not interfere with the competition between DA and Frye, which DA lost.
You always make this stupid shit up D&S
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If DA beats out BQ then we better start looking at the front office again.
Your not turning down picks for Quinn if you think DA even has a shot at beating him out.
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You respect results?
So what results has DA delivered consistently? He's consistenly inconsistent, that's about it. The fact you keep pimping him tells me that you DON'T respect 'results over potential'.
Give me a xxxxing break, 'Mr. Neutral'. There's a Quinn bias here, because we're sick of watching Anderson throw games away, and we want to see what the guy who was highly touted, won a lot of games at Notre Dame and set records while there can do. I can't name one poster who is on this board because he is a 'Brady Quinn' fan. If it were Sanchez, or any other QB we picked in the first round sitting behind Anderson, we'd STILL feel the same way. Hell, look at the way we felt with Couch and Holcomb.
There is no bias 'for Quinn' per se. There's a bias against seeing a guy shit the bed every time he's put into a pressure situation.
Jesus. Some people go beyond Retarded.
now why you gotta get all personal, lemosley? that's how you can differentiate who the Quinnies are, those of you who are apparently personally invested in Quinn's success, taking offense and wading in here, tossing around the personal attacks. (i don't mind them though, it's been my style too.)
what results has DA delivered consistently? now Lem, how in the world can Derek consistently improve when Lerner is trumping Romeo's authority and yanking the guy in the second year of his development? in this land of McDonald's drive thru's and Netflix-instantly-streaming movies i can understand the "right now" attitude of Americans, but you need to break out of that mold when it comes to QB's. like i said, he was 22, 23, and 24 years old when you've seen him. some QB's don't even get their first start until they're that old. this kid has a ton of experience for his age and many would see value in that. so why don't a lot of Browns fans? because he's sitting beside a potential superstar? maybe. but based upon what? college? lmao. if he was all that it would've shown up already. he hasn't been that guy, but i'm old enough to realize he could still become that guy. and the same goes for Derek Anderson.
"HE'S HAD LONG ENOUGH, DAMMIT!!"
why are his showings ages 22-24 the end all be all with Derek and w/ Quinn it's always "the finger", "it wasn't Quinn vs the Broncos on the scoreboard", "Quinn was playing behind an
unprepared, disorganized, unmotivated and undisciplined team"...
why doesn't Derek get the same good will? he played through a concussion after all, while the finger wasn't even serious enough to affect his game.
your post earlier about him only having 3 days to prepare (you actually morphed it to 2 lol) is just more excuses for him. it's more like he had a season and a half to prepare. the #2 prepares every day to be the starter, not just that week. that gameplan was so vanilla it was laughable. as Brady came to the sidelines to review he displayed the quintessential "deer in the headlights" look as Derek merely glanced over to absorb the same information. it was telling to those that wanted to see it, as Derek appeared to have full grasp of what was happening. at least that's how i saw it.
"we're not willing to bet the franchise on him [DA], and you have a young guy who has shown some promise, so it's his time"...but said guy hasn't even been able to beat out the old guy to get the start. why do we need to supercede the coaches and award a guy "his time" if he can't win the start on his own? that's all i'm asking. if Quinn wins the competition, we'll know he's improved beyond where he was last year in his development.
There is no bias 'for Quinn' per se. There's a bias against seeing a guy shit the bed every time he's put into a pressure situation.
that's a load of crap, otherwise you'd be in favor of him adding some more tools to his toolbox and taking us to the promised land. you do care who that guy is who takes us there and you want that guy to be Quinn. admit it.that's a load of crap, otherwise you'd be in favor of him adding some more tools to his toolbox and taking us to the promised land. you do care who that guy is who takes us there and you want that guy to be Quinn. admit it.
The rest of your 'post' isn't worth the effort it would take to disentangle. No offense, but quotes work much better.
I'd be in favor of who adding more tools? Anderson or Quinn? Or both? Of course, whoever can add the tools and performs better game in and game out. Problem is, Anderson hasn't done that and has never been consistent.
He does the same things in the NFL he did in college. Should we give him a couple more years 'hoping' he'll finally 'get it'? Or do we move on to the next guy and try and figure out what we have before the draft next year?
You keep wanting to give DA credit for 07, then say 'it wasn't his fault in 08'. Same team. Same coaches. If you want to give him the glory, then he gets the shit with it. While, IMO, he was part of the problem in 2008, he also benefitted GREATLY from a cast playing what appears to have been above their level in 2007. When the team is down, Anderson goes and sucks right with them. Unlike a Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, he doesn't make the guys around him better; on the contrary, he needs the guys around him to make HIM better.
I vote for 'move on' and see what we've got in Quinn. If he's garbage, there's what looks like a lot of good QBs coming out in next years class. Personally, I'd LOVE to see Colt McCoy in a Browns uni.
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no problem here with anaylzing DA at all. hell, i do it too. it's the incessant name-calling of a Brownie and certainty he's already jumped the shark i take offense to.
i know he has faults but definitely saw improvement from '07 to '08, which gives me reason to believe he is still progressing. i'm really forgiving though, just look at my affinity for Edwards. lol if Quinn is ahead of him in his development now>>>all the better. i don't necessarily want either, i just want the best we can get. i even had fingers crossed for Cutler a couple months ago.
it's all about winning. Mangini, MAKE IT HAPPEN.
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I never said he wasn't a fan of the Browns.... I wanted to say that people who say "He wants to play for the Browns" as if it's the team he's dreamed of leading all his life, especially his college years, is a bunch of BS. By his actions over the years (for example, charging kids 75 bucks for autographs before even signing an NFL contract, or holding out on the team he "wants to play for"), it appears to me that Quinn wants fame, success and money far more than a "good fit". If he ends up playing for someone else at some point in time, my guess is that community will hear how much he loves it thousands of times too.
Quinn was purposely held out of the first camp as to not interfere with the competition between DA and Frye, which DA lost.
You always make this stupid shit up D&S
AdaM said:
Quinn was purposely held out of the first camp as to not interfere with the competition between DA and Frye, which DA lost.You always make this stupid shit up D&S
Seriously, you trying to say he didn't hold out on the Browns? Who's making shit up now? http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/20114986"]http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/20114986 http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html...75BC0A9619C8B63
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@jadbf said:
so you're saying if I have a similar injury and I don't have surgery, then I am not ensuring it will heal properly? and my doctor is failing and giving me bad advice??again what point exactly are you making? maybe the problem with people making the finger issue is because you try to make little flippant jokes and snide comments about it and refuse to acknowledge the fact that it WAS a serious injury.
because every time I refute your claims, you try to change your definition and use more vague terms to try and defend your undefendable position, because you just can't admit you might be wrong.
The fact that surgery was used as an option is a CLEAR SIGN that it was a serious injury. any way you try to diminish that fact is just silly.
omg. when this all began i quoted the posters in this thread and their excuses for Quinn's lack of success. "the finger" was one of them. out of a thousand words typed, that's the sentence you chose to zero in on. "a thousand posts nit-picking" is not my words, so i don't know what you're saying there. no one knows how serious it really was or how much it affected his game.
players have surgery for anything and everything, regardless of seriousness. it's a luxury they can afford. while i'll contend playing helped injure the finger further, as it was reported, a player having surgery in and of itself does not define the extent of it's severity. you must be absolutely bored.
i intended to refute Adam's contention that BQ never held out but thankfully there are now links. while Chud was installing his offense from the very beginning Quinn was a no-show...for two weeks. by the time he finally showed up he had missed so much he had no chance of challenging Frye or DA for the position. had he shown up, who knows?
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no problem here with anaylzing DA at all. hell, i do it too. it's the incessant name-calling of a Brownie and certainty he's already jumped the shark i take offense to.
i know he has faults but definitely saw improvement from '07 to '08, which gives me reason to believe he is still progressing. i'm really forgiving though, just look at my affinity for Edwards. lol if Quinn is ahead of him in his development now>>>all the better. i don't necessarily want either, i just want the best we can get. i even had fingers crossed for Cutler a couple months ago.
it's all about winning. Mangini, MAKE IT HAPPEN.
no problem here with anaylzing DA at all. hell, i do it too. it's the incessant name-calling of a Brownie and certainty he's already jumped the shark i take offense to.
i know he has faults but definitely saw improvement from '07 to '08, which gives me reason to believe he is still progressing. i'm really forgiving though, just look at my affinity for Edwards. lol if Quinn is ahead of him in his development now>>>all the better. i don't necessarily want either, i just want the best we can get. i even had fingers crossed for Cutler a couple months ago.
it's all about winning. Mangini, MAKE IT HAPPEN.
Please, show us these 'improvements' from 07 to 08 in DA's game.
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watch the games. watch his near perfect play against the Giants, his poise vs the Colts, and his improvement on his short game. gotta run now, you'll have to find something else to do for the last 1.5 hrs of your shift.
happy hump day.
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If DA beats out BQ then we better start looking at the front office again.
Your not turning down picks for Quinn if you think DA even has a shot at beating him out.
Post of the thread.
Why anyone is bantering with Sisky is beyond me. Guy has an agenda and he sounds eerily like OSUSev with his irrational hatred of "the favorite". I love a good underdog story too. The emphasis on "good". I just can't see investing more time betting on the "come" with DA when we can see what we've got with Quinn now. If Quinn sucks, move on.
But, as Hammer said, if the staff felt the probability was high that Quinn would "suck", they would have taken the picks for him in a heartbeat.
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This is not directed at any individual but it's good advise. " Never argue with an idiot - they'll bring you down to their level then beat you
with experience. "
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Sisky! Are you stirring things up once again?
He's like a puppy, breaking things, running around aimlessly, eating his own shit... etc.
Cold hard facts show that DA is inconsistent, and cant throw a short pass.
In Quinn's only full, uninjured game he posted a QB rating over 100, that was his first start ever, and he had little or no time to prepare, good d or bad d, that was the case.
The second game, the Browns won, Quinn drove the ball down the field and put us in consistent FG position. He then broke his finger on his throwing hand.
Romeo Crennel wasnt as dumb as you may think, he took Quinns word that he could play, because it would look awfull to have DA start after Quinn was 1-1 with a QB rating over 100 injured or not injured.
Quinn played the Texans game, made a few good throws (the 30 yarder to Braylon), but was still throwing in pain, and his delivery was off. It was freezing in the stadium that day (I was there), The cold, and the finger, and the stress he put on it throughout the game caused him to screw up his passes, and led to the 2 picks. One of the ints. wasnt even his fault, and the other could have been a TD but it was off the mark (due to his injured finger)
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Sisky! Are you stirring things up once again?
He's like a puppy, breaking things, running around aimlessly, eating his own shit... etc.
Cold hard facts show that DA is inconsistent, and cant throw a short pass.
In Quinn's only full, uninjured game he posted a QB rating over 100, that was his first start ever, and he had little or no time to prepare, good d or bad d, that was the case.
The second game, the Browns won, Quinn drove the ball down the field and put us in consistent FG position. He then broke his finger on his throwing hand.
Romeo Crennel wasnt as dumb as you may think, he took Quinns word that he could play, because it would look awfull to have DA start after Quinn was 1-1 with a QB rating over 100 injured or not injured.
Quinn played the Texans game, made a few good throws (the 30 yarder to Braylon), but was still throwing in pain, and his delivery was off. It was freezing in the stadium that day (I was there), The cold, and the finger, and the stress he put on it throughout the game caused him to screw up his passes, and led to the 2 picks. One of the ints. wasnt even his fault, and the other could have been a TD but it was off the mark (due to his injured finger)
In Quinn's only full, uninjured game he posted a QB rating over 100, that was his first start ever, and he had little or no time to prepare, good d or bad d, that was the case.
It's tough to put all your marbles on one game. People keep pointing out the 104 or whatever rating in Quinn's first game. Well, it was against a team that gave up an average of 98.5 and the Browns still lost. As far as little time to prepare... he had a season and a half in the offense, he got half of preseason with the ones, it wasn't like he just walked in off the street. That said, he showed potential, but one game is not proof. Heck, DA showed good potential in his first NFL appearance... coming in with the Browns down, he has a 90+ game and leads the team on the verge of a three win season to a win against playoff bound Kansas City... see, anyone can play that one game short notice stuff.
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D&S was just trying to spin the facts so it would appear that BQ only became a Browns fan once he was drafted by them.
I never said he wasn't a fan of the Browns.... I wanted to say that people who say "He wants to play for the Browns" as if it's the team he's dreamed of leading all his life, especially his college years, is a bunch of BS. By his actions over the years (for example, charging kids 75 bucks for autographs before even signing an NFL contract, or holding out on the team he "wants to play for"), it appears to me that Quinn wants fame, success and money far more than a "good fit". If he ends up playing for someone else at some point in time, my guess is that community will hear how much he loves it thousands of times too.
I never said he wasn't a fan of the Browns.... I wanted to say that people who say "He wants to play for the Browns" as if it's the team he's dreamed of leading all his life, especially his college years, is a bunch of BS. By his actions over the years (for example, charging kids 75 bucks for autographs before even signing an NFL contract, or holding out on the team he "wants to play for"), it appears to me that Quinn wants fame, success and money far more than a "good fit". If he ends up playing for someone else at some point in time, my guess is that community will hear how much he loves it thousands of times too.
Right, but nobody ever made that drawn-out, exagerrated claim. He lucked into our dream gig, and he happened to be a fan too. Once a Browns fan, always a Browns fan - especially when you're born into it.
With regards to his pre draft quotes you have to understand what a tight rope those guys are walking with what their agents are feeding them to say, etc. "Don't shut any doors," etc. I'm sure Condon had a stroke when Quinn said he was a Browns fan growing up. Any agent who is worth a damn tells his clients to shut up and say you're a fan of your college team, and you want to be drafted #1. Motivation = $$$.
oh, and:
The company that hosted the BQ autograph event got the coin, Brady gets a flat rate for showing up. Standard stuff.
Quinn held out for a starting QB contract, because in August of 2007, we didn't have one. Can't fault him for that, especially after the move the FO made to get him. And again, this is what is getting pumped into his ear from Condon. Having followed him through all 4 years at ND, I guarantee you he wanted to be on the field.
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And finally Legacy, DA in Quinn's position would have done the EXACT same things. What potential first round QB draftee doesn't?
Nothing to see on this line of thinking. Move on all.
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Yeah, I agree - and I think D&S probably does too. He's a good dude and the only manwagoner on here I can tolerate and he's been venturing off into lu-lu-land recently - I just felt I needed to address some incorrect info.
Of course, I've got the real ding-a-lings on ignore, so it could all just be relative.
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@jadbf said:
Now this is a post that leads right into sisky's handsbecause YES YOU DO. They really didn't have any good film to base their decision on Quinn on. So you have two QBs on your roster. One you have more than a season's worth of film on, and he has some bright spots and some things that need work. and then you have a 1st round draft pick who some people are saying has the potential to be very good. Niether of these QBs will hurt you cap wise. For me I'd do exactly what Mangini did. Keep them both unless I get a deal that blows me out of the water. getting one 1st round pick in exchange for a guy that was already a 1st round pick isn't good enough.
You now go through camp and find out which QB you prefer for your team, and then at some point in the future trade the other.
JADBF with a qb available in the draft and the coaches having plenty of film on DA. Quinn's exchange value was more than 1 pick supposedly.
Its not all bad having DA on the roster but my opinion is that they have a high level of confidence in Quinn for the future of this team. Another scenario could be that the past season waiting in the wings didn't really qualify because of the shitfest of game planning and coaching. Hard to pick up quality stuff if there is very little around. Could Quinn need another year on the bench? I personally don't think so.
The new front office has a plan for its qb's, we just know what it is
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In Quinn's only full, uninjured game he posted a QB rating over 100, that was his first start ever, and he had little or no time to prepare, good d or bad d, that was the case.
It's tough to put all your marbles on one game. People keep pointing out the 104 or whatever rating in Quinn's first game. Well, it was against a team that gave up an average of 98.5 and the Browns still lost. As far as little time to prepare... he had a season and a half in the offense, he got half of preseason with the ones, it wasn't like he just walked in off the street. That said, he showed potential, but one game is not proof. Heck, DA showed good potential in his first NFL appearance... coming in with the Browns down, he has a 90+ game and leads the team on the verge of a three win season to a win against playoff bound Kansas City... see, anyone can play that one game short notice stuff.
It's tough to put all your marbles on one game. People keep pointing out the 104 or whatever rating in Quinn's first game. Well, it was against a team that gave up an average of 98.5 and the Browns still lost.
Quinn led us to 30 points in that game against Denver. 30 should spot you a win if your defense doesn't completely suck, no matter what. So mentioning the fact that we still lost is kinda like saying we still lost back when Kosar was playing impeccable ball and our defense was losing the games for us.
Second of all, you said it yourself, Denver had QBs at 98.5 and they let a rookie post a 104 in his first game ever on like 3 days notice. I'll take that any day of the week, BRAH.
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@jadbf said:
Oh come on now, really? I can now go hand pick the games where DA sucked that were before and after those games and claime he has regressed right?see this is what I mean. you want to sound funny and smart...and in trying, you fail miserably.
nope. it's like when you have unbelievable sex w/ a girl a few times but then at other times it's just ok. but when it was great, it was the best you'd had in a decade plus. you know the potential's there, you just have to tap into it. a wise man doesn't just throw that away>>>he tries to figure out how to have it every day.
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@jadbf said:
No I am not bored, I'm just trying to get you pinned down to one point, to which you keep changing and squirming. Because I specifically asked you if players routinely recieved surgery for things that weren't serious. and you replied."no, i'm saying NFL players sometimes get surgery for things when you or i wouldn't."
so now you are changing your tune and telling me that players get surgery for injuries that aren't serious?
add that to the fact you never answered me that if Quinn's injury wasn't serious, why didn't they put him back in after DA got hurt?
what do you mean? i answered all that, over here.
and i answered the surgery thing like three times without ever changing my tune. this is all in the past and meaningless in the grand scheme of things anyway, JADBF. so why grind axes about it?
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