So much winning...
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yes, "strategic" tariffs. not sure they were ever for an all out trade war like trump is fixin for. im no expert but it seems the time for such a war was decades ago when we had more leverage. with burgeoning consumer markets in parts asia,india and perhaps russia....alot of these countries could potentially say fuk u donald and dump their products elsrwhere. the world doesnt "need" the u.s economy quite like it used to. if he's not careful he could blow us up harder than any russian nuke
Careful is probably a minor aspect of any plan. Murphy's Law. Remember the flood of crappy Japanese steel in the 70s? Remember when made in Japan was a joke? But sure as other countries develop their Manufacturing and farming capability there will be competition for what ever we have to sell. History didn't begin 5 years ago.
WSS
Careful is probably a minor aspect of any plan. Murphy's Law. Remember the flood of crappy Japanese steel in the 70s? Remember when made in Japan was a joke? But sure as other countries develop their Manufacturing and farming capability there will be competition for what ever we have to sell. History didn't begin 5 years ago.
WSS
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yes, "strategic" tariffs. not sure they were ever for an all out trade war like trump is fixin for. im no expert but it seems the time for such a war was decades ago when we had more leverage. with burgeoning consumer markets in parts asia,india and perhaps russia....alot of these countries could potentially say fuk u donald and dump their products elsrwhere. the world doesnt "need" the u.s economy quite like it used to. if he's not careful he could blow us up harder than any russian nuke
Careful is probably a minor aspect of any plan. Murphy's Law. Remember the flood of crappy Japanese steel in the 70s? Remember when made in Japan was a joke? But sure as other countries develop their Manufacturing and farming capability there will be competition for what ever we have to sell. History didn't begin 5 years ago.
WSS
Careful is probably a minor aspect of any plan. Murphy's Law. Remember the flood of crappy Japanese steel in the 70s? Remember when made in Japan was a joke? But sure as other countries develop their Manufacturing and farming capability there will be competition for what ever we have to sell. History didn't begin 5 years ago.
WSS
"careful" is a minor aspect to a plan that could potentially affect over a 100m people? what??
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Careful is probably a minor aspect of any plan. Murphy's Law. Remember the flood of crappy Japanese steel in the 70s? Remember when made in Japan was a joke? But sure as other countries develop their Manufacturing and farming capability there will be competition for what ever we have to sell. History didn't begin 5 years ago.
WSS
"careful" is a minor aspect to a plan that could potentially affect over a 100m people? what??
"careful" is a minor aspect to a plan that could potentially affect over a 100m people? what??
Read the next two words. Murphy's Law.
The best laid plans gang aft agley. Plus it doesn't matter the level of care because the other side is going to hate everything about it no matter what.
I have no doubt that there are dozens of people who are considered experts in this crap putting it together. Guarantee? Please.
WSS
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no offense because this stuff aint common knowledge, but i dont think u undetstand nearly enough about this to fully grasp the consequences. like it or not we've laid a bed rock to our economy on these trade deals. i dont like alot of em, i agree "in theory" with alot of what trump says about our trade structure. ive said this numerous times that its about fukking time a president deals with this. i was all onboard with playing hardball with china.....but what i would consider sheer unadulterated madness is starting ww3 in trade. u deal with one trade block at a time.
i cant conceive of a beneficial outcome to starting a trade war with every single trading partner we have. we'll lose our leverage. china is going to see the tariffs that canada, mexico, the entire EU, the mars colony's etc,etc....put on us and they'll say to themselves we can wait the u.s out because they're going to get hammered by everyone else. does that make sense? and in the meantime short term what this insterstellar trade war is going to do to us might cause massive perturbations in our standard of living. if those countries band together and threaten the u.s dollar as the reserve what u think u have saved up in the bank right now will get hit like the hindenberg. prices will not immediately adjust. u ready to go a few days without food steve? u dont look like a guy kin to missing too many meals know what i mean?
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Oooh fat jokes; I'm crushed. Here's how I see this. There are always guys on the Browns board that like to spew their pompous opinions and sneer at everyone else, bragging about their superlative knowledge of football and the dearth of knowledge amongst the others. I say those guys are windbags, sucking air and no more. In football the guy that fetches coffee for the lowliest assistant coach on the team more than likely has a hundred times more knowledge that any boastful clown on an internet message board. Here you are bragging about your deep knowledge of the workings involved in trade policy. First of all the people involved in this, whether you like them personally or not , know more about the stuff that you would know if you spent the rest of your life studying it. And these are the people, like it or not, that are putting together these policies based on whatever theories they are hoping are correct. Millions of factors can change that either way.
I don't have a professional grasp on this issue but the difference is I don't pretend to. Unlke you these people are experts. If you are seriously in fear of a financial meltdown because we have slapped a little tariff on Canada who is little more than a barnacle on The Good Ship USA, time to pack your stuff and move north.
WSS
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no ur right, which is why i preceded with "im no expert" and i fully acknowledge i dont know the overall plan. but i do know a bit more than the basucs vecause it was part of my degree. agaon, not an expert. heres the problem though, i have close personal friebds in economics and finance....who are not liberals so there goes ur first objection.
second, what we've seen from the trump administration so far is a revolving door. he assured us from the beginning that he's got all the best people in place and all the best people wanna come work for him. yet he gets rid of these people at a pace never seen before and their replacements then get replaced, when is it going to end? that famous picture now of trump with merkle, who's next to trump but bolton....who's trumps national security adviser not his econ guy which is kudlow. why bton was there and not kudlow...u got me. i know enough to smell a guy who's "wingin it"
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no ur right, which is why i preceded with "im no expert" and i fully acknowledge i dont know the overall plan. but i do know a bit more than the basucs vecause it was part of my degree. agaon, not an expert. heres the problem though, i have close personal friebds in economics and finance....who are not liberals so there goes ur first objection.
second, what we've seen from the trump administration so far is a revolving door. he assured us from the beginning that he's got all the best people in place and all the best people wanna come work for him. yet he gets rid of these people at a pace never seen before and their replacements then get replaced, when is it going to end? that famous picture now of trump with merkle, who's next to trump but bolton....who's trumps national security adviser not his econ guy which is kudlow. why bton was there and not kudlow...u got me. i know enough to smell a guy who's "wingin it"
no ur right, which is why i preceded with "im no expert" and i fully acknowledge i dont know the overall plan. but i do know a bit more than the basucs vecause it was part of my degree. agaon, not an expert. heres the problem though, i have close personal friebds in economics and finance....who are not liberals so there goes ur first objection.
second, what we've seen from the trump administration so far is a revolving door. he assured us from the beginning that he's got all the best people in place and all the best people wanna come work for him. yet he gets rid of these people at a pace never seen before and their replacements then get replaced, when is it going to end? that famous picture now of trump with merkle, who's next to trump but bolton....who's trumps national security adviser not his econ guy which is kudlow. why bton was there and not kudlow...u got me. i know enough to smell a guy who's "wingin it"
If Trump ever makes a visit here I will offer to take him for a free meal at the local Wingstop Restaurant. He's earned it.?
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so heres a guy who factually and demonstrably knows more about the economy and trade than trump...and this is not a liberal.
http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2018/march/12/tariffs-are-not-the-answer/
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"President Trump’s planned 25 percent tariff on steel imports and 10 percent tariff on aluminum imports may provide a temporary boost for those industries, but the tariffs will do tremendous long-term damage to the American and global economies. Tariffs raise the price of, and reduce demand for, imported goods. Tariffs ensure the preferences of politicians, instead of the preferences of consumers, to determine how resources are allocated. This reduces economic efficiency and living standards.
Some justify these economic inefficiencies as being worth it to save American jobs. This ignores how tariffs increase costs of production for industries reliant on imported materials to produce their products. These increased costs lead to job losses in those industries. For example, President Trump’s proposed steel tariff could cost nearly 40,000 jobs in the steel-dependent auto manufacturing industry. Tariffs also cause job losses in industries reliant on exports. This is especially true if — as is likely to be the case — other countries respond to President Trump’s actions by increasing tariffs on US products.
Many of President Trump’s critics do not themselves support true free trade, which is the voluntary exchange of goods and services across borders. Instead, they support the managed (by government) trade of NAFTA and the World Trade Organization (WTO). NAFTA and the WTO promote world government and crony capitalism, not free markets. Any libertarian or free-market conservative who thinks the WTO promotes economic liberty should remember that the WTO once ordered Congress to raise taxes!
Foreign manufacturers may make convenient scapegoats for the problems facing US industry. However, the truth is that most of the problems plaguing American businesses stem from the US government. American businesses are burdened by thousands of federal regulations controlling every aspect of their operations. The tax system also burdens businesses. Until last year’s tax reform bill, the US had the highest corporate tax rates in the developed world. The tax reform bill lowered corporate taxes, but the US corporate tax rate is still higher than that of many other developed countries.
The United States not only spends more on military weapons than the combined budgets of the next eight biggest spending countries, but also spends billions subsidizing the defense of developed counties like Germany, Japan, and South Korea. Bringing US troops home from these countries is an excellent place to start reducing spending on militarism.
The biggest cause of our economic problems is the Federal Reserve. America’s experiment with fiat currency has enabled a system based on private and public debt. This makes trade imbalances inevitable as the US government needs foreign investors to purchase its debt. Foreign investors get the money to purchase the US government’s debt by selling products to American consumers. A trade war could cause foreign investors to stop buying US debt instruments and could end the dollar’s world reserves currency status. This would cause a major economic crisis — but at least it would stop our shores from being flooded with “cheap foreign goods.”
President Trump’s claim that trade wars can be easily won is as credible as the neoconservative claim that the Iraq War would be a cakewalk. A trade war would likely push the global economy into a recession or worse. Instead of imposing costs on American businesses and consumers and putting those whose livelihoods depend on imports out of s job, President Trump should address the real causes of our economic problems: the welfare-warfare state, the IRS, and the Federal Reserve."
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now theres a mother fukker that knows what the fuk is up with both parties in washington
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now theres a mother fukker that knows what the fuk is up with both parties in washington
now theres a mother fukker that knows what the fuk is up with both parties in washington
And what expert might that be?
WSS
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now theres a mother fukker that knows what the fuk is up with both parties in washington
And what expert might that be?
WSS
And what expert might that be?
WSS
click the link lazy boy....
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"President Trump’s planned 25 percent tariff on steel imports and 10 percent tariff on aluminum imports may provide a temporary boost for those industries, but the tariffs will do tremendous long-term damage to the American and global economies. Tariffs raise the price of, and reduce demand for, imported goods. Tariffs ensure the preferences of politicians, instead of the preferences of consumers, to determine how resources are allocated. This reduces economic efficiency and living standards.
Some justify these economic inefficiencies as being worth it to save American jobs. This ignores how tariffs increase costs of production for industries reliant on imported materials to produce their products. These increased costs lead to job losses in those industries. For example, President Trump’s proposed steel tariff could cost nearly 40,000 jobs in the steel-dependent auto manufacturing industry. Tariffs also cause job losses in industries reliant on exports. This is especially true if — as is likely to be the case — other countries respond to President Trump’s actions by increasing tariffs on US products.
Many of President Trump’s critics do not themselves support true free trade, which is the voluntary exchange of goods and services across borders. Instead, they support the managed (by government) trade of NAFTA and the World Trade Organization (WTO). NAFTA and the WTO promote world government and crony capitalism, not free markets. Any libertarian or free-market conservative who thinks the WTO promotes economic liberty should remember that the WTO once ordered Congress to raise taxes!
Foreign manufacturers may make convenient scapegoats for the problems facing US industry. However, the truth is that most of the problems plaguing American businesses stem from the US government. American businesses are burdened by thousands of federal regulations controlling every aspect of their operations. The tax system also burdens businesses. Until last year’s tax reform bill, the US had the highest corporate tax rates in the developed world. The tax reform bill lowered corporate taxes, but the US corporate tax rate is still higher than that of many other developed countries.
The United States not only spends more on military weapons than the combined budgets of the next eight biggest spending countries, but also spends billions subsidizing the defense of developed counties like Germany, Japan, and South Korea. Bringing US troops home from these countries is an excellent place to start reducing spending on militarism.
The biggest cause of our economic problems is the Federal Reserve. America’s experiment with fiat currency has enabled a system based on private and public debt. This makes trade imbalances inevitable as the US government needs foreign investors to purchase its debt. Foreign investors get the money to purchase the US government’s debt by selling products to American consumers. A trade war could cause foreign investors to stop buying US debt instruments and could end the dollar’s world reserves currency status. This would cause a major economic crisis — but at least it would stop our shores from being flooded with “cheap foreign goods.”
President Trump’s claim that trade wars can be easily won is as credible as the neoconservative claim that the Iraq War would be a cakewalk. A trade war would likely push the global economy into a recession or worse. Instead of imposing costs on American businesses and consumers and putting those whose livelihoods depend on imports out of s job, President Trump should address the real causes of our economic problems: the welfare-warfare state, the IRS, and the Federal Reserve."
"President Trump’s planned 25 percent tariff on steel imports and 10 percent tariff on aluminum imports may provide a temporary boost for those industries, but the tariffs will do tremendous long-term damage to the American and global economies. Tariffs raise the price of, and reduce demand for, imported goods. Tariffs ensure the preferences of politicians, instead of the preferences of consumers, to determine how resources are allocated. This reduces economic efficiency and living standards.
Some justify these economic inefficiencies as being worth it to save American jobs. This ignores how tariffs increase costs of production for industries reliant on imported materials to produce their products. These increased costs lead to job losses in those industries. For example, President Trump’s proposed steel tariff could cost nearly 40,000 jobs in the steel-dependent auto manufacturing industry. Tariffs also cause job losses in industries reliant on exports. This is especially true if — as is likely to be the case — other countries respond to President Trump’s actions by increasing tariffs on US products.
Many of President Trump’s critics do not themselves support true free trade, which is the voluntary exchange of goods and services across borders. Instead, they support the managed (by government) trade of NAFTA and the World Trade Organization (WTO). NAFTA and the WTO promote world government and crony capitalism, not free markets. Any libertarian or free-market conservative who thinks the WTO promotes economic liberty should remember that the WTO once ordered Congress to raise taxes!
Foreign manufacturers may make convenient scapegoats for the problems facing US industry. However, the truth is that most of the problems plaguing American businesses stem from the US government. American businesses are burdened by thousands of federal regulations controlling every aspect of their operations. The tax system also burdens businesses. Until last year’s tax reform bill, the US had the highest corporate tax rates in the developed world. The tax reform bill lowered corporate taxes, but the US corporate tax rate is still higher than that of many other developed countries.
The United States not only spends more on military weapons than the combined budgets of the next eight biggest spending countries, but also spends billions subsidizing the defense of developed counties like Germany, Japan, and South Korea. Bringing US troops home from these countries is an excellent place to start reducing spending on militarism.
The biggest cause of our economic problems is the Federal Reserve. America’s experiment with fiat currency has enabled a system based on private and public debt. This makes trade imbalances inevitable as the US government needs foreign investors to purchase its debt. Foreign investors get the money to purchase the US government’s debt by selling products to American consumers. A trade war could cause foreign investors to stop buying US debt instruments and could end the dollar’s world reserves currency status. This would cause a major economic crisis — but at least it would stop our shores from being flooded with “cheap foreign goods.”
President Trump’s claim that trade wars can be easily won is as credible as the neoconservative claim that the Iraq War would be a cakewalk. A trade war would likely push the global economy into a recession or worse. Instead of imposing costs on American businesses and consumers and putting those whose livelihoods depend on imports out of s job, President Trump should address the real causes of our economic problems: the welfare-warfare state, the IRS, and the Federal Reserve."
I don't see any link here. Not that I give that much of a damn about it but...
WSS
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now theres a mother fukker that knows what the fuk is up with both parties in washington
now theres a mother fukker that knows what the fuk is up with both parties in washington
And I don't see any link here either.
WSS
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that was the excerpt from tbe previous post i made linking to the ron paul institute. so u read ron pauls writing
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get it now?
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get it now?
get it now?
Okay BFD it's Ron Paul. Why go through this pain in my butt rather than just say it was Ron Paul? I don't care much about him one way or the other. And all this blather is still speculation we don't even know what forms these tariffs are going to exactly entail. Or how they will be negotiated, or whether or not they'll be any trade war no matter how hysterical MSNBC and the New York Times yet.
Some people think Paul is cool because they think he's independent. Bottom line is I'm sure there are any number of educated economist with any number of opinions.
WSS
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One thing I can guarantee however, is the fact that the Trump haters would be apoplectic if he made some sort of a deal allowing more foreign steel and aluminum into the country. Then you guys will be crying about cheap for and steel putting the honest American worker out of business. Face it Cleve its politics. All you have to do is a simple Google search and the usual gang is suspects will have their opinion pages screaming trade War trade War trade War.
WSS
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and thsys why i listen to men like ron paul who have the same msg since, well...the 80's. even tho i thi k krugman is a smart guy and is right on some things...his political bias is "quite obvious" so i dont pay much attn to him. Paul is outside the right vs left political spectrum. i guarantee u paul agrees wirh trump in principal with alot of things and vice versa....but u can see paul is concerned about the aforementioned galactic trade war that seems imminent.
my point of all this is that im not wetting my finger and holding it up to the wind such as guys like you do. im drawing on multiple sources that ive been listening to for quite some time and they too arent drifting in the political winds. do i agree with paul on everything? ofc not. try researching some stuff sometime instead of being spoonfed from one immutable source. its interesting stuff frankly even if at times you cant follow everything because you dont have a phd in econ. men like ron paul make it a point to break things down succinctly for people who havent studied econ professionally. educating urself doesnt mean ur going to magically turn into a liberal and start going to the truck stop gloryholes on the weekend with diehard.....although im sure he'd love to have you along.
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