Jonathan Paul Manziel

The Gipper

@hoorta said:

He'll have to wreck the CFL before he gets a shot at wrecking the NFL. I don't like his odds.

Then there is the Arena League...but that thing has almost all but folded up shop. There are only 4 teams left in that system:

http://www.afldigital.com/index.cfm?view=standings

Not sure why they bother at this point.

mjp28

Wow I didn't realize that the former (about) 16 team league in 2003 was so bad off.....and further the decline of American football at all levels, I quit watching it years back. Had a PA buddy follow the Pittsburgh Gladiators in their one season around 1986.

And the new IFL.....The Indoor Football League (IFL) is a professional indoor American footballleague created in 2008 out of the merger between the Intense Football League and United Indoor Football. The league is the second highest tier in indoor/arena football behind the Arena Football League (AFL).^{[citation needed]} IFL players earn a minimum of US$250 per game played (before taxes). The season is typically about 14 games long, plus playoffs of two or more rounds......

T.O. was involved in that? Six or so teams? Never followed it at all.

The Gipper

@mjp28 said:

Wow I didn't realize that the former (about) 16 team league in 2003 was so bad off.....and further the decline of American football at all levels, I quit watching it years back. Had a PA buddy follow the Pittsburgh Gladiators in their one season around 1986.

And the new IFL.....The Indoor Football League (IFL) is a professional indoor American footballleague created in 2008 out of the merger between the Intense Football League and United Indoor Football. The league is the second highest tier in indoor/arena football behind the Arena Football League (AFL).^{[citation needed]} IFL players earn a minimum of US$250 per game played (before taxes). The season is typically about 14 games long, plus playoffs of two or more rounds......

T.O. was involved in that? Six or so teams? Never followed it at all.

Does it still exist?

The Gipper

further the decline of American football at all levels,

I think this is a way off base statement by you. Just because people don't want to watch bastardized football does not mean football is declining. Quite the opposite. It seems that two new football leagues are cropping up:

https://aaf.com/

The Alliance of American Football....starting Feb 9, 2019. 8 teams in southern cities. (too pussy to play in the north in winter) Lots of big names associated with it. Polian and others. Games to be shown on CBS. Cities include Phoenix, San Diego, San Antonio, Salt Lake, Birmingham, Atlanta, Orlando, Memphis. (only 2 current NFL cities)

And there is the potential for the nex XFL in 2020. Owned as you know by Vince McMahon.....but Oliver Luck...Andrew Luck's Dad, from Cleveland, has been named its new Commish.

https://www.cbssports.com/wwe/news/this-is-the-xfl-again-controversial-football-league-set-to-return-in-2020/

mjp28

@the-gipper said:

further the decline of American football at all levels,

I think this is a way off base statement by you. Just because people don't want to watch bastardized football does not mean football is declining. Quite the opposite. It seems that two new football leagues are cropping up:

Off base? Check out this screenshot on is American football decreasing in popularity. Check the sources too.....

mjp28

Pee-wee, high school, college, professional it's dropping across the board including the super bowl.

......oh edit add, what do you think is going to happen to the life blood of any sport money if these trends continue over time?

We boomers, like me, we're born and raised and lived American football I'm not so sure about the current under 40 crop.

The Gipper

Yes off-base completely off-base. If you were not off base you wouldn't have two new league is starting up.

Dutch Oven

@the-gipper said:

Yes off-base completely off-base. If you want if you were not based and you wouldn't have two new league is starting up

When either of the leagues are in existence in five years, come back to this.

Football leagues start up all the time. Virtually none of them last.

The Gipper

@dutch-oven said:

When either of the leagues are in existence in five years, come back to this.

Football leagues start up all the time. Virtually none of them last.

I expect the AAF to hang around. They have a TV contract with CBS. (and to be honest with you....I think they may in fact have the blessings of the NFL....as I think they believe that it may serve as somewhat of a minor league/feeder league for them) The new XFL, however, I give little chance of actually getting off the ground.

mjp28

@the-gipper said:

Yes off-base completely off-base. If you want if you were not based and you wouldn't have two new league is starting up

I'm talking football in the USA, all of it not some small obscure part of it which is getting canabalized by other small insignificant indoor leagues.

If the AFL which was somewhat popular in the 2000s died this probably will too before too long.

Off base? No.

mjp28

@dutch-oven said:

When either of the leagues are in existence in five years, come back to this.

Football leagues start up all the time. Virtually none of them last.

Name all of the American professional football leagues besides the NFL particularly indoor mini leagues that have been successful over time, _________ .

That's right, none. Even the old AAFL and more recently AFL ended up merging with the NFL.

These niche, gadget, cute leagues just lose any generational appeal and die.

Even the mighty NFL has it's problems right now, just read up......and that is not off base.

The Gipper

@mjp28 said:

Name all of the American professional football leagues besides the NFL particularly indoor mini leagues that have been successful over time, _________ .

That's right, none. Even the old AAFL and more recently AFL ended up merging with the NFL.

These niche, gadget, cute leagues just lose any generational appeal and die.

Even the mighty NFL has it's problems right now, just read up......and that is not off base.

You are stupidly off base. Are there minor concerns? No doubt. Are their concussion issues? Yes.

Are ratings down a bit? Yes....but then ratings are down for ALL sports....for ALL TV. Compare the ratings for TV shows from like the 80s compared to now...and you would conclude that TV is dead because of it. I guess we can now declare soccer dead in this country...because, after all, I won my bet with Hoorta who said the World Cup Final would get more than the 17 million viewers that it got in 2014. It only got like 2/3ds of the viewers of 2014. Only like 11 million viewers.

And other leagues? How many leagues now compete with the NHL, NBA, MLB? None, nada.

And, of course, given the record revenues the NFL is reaping....and the record money being paid its players...I doubt any economists would agree with your off base ideations. So, yes, Chicken Little....you can go crying that the sky is falling....because you just sound like you got hit on the head with a rock.

mjp28

@mjp28 said:

Off base? Check out this screenshot on is American football decreasing in popularity. Check the sources too.....

Remember here were discussing American professional tackle football not every major sport but there are some mutually inclusive trends.

Also not many people try to say I'm stupidly off base and succeed......well except maybe my wife. (hey but I do enjoy eating ).

The Gipper

@mjp28 said:

Remember here were discussing American professional tackle football not every major sport but there are some mutually inclusive trends.

Also not many people try to say I'm stupidly off base and succeed......well except maybe my wife. (hey but I do enjoy eating ).

How many high schools and how many colleges have shut down their football programs? None that I have heard of. And if they have done it, they have done it for totally other reasons (e.g...when the University of Chicago quit the Big Ten to become a D-III school....it had all to do with academic priorities, and none of the reasons you suggest...plus, that happened like 80 years ago).

Maybe not many people say you are stupidly off base...because you are not so stupidly off base as you are on this occasion....except. of course, as you say...in the eyes of your wife. But then who here that is married doesn't "enjoy" the same situation.

mjp28

Oh BTW many pee-wee and high schools around the country have cutback or quit, some local here even in football crazy texas, can't field 11 man football anymore going to 7/7 or zero. Many 1-A and particularly smaller colleges are getting squeezed.

See the article above from the Chicago Trib, only 4 teams left in their one league, and that's Chicago not Podunk on and on it goes.....

Just ask my wife, oh wait she's not a sports junkie like me she reads books and does other cerebral things.

mjp28

B/R BLEACHER REPORT -

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2726124-report-shows-continuing-drop-in-high-school-football-players

........The number of high school football players dropped by 25,901 participants in 2016-17, according to a report by National Federation of State High School Associations.

Football still had the highest number of overall participants, however, with 1,086,748 in total last season. An additional 61 schools added football to their athletic offerings in 2016-17 as well.

"While we are concerned when any sport experiences a decline in participation, the numbers do not substantiate that schools are dropping the sport of football," NFHS executive director Bob Gardner said. "The NFHS and its member state high school associations have worked hard to reduce the risk of injury in high school football, and we are pleased at the continued strength of the sport across the country."........continued in link......

mjp28

AP - https://www.apnews.com/66e699491a3b478293620c1e5069dc9e

........ELLICOTT CITY, Md. (AP) — On a cool and rainy afternoon during the first week of classes at Centennial High School in this well-to-do Baltimore suburb, about 50 members of the boys’ cross-country team sauntered across the parking lot for their after-school run.

Meanwhile, about 30 kids in helmets and pads were going through drills on the pristine artificial turf field at the school’s hillside football stadium.

“It used to be the other way around,” said Al Dodds, Centennial’s cross-country coach, who has 64 boys on his team this year. “Now, there’s a small turnout in football and cross-country is huge.”..........

........The decline would be much steeper if not for a handful of states in the South and the West. Throughout the Northeast, the Midwest and the West Coast, in communities urban and rural, wealthy and working-class, fewer kids are playing football.

“I’ve never been interested in football,” said 16-year-old Zach Deming, a cross-country runner at Centennial with the solid build of a defensive back. “I’m afraid of getting hurt badly, like getting a serious concussion .”........... continued in link.......

mjp28

In closing remember too that the US population or interest in sports isn't really dropping but interest in American tackle football is, so?

But no I'm not switching to sock-her.

NJ SCHOOLS DISBANDING FOOTBALL - The tip of the iceburg..... https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/highschools/the-leading-edge-of-a-much-larger-iceberg-new-jersey-high-school-disbands-football-team/2017/08/22/e13b6516-836e-11e7-82a4-920da1aeb507_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.c5f571d3c2ce

TexasAg1969

Jesssss-mjp, this looks like a Cal litany of over-responses on the Poly board.?

mjp28

@texasag1969 said:

Jesssss-mjp, this looks like a Cal litany of over-responses on the Poly board.?

Oh no, I'm in the poli board status!

......OK I deleted one. But I learned a lot more like.......

Led by the largest one-year increase in girls participation in 16 years, the overall number of participants in high school sports increased for the 28th consecutive year in 2016-17, according to the annual High School Athletics Participation Survey conducted by the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFHS).

Based on figures from the 51 NFHS member state high school associations, which includes the District of Columbia, the number of participants in high school sports reached an all-time high of 7,963,535. The increase of 94,635 participants from 2015-16 is the largest one-year jump in overall participation since the 2008-09 school year......... BUT BOYS FOOTBALL DROPPED!