NFL Hall of Fame Finalists

VikingDawg

@orion said:

Alan Faneca = 9 probowls

Alan Faneca should be disqualified for the fact he was part of the Steelers roster that was there when the Rooneys personal drug pimp Richard Rydze was having $250,000/month worth of HGH and Steroids sent from BALCO Labs to the Steelers team facility. No one from those years are deserving of the HOF.

The Gipper

@vikingdawg said:

Alan Faneca should be disqualified for the fact he was part of the Steelers roster that was there when the Rooneys personal drug pimp Richard Rydze was having $250,000/month worth of HGH and Steroids sent from BALCO Labs to the Steelers team facility. No one from those years are deserving of the HOF.

He has been a finalist 4 times already without getting in. So...maybe that HAS been a factor.

VikingDawg

He should even BE a finalist. Beside it obviously isn't a factor as other juicemonkeys like Hines Ward got in despite being roided to the gills and a dirtbag.

The Gipper

@vikingdawg said:

He should even BE a finalist. Beside it obviously isn't a factor as other juicemonkeys like Hines Ward got in despite being roided to the gills and a dirtbag.

Hines Ward is NOT in the HOF. I believe he may have been a semi-finalist....but he is definitely not in. Maybe exactly because he was considered such a dirtbag (dirty player)

The only Steelers who have made the HOF who played for them since the mid 90s are Dermonti Dawson and Jerome Bettis.

Others may make it: Pollymolly...and eventually BR.

TexasAg1969

@the-gipper said:

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/D/DixoHa00.htm

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MinnFr00.htm

Dixon 3 X Pro-bowl 2 X All-Pro

Minnifield 4 X Pro-Bowl 1 All-Pro

Lynch 9 X Pro-bowl 2 X All-Pro

Atwater 8 X Pro-Bowl 2 X All-Pro

The difference seems to be in how many Pro-Bowls they were invited to. All-Pro pretty much the same.

hoorta

@texasag1969 said:

Dixon 3 X Pro-bowl 2 X All-Pro

Minnifield 4 X Pro-Bowl 1 All-Pro

Lynch 9 X Pro-bowl 2 X All-Pro

Atwater 8 X Pro-Bowl 2 X All-Pro

The difference seems to be in how many Pro-Bowls they were invited to. All-Pro pretty much the same.

& as I mentioned, that's what's keeping Mathews out, only 4 Pro Bowls & second team all pro once. But taking into account he played for 19 seasons, that should count for something in the minds of the voters....

TexasAg1969

@hoorta said:

& as I mentioned, that's what's keeping Mathews out, only 4 Pro Bowls & second team all pro once. But taking into account he played for 19 seasons, that should count for something in the minds of the voters....

If Baker and Myles keep playing as well or better than they are now without major injuries, I can see HOF for both some day.

Dutch Oven

@hoorta said:

& as I mentioned, that's what's keeping Mathews out, only 4 Pro Bowls & second team all pro once. But taking into account he played for 19 seasons, that should count for something in the minds of the voters....

What's holding Matthews back is the fact that so many people think he's a "compiler".

Basically, if he was a baseball player, they consider him to be a sub-.300 batting average guy who got 3000 hits because he played forever, not because he was putting up monster years.

The Gipper

@dutch-oven said:

What's holding Matthews back is the fact that so many people think he's a "compiler".

Basically, if he was a baseball player, they consider him to be a sub-.300 batting average guy who got 3000 hits because he played forever, not because he was putting up monster years.

But most of those guys never do much in postseason play. Clay DID play in at least 3 AFC title games plus a number of other postseason games.

If you got rid of the "compilers"....then you would have to kick out half the players in the HOF. Like say, at QB: Warren Moon, Dan Fouts, Sonny Jurgenson; and any number of these LBs:

Chuck Bednarik (C-LB) 1949-1962

Bobby Bell (also DE) 1963-1974

Robert Brazile

Derrick Brooks 1995-2008

Nick Buoniconti 1962-1974, 1976

Dick Butkus 1965-1973

Harry Carson 1976-1988

George Connor (also DT, OT) 1948-1955

Chris Doleman (DE, LB) 1985-1999

Bill George 1952-1966

Kevin Greene (also DE) 1985-1999

Jack Ham 1971-1982

Chris Hanburger 1965-1978

Ted Hendricks 1969-1983

Sam Huff 1956-1967, 1969

Rickey Jackson LB (also DE) 1981-1995

Jack Lambert 1974-1984

Willie Lanier 1967-1977

Ray Lewis

Ray Nitschke 1958-1972

Les Richter 1954-1962

Dave Robinson 1963-1974

Joe Schmidt 1953-1965

Junior Seau 1990-2009

Mike Singletary 1981-1992

Lawrence Taylor 1981-1993

Derrick Thomas 1989-1999

Andre Tippett 1982-1993

Brian Urlacher

Dave Wilcox 1964-1974

Dutch Oven

You compiled a list of players who all played at minimum five less seasons than Matthews, Gip.

The Gipper

@dutch-oven said:

You compiled a list of players who all played at minimum five less seasons than Matthews, Gip.

You mean my previous post? All I did was cut and paste the names of the Linebackers that are in the HOF. Do with that list what you will.

Are you trying to say that Clay Matthews is the Niekro of football? Won 300 games and lost almost as many?

mjp28

@the-gipper said:

You mean my previous post? All I did was cut and paste the names of the Linebackers that are in the HOF. Do with that list what you will.

Are you trying to say that Clay Matthews is the Niekro of football? Won 300 games and lost almost as many?

It does remind one that football, baseball and somewhat hoops and hockey are team sports and the sucess or lack of it do can somewhat affect individual recognition and rewards. "Knucksie" was a tough pitcher on a few not so good teams he did have longevity though.

The Gipper

@mjp28 said:

It does remind one that football, baseball and somewhat hoops and hockey are team sports and the sucess or lack of it do can somewhat affect individual recognition and rewards. "Knucksie" was a tough pitcher on a few not so good teams he did have longevity though.

Well....I understand the concept of a "compiler" not being considered for HOF recognition...at least not in football.

There are like two guys that are way up there in career numbers: attempts/completions/yards/ etc. who are not being give HOF recognition: Vinny Testaverde and Drew Bledsoe. Each of whom, despite their gaudy career totals, was never considered to be anywhere near the Top QBs of their time.

So, I suppose the same could be true for defenders as well. But...Hoorta makes a point....if those guys, or Clay Matthews, and others, had played for a couple of Championship teams, they would get far more consideration. (Bledsoe did geta ring with NE...after Brady took over and won it...so that does not count for him)

The Gipper

Compilers? At QB. Guys that played a long time and racked up lots of stats but not to be considered among the best that played (HOF questionable)

Completions:

Carson Palmer 12th overall; Bledsoe 13th; Testaverde 14th; Kerry Collins 18th.....and what about Matt Ryan...10th

Yards:

Ryan 12th; Palmer 13th; Vinny 14th; Bledsoe 15th; Collins 18th

TDs:

Ryan 12th; Palmer 13th; Vinny 16th; Bledsoe 21st Collins 38th.

I guess the thing about Ryan is that he is still young....only 33 and likely to move up high on these lists.

But...who else could be a "compiler"? What about Rivers? Eli?(but 2 titles)

Warren Moon...to me, was a compiler. High on the above lists...never close to a championship (but...oh...yeaa...he is black). Dave Kreig...very high up in a lot of categories.

I mean...is it fair to say that the ONLY difference between these guys and a few that are considered shoe ins is that perhaps those guys played on better teams? Eli, Ben R.

If these guys had gotten as much as a single championship under their belt....would that have made a big difference in HOF consideration?

The Gipper

What about RBs? Are there compilers there as well?

Frank Gore? Curtis Martin? (HOF) Edgerrin James? Fred Taylor, Steven Jackson, Corey Dillon?