NOTES ON 3 BROWNS PLAYERS, MACK, FRAHLEY,AND FURREY

[Sez.EJ]

I think maybe half of those guys will be regular (on the field a lot) contributers. Not to knock the additions... Even 8 is a significant upgrade in our overall talent. The other 8 will be situational or backups but still it looks like better depth on paper than in the past. I'm still fairly unconvinced with our overall DL talent being anything but mediacre after Rogers.

[Aloysius]

According to Football Outsiders, our pass defense was average against formations including three or fewer wideouts but ranked 27th in the league against 4-5 receiver sets.

Having Hood at nickel will help a lot. He's a huge upgrade over Cousin, and he gives Mangini another credible option if one of our young starting CB's struggles. Corey Ivy should earn a roster spot and some playing time as well. Had we not acquired Hood, Ivy may have been our nickel corner. And one of the rookies could end up pushing for playing time.

The one issue may be how Abe Elam holds up. He'll help out in the run game, but he may be the weak link in coverage.

[ballpeen]

We got Fraley 3 years ago for what...a 5th rounder???

I doubt he has held his value.

I doubt we could get anything for the guy.

A great hustle guy who got the most out of his ability, but his days are numbered.

I doubt he makes the team.

[Sez.EJ]

Hey guys found this on cbs sportsline regarding robiskie in a rookie evaluation:

Brian Robiskie, BROWNS:

College: Ohio State

Pick: No. 36 overall

Robiskie has plenty of things in his favor with his size (6-foot-3), speed and polished skill. His father, Terry, has been a wide receivers coach for years in the NFL, and it shows in his son's route running. Robiskie also goes to Cleveland, which is looking for help at wide receiver opposite Braylon Edwards. Robiskie will face some competition from fellow rookie Mohamed Massaquoi and veterans David Patten and Mike Furrey, but look for Robiskie to start. He's worth drafting with a late-round pick as a No. 4 option.

2008 stats (college): 42 catches, 535 receiving yards, eight touchdowns

2009 projected stats: 46 catches, 608 receiving yards, four touchdowns

As far as the 2009 projection it really depends on whether he plays the #2 spot or the #3 spot.. If Robiskie produces those numbers out of the #3 spot (that assumes furry wins the 2 spot, which is entirely possible) I would be ok with those numbers from him.

If those are Robiskie's numbers for the year from the #2 spot I would be a bit dissapointed with that production. Personally I would like to see him start in the slot with Furry as the #2 guy.

I like furreys experience and explosiveness. I think he can be a 60 catch 6 td guy at that spot. In a perfect world... Robiske moves up, and bumps Furry into the slot at some point in the season. I would be pleased to see something like that. The main thing is I want to see are solid routes ,and production from the recievers.

If they don't really step up this year it's going to be real ugly cuz our running game is not going to dominate anyone. It will be at least average, but we are not going to be blowing people away until we get an adrian peterson type guy back there...

Yeah, I'm still pissed we did not draft AP. What a stud. There was no one even close to him in this years draft, and won't be anyone in next years draft who can hold his jock either. Not sure what's coming up beyond that. Seriously we have not had a decend high round running back pick since leroy hoard. 3rd rounder. We have had a couple other picks but never worked out. In my opionion Metcalf was a bust. You don't draft flyweight backs in our division.

[Kosar_For_President]

Fraley is not the type of player to be a bitch playing second fiddle. He will be on the Browns, as a backup.

[Riffer X]

Robo is taylor made for the outside, not the slot. Furrey is taylor made for the slot, not the outside. Hopefully they start off that way and stay that way, which will help keep a continuity to a new system and QB.

MoMass gets time to develop at #4 but don't count Patten out.

[PlaygroundLegend]

Im still mad that we diddnt draft Jennings. We could of had him in the 6th but chose Davis instead. Im sorry but I have heard way too many good things about jennings from down in Jacksonvilles workouts and OTA's. That was the true steal of the draft (7th ROUND for a guy who was projected round 3). Jennings is completely his own type of back, his size, speed, strength and pass catching ability are a huge upside. He has great long spee, but just needs to work on his agility and initial step.

As far as whos starting,

Robiskie is a #2 shoo in.

Massaquoi doesnt see the field this year (hardly ever)

Frahely is great depth

and Mack is starting

P.S. You heard it here first, Jacksonville's running attack is going to be NASTY with MJD with his speed and agility, Jennings with his size, power, and pass catching abilities, and Gerrard running around with the PA rolls.

[daddybull1]

I thought I read that Foster was cut this week end... Maybe someone could verify with a link...

Peace

T.Dawg

[ndneighbor]

@daddybull1 said:

I thought I read that Foster was cut this week end... Maybe someone could verify with a link...

Peace

T.Dawg

It was LB Jonathan Foster that was waived: http://www.dawgsbynature.com/2009/7/16/951...ns-transactions

[Tobalaz]

I think we need to keep Hank for one more season even though his skills have diminished.

Fraley is a smart center and made good line adjustments, this is something he could help Mack pick up to speed along his development.

LCB, yeah, I said it. We got rid of an undersized probowl center for the beefier center who blew out his leg before he ever took a snap for us. What's to say lightning is going to strike twice? What's going to say that it isn't? We're the Browns remember? If shit can go wrong for us, well, it will.

Again, I said right after the draft Hank is probably gone but with our history I'd rather see him stick around for a year.

[Kosar_For_President]

@tobalaz said:

I think we need to keep Hank for one more season even though his skills have diminished.

Fraley is a smart center and made good line adjustments, this is something he could help Mack pick up to speed along his development.

LCB, yeah, I said it. We got rid of an undersized probowl center for the beefier center who blew out his leg before he ever took a snap for us. What's to say lightning is going to strike twice? What's going to say that it isn't? We're the Browns remember? If shit can go wrong for us, well, it will.

Again, I said right after the draft Hank is probably gone but with our history I'd rather see him stick around for a year.

Agreed Fraley might not have it physically, but mentially he can help Mack develop. Plus, he's not a bad backup.

[Sez.EJ]

It is going to be very difficult on the OL when it comes to roster cutdowns. I like that a lot. We appear to have very good depth. There should be guys who get cut who will go elswhere and find work this year. While Joe Thomas (at this time) is the only rising superstar. The other guys are all solid and can get it done. Hopefully Mack will turn into a superstar...but I think I'll wait for him to get his shoes on before I crown him.

This site has some issues with that. Seems as soon as we draft a guy..whether 1st round or in the 7th round, guys are crowning them as the second coming. (kind of like what guys are doing with James Davis right now) Guys are saying how great he is and it's not even training camp). all these guys are great athletes and are going to look good in shorts.

[Aloysius]

@sez.ej said:

Hopefully Mack will turn into a superstar...but I think I'll wait for him to get his shoes on before I crown him.

This site has some issues with that. Seems as soon as we draft a guy..whether 1st round or in the 7th round, guys are crowning them as the second coming.

I'm sorry that we're not living up to your high standards.

@sez.ej said:

I also believe Mack will be an immediate starter and HUGE upgrade to our line. I am overjoyed we have a young stud to sick on Casey Hampton and the other DT is in the division and league. The days of blowing up the Center of the Browns line are GONE..

Well, I guess you aren't either...

[Riffer X]

I am always concerned with living up to Sez's judgments.

[Sez.EJ]

I have not crowned anyone. By saying he is a HUGE upgrade is really just expressing my opinion of how sorry Frahley is. I am sick of watching him get pushed into the QB's lap and having to get so much help from the guards. So nearly any center worthy of a first round draft pick would be an upgrade to Frahely. He has been THE weak spot of the offensive line. The coaching staff new that and that is why we used our #1 pick to fix that weak spot. I am not declaring Mack at the next probowler, or that he will be great. Just an big upgrade over Frahley. If you look at Aloysius first quote.the first word used is "hopefully" . Also if you notice in my complaint about " crowning" people.. I respectfully do not call people out by name. I just prefer to stir the WHOLE pot hahaha. (nice spin eh?)

[Aloysius]

@shepwrite said:

Royal - starter

Not sure he'll start. He's had some drops/fumbling issues in recent years. And though he's explosive enough to be a factor in the passing game, he doesn't seem to gain many yards after the catch.

He is a very good blocker. But when I watched the Bills, it seemed like they often relied on h-back Derek Schoumann to block on running downs. If the Browns use a lot of 2 TE sets, they may rely on Royal, but they may prefer to use Heiden (run) & Rucker (pass) in single TE formations.

The most important contribution Royal may make is serving as a good locker room influence and a mentor to Rucker. Apparently, he's already begun doing that:

Zac Jackson said:

RUCK AND ROB: Royal and Rucker have bonded in and out of the meeting room. Royal is an eight-year pro on his third NFL stop after starting with the Redskins and spending the last three seasons in Buffalo, where he set a new personal receiving best in each of those three years and started 36 games during that time. Rucker's rookie experience was cut short by a preseason knee injury and more experienced players in front of him, but he performed well in a limited role down the stretch and says he's a stronger, smarter player entering his second professional camp than he was last year.

[Flugel]

@sez.ej said:

I have not crowned anyone. By saying he is a HUGE upgrade is really just expressing my opinion of how sorry Frahley is. I am sick of watching him get pushed into the QB's lap and having to get so much help from the guards. So nearly any center worthy of a first round draft pick would be an upgrade to Frahely. He has been THE weak spot of the offensive line. The coaching staff new that and that is why we used our #1 pick to fix that weak spot. I am not declaring Mack at the next probowler, or that he will be great. Just an big upgrade over Frahley. If you look at Aloysius first quote.the first word used is "hopefully" . Also if you notice in my complaint about " crowning" people.. I respectfully do not call people out by name. I just prefer to stir the WHOLE pot hahaha. (nice spin eh?)

I actually thought this was a very good post by you Sez so thanks!

I know what you mean about the Center position and how important it is. I'd like us to keep Fraley mainly in case we see more injuries at Center. Before Bentley got injured - it sure seemed like Jeff Faine was always getting injured. I think Fraley could give us depth at Center and even OG in a worst case scenario.

Picturing Thomas, Steinbach and Mack all side by side shows me that 60% of the line has Pro Bowl caliber. On the other side, people forget how instrumental St Clair was in bringing the Chicago running game back to life last year. I think he's going to provide a strong competition at the RT spot. I kind of hope Lee Ann Womack beats out Tucker at RG. I haven't been very fond of Tucker over the years. I kept hearing great leader and yet he went AWOL 1 season before getting busted for steroids in 07 (causing him to miss the first 4 games). Last year he was only reliable enough for 1 start or so. I wouldn't mind him as a backup. I also wonder how George Foster would do at 1 of the OG spots facing the wider girths inside.

- Tom F.

[Sez.EJ]

I found this on roto times earlier

Brian Robiskie, WR, Cleveland Browns Tuesday 7/21, 6:16 PM CT

There has reportedly been little talk between the Browns and rookie Brian Robiskie regarding a contract, according to the Akron Beacon Journal.

Our View: The club has also had little talk with center Alex Mack (pick 21), receiver Mohamad Massaquoi (pick 50) and linebacker David Veikune (pick 52). The Browns still have some time to get their top rookies inked prior to the start of training camp July 31 though.

I am not too worried about this. Not many 2's and 3's have been signed by any teams yet. The market price is still being set. The Browns usually do not want to be the ones to "set" the market. Even though this article says there has been "little" talk.. Seems like they are getting some preliminary talks out of the way..

It would be a huge feather in the cap of the new regime to get everyone in on time. Especially Robiskie and Mack as it appears they will play early and often if they get in on time.