Rank Em

[darren15]

I was just thinking how many different rankings we would get for each category ....... without trying to be Cleveland bias please rank these in order based on current skills .... my rankings are next to name

QB

TOM BRADY   1

DREW BREES    3

BAKER MAYFIELD  5

ANDREW LUCK   6

RUSSELL WILSON   7

PHILIP RIVERS   9

DESHAUN WATSON   8

MATT RYAN   10

PAT MAHOMES   2

AARON RODGERS   4

WR

ODELL BECKHAM   3

AJ GREEN   10

ANTONIO BROWN   4

TYREEK HILL   8

DEANDRE HOPKINS   1

JULIO JONES   2

KEENAN ALLEN   7

MICHAEL THOMAS   6

DEVANTE ADAMS   5

MIKE EVANS   9

RB

KAREEM HUNT   6

MELVIN GORDON   8

SAQUON BARKLEY   1

EZEKIEL ELLIOTT   4

NICK CHUBB   7

DAVID JOHNSON   10

ALVIN KAMARA   3

TODD GURLEY   2

CHRISTIAN MCCAFFREY   5

LEONARD FOURNETTE   9

[TexasAg1969]

I would put Matt Ryan further up. If they had a decent defense they would have more wins. Hill should be higher if he plays. And Fornette when healthy is top 5.

[Zombo]

@darren15 said:

I was just thinking how many different rankings we would get for each category ....... without trying to be Cleveland bias please rank these in order based on current skills .... my rankings are next to name

QB

TOM BRADY   1

DREW BREES    3

BAKER MAYFIELD  5

ANDREW LUCK   6

RUSSELL WILSON   7

PHILIP RIVERS   9

DESHAUN WATSON   8

MATT RYAN   10

PAT MAHOMES   2

AARON RODGERS   4

WR

ODELL BECKHAM   3

AJ GREEN   10

ANTONIO BROWN   4

TYREEK HILL   8

DEANDRE HOPKINS   1

JULIO JONES   2

KEENAN ALLEN   7

MICHAEL THOMAS   6

DEVANTE ADAMS   5

MIKE EVANS   9

RB

KAREEM HUNT   6

MELVIN GORDON   8

SAQUON BARKLEY   1

EZEKIEL ELLIOTT   4

NICK CHUBB   7

DAVID JOHNSON   10

ALVIN KAMARA   3

TODD GURLEY   2

CHRISTIAN MCCAFFREY   5

LEONARD FOURNETTE   9

I'm the biggest homer there is, and there is no way you can rank Mayfield over guys like Wilson, Rivers and Ryan ... YET.

He is still growing into his skills. Russell Wilson should be in that five spot, and everyone else should move up a spot, and throw Ben in there ... give Baker another year of NFL development. Not that I dont think he won't top this list eventually, seems a bit premature and disrespectful to these other guys at this point.

Z

[The Gipper]

@darren15 said:

I was just thinking how many different rankings we would get for each category ....... without trying to be Cleveland bias please rank these in order based on current skills .... my rankings are next to name

QB

TOM BRADY   1

DREW BREES    3

BAKER MAYFIELD  5

ANDREW LUCK   6

RUSSELL WILSON   7

PHILIP RIVERS   9

DESHAUN WATSON   8

MATT RYAN   10

PAT MAHOMES   2

AARON RODGERS   4

Sorry, but Ben R. (as much as I wish it were not so)  still has to rank in the Top Ten.  If Cam Newton were healthy he too would have to be in there.

WR

ODELL BECKHAM   3

AJ GREEN   10

ANTONIO BROWN   4

TYREEK HILL   8

DEANDRE HOPKINS   1

JULIO JONES   2

KEENAN ALLEN   7

MICHAEL THOMAS   6

DEVANTE ADAMS   5

MIKE EVANS   9

RB

KAREEM HUNT   6

MELVIN GORDON   8

SAQUON BARKLEY   1

EZEKIEL ELLIOTT   4

NICK CHUBB   7

DAVID JOHNSON   10

ALVIN KAMARA   3

TODD GURLEY   2

CHRISTIAN MCCAFFREY   5

LEONARD FOURNETTE   9

I think Elliott is #1....and now that L. Bell is back he has to go on here.  With Hunt's suspension, I would not rank him at this point.

[calfoxwc]

Zombo said:

I'm the biggest homer there is, and there is no way you can rank Mayfield over guys like Wilson, Rivers and Ryan ... YET.

He is still growing into his skills. Russell Wilson should be in that five spot, and everyone else should move up a spot, and throw Ben in there ... give Baker another year of NFL development. Not that I dont think he won't top this list eventually, seems a bit premature and disrespectful to these other guys at this point.

  I disagree - he is growing into his skills, sure, but I see him having skills that several on the list do not have - to the degree that Baker has them. Sure, experience proves to be a serious advantage - but I"ve seen Baker display abilities as a qb far beyond several other qb's in the NFL whose experience hasn't helped them accrue the skills.

  But, these ratings need to take into account the talent around them, or it's just spitting into the wind, I think.

[hoorta]

@calfoxwc said:

  I disagree - he is growing into his skills, sure, but I see him having skills that several on the list do not have - to the degree that Baker has them. Sure, experience proves to be a serious advantage - but I"ve seen Baker display abilities as a qb far beyond several other qb's in the NFL whose experience hasn't helped them accrue the skills.

  But, these ratings need to take into account the talent around them, or it's just spitting into the wind, I think.

I'll agree that Baker has shown more raw talent than any Browns QB since Bernie. (Yeah, more than our other #1 QB Tim Couch) 

But I do have some concerns about the dreaded "sophomore slump". Teams now have plenty of tape on Mayfield, let's hope the rookie year wasn't an aberration. Horse Balls Anderson looked great for 10 games until he got figured out.

[mjp28]

This kind of reminds me of our FL Drafts wich will be coming up in about 5 short months. 

Those FL ranking lists are handy in figuring out the #1, 2, 3.. at each position..

[calfoxwc]

@hoorta said:

I'll agree that Baker has shown more raw talent than any Browns QB since Bernie. (Yeah, more than our other #1 QB Tim Couch) 

But I do have some concerns about the dreaded "sophomore slump". Teams now have plenty of tape on Mayfield, let's hope the rookie year wasn't an aberration. Horse Balls Anderson looked great for 10 games until he got figured out.

This is true - but I think bigfoot Anderson had flaws defenses took advantage of - not mobile, not seeing the field, big arm no touch, not very smart, poor leadership, etc. I believe his wonderlick score was 19.

[D Bone]

I'll do QBs

QB

TOM BRADY   1

DREW BREES    3

BAKER MAYFIELD  9

ANDREW LUCK   8

RUSSELL WILSON   5

PHILIP RIVERS   6

DESHAUN WATSON   10

MATT RYAN   7

PAT MAHOMES   4

AARON RODGERS   2

[calfoxwc]

in terms of skills, I put Baker tied with Mahomes at 4. Not in accomplishments, of course, but in the abilities

to be a qb game changer. Just my goofy opinion.

[Tour2ma]

QB

1. AARON RODGERS  - the QB who elevates all around him better than anyone else.
2. DREW BREES  - flourished as a gunslinger... flourishing now as a field general... great PAP ability
3. TOM BRADY - yes, I could see signs of decline in 2018, but with a game on the line late, who would you want over Tom Terrific?
4. ANDREW LUCK - I'm so glad he's back... Texan fans not so much...
5. PAT MAHOMES - Only QB that can best Baker in the excITement factor, but need a repeat at close to same level.
6. BAKER MAYFIELD - Ditto above except "get anywhere close to Pat"
7. RUSSELL WILSON - for God's sake, give the man  an OL that can protect... how he holds up under the demands Carroll makes is beyond me.
8. PHILIP RIVERS - the cranky old SOB, can still play...
9. DESHAUN WATSON - I ain't convinced...
10. MATT RYAN  - played well last season... again... but has he ever strung two season together???

WR

1. ANTONIO BROWN - The dude flat gets open
2. DEANDRE HOPKINS - Best 50/50 ball WR... great hands...
3. JULIO JONES - talent + imposing presence... kinda inherited the Megatron mantel...
4. MICHAEL THOMAS  - what gift to NOLA... and Brees...
5. AJ GREEN - TBH... I've never gotten Green
6. ODELL BECKHAM - availability and "tude" concerns...
7. TYREEK HILL - dangerous to be sure, but still developing as a route runner.
8. MIKE EVANS - more than just a big body, but I think the sun sets early on this one due to the physical toll.
9. KEENAN ALLEN - really exciting #1-ish guy, but Benji being his #2 helps him a lot.
10. JARVIS LANDRY - his body of work including MIA years makes him an easy sub for ADAMS on my list...

RB

1. SAQUON BARKLEY - Po was right about his talent, but not his draft value... There's a new bell cow in the league.
2. TODD GURLEY  - Simply the man... before SaqBark arrived...
3. EZEKIEL ELLIOTT - hardest working man on the list... gets rode the hardest... and delivers.
4. MELVIN GORDON - tad one dimensional to be any higher.
5. CHRISTIAN MCCAFFREY -  everyone knew he'd be a dangerous 3rd-down guy, but 2018 showed that an undersized white boy can be the man takin' the rock as well.
6. DAVID JOHNSON - has an "ability" problem... as in "avail-"...
7. KAREEM HUNT - want to be higher, KH? Do 2017 again, but as a Brown.
8. NICK CHUBB - early returns are very very promising (see above except for 2018 in place of 2017... and for a full season).
9. ALVIN KAMARA  - fantastic "change of pace" RB, but hasn't yet shown he can be "the guy"... maybe this year.with Inman moving on...
10. LEONARD FOURNETTE  - one dimensional... plus I get to piss off Ag...

Nice thread, darren...

[hoorta]

@tour2ma said:

QB

1. AARON RODGERS  - the QB who elevates all around him better than anyone else.
2. DREW BREES  - flourished as a gunslinger... flourishing now as a field general... great PAP ability
3. TOM BRADY - yes, I could see signs of decline in 2018, but with a game on the line late, who would you want over Tom Terrific?
4. ANDREW LUCK - I'm so glad he's back... Texan fans not so much...
5. PAT MAHOMES - Only QB that can best Baker in the excITement factor, but need a repeat at close to same level.
6. BAKER MAYFIELD - Ditto above except "get anywhere close to Pat"
7. RUSSELL WILSON - for God's sake, give the man  an OL that can protect... how he holds up under the demands Carroll makes is beyond me.
8. PHILIP RIVERS - the cranky old SOB, can still play...
9. DESHAUN WATSON - I ain't convinced...
10. MATT RYAN  - played well last season... again... but has he ever strung two season together???

WR

1. ANTONIO BROWN - The dude flat gets open
2. DEANDRE HOPKINS - Best 50/50 ball WR... great hands...
3. JULIO JONES - talent + imposing presence... kinda inherited the Megatron mantel...
4. MICHAEL THOMAS  - what gift to NOLA... and Brees...
5. AJ GREEN - TBH... I've never gotten Green
6. ODELL BECKHAM - availability and "tude" concerns...
7. TYREEK HILL - dangerous to be sure, but still developing as a route runner.
8. MIKE EVANS - more than just a big body, but I think the sun sets early on this one due to the physical toll.
9. KEENAN ALLEN - really exciting #1-ish guy, but Benji being his #2 helps him a lot.
10. JARVIS LANDRY - his body of work including MIA years makes him an easy sub for ADAMS on my list...

RB

1. SAQUON BARKLEY - Po was right about his talent, but not his draft value... There's a new bell cow in the league.
2. TODD GURLEY  - Simply the man... before SaqBark arrived...
3. EZEKIEL ELLIOTT - hardest working man on the list... gets rode the hardest... and delivers.
4. MELVIN GORDON - tad one dimensional to be any higher.
5. CHRISTIAN MCCAFFREY -  everyone knew he'd be a dangerous 3rd-down guy, but 2018 showed that an undersized white boy can be the man takin' the rock as well.
6. DAVID JOHNSON - has an "ability" problem... as in "avail-"...
7. KAREEM HUNT - want to be higher, KH? Do 2017 again, but as a Brown.
8. NICK CHUBB - early returns are very very promising (see above except for 2018 in place of 2017... and for a full season).
9. ALVIN KAMARA  - fantastic "change of pace" RB, but hasn't yet shown he can be "the guy"... maybe this year.with Inman moving on...
10. LEONARD FOURNETTE  - one dimensional... plus I get to piss off Ag...

Nice thread, darren...

Only thing I'd change is putting Ryan up higher, and based on past production, Bell belongs on that list- somewhere- at least #5 for starters.

[Gunz41]

@hoorta said:

I'll agree that Baker has shown more raw talent than any Browns QB since Bernie. (Yeah, more than our other #1 QB Tim Couch) 

But I do have some concerns about the dreaded "sophomore slump". Teams now have plenty of tape on Mayfield, let's hope the rookie year wasn't an aberration. Horse Balls Anderson looked great for 10 games until he got figured out.

Completely agree, let's pump the brakes a little bit for any of these young guys. I get the optimism and bias, but I remember reading somewhere (it could have been on this board or somewhere else with Browns fans) where to not give so much credit to someone as there is now tape on him (maybe James Conner). Well the same can be said for the Browns guys.

As for the lists: As much as I dislike him, and I mean REALLY dislike him, Luck should certainly be above Baker right now, along with a few others.

As for WR, again I STRONGLY dislike Brown, but he has certainly had more success than OBJ. So has Hill. 

I don't know if the objective was to rank for their career so far, this upcoming season, or future. That would help clarify how to rank them. It says current skills, but both Rodgers and Mahomes at the very least have more skills than Brady at this point. And WR wise, Hill is way too low at 8

[Tour2ma]

@hoorta said:

Only thing I'd change is putting Ryan up higher, and based on past production, Bell belongs on that list- somewhere- at least #5 for starters.

Agree... I was working more off of reordering darren's list than thinking about my own.

[calfoxwc]

@hoorta said:

Only thing I'd change is putting Ryan up higher, and based on past production, Bell belongs on that list- somewhere- at least #5 for starters.

except it's supposed to be "skills", and not production/accomplishments etc.

[The Gipper]

@calfoxwc said:

except it's supposed to be "skills", and not production/accomplishments etc.

What good are certain skills if you cannot apply them to achieve any production or accomplishments?

Jamarcus Russell had the skill of being able to throw the ball 80 yards from his knees....but what did he produce as a QB?

Bell certainly has skills....and production. (but it does no good if he sits out...certainly)

[calfoxwc]

you miss the point. Grading Baker on accomplishments is bogus, since he was a rookie last year.Of COURSE Brady etc are more ACCOMPLISHED. Russell had other glaring problems - learning the offense, his weight, work ethic, many more ints than TD's, he didn't see the field well in the pros. It's a different, huge step up in speed and complexity.

Russell was one of the biggest busts. The POINT IS, actual SKILLS needed to be effective in the pros, not how many superbowls, etc they've accomplished over the years. Baker was just a rookie.

Baker Mayfield rocked the NFL - his skills really showed. It doesn't mean he doesn't have them because he didn't go to a superbowl.

Sure, his skills will be advanced with experience, but he had skills at Oklahoma that several NFL qb's never will have.

[The Gipper]

@calfoxwc said:

you miss the point. Grading Baker on accomplishments is bogus, since he was a rookie last year.Of COURSE Brady etc are more ACCOMPLISHED. Russell had other glaring problems - learning the offense, his weight, work ethic, many more ints than TD's, he didn't see the field well in the pros. It's a different, huge step up in speed and complexity.

Russell was one of the biggest busts. The POINT IS, actual SKILLS needed to be effective in the pros, not how many superbowls, etc they've accomplished over the years. Baker was just a rookie.

Baker Mayfield rocked the NFL - his skills really showed. It doesn't mean he doesn't have them because he didn't go to a superbowl.

Sure, his skills will be advanced with experience, but he had skills at Oklahoma that several NFL qb's never will have.

OK, I probably did miss the point because I took your post out of the context in which you meant it. My point remains valid...just in another context. 

Certainly you cannot compare the production/accomplishments of Baker vs. these others who have been in the league for 15 years,  Brady/BR/Brees/ etc.

[Gunz41]

Before we get ahead of ourselves, just keep a few things in mind.

1. Baker did have a good rookie season, but just like other guys there is tape on him now. And while certainly impressive, part of the reason that he set the new record is how the game has evolved. And using a rookie season and awards and success to predict future doesnt always work out. There was ALOT of optimism in Washington for RG3. What do these guys have in common, RG3, Teddy Twatwater, Sam Bradford, Vince Young? They have all won ROY awards. Dont misunderstand me, I DON'T THINK THAT WILL BE BAKER, but I do believe that the fans for those teams probably had similar hope as we as Browns fans do.

As far as comparing with Derek Anderson. Most of what was said above could be said about Cam Newton (he is mobile, I dont think he sees the field great, he certainly has a big arm with inconsistent accuracy, I don't know about his intelligence, and I wouldn't call him a great leader.) The point is that he would at least be somewhat compared to that profile of DA, and he has been an MVP and in Super Bowl

[calfoxwc]

@gunz41 said:

Before we get ahead of ourselves, just keep a few things in mind.

1. Baker did have a good rookie season, but just like other guys there is tape on him now. And while certainly impressive, part of the reason that he set the new record is how the game has evolved. And using a rookie season and awards and success to predict future doesnt always work out. There was ALOT of optimism in Washington for RG3. What do these guys have in common, RG3, Teddy Twatwater, Sam Bradford, Vince Young? They have all won ROY awards. Dont misunderstand me, I DON'T THINK THAT WILL BE BAKER, but I do believe that the fans for those teams probably had similar hope as we as Browns fans do.

As far as comparing with Derek Anderson. Most of what was said above could be said about Cam Newton (he is mobile, I dont think he sees the field great, he certainly has a big arm with inconsistent accuracy, I don't know about his intelligence, and I wouldn't call him a great leader.) The point is that he would at least be somewhat compared to that profile of DA, and he has been an MVP and in Super Bowl

good post, but may I add, Cam ran a 4.56 forty, liked to run. Bigfoot Anderson ran about a 5.03 at best, sometimes 5.23 and didn't run very often - but did scramble big catching defenses off guard.

whatever. but Anderson and Cam weren't all that different - good point..