FORBES OT/OG
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Nasty is a good word.. Get your ? ready !!
he's got OL prick'ism
word of the day (prick'ism)..
I’m guessing at his size and at his school he was a man among boys, but watching this you can see the appeal. Looks like a good candidate for misdirection plays, which l tend to think Kitchens is pretty good at drawing up, and you can definitely see the “finisher” compliment he was given in the interview clip. Gonna be fun to watch this guy develop.
He seems to have the feets to stick at tackle.
I’m guessing at his size and at his school he was a man among boys, but watching this you can see the appeal. Looks like a good candidate for misdirection plays, which l tend to think Kitchens is pretty good at drawing up, and you can definitely see the “finisher” compliment he was given in the interview clip. Gonna be fun to watch this guy develop.
He seems to have the feets to stick at tackle.
Well said! He gets from 1 side of the formation to other at the blink of an eye especially considering he did it as a Tackle. That projects extremely well for trapping and pulling at the next level, which could move him to Guard (aside from the arm length).
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Think he probably needs to move inside like Bitonio and Corbett?
That clip was a very limited sample size designed to make Forbes look as good as possible, but it looked to me like he has the quicks to stay at Tackle. I mean, they basically used him as a pulling Tackle. You don’t really see much of that in the NFL. So l doubt there will be many designed plays where he’s sweeping behind the line to pick up a block on the other side of Center, but it’s a good asset to have.
So l doubt there will be many designed plays where he’s sweeping behind the line to pick up a block on the other side of Center, but it’s a good asset to have.
Those are trap plays you speak of and he seems ideal for those. That's what often unfolds on the mis-direction counters you spoke of in another one of your posts. There's short traps and long traps but not every defensive scheme is vulnerable to them so you have to pick the right opportunities to call those. Also, if we do any bootleg/waggle passes - it's not uncommon to pull the OG from 1 side of the formation to the other leading the QB out of the pocket for pass or run.
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Just thinkin - if an offensive tackle has a long wingspan but sluggish feet and poor balance....wouldn't having
really quick feet and excellent balance make up for a few inches of wingspan lacking?
Just askin...I would think so, but....
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Just thinkin - if an offensive tackle has a long wingspan but sluggish feet and poor balance....wouldn't having
really quick feet and excellent balance make up for a few inches of wingspan lacking?
Just askin...I would think so, but....
Just thinkin - if an offensive tackle has a long wingspan but sluggish feet and poor balance....wouldn't having
really quick feet and excellent balance make up for a few inches of wingspan lacking?
Just askin...I would think so, but....
Few inches begins to push the limits, but yes, I'd trade some span for better feet.
We've seen a number of 6'6+ OTs in preseason getting beat play after play by speed rushers. OT is slow off the ball... can't get into position so reach, which includes bending at waist, which ends balance...
If his arms are too short, however, the OT, who has to keep his shoulders perpendicular to a line drawn from him to his QB, will struggle to keep even shorter armed DEs from one-armed "stabbing" them in the chest and sending them off balance. Longer armed DEs can bull both arms into the OT's chest and then control the OT by grabbing their breast plate and pulling or pushing the OT whenever they like.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Just thinkin - if an offensive tackle has a long wingspan but sluggish feet and poor balance....wouldn't having
really quick feet and excellent balance make up for a few inches of wingspan lacking?
Just askin...I would think so, but....
Few inches begins to push the limits, but yes, I'd trade some span for better feet.
We've seen a number of 6'6+ OTs in preseason getting beat play after play by speed rushers. OT is slow off the ball... can't get into position so reach, which includes bending at waist, which ends balance...
If his arms are too short, however, the OT, who has to keep his shoulders perpendicular to a line drawn from him to his QB, will struggle to keep even shorter armed DEs from one-armed "stabbing" them in the chest and sending them off balance. Longer armed DEs can bull both arms into the OT's chest and then control the OT by grabbing their breast plate and pulling or pushing the OT whenever they like.
Few inches begins to push the limits, but yes, I'd trade some span for better feet.
We've seen a number of 6'6+ OTs in preseason getting beat play after play by speed rushers. OT is slow off the ball... can't get into position so reach, which includes bending at waist, which ends balance...
If his arms are too short, however, the OT, who has to keep his shoulders perpendicular to a line drawn from him to his QB, will struggle to keep even shorter armed DEs from one-armed "stabbing" them in the chest and sending them off balance. Longer armed DEs can bull both arms into the OT's chest and then control the OT by grabbing their breast plate and pulling or pushing the OT whenever they like.
Keep an eye on Forbes vs Vernon in camp for that very example.
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Just thinkin - if an offensive tackle has a long wingspan but sluggish feet and poor balance....wouldn't having
really quick feet and excellent balance make up for a few inches of wingspan lacking?
Just askin...I would think so, but....
Few inches begins to push the limits, but yes, I'd trade some span for better feet.
We've seen a number of 6'6+ OTs in preseason getting beat play after play by speed rushers. OT is slow off the ball... can't get into position so reach, which includes bending at waist, which ends balance...
If his arms are too short, however, the OT, who has to keep his shoulders perpendicular to a line drawn from him to his QB, will struggle to keep even shorter armed DEs from one-armed "stabbing" them in the chest and sending them off balance. Longer armed DEs can bull both arms into the OT's chest and then control the OT by grabbing their breast plate and pulling or pushing the OT whenever they like.
Few inches begins to push the limits, but yes, I'd trade some span for better feet.
We've seen a number of 6'6+ OTs in preseason getting beat play after play by speed rushers. OT is slow off the ball... can't get into position so reach, which includes bending at waist, which ends balance...
If his arms are too short, however, the OT, who has to keep his shoulders perpendicular to a line drawn from him to his QB, will struggle to keep even shorter armed DEs from one-armed "stabbing" them in the chest and sending them off balance. Longer armed DEs can bull both arms into the OT's chest and then control the OT by grabbing their breast plate and pulling or pushing the OT whenever they like.
I got that - I was thinkin of a player - couldn't remember his name on the instant, lol, ...Cameron Erving. 34 1/8 " wingspan....
but didn't have much of a love for the game, not much on aggressiveness I think it was... very athletic... even very athletic, I don't think he was very bendable....still was never able to play at LOT. I guess what I'm saying is, I don't the inch of shorter arm (one arm push to one side, right?) is a problem that isn't able to be overcome with quickness, power, agility, and aggressiveness/work ethic...
Of course, all things being equal, I'd take the longer-armed guy, sure. I honestly don't know - Flugels was a mean offensive lineman - I thought of Flugels playing football when I heard Bitonio, Corbett and Forbes' meanness on the field.
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Few inches begins to push the limits, but yes, I'd trade some span for better feet.
We've seen a number of 6'6+ OTs in preseason getting beat play after play by speed rushers. OT is slow off the ball... can't get into position so reach, which includes bending at waist, which ends balance...
If his arms are too short, however, the OT, who has to keep his shoulders perpendicular to a line drawn from him to his QB, will struggle to keep even shorter armed DEs from one-armed "stabbing" them in the chest and sending them off balance. Longer armed DEs can bull both arms into the OT's chest and then control the OT by grabbing their breast plate and pulling or pushing the OT whenever they like.
I got that - I was thinkin of a player - couldn't remember his name on the instant, lol, ...Cameron Erving. 34 1/8 " wingspan....
but didn't have much of a love for the game, not much on aggressiveness I think it was... very athletic... even very athletic, I don't think he was very bendable....still was never able to play at LOT. I guess what I'm saying is, I don't the inch of shorter arm (one arm push to one side, right?) is a problem that isn't able to be overcome with quickness, power, agility, and aggressiveness/work ethic...
Of course, all things being equal, I'd take the longer-armed guy, sure. I honestly don't know - Flugels was a mean offensive lineman - I thought of Flugels playing football when I heard Bitonio, Corbett and Forbes' meanness on the field.
I got that - I was thinkin of a player - couldn't remember his name on the instant, lol, ...Cameron Erving. 34 1/8 " wingspan....
but didn't have much of a love for the game, not much on aggressiveness I think it was... very athletic... even very athletic, I don't think he was very bendable....still was never able to play at LOT. I guess what I'm saying is, I don't the inch of shorter arm (one arm push to one side, right?) is a problem that isn't able to be overcome with quickness, power, agility, and aggressiveness/work ethic...
Of course, all things being equal, I'd take the longer-armed guy, sure. I honestly don't know - Flugels was a mean offensive lineman - I thought of Flugels playing football when I heard Bitonio, Corbett and Forbes' meanness on the field.
1. Don't confuse arm-length (the measurement you quoted for Cam) with wingspan. Wingspan, finger tip to finger tip, eliminates measurement variables and includes the width of the OL's frame.
2. Again... within limits I'll trade off arm-length, but there is one thing you fail to mention.... Technique.
I used to think any player could learn technique. Drafting athletic OL and teaching tech was the way you built OL depth... both in the NFL and in various sims (Head Coach, Madden, etc.), but now so many OL leave college with such a weak foundation that this path is far less traveled. In fact only the Pats (or more precisely, Scarnecchia) have a recent track record of "raising" OL.
3. TBH... I'm not sure what qualifies as mean for an OL in today's game. Maybe consistently finishing blocks to the ground? There certainly are no Conrad Doblers in today's NFL.
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I got that - I was thinkin of a player - couldn't remember his name on the instant, lol, ...Cameron Erving. 34 1/8 " wingspan....
but didn't have much of a love for the game, not much on aggressiveness I think it was... very athletic... even very athletic, I don't think he was very bendable....still was never able to play at LOT. I guess what I'm saying is, I don't the inch of shorter arm (one arm push to one side, right?) is a problem that isn't able to be overcome with quickness, power, agility, and aggressiveness/work ethic...
Of course, all things being equal, I'd take the longer-armed guy, sure. I honestly don't know - Flugels was a mean offensive lineman - I thought of Flugels playing football when I heard Bitonio, Corbett and Forbes' meanness on the field.
1. Don't confuse arm-length (the measurement you quoted for Cam) with wingspan. Wingspan, finger tip to finger tip, eliminates measurement variables and includes the width of the OL's frame.
2. Again... within limits I'll trade off arm-length, but there is one thing you fail to mention.... Technique.
I used to think any player could learn technique. Drafting athletic OL and teaching tech was the way you built OL depth... both in the NFL and in various sims (Head Coach, Madden, etc.), but now so many OL leave college with such a weak foundation that this path is far less traveled. In fact only the Pats (or more precisely, Scarnecchia) have a recent track record of "raising" OL.
3. TBH... I'm not sure what qualifies as mean for an OL in today's game. Maybe consistently finishing blocks to the ground? There certainly are no Conrad Doblers in today's NFL.
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Zombo said:
Yes, he is a former right tackle for the Browns too.
Zombo
?
How did we let him go?
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Zombo said:
Yes, he is a former right tackle for the Browns too.
Zombo
?
How did we let him go?
How did we let him go?
Browns offered him the most money. He was offered a more than fair contract. He thought he was worth more so he turned it down. Proceeded to go on the free agency tour. Schwartz found out Browns offer was the best came back asking for original offer. Browns took original offer off the table and lowered guaranteed a bit. He got pissed and signed with KC for less money. Sort of like the terrelle Pryor situation except the contract he turned down was given to Kenny britt so when Pryor came back there was no offer to give him. Alex mack, however just wanted out and took way less to play with a "contender".
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How did we let him go?
Browns offered him the most money. He was offered a more than fair contract. He thought he was worth more so he turned it down. Proceeded to go on the free agency tour. Schwartz found out Browns offer was the best came back asking for original offer. Browns took original offer off the table and lowered guaranteed a bit. He got pissed and signed with KC for less money. Sort of like the terrelle Pryor situation except the contract he turned down was given to Kenny britt so when Pryor came back there was no offer to give him. Alex mack, however just wanted out and took way less to play with a "contender".
Schwartz got pissed and signed with KC for less money. Alex mack, however just wanted out and took way less to play with a "contender".
always starts with ownership.. Haslem is still football business clueless..ask his wife
.. Farmer & SB sat on millions of dollars of cap space money everyday, while these 2 guys should have gotten paid as pro bowlers to the team that drafted them after 3 years..Cleveland..They chose to go win now, never hearing of Baker Mayfield ?..Tretter, Bitonio up next. Dorse your move?
Wingspan, finger tip to finger tip, eliminates measurement variables and includes the width of the OL's frame.
I used to think any player could learn technique. but now so many OL leave college with such a weak foundation that this path is far less traveled. In fact only the Pats (or more precisely, Scarnecchia) have a recent track record of "raising" OL.
3. TBH... I'm not sure what qualifies as mean for an OL in today's game. There certainly are no Conrad Doblers in today's NFL.
^^pure f'n OL gold right here ^^..well said Tour ?.. We have drafted back to back, 2 college Tackles with a 78" & 79" wingspan respectively. Last season Orlando Brown 85", McGlinchy 81",Kolten Miller 83",Q.Nelson 83" wingspans..am becoming a bigger fan of Greg Robinson (age 26) winning that 7M dollar prove it deal by the end of season..
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Gumby: always starts with ownership.. Haslem is still football business clueless..ask his wife
.. Farmer & SB sat on millions of dollars of cap space money everyday, while these 2 guys should have gotten paid as pro bowlers to the team that drafted them after 3 years..Cleveland..They chose to go win now, never hearing of Baker Mayfield ?..Tretter, Bitonio up next. Dorse your move?
Thanks, now I remember. That is what bad ownership/management does for you. Let us hope we are over those days.
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The Browns may have told him that he could play Tackle in case he went undrafted. He would then be more apt to sign with us. Now that they've drafted him they pretty much owe him a shot at tackle...but that doesn't mean they won't move him. Doesn't mean he makes the team either. All of the draft picks are good in May.
BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE -
I don't get the head ducked when trying to land his initial strike... Appears to be an ok bender at the knees. Sometimes has his weight too far out in front of him in pass pro sets though. Raw tools to be coached up are there.
Think he probably needs to move inside like Bitonio and Corbett?
Think he probably needs to move inside like Bitonio and Corbett?
I believe I heard on Browns Daily that was the plan, but who knows at this early stage in the process. What I certainly love is the potential value we have with this guy. We could develop Desmond Harrison into a viable player, and then develop this guy for next year. Don't forget that Harrison got some incredible experience last year, and he's been healthy for quite some time and is getting the full benefit of an offseason workout. One of his biggest challenges was his raw power, and if he gets that worked out, he's going to have a chance.
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The Browns may have told him that he could play Tackle in case he went undrafted. He would then be more apt to sign with us. Now that they've drafted him they pretty much owe him a shot at tackle...but that doesn't mean they won't move him. Doesn't mean he makes the team either. All of the draft picks are good in May.
The Browns may have told him that he could play Tackle in case he went undrafted. He would then be more apt to sign with us. Now that they've drafted him they pretty much owe him a shot at tackle...but that doesn't mean they won't move him. Doesn't mean he makes the team either. All of the draft picks are good in May.
Well, almost all of them. Remember when Tampa Bay drafted a kicker in the 2nd round? And then cut him midway into the season? Bwahaha!
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Is he related to George Forbes:
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