1986 Browns vs. 2019 Browns
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Let's compare Mayfield vs Kosar in that time period and see what happens. Kosar was 4-6 in year 1 and then shot up to 12-4 in perhaps the most exciting year of his career and 16 starts in year 2.
You are up Mr. Mayfield.
Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS QBrec Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD TD% Int Int% Lng Y/A AY/A Y/C Y/G Rate Sk Yds NY/A ANY/A Sk% 4QC GWD AV Career 126 108 53-54-1 1994 3365 59.3 23301 124 3.7 87 2.6 97 6.9 6.5 11.7 184.9 81.8 273 1660 5.95 5.55 7.5 14 16 80 9 yrs CLE 108 105 53-51-1 1853 3150 58.8 21904 116 3.7 81 2.6 97 7.0 6.5 11.8 202.8 81.6 259 1594 5.96 5.57 7.6 14 16 75 3 yrs MIA 14 2 0-2-0 105 152 69.1 987 5 3.3 6 3.9 31 6.5 5.4 9.4 70.5 81.2 12 62 5.64 4.60 7.3 3 1985 22 CLE QB 19 12 10 4-6-0 124 248 50.0 1578 8 3.2 7 2.8 68 6.4 5.7 12.7 131.5 69.3 19 121 5.46 4.88 7.1 2 2 6 1986 23 CLE QB 19 16 16 12-4-0 310 531 58.4 3854 17 3.2 10 1.9 72 7.3 7.1 12.4 240.9 83.8 39 274 6.28 6.09 6.8 4 6 13 1987* 24 CLE QB 19 12 12 8-4-0 241 389 62.0 3033 22 5.7 9 2.3 54 7.8 7.9 12.6 252.8 95.4 22 129 7.07 7.15 5.4 14 1988 25 CLE QB 19 9 9 6-3-0 156 259 60.2 1890 10 3.9 7 2.7 77 7.3 6.9 12.1 210.0 84.3 25 172 6.05 5.64 8.8 3 3 6 1989 26 CLE QB 19 16 16 9-6-1 303 513 59.1 3533 18 3.5 14 2.7 97 6.9 6.4 11.7 220.8 80.3 34 192 6.11 5.61 6.2 2 3 11 1990 27 CLE QB 19 13 13 3-10-0 230 423 54.4 2562 10 2.4 15 3.5 50 6.1 4.9 11.1 197.1 65.7 37 220 5.09 4.06 8.0 1 1 5 1991 28 CLE QB 19 16 16 6-10-0 307 494 62.1 3487 18 3.6 9 1.8 71 7.1 7.0 11.4 217.9 87.8 41 232 6.08 6.00 7.7 2 1 13 1992 29 CLE qb 19 7 7 2-5-0 103 155 66.5 1160 8 5.2 7 4.5 69 7.5 6.5 11.3 165.7 87.0 21 126 5.88 4.99 11.9 4 1993 30 2TM 11 7 3-4-0 115 201 57.2 1217 8 4.0 3 1.5 86 6.1 6.2 10.6 110.6 82.0 23 132 4.84 4.96 10.3 0 0 5 CLE qb 19 7 6 3-3-0 79 138 57.2 807 5 3.6 3 2.2 38 5.8 5.6 10.2 115.3 77.2 21 128 4.27 4.05 13.2 0 0 3 DAL qb 18 4 1 0-1-0 36 63 57.1 410 3 4.8 0 0.0 86 6.5 7.5 11.4 102.5 92.7 2 4 6.25 7.17 3.1 2 1994 31 MIA 19 2 0 7 12 58.3 80 1 8.3 1 8.3 22 6.7 4.6 11.4 40.0 71.5 0 0 6.67 4.58 0.0 0 1995 32 MIA qb 19 9 2 0-2-0 74 108 68.5 699 3 2.8 5 4.6 31 6.5 4.9 9.4 77.7 76.1 6 28 5.89 4.44 5.3 2 1996 33 MIA 19 3 0 24 32 75.0 208 1 3.1 0 0.0 20 6.5 7.1 8.7 69.3 102.1 6 34 4.58 5.11 15.8 1 -
Didn't Mayfield have like 27 TDs in his rookie year to set the rookie record...in only a partial season:?
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Not to be a prick, but Sam was replaced by Marty in 1984, but I see the comparisons.
If we had a pass rush in the mid 80s we would have won a Super Bowl. We have a pass rush now (I think), but no Dixon/Minnifield/Felix Wright at CB/FS.
My whole take is the Browns need to survive the first 6 games at say 4-2, stay injury free and takeoff from there.
Not to be a prick, but Sam was replaced by Marty in 1984, but I see the comparisons.
If we had a pass rush in the mid 80s we would have won a Super Bowl. We have a pass rush now (I think), but no Dixon/Minnifield/Felix Wright at CB/FS.
My whole take is the Browns need to survive the first 6 games at say 4-2, stay injury free and takeoff from there.
& Some have posited if Don Rodgers hadn't OD on cocaine, it would have been enough to push the Browns over the top, even with the D-line they had.
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Didn't Mayfield have like 27 TDs in his rookie year to set the rookie record...in only a partial season:?
Didn't Mayfield have like 27 TDs in his rookie year to set the rookie record...in only a partial season:?
The stats NFL QBs are putting up now, even mediocre ones, are insane.
Mayfield is going to obliterate every passing record the Browns have, way before he turns 30. (If he stays healthy, of course)
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Didn't Mayfield have like 27 TDs in his rookie year to set the rookie record...in only a partial season:?
The stats NFL QBs are putting up now, even mediocre ones, are insane.
Mayfield is going to obliterate every passing record the Browns have, way before he turns 30. (If he stays healthy, of course)
The stats NFL QBs are putting up now, even mediocre ones, are insane.
Mayfield is going to obliterate every passing record the Browns have, way before he turns 30. (If he stays healthy, of course)
Well, he beat the record that had been set by both Peyton Manning and Russell Wilson. In any world that is impressive.
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Didn't Mayfield have like 27 TDs in his rookie year to set the rookie record...in only a partial season:?
The stats NFL QBs are putting up now, even mediocre ones, are insane.
Mayfield is going to obliterate every passing record the Browns have, way before he turns 30. (If he stays healthy, of course)
The stats NFL QBs are putting up now, even mediocre ones, are insane.
Mayfield is going to obliterate every passing record the Browns have, way before he turns 30. (If he stays healthy, of course)
The thing that really surprised me was seeing Kosar's stats, in today's NFL, they'd be considered at best pretty average.
PS, for your off season reading enjoyment- here's one guy's opinion of the top 25 QBs all time. Can't say I disagree with many.
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Didn't Mayfield have like 27 TDs in his rookie year to set the rookie record...in only a partial season:?
The stats NFL QBs are putting up now, even mediocre ones, are insane.
Mayfield is going to obliterate every passing record the Browns have, way before he turns 30. (If he stays healthy, of course)
The stats NFL QBs are putting up now, even mediocre ones, are insane.
Mayfield is going to obliterate every passing record the Browns have, way before he turns 30. (If he stays healthy, of course)
Yes welcome to the new NFL touch football passing game when it comes to QBs and WRs.
Bernie got killed compared to the quarterbacks today.
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Good comparison.
Lindy Infante came in as OC to spark the aerial attack as Kitchens is hoped to do/continue with Mayfield.
One could say there's precedence for a second year Browns QB, with talent around him, to go out and win a dozen football games. - Not sayin' that'll happen. But it has happened before......
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The 1986 team went 12-4. It would be a dream if this year's team could do that. But I still think they have some catching up/proving to do.
They are not quite up to that level yet along the OL...which hopefull can prove to mesh well together as that group did; LBs, DBs, or special teams. Perhaps big edges for this year's team at WR, and most importantly, along the DL will make them match up to 1986.
The 1986 team went 12-4. It would be a dream if this year's team could do that. But I still think they have some catching up/proving to do.
They are not quite up to that level yet along the OL...which hopefull can prove to mesh well together as that group did; LBs, DBs, or special teams. Perhaps big edges for this year's team at WR, and most importantly, along the DL will make them match up to 1986.
Outside of the final 2 minutes of the 1986 post season - that season was a very fond memory for me and my family. It was the re-birth of beating Pittsburgh at least once a season, which would be REAL nice to return to in 2019. It re-confirmed how important the running game has always been to the winning tradition of the franchise. From the physicality of Mack and Byner to the speed of Curtis Dickey to the ability to convert 3rd downs with Herman Fontenot (47 receptions for 559 yards). Little bit of everything to make the opponent feel like a whole lotta nothing. Chubb showed us plenty to get excited about. What's to say Hilliard can't give us what Fontenot did if it has to come to that?
Meatball on spaghetti, only 10 of Kosar's 531 passes were intercepted to perpetuate the favorable time of possession advantage that had us understanding the best defense is a great offense (that doesn't turn over the football). It also allows the defense to rest and keep fresh legs when they do play less than 50% of the game as beneficiaries of the offense. Over the years people have brought up (the 2nd year QB) Kosar only threw 17 TD passes in 86; but he was also already on his 2nd OC (my fave- Lindy Infante). Infante took over an offense that had a RB and a FB rush for over 1000 yards apiece in 1985 with goals of keeping ball control via accurate short passes from Kosar in lieu of handing off. We went from 76 receptions from the RB position in 85 to 122 receptions from the RBs in 86. IMO, that was a masterful way to prevent/sting the blitz despite the reality we had a cement shoe'd QB baiting it. Watching Kosar beat the blitz time after time to keep drives alive especially on 3rd downs featuring the 1-2 punch of undrafted RB Fontentot (47 receptions) and 4th round WR Brian Brennan (who led our WRs with 55 receptions) meant more to me than how many TD passes Bernie threw. Those are what led to the points we needed for 12 wins in a regular season.
Today, Baker packs the same leadership cred with teammates while his performance has CPR'd excitement and enthusiasm throughout our fanbase. Meanwhile Dorsey added another pass rusher (Vernon) and talent DT (Richardson) to compliment Garrett and Ogunjobi upfront while he also drafted (CB) Greedy Williams to a couple young LBers to press people for playing time. My guess is the better we are up front and at the back end - the challenges of playing LBer get a little bit easier. When Williams had Peppers lining up in Toronto most of 2017 - the extended/boundary-free hook zones to the right and left of MLB (Schobert) had to leave him feeling helpless. The ole saying robbing Peter to pay Paul - Schobert was Peter while I never did find out who Paul was in that scenario. Anyway, we now have a collection of talent where we no longer have to look to smoke and mirrors despair that gashed this defense and victimized some positions as much as injuries. I get the feeling we can bring a much better pass rush than our 86 team which should only help the exciting talent/depth we have at CB. Gotta thank Dorsey for this kind of feeling about what he's building.
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