Brett Ratliff
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There was one training camp report where it was said he looked sharp. He tore us up last preseason, so he gets respect from us.
Welcome. No troll tag for you.
We're pretty happy with Mangini as he's made us realize our last run of coaches failed to give the Browns strong direction and identity. What say you about him?
The Jets seem to be our sister franchise of late with the Mangini, Ryan, and multiplayer connections. Good luck this season.
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Thanks guys.
I love football, so I love all things football. There are a bunch of Jets fans who were upset to see Ratliff go, but maybe Sanchez will work out, not to get into that now.
Mangini.
The guy is smart, disciplined, and hard working. He knows x's and o's of football, but is very conservative in his approach. In every season, it took a while before blitz schemes were being used consistently, and in games where they were used we were effective (i.e. vs Pittsburgh, New England, etc.). He loves players who are good all round people, and often overlooks talent for character. That's fine in college, but in the NFL, guys like Terrell Suggs are much better than, oh, say, Bryan Thomas. Who?
In the 3 seasons that he was the head coach, he had 3 different approaches to the season. Heavily involved in free agency, not at all, moving all over the place in the draft, you name it. I'm not sure I like what he's done with this team (2009 Browns) up to this point. I do think your camp is going well, better than at least 2 of the camps when he was in NY, and probably the 3rd. I do know however that in 2006 when he had an extremely difficult training camp, our team was very resilient and always prepared during the season. Players complained of being tired, but I think that was just to make next year's camp easier. The last 2 seasons had very slower pace training camps.
Expect your defense to be improved. He heavily relies on the defensive line to allow linebackers to move. Your defensive line is better overall than ours (my opinion, of course), and the nose tackle position is key here. Rodgers and Rubin are perfect. Mosely can also play interior well, and has a good motor. Coleman is solid against the run (don't expect too much pressure from him on the QB). Then behind these guys are a lot of players who make plays. Barton is a good LB, I was sad to see him go. Elam is also a very underrated player.
Offensively, Mangini is conservative. Hopefully he relinquishes offensive play calling duties to the coordinator, BUT, despite this being the case in New York, Mangini still had a hand in play calling. He believes in defense, ball control, creating turnovers and having none of your own. You will be penalized very little, as his teams are disciplined in this department (we were all 3 years).
Don't read into anything he says, he is very deliberate with his statements when he wants to be. He's like the CIA, but when he wants to make his point, he does. You'll know the starting QB when you see one guy taking all the snaps with the first team. He says one thing and does whatever he wants.
He is good friends with Tannenbaum. I expect many trades between our two franchises in the future.
I hope you guys do well this year. Beat the snot out of Pittsburgh and Baltimore. You have 2 good QBs in Anderson and Quinn, so whoever starts you shouldn't have a problem. I also hope you don't trade Edwards. He's very good, and if Mangini lets the offense go a little, this could work out well for you.
I'm pooped for today, I'll talk to you guys soon. Thanks for the welcome.
John
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Thanks guys.
I love football, so I love all things football. There are a bunch of Jets fans who were upset to see Ratliff go, but maybe Sanchez will work out, not to get into that now.
Mangini.
The guy is smart, disciplined, and hard working. He knows x's and o's of football, but is very conservative in his approach. In every season, it took a while before blitz schemes were being used consistently, and in games where they were used we were effective (i.e. vs Pittsburgh, New England, etc.). He loves players who are good all round people, and often overlooks talent for character. That's fine in college, but in the NFL, guys like Terrell Suggs are much better than, oh, say, Bryan Thomas. Who?
In the 3 seasons that he was the head coach, he had 3 different approaches to the season. Heavily involved in free agency, not at all, moving all over the place in the draft, you name it. I'm not sure I like what he's done with this team (2009 Browns) up to this point. I do think your camp is going well, better than at least 2 of the camps when he was in NY, and probably the 3rd. I do know however that in 2006 when he had an extremely difficult training camp, our team was very resilient and always prepared during the season. Players complained of being tired, but I think that was just to make next year's camp easier. The last 2 seasons had very slower pace training camps.
Expect your defense to be improved. He heavily relies on the defensive line to allow linebackers to move. Your defensive line is better overall than ours (my opinion, of course), and the nose tackle position is key here. Rodgers and Rubin are perfect. Mosely can also play interior well, and has a good motor. Coleman is solid against the run (don't expect too much pressure from him on the QB). Then behind these guys are a lot of players who make plays. Barton is a good LB, I was sad to see him go. Elam is also a very underrated player.
Offensively, Mangini is conservative. Hopefully he relinquishes offensive play calling duties to the coordinator, BUT, despite this being the case in New York, Mangini still had a hand in play calling. He believes in defense, ball control, creating turnovers and having none of your own. You will be penalized very little, as his teams are disciplined in this department (we were all 3 years).
Don't read into anything he says, he is very deliberate with his statements when he wants to be. He's like the CIA, but when he wants to make his point, he does. You'll know the starting QB when you see one guy taking all the snaps with the first team. He says one thing and does whatever he wants.
He is good friends with Tannenbaum. I expect many trades between our two franchises in the future.
I hope you guys do well this year. Beat the snot out of Pittsburgh and Baltimore. You have 2 good QBs in Anderson and Quinn, so whoever starts you shouldn't have a problem. I also hope you don't trade Edwards. He's very good, and if Mangini lets the offense go a little, this could work out well for you.
I'm pooped for today, I'll talk to you guys soon. Thanks for the welcome.
John
Offensively, Mangini is conservative. Hopefully he relinquishes offensive play calling duties to the coordinator, BUT, despite this being the case in New York, Mangini still had a hand in play calling. He believes in defense, ball control, creating turnovers and having none of your own.
He sounds like Quinn would fit his style better. Low INT's and a smart game manager rather than a gunslinger, DA's life long pattern.
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The folks at Football Outsiders made a surprising point about Mangini's offense in New York:
Football Outsiders said:
The Browns offense may mimic what the Jets did in 2008. If so, expect the team to abandon the run before the national anthem each week. The Jets were a good running team (fifth in DVOA, as opposed to 22nd in passing DVOA), but Mangini’s staff treated runs like inconvenient obligations. The Jets ran on 56 percent of their first downs, but then ran just 41 percent of the time on all other downs, including just 31 percent of all third-and-short situations. It’s as if Mangini’s staff called a first-down handoff, shouted “Are you satisfied?” to the guys at the New York Post who demanded more Thomas Jones every week, then spread the field and ordered Favre to throw a short hitch, regardless of the situation.Not sure whether Mangini or Schottenheimer deserves the blame for that. Probably both of them.
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The folks at Football Outsiders made a surprising point about Mangini's offense in New York:
Football Outsiders said:
The Browns offense may mimic what the Jets did in 2008. If so, expect the team to abandon the run before the national anthem each week. The Jets were a good running team (fifth in DVOA, as opposed to 22nd in passing DVOA), but Mangini’s staff treated runs like inconvenient obligations. The Jets ran on 56 percent of their first downs, but then ran just 41 percent of the time on all other downs, including just 31 percent of all third-and-short situations. It’s as if Mangini’s staff called a first-down handoff, shouted “Are you satisfied?” to the guys at the New York Post who demanded more Thomas Jones every week, then spread the field and ordered Favre to throw a short hitch, regardless of the situation.Not sure whether Mangini or Schottenheimer deserves the blame for that. Probably both of them.
Aloysius said:
The folks at Football Outsiders made a surprising point about Mangini's offense in New York:Not sure whether Mangini or Schottenheimer deserves the blame for that. Probably both of them.
You know that's a good way to describe the offensive play callling. I'd say both deserve the blame, we'll find out this year with Schotty staying behind (who knows, maybe Rex will be even MORE conservative on offense).
Mangini is smart (despite what people in NY say). He'll figure out the offense.
The 09 Browns are set up for success, IMO. Winning a couple of key divisional games will set the pace (week 3 & 6 both on the road - that's tough). 7 of the first 11 games on the road, to include Pitt, & Bal, but the schedule is not unbearable. A lot of games are within driving distance. I think this is a huge factor for NFL teams. We went to the west coast 4 times last year (from NY), and lost every game.
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To answer your question on Ratliff, he has been decent. Not starting material, but better than the 4th QB, Bartel. Unforunately, his best asset (that cannon attached to his right shoulder) is overlooked because DA has a stronger cannon. A lot of his deep passes are wobbly and his short passes tend to wobble at the end, but he's still young and a good #3 QB. Much better than Bartel, again.
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To answer your question on Ratliff, he has been decent. Not starting material, but better than the 4th QB, Bartel. Unforunately, his best asset (that cannon attached to his right shoulder) is overlooked because DA has a stronger cannon. A lot of his deep passes are wobbly and his short passes tend to wobble at the end, but he's still young and a good #3 QB. Much better than Bartel, again.
To answer your question on Ratliff, he has been decent. Not starting material, but better than the 4th QB, Bartel. Unforunately, his best asset (that cannon attached to his right shoulder) is overlooked because DA has a stronger cannon. A lot of his deep passes are wobbly and his short passes tend to wobble at the end, but he's still young and a good #3 QB. Much better than Bartel, again.
Well, it's interesting you say that (cannon), because Pennington's lack of one probably increased Ratliff's stock. Some guys are still wondering about him, and a few even think he'd start over the two guys you have, but these are the homer fans who don't understand football. There's a reason the guy was undrafted. Not to say he can't be a great QB (it happens, right), but he's in a tough situation to succeed in Cleveland.
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To answer your question on Ratliff, he has been decent. Not starting material, but better than the 4th QB, Bartel. Unforunately, his best asset (that cannon attached to his right shoulder) is overlooked because DA has a stronger cannon. A lot of his deep passes are wobbly and his short passes tend to wobble at the end, but he's still young and a good #3 QB. Much better than Bartel, again.
Well, it's interesting you say that (cannon), because Pennington's lack of one probably increased Ratliff's stock. Some guys are still wondering about him, and a few even think he'd start over the two guys you have, but these are the homer fans who don't understand football. There's a reason the guy was undrafted. Not to say he can't be a great QB (it happens, right), but he's in a tough situation to succeed in Cleveland.
Well, it's interesting you say that (cannon), because Pennington's lack of one probably increased Ratliff's stock. Some guys are still wondering about him, and a few even think he'd start over the two guys you have, but these are the homer fans who don't understand football. There's a reason the guy was undrafted. Not to say he can't be a great QB (it happens, right), but he's in a tough situation to succeed in Cleveland.
The loser of this QB competiton will most likely be shopped in the offseason. I think Mangini brought Ratliff in for a reason. He wasn't just a throwin. The kid is working with the #3 group because of the competition so yo aren't really getting a good look at him.
Persoonally, I like what I see in him. He could definately play in this league. You can always look at Cassels and know there's a chance.
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Aug 5th, 2009 @ 7:16 pm by Steve Doerschuk
- No. 3 QB Brett Ratliff has had a quiet camp after some misguided buzz that he might horn into the race for No. 1.
Ratliff is a likeable fellow who had a laugh today about last year’s preseason game at Cleveland.
He was a Jet then, with Brett Favre on his way in, and Chad Pennington on his way out.
“It was my coming-out party,” said Ratliff, who played three quarters and had a monster game. His first pass as an NFL quarterback was in that game, a 71-yarder to David Clowney.
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In his roundup of this morning's practice, Steve King talks to the "other" QB on the roster about his role now and into the future.
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Hey another jet fan here. Was also checking how Ratliff was doing but didn't seem to find anything but I guess that is understandable considering he is behind on the depth chart with DA and Quinn competing. Like John said a lot jet fans were pulling for him, and a lot of homers but what else is new. I guess it was just refreshing seeing a big "prototypical" QB with an arm after seeing Pennington all those years. But anyway..
You guys like Mangini so far as a HC? The one thing I didn't like about him was that to me , he seemed so stubborn with some of the decisions he made. Like he wanted to keep doing something until it worked, when everyone else knew it clearly wasn't going to work and it just kept costing the team. Also hated the way he punished the players or put them in the doghouse so often. I understand you shouldn't be making mistakes, but to bench a guy or take him off the field could sometimes hurt their confidence and just set a bad example after that. For example our TE Dustin Keller one game had a couple of a drops one game, then the next game he had Bubba effin Franks starting ahead of him because of it. There is no point of that to me. To me you should be able to go out make mistakes, especially as a rookie, but then go back out and learn from them. Thats how you get better. Not by being punished.
The guy seems like a genius with x's and o's in the film room and breaking it down but never seemed to translate on the field come game time.
And obviously from a fan standpoint, his secrecy and being all confidential was aggrivating lol but that doesn't really matter at he end.
I still feel like he will learn from all his mistakes and also things that worked in NY and build on it and become a good HC for you guys. Good luck on the season!
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Marty Gitlin said:
Brett Ratliff took a step forward in his quest for the third QB spot by pinpointing a strike in the end zone to WR Braylon Edwards between two defenders. -
Ratliff should be given a fair shot to win the job, but I don't know how politically viable that is right now.
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Hey another jet fan here. Was also checking how Ratliff was doing but didn't seem to find anything but I guess that is understandable considering he is behind on the depth chart with DA and Quinn competing. Like John said a lot jet fans were pulling for him, and a lot of homers but what else is new. I guess it was just refreshing seeing a big "prototypical" QB with an arm after seeing Pennington all those years. But anyway..
You guys like Mangini so far as a HC? The one thing I didn't like about him was that to me , he seemed so stubborn with some of the decisions he made. Like he wanted to keep doing something until it worked, when everyone else knew it clearly wasn't going to work and it just kept costing the team. Also hated the way he punished the players or put them in the doghouse so often. I understand you shouldn't be making mistakes, but to bench a guy or take him off the field could sometimes hurt their confidence and just set a bad example after that. For example our TE Dustin Keller one game had a couple of a drops one game, then the next game he had Bubba effin Franks starting ahead of him because of it. There is no point of that to me. To me you should be able to go out make mistakes, especially as a rookie, but then go back out and learn from them. Thats how you get better. Not by being punished.
The guy seems like a genius with x's and o's in the film room and breaking it down but never seemed to translate on the field come game time.
And obviously from a fan standpoint, his secrecy and being all confidential was aggrivating lol but that doesn't really matter at he end.
I still feel like he will learn from all his mistakes and also things that worked in NY and build on it and become a good HC for you guys. Good luck on the season!
Hey another jet fan here. Was also checking how Ratliff was doing but didn't seem to find anything but I guess that is understandable considering he is behind on the depth chart with DA and Quinn competing. Like John said a lot jet fans were pulling for him, and a lot of homers but what else is new. I guess it was just refreshing seeing a big "prototypical" QB with an arm after seeing Pennington all those years. But anyway..
You guys like Mangini so far as a HC? The one thing I didn't like about him was that to me , he seemed so stubborn with some of the decisions he made. Like he wanted to keep doing something until it worked, when everyone else knew it clearly wasn't going to work and it just kept costing the team. Also hated the way he punished the players or put them in the doghouse so often. I understand you shouldn't be making mistakes, but to bench a guy or take him off the field could sometimes hurt their confidence and just set a bad example after that. For example our TE Dustin Keller one game had a couple of a drops one game, then the next game he had Bubba effin Franks starting ahead of him because of it. There is no point of that to me. To me you should be able to go out make mistakes, especially as a rookie, but then go back out and learn from them. Thats how you get better. Not by being punished.
The guy seems like a genius with x's and o's in the film room and breaking it down but never seemed to translate on the field come game time.
And obviously from a fan standpoint, his secrecy and being all confidential was aggrivating lol but that doesn't really matter at he end.
I still feel like he will learn from all his mistakes and also things that worked in NY and build on it and become a good HC for you guys. Good luck on the season!
If there is one thing I like about Mangini, his tough, no bullsh*t approach. It works to an extent, and sometimes it doesn't but for a team that sure lacking in discipline like our brownies, his approach sure helps.
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Ratliff should be given a fair shot to win the job, but I don't know how politically viable that is right now.
Ratliff should be given a fair shot to win the job, but I don't know how politically viable that is right now.
Ratliff is a good player and all, I'm not really sure if he has the credentials to lead this team. After all, we have Anderson, who was a pro-bowler, and a unproven first rounder in Quinn. So, it's a double edged sword.
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