So, who would you pick as the next HC ?
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I suspect that Six Super Bowl rings gives the guy a lot of credibility as a leader with players....
For about 5 minutes. Then when he has control of his own team and, god forbid - things go sideways, those rings really won't mean jack shit then, do they? Credibility as a play caller and schematic mind? Sure. But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
Those 3 rings sure didn't help him from losing control of the Denver locker room, throwing some of his players under the bus and making some of the most obviously questionable personnel choices this side of Mike Holmgren.
edit: That's not even to mention what went down with Indy. That was bush league shit.
For about 5 minutes. Then when he has control of his own team and, god forbid - things go sideways, those rings really won't mean jack shit then, do they? Credibility as a play caller and schematic mind? Sure. But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
Those 3 rings sure didn't help him from losing control of the Denver locker room, throwing some of his players under the bus and making some of the most obviously questionable personnel choices this side of Mike Holmgren.
True, but should the Browns hire McDaniels, I doubt he's going to get final say on players.
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Ideally under our current circumstances? I'd be cool with Stef, Kubiak as the OC/Asst Hc and Schwartz or Phillips as DC.
edit: And for the many here that want a HC who is a "leader of men"... I would have a hard time playing for McDaniels and taking him seriously as that.
Ideally under our current circumstances? I'd be cool with Stef, Kubiak as the OC/Asst Hc and Schwartz or Phillips as DC.
edit: And for the many here that want a HC who is a "leader of men"... I would have a hard time playing for McDaniels and taking him seriously as that.
Why would Schwartz take a lateral move to Coordinate a defense in Cleveland? I used to agree with your thought about McDaniel; but it looked like he finally reached puberty a year or 2 after his Denver experience.
I'm actually more worried about Stefanski's ability to be THE "leader of Men" here. Kubiak already had to bail Stefanski out earlier this year when various important men on the Vikings offense were protesting his leadership of the passing game.
As long as Stefanski has been with the Vikings, they've seemed reluctant to even give him the QB Coach Title without making him share it with another coach as I'll cut and paste:
Year Position
2006 Minnesota Vikings Assistant to the Head Coach
2007 Minnesota Vikings Assistant to the Head Coach
2008 Minnesota Vikings Assistant to the Head Coach
2009 Minnesota Vikings Assistant Quarterbacks Coach / Offensive Quality Control Coach
2010 Minnesota Vikings Assistant Quarterbacks Coach
2011 Minnesota Vikings Assistant Quarterbacks Coach
2012 Minnesota Vikings Assistant Quarterbacks Coach
2013 Minnesota Vikings Assistant Quarterbacks Coach
2014 Minnesota Vikings Tight Ends Coach
2015 Minnesota Vikings Tight Ends Coach
2016 Minnesota Vikings Running Backs Coach
2017 Minnesota Vikings Quarterbacks Coach
2018 Minnesota Vikings Quarterbacks Coach
2019 Minnesota Vikings Offensive Coordinator - a year the Kubiak intervention was very necessary
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I suspect that Six Super Bowl rings gives the guy a lot of credibility as a leader with players....
For about 5 minutes. Then when he has control of his own team and, god forbid - things go sideways, those rings really won't mean jack shit then, do they? Credibility as a play caller and schematic mind? Sure. But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
Those 3 rings sure didn't help him from losing control of the Denver locker room, throwing some of his players under the bus and making some of the most obviously questionable personnel choices this side of Mike Holmgren.
edit: That's not even to mention what went down with Indy. That was bush league shit.
For about 5 minutes. Then when he has control of his own team and, god forbid - things go sideways, those rings really won't mean jack shit then, do they? Credibility as a play caller and schematic mind? Sure. But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
Those 3 rings sure didn't help him from losing control of the Denver locker room, throwing some of his players under the bus and making some of the most obviously questionable personnel choices this side of Mike Holmgren.
edit: That's not even to mention what went down with Indy. That was bush league shit.
Well, you are just speculating....making an ass of yourself by assuming. Essentially....anything McD did with what you describe up there BB did before him and better/worse.
BB had some SB rings as DC of the NYG. BB clearly threw Bernie under the bus...and the whole team by cutting him and putting in Todd Phucking Phicox. There has been no worse personell choice in Browns history than that. Hell, at least Tim Tebow won a playoff game for McD. And he BB lost the locker room basically 2 years running. And the Indy thing with McD: Remember BBs one day stint as HC of the NYJ.....that was some even bigger bush league shit.
So, obviously, per the BB example, the things you gripe about don't mean shit, if he can come in here and win. And, of course, it will help if he has a great QB. (as it would help any coach who ever donned a headset)
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For about 5 minutes. Then when he has control of his own team and, god forbid - things go sideways, those rings really won't mean jack shit then, do they? Credibility as a play caller and schematic mind? Sure. But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
Those 3 rings sure didn't help him from losing control of the Denver locker room, throwing some of his players under the bus and making some of the most obviously questionable personnel choices this side of Mike Holmgren.
True, but should the Browns hire McDaniels, I doubt he's going to get final say on players.
-
Ideally under our current circumstances? I'd be cool with Stef, Kubiak as the OC/Asst Hc and Schwartz or Phillips as DC.
edit: And for the many here that want a HC who is a "leader of men"... I would have a hard time playing for McDaniels and taking him seriously as that.
Ideally under our current circumstances? I'd be cool with Stef, Kubiak as the OC/Asst Hc and Schwartz or Phillips as DC.
edit: And for the many here that want a HC who is a "leader of men"... I would have a hard time playing for McDaniels and taking him seriously as that.
My thoughts exactly on McDaniels.
Im kind of leaning toward Saleh or Stefanski.
And i want Phillips as the DC.
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For about 5 minutes. Then when he has control of his own team and, god forbid - things go sideways, those rings really won't mean jack shit then, do they? Credibility as a play caller and schematic mind? Sure. But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
Those 3 rings sure didn't help him from losing control of the Denver locker room, throwing some of his players under the bus and making some of the most obviously questionable personnel choices this side of Mike Holmgren.
True, but should the Browns hire McDaniels, I doubt he's going to get final say on players.
True, but should the Browns hire McDaniels, I doubt he's going to get final say on players.
Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Why would Schwartz take a lateral move to Coordinate a defense in Cleveland?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
Well, you are just speculating....making an ass of yourself by assuming. Essentially....anything McD did with what you describe up there BB did before him and better/worse.
BB had some SB rings as DC of the NYG. BB clearly threw Bernie under the bus...and the whole team by cutting him and putting in Todd Phucking Phicox. There has been no worse personell choice in Browns history than that. Hell, at least Tim Tebow won a playoff game for McD. And he BB lost the locker room basically 2 years running. And the Indy thing with McD: Remember BBs one day stint as HC of the NYJ.....that was some even bigger bush league shit.
So, obviously, per the BB example, the things you gripe about don't mean shit, if he can come in here and win. And, of course, it will help if he has a great QB. (as it would help any coach who ever donned a headset)
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
My thoughts exactly on McDaniels.
Im kind of leaning toward Saleh or Stefanski.
And i want Phillips as the DC.
Saleh is another interesting name. I wonder who he would bring from SF? I would love a Shanny type mind to help craft this offense. Between my calls for more 12 personnel, under center work and using the sprint outs, waggles, boots... Would be a great
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True, but should the Browns hire McDaniels, I doubt he's going to get final say on players.
Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Why would Schwartz take a lateral move to Coordinate a defense in Cleveland?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
Well, you are just speculating....making an ass of yourself by assuming. Essentially....anything McD did with what you describe up there BB did before him and better/worse.
BB had some SB rings as DC of the NYG. BB clearly threw Bernie under the bus...and the whole team by cutting him and putting in Todd Phucking Phicox. There has been no worse personell choice in Browns history than that. Hell, at least Tim Tebow won a playoff game for McD. And he BB lost the locker room basically 2 years running. And the Indy thing with McD: Remember BBs one day stint as HC of the NYJ.....that was some even bigger bush league shit.
So, obviously, per the BB example, the things you gripe about don't mean shit, if he can come in here and win. And, of course, it will help if he has a great QB. (as it would help any coach who ever donned a headset)
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
My thoughts exactly on McDaniels.
Im kind of leaning toward Saleh or Stefanski.
And i want Phillips as the DC.
Saleh is another interesting name. I wonder who he would bring from SF? I would love a Shanny type mind to help craft this offense. Between my calls for more 12 personnel, under center work and using the sprint outs, waggles, boots... Would be a great
Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
Of course you assumed. You said this: But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
If that is not pure assumption on your part that McD would not bring vision, leadership, wisdom, guidance to this team...then what the fuck was it?
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
Actually....you make my case better than I did. BB is in this conversation because: A. McD. is a BB protoge, and what he learned as a football coach came much from him. B. Some of what McD has gone through perfectly parallels some of what BB went through...as I detailed, so they each have similar experiences and C. The BB/Brady relationship as you describe is essentially, precisely what we would want here with the McD./Baker relationship. Another perfect parallel. We would want McD to be the mind and Baker to be the fiery leader.
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Informed Speculation >> Mindless Regurgitation
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
Of course you assumed. You said this: But on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, in OTA's, mini camp, etc etc where you forge your teams identity and players know they trust your vision, leadership, wisdom and guidance? Completely different story.
If that is not pure assumption on your part that McD would not bring vision, leadership, wisdom, guidance to this team...then what the fuck was it?
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
Actually....you make my case better than I did. BB is in this conversation because: A. McD. is a BB protoge, and what he learned as a football coach came much from him. B. Some of what McD has gone through perfectly parallels some of what BB went through...as I detailed, so they each have similar experiences and C. The BB/Brady relationship as you describe is essentially, precisely what we would want here with the McD./Baker relationship. Another perfect parallel. We would want McD to be the mind and Baker to be the fiery leader.
I'm not saying McD wouldn't bring his "vision" to this team. Is that something you can get grown men to buy into is a different story. He has a history of failure at that part along with personnel evaluation. NOT an ideal combination.
And until Baker displays some selfless type leadership when under severe duress, I remain skeptical. Our QB did not acquit himself well this past season in that category.
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I'm not saying McD wouldn't bring his "vision" to this team. Is that something you can get grown men to buy into is a different story. He has a history of failure at that part along with personnel evaluation. NOT an ideal combination.
And until Baker displays some selfless type leadership when under severe duress, I remain skeptical. Our QB did not acquit himself well this past season in that category.
I'm not saying McD wouldn't bring his "vision" to this team. Is that something you can get grown men to buy into is a different story. He has a history of failure at that part along with personnel evaluation. NOT an ideal combination.
A history of failure at what? He had 1.5 seasons at Denver. Are you talking about his drafting? First question: Was he even the one doing the drafting...or was there a GM there? If he was the one, truly I don't think he did that badly.....even if you are talking about Tebow (who did, after all win a playoff game for John Fox..who chose to play him). Here are the draft choices made the 2 years he was with Denver:
Year Rnd Player Pick Pos To AP1 PB St CarAV G Cmp Att Yds TD Int Att Yds TD Rec Yds TD Int Sk College/Univ 2010 1 Demaryius Thomas 22 WR 2019 0 4 8 69 143 0 1 0 0 0 3 6 0 724 9763 63 Georgia Tech 2010 1 Tim Tebow 25 QB 2012 0 0 1 12 35 173 361 2422 17 9 197 989 12 0 0 0 Florida 2010 2 Zane Beadles 45 G 2018 0 1 7 51 137 0 0 0 Utah 2010 3 J.D. Walton 80 C 2015 0 0 3 23 56 Baylor 2010 3 Eric Decker 87 WR 2017 0 0 6 46 111 0 2 0 0 0 1 1 0 439 5816 53 Minnesota 2010 5 Perrish Cox 137 DB 2016 0 0 4 19 81 10 Oklahoma St. 2010 6 Eric Olsen 183 C 2014 0 0 0 3 23 Notre Dame 2010 7 Syd'Quan Thompson 225 DB 2010 0 0 0 1 13 2 California 2010 7 Jammie Kirlew 232 DE 2011 0 0 0 0 1 Indiana Year Rnd Player Pick Pos To AP1 PB St CarAV G Cmp Att Yds TD Int Att Yds TD Rec Yds TD Int Sk College/Univ 2009 1 Knowshon Moreno 12 RB 2014 0 0 3 33 63 876 3616 27 158 1409 9 Georgia 2009 1 Robert Ayers 18 DE 2017 0 0 5 27 120 34.5 Tennessee 2009 2 Alphonso Smith 37 DB 2012 0 0 1 8 42 8 Wake Forest 2009 2 Darcel McBath 48 DB 2012 0 0 0 3 37 2 Texas Tech 2009 2 Richard Quinn 64 TE 2012 0 0 0 0 30 1 9 0 North Carolina 2009 4 David Bruton 114 DB 2016 0 0 0 10 108 2 48 0 3 2.0 Notre Dame 2009 4 Seth Olsen 132 G 2012 0 0 0 3 14 Iowa 2009 5 Kenny McKinley 141 WR 2009 0 0 0 0 8 South Carolina 2009 6 Tom Brandstater 174 QB 2011 0 0 0 0 1 0 2 0 0 0 Fresno St. 2009 7 Blake Schlueter 225 C 0 0 0 Some of these were main cogs in that teams 5 year playoff run subsequent to his time there.
And until Baker displays some selfless type leadership when under severe duress, I remain skeptical. Our QB did not acquit himself well this past season in that category.
But he did the prior season, so we know that with the right direction he can show that.
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True, but should the Browns hire McDaniels, I doubt he's going to get final say on players.
Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Why would Schwartz take a lateral move to Coordinate a defense in Cleveland?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
Well, you are just speculating....making an ass of yourself by assuming. Essentially....anything McD did with what you describe up there BB did before him and better/worse.
BB had some SB rings as DC of the NYG. BB clearly threw Bernie under the bus...and the whole team by cutting him and putting in Todd Phucking Phicox. There has been no worse personell choice in Browns history than that. Hell, at least Tim Tebow won a playoff game for McD. And he BB lost the locker room basically 2 years running. And the Indy thing with McD: Remember BBs one day stint as HC of the NYJ.....that was some even bigger bush league shit.
So, obviously, per the BB example, the things you gripe about don't mean shit, if he can come in here and win. And, of course, it will help if he has a great QB. (as it would help any coach who ever donned a headset)
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
My thoughts exactly on McDaniels.
Im kind of leaning toward Saleh or Stefanski.
And i want Phillips as the DC.
Saleh is another interesting name. I wonder who he would bring from SF? I would love a Shanny type mind to help craft this offense. Between my calls for more 12 personnel, under center work and using the sprint outs, waggles, boots... Would be a great
Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
Saleh is another interesting name. I wonder who he would bring from SF? I would love a Shanny type mind to help craft this offense. Between my calls for more 12 personnel, under center work and using the sprint outs, waggles, boots... Would be a great
Mike LaFleur...Matt’s brother. He would be an interesting add offensively. Passing coordinator Niners. Was on Cleveland staff in 2014.
The Shanny offensive system and any disciples to it would be great. They block so dang well and call some great play action stuffSaleh was with the Hawks and Jags both at great points in the franchise.
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Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
Saleh is another interesting name. I wonder who he would bring from SF? I would love a Shanny type mind to help craft this offense. Between my calls for more 12 personnel, under center work and using the sprint outs, waggles, boots... Would be a great
Mike LaFleur...Matt’s brother. He would be an interesting add offensively. Passing coordinator Niners. Was on Cleveland staff in 2014.
The Shanny offensive system and any disciples to it would be great. They block so dang well and call some great play action stuffSaleh was with the Hawks and Jags both at great points in the franchise.
Mike LaFleur...Matt’s brother. He would be an interesting add offensively. Passing coordinator Niners. Was on Cleveland staff in 2014.
The Shanny offensive system and any disciples to it would be great. They block so dang well and call some great play action stuffSaleh was with the Hawks and Jags both at great points in the franchise.
Interesting. Might have to change my choice of HC now.
Saleh really has this cover 3 running a bit more different than what the Hawks did... at least, how they handle zone replacement at times. Right now we have some quality DB's on the perimeter to run a great deal of the C3, C1 and most other single high shells/rolls. A complete bonus to bring along the Shanny tree back to Cleveland.
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A thinking I have on McDaniels is that he won't be able to handle very well the strong egos on this team.
I'm surprised that Jimmy could contain himself enough to let McDaniels go home.
A thinking I have on McDaniels is that he won't be able to handle very well the strong egos on this team.
What is your evidence of that?
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What is your evidence of that?
BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE -
Saleh's grown on me, looks like a leader of men and I read he's very detail oriented and easily adapts to technology. I expect he wouldn't oppose analytics which maybe another reason why he's a finalist. Defensive coach but some defensive coaches have spearheaded some of the greatest offensive teams like Tony Dungy in Indy and Rivera had fairly good offenses when in Carolina.
Edit: Hawkins on the ThomaHawk podcast also stated he's not an egomaniac/a**hole which also fits into Jimmy's alignment philosophy.
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Very little evidence and history to back this up. Especially if McD is "picking" the GM. He had say in Denver, BB has the say the NE. Whom do you think he molds himself after?
Contract expires with Philly. May mutually be looking for a new change in scenery.
First off... STHEEFU. That's all most of what we do - speculation. But I'm not making an ass of myself as history has shown, that is exactly what happened in Denver. Accept it or keep your head up your ass. At least there you can't see the screen to type.
BB has nothing to do with this conversation. When you want to converse like an adult, get at me. BB isn't the "leader" in that locker room - that would be Brady. Which is exactly why that relationship works the way it does. Tom is the fiery leader for his man, BB is the mind.
Saleh is another interesting name. I wonder who he would bring from SF? I would love a Shanny type mind to help craft this offense. Between my calls for more 12 personnel, under center work and using the sprint outs, waggles, boots... Would be a great
Mike LaFleur...Matt’s brother. He would be an interesting add offensively. Passing coordinator Niners. Was on Cleveland staff in 2014.
The Shanny offensive system and any disciples to it would be great. They block so dang well and call some great play action stuffSaleh was with the Hawks and Jags both at great points in the franchise.
Mike LaFleur...Matt’s brother. He would be an interesting add offensively. Passing coordinator Niners. Was on Cleveland staff in 2014.
The Shanny offensive system and any disciples to it would be great. They block so dang well and call some great play action stuffSaleh was with the Hawks and Jags both at great points in the franchise.
this post might have some legs..am seeing it elsewhere & the rumor is Berry might be the rooney gm fit..Than Dobbs (connected to Saleh) would be the GM hired from Indy..Dobbs had loads to do with the scouting getting the Colts OL right..stay tuned, and looks like a good connection backer80
https://49erswebzone.com/articles/133223-robert-saleh-49ers-mcdaniel-lafleur-should-browns-coach/
Browns & Buffett: Got to go fishin, Down to rock bottom again, with just a few Friends -
What is your evidence of that?
Whatever this was supposed to be wasn't working.
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