Myles Garrett Reinstated
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It happened.
You were there? I missed seeing you on the replays, I'll check again more closely.
Just because no one heard what was said by two people who were face to face doesn't mean it didn't happen.
Doesn't mean it did.
You were there? I missed seeing you on the replays, I'll check again more closely.
Doesn't mean it did.
But I went over this when it happened. Body language denotes that something happened. Can Garrett prove the allegation?
Here are items that I have gone over befo,e but which I guess I have to educate you all on once again: As a trier of fact, I have to occasionally employMethods to determine the credibility of a claim where there is no collaborating evidence. These, among others perhaps, are methods used to try to do that:
A. the present sense of impression, i.e. take the entirety of the circumstances an try to understand what could have brought them about.
B. Were there any excited utterances made. Verbal. (from what I know....while supposedly no one says they heard the use of the N-word...NO ONE stated that they heard ANYTHING said.
C. What were the emotional and physical reactions of the parties Which may have explained their actions.
Some other things that I may take into account:
1. The reputations of the individuals testifying. I mean, if the person making the accusations is the biggest liar on earth...you may take that into account in judging credibility. If on the other hand, the person has a stellar reputation for veracity...then you may weigh that as well.
2. What we call "priors". Usually applicable in a criminal case. It kind of goes beyond reputation to whether or not someone has committed a previous offense of similar ilk.
So...while you cannot, in this case, elicit any direct evidence of what was overheard...you CAN judge the credibility of an accusation by a number of methods.
If you do not think this happens all the time....there are people in prison who are there because of this sort of circumstantial evidence.
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You were there? I missed seeing you on the replays, I'll check again more closely.
Doesn't mean it did.
But I went over this when it happened. Body language denotes that something happened. Can Garrett prove the allegation?
Here are items that I have gone over befo,e but which I guess I have to educate you all on once again: As a trier of fact, I have to occasionally employMethods to determine the credibility of a claim where there is no collaborating evidence. These, among others perhaps, are methods used to try to do that:
A. the present sense of impression, i.e. take the entirety of the circumstances an try to understand what could have brought them about.
B. Were there any excited utterances made. Verbal. (from what I know....while supposedly no one says they heard the use of the N-word...NO ONE stated that they heard ANYTHING said.
C. What were the emotional and physical reactions of the parties Which may have explained their actions.
Some other things that I may take into account:
1. The reputations of the individuals testifying. I mean, if the person making the accusations is the biggest liar on earth...you may take that into account in judging credibility. If on the other hand, the person has a stellar reputation for veracity...then you may weigh that as well.
2. What we call "priors". Usually applicable in a criminal case. It kind of goes beyond reputation to whether or not someone has committed a previous offense of similar ilk.
So...while you cannot, in this case, elicit any direct evidence of what was overheard...you CAN judge the credibility of an accusation by a number of methods.
If you do not think this happens all the time....there are people in prison who are there because of this sort of circumstantial evidence.
If you do not think this happens all the time....there are people in prison who are there because of this sort of circumstantial evidence.
Shit, the inmates have been right all along, there really are loads of innocent people in prison.
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If you do not think this happens all the time....there are people in prison who are there because of this sort of circumstantial evidence.
Shit, the inmates have been right all along, there really are loads of innocent people in prison.
Shit, the inmates have been right all along, there really are loads of innocent people in prison.
Not necessarily. A judge/jury found the guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. There may be more to some criminal case than there was here.
I agree that in a criminal court of law, you could not likely find Rudolph guilty. On the other hand, if Rudolph thinks that he could try to Garrett responsible for some civil damages, as he is spewing about, he has his head where the sun don't shine......as I believe that the lawyer who is threatening that is just doing a shine job on Rudolph.
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"They"...meaning Us? So...let's close the thread if that is what you want.
Are your comphrehension skills gone old man?.. I meant Garrett and whomever else is involved...
Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~ -
No other Browns player heard it. No Steeler player heard it. No white player heard it. No other BLACK players heard it. No Hispanic player heard it. Steeler black coach goes public defending his white QB (who sucks as a QB)
Myles should have responded like this when that complete STRANGER pimp SLAPPED HIM in his vehicle that day.
It happened. Just because no one heard what was said by two people who were face to face doesn't mean it didn't happen.
It happened. Just because no one heard what was said by two people who were face to face doesn't mean it didn't happen.
There's also the possibility Rudolf could have whispered it in Myles ear.
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@gorka said:
It's highly likely he did say something, but highly unlikely it was the N word.
What?
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No other Browns player heard it. No Steeler player heard it. No white player heard it. No other BLACK players heard it. No Hispanic player heard it. Steeler black coach goes public defending his white QB (who sucks as a QB)
Myles should have responded like this when that complete STRANGER pimp SLAPPED HIM in his vehicle that day.
No other Browns player heard it. No Steeler player heard it. No white player heard it. No other BLACK players heard it. No Hispanic player heard it. Steeler black coach goes public defending his white QB (who sucks as a QB)
Myles should have responded like this when that complete STRANGER pimp SLAPPED HIM in his vehicle that day.
The NFL could not find anyone to corroborate Myle's lie. They also stated that they looked a every camera angle available. I suppose they attempted to read Rudolphs lips.
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Lol...true it doesn't mean he didn't use the word, but that does not constitute my logic as being twisted in the least.
There is one fact about this incident that cannot be refuted. No player on either team heard Rudolf saying anything racist. The behavior of both players as described was only meant to help to support that fact, not prove it.
There is the twisted logic. Actually quite the opposite is true actions seem more to support the fact that Rudolph said something.
There is the twisted logic. Actually quite the opposite is true actions seem more to support the fact that Rudolph said something.
No it isn't. What you just stated is an example of twisted logic.
Myles actions soundly support that Rudolf DID something, not that he said something... how about like kicking Myles in the groin while trying to PULL HIS HELMET OFF?...after which Myles retaliated by yanking Rudolph's off.
Dismissing the obvious while trying to sell us the idea that it was a racial slur that fueled the ruckus, coupled with the fact no one heard anything is pretty twisted there Gipper.
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It was highly likely he said something, but highly unlikely it was the N word.
Louder?
It was loud enough...
It was my incredulity at your ability to divine degrees of likelihood spilling out.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
After the game, Garrett said that Rudolph used the 'N' word. - In for a penny, in for a pound. Just because some tmz interviewer asked him again 4 months later, he wasn't gonna say, 'Nah, I made that up.' Whether he DID make it up or not.
It certainly is possible that nobody else heard it said. While the two guys were on the ground and Mason was trying to rip Garrett's helmet off would've been the 'heat of the moment' time that it would've been said.
Garrett seems like an awfully nice guy, though I obviously do not know him. I'm going to believe him.
What we have is a He said She said thing here. (ok, he said, he said) We're never going to know unless the liar comes clean. And I certainly wouldn't want some judge who thinks he posses divine powers to start dreaming up ways why HE knows who said what!
BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE -
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OK- I've had it- any more off topic name calling, and guys are going to start getting penalty points and kiddie timeouts. Grow the hell up, I want to see some semi intelligent discussion- and this thread has devolved into some schoolyard taunting for the most part. I don't give a rat's ass who started it.
That means you Dutch and Gorka. Take that crap over to the poli board.
OK- I've had it- any more off topic name calling, and guys are going to start getting penalty points and kiddie timeouts. Grow the hell up, I want to see some semi intelligent discussion- and this thread has devolved into some schoolyard taunting for the most part. I don't give a rat's ass who started it.
Well, you should give a rats ass who starts it. And I know that you know who usually does.
Other than retaliation the recipient of name calling/taunting has two choices, either shut up and take it or squeal to the moderators. Which do you prefer he does?
You're not a moderator, what would you do?
.
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It was loud enough...
It was my incredulity at your ability to divine degrees of likelihood spilling out.
What the fuck are you babbling about now?
The concept of likelihood/ unlikelihood is always derived from facts. The fact that no one heard him use a racial slur, coupled with the fact that Rudolf has never been known to display racist behavior. Plus the fact that he had played with blacks all his life, and the fact that this wasn't the first time he had been sacked by a black man. Therefore it would have been unlikely for a guy like Rudulof to have used the N word.
Why do you have a problem with that?
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"They"...meaning Us? So...let's close the thread if that is what you want.
Are your comphrehension skills gone old man?.. I meant Garrett and whomever else is involved...
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No other Browns player heard it. No Steeler player heard it. No white player heard it. No other BLACK players heard it. No Hispanic player heard it. Steeler black coach goes public defending his white QB (who sucks as a QB)
Myles should have responded like this when that complete STRANGER pimp SLAPPED HIM in his vehicle that day.
The NFL could not find anyone to corroborate Myle's lie. They also stated that they looked a every camera angle available. I suppose they attempted to read Rudolphs lips.
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After the game, Garrett said that Rudolph used the 'N' word. - In for a penny, in for a pound. Just because some tmz interviewer asked him again 4 months later, he wasn't gonna say, 'Nah, I made that up.' Whether he DID make it up or not.
It certainly is possible that nobody else heard it said. While the two guys were on the ground and Mason was trying to rip Garrett's helmet off would've been the 'heat of the moment' time that it would've been said.
Garrett seems like an awfully nice guy, though I obviously do not know him. I'm going to believe him.
What we have is a He said She said thing here. (ok, he said, he said) We're never going to know unless the liar comes clean. And I certainly wouldn't want some judge who thinks he posses divine powers to start dreaming up ways why HE knows who said what!
After the game, Garrett said that Rudolph used the 'N' word. - In for a penny, in for a pound. Just because some tmz interviewer asked him again 4 months later, he wasn't gonna say, 'Nah, I made that up.' Whether he DID make it up or not.
It certainly is possible that nobody else heard it said. While the two guys were on the ground and Mason was trying to rip Garrett's helmet off would've been the 'heat of the moment' time that it would've been said.
Garrett seems like an awfully nice guy, though I obviously do not know him. I'm going to believe him.
What we have is a He said She said thing here. (ok, he said, he said) We're never going to know unless the liar comes clean. And I certainly wouldn't want some judge who thinks he posses divine powers to start dreaming up ways why HE knows who said what!
Well....that is not how it works. I agree that this should never be placed in the hands of a judge.....but IF for some reason it were....If he/she were obligated to make a decision on it (which is what judges are obligated to do).....it is not divine powers....it is the application of those principles I outlined some above. If it were placed in the hands of a judge.....then it would be like some of those replays: insufficient (visual or otherwise)...evidence to make a ruling. That is why Rudolph would be an asshat to actually try to bring an action on this matter. It would just be his way of grandstanding. A nobody (or at least...just a 3rd stringer) wanting to keep his name in the news.
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It was loud enough...
It was my incredulity at your ability to divine degrees of likelihood spilling out.
What the fuck are you babbling about now?
The concept of likelihood/ unlikelihood is always derived from facts. The fact that no one heard him use a racial slur, coupled with the fact that Rudolf has never been known to display racist behavior. Plus the fact that he had played with blacks all his life, and the fact that this wasn't the first time he had been sacked by a black man. Therefore it would have been unlikely for a guy like Rudulof to have used the N word.
Why do you have a problem with that?
What the fuck are you babbling about now?
The concept of likelihood/ unlikelihood is always derived from facts. The fact that no one heard him use a racial slur, coupled with the fact that Rudolf has never been known to display racist behavior. Plus the fact that he had played with blacks all his life, and the fact that this wasn't the first time he had been sacked by a black man. Therefore it would have been unlikely for a guy like Rudulof to have used the N word.
Why do you have a problem with that?
Fair arguments....but then all those same arguments apply to the counter case. You have no better of a case at calling Garrett a liar than anyone has at calling Rudolph a liar.
On the other hand you DO have a reputation on here of exhibiting racist behavior, and of excusing racist behavior. Ergo, simply by you being the person to make his argument taints that argument.
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OK- I've had it- any more off topic name calling, and guys are going to start getting penalty points and kiddie timeouts. Grow the hell up, I want to see some semi intelligent discussion- and this thread has devolved into some schoolyard taunting for the most part. I don't give a rat's ass who started it.
Well, you should give a rats ass who starts it. And I know that you know who usually does.
Other than retaliation the recipient of name calling/taunting has two choices, either shut up and take it or squeal to the moderators. Which do you prefer he does?
You're not a moderator, what would you do?
.
Well, you should give a rats ass who starts it. And I know that you know who usually does.
Other than retaliation the recipient of name calling/taunting has two choices, either shut up and take it or squeal to the moderators. Which do you prefer he does?
You're not a moderator, what would you do?
.
Wah, wah, wah he started it. Go back to the Poli board and call him whatever name you want to.
FWIW, in case you don't know, me and Zombo ARE the primary Moderators on the Browns Forum, and I run one hell of a lot tighter ship than Steve does on the Poli board. So kindly keep politics separated from football. I take a damn dim view of off topic personal attacks, when you stoop to that level, you've already lost the argument.
Both of you can can the crap, or I'll kick both of you off for a week. GOT IT?
You're all butthurt, aw gee Dutch is baiting you? I already deleted one of Dutch's posts. So boo hoo. He's on the same zero tolerance alert. So Suck it up, and grow up.
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