Draft Grades
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Jim Cobern and his purely data driven grades. It won’t interest some but will others.....food for thought for those that think the Ravens won the draft ?
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Jim Cobern and his purely data driven grades. It won’t interest some but will others.....food for thought for those that think the Ravens won the draft ?
Jim Cobern and his purely data driven grades. It won’t interest some but will others.....food for thought for those that think the Ravens won the draft ?
May I have a link, please, explaining methodology for "AAS" vs. "AAS Rank" in to this chart?
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My early take... plan to spend some time with tape to see what revisions are needed...
1.10 - OT Jedrick Wills.... A ... solid pick, while there were other OTs with better skills in one area or another that I liked a shade better, Wills was at least my #2 in every area.
2.44 - S Grant Delpit ....... C+ . I don't like players with "ifs" on Day 2. There were other Safeties that were "if-less" in my book, Chinn/Davis, that could have been had later.
3.88 - IDL Jordan Elliott... C... ditto the above... except the remaining IDL value that I saw was even lower in the draft, but if his tech develops, then?
3.97 - LB Jacob Phillips... B- ... if he can cover, then maybe he can be as good as Schobert? I admit it, I wanted Harrison because I see more thump in him.
4-115-TE Harrison Bryant D ... no if here... I just don't get adding another one-dimensional TE. Plus has short-arms and not very agile... not Devalve-like as a receiver.
5-160 - C Nick Harris ....... B+ . nice scheme fit, very nice get-off... just has to get stronger... which is not an if.
6-187-WR Peoples-Jones..B- .. great Combine... if UM issues were due to QB play could approach "steal" status and in the 6th an if is OK...
Overall: B-... with UDFAs call it a B
My early take... plan to spend some time with tape to see what revisions are needed...
1.10 - OT Jedrick Wills.... A ... solid pick, while there were other OTs with better skills in one area or another that I liked a shade better, Wills was at least my #2 in every area.
2.44 - S Grant Delpit ....... C+ . I don't like players with "ifs" on Day 2. There were other Safeties that were "if-less" in my book, Chinn/Davis, that could have been had later.
3.88 - IDL Jordan Elliott... C... ditto the above... except the remaining IDL value that I saw was even lower in the draft, but if his tech develops, then?
3.97 - LB Jacob Phillips... B- ... if he can cover, then maybe he can be as good as Schobert? I admit it, I wanted Harrison because I see more thump in him.
4-115-TE Harrison Bryant D ... no if here... I just don't get adding another one-dimensional TE. Plus has short-arms and not very agile... not Devalve-like as a receiver.
5-160 - C Nick Harris ....... B+ . nice scheme fit, very nice get-off... just has to get stronger... which is not an if.
6-187-WR Peoples-Jones..B- .. great Combine... if UM issues were due to QB play could approach "steal" status and in the 6th an if is OK...
Overall: B-... with UDFAs call it a B
Nice write up! At first, the D for Bryant seemed a little harsh until I got to your reasoning. I've posted more than a few times in the last year about wanting a dual purpose TE (one that doesn't tip off a tendency when he's in because he can block, catch AND get open).
At the other end of the spectrum, Charley Casserly thinks Harrison Bryant is the best pick made by anyone on Saturday (at 6:35 into the video).
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Is Casserly rockin' a rug???
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Jim Cobern and his purely data driven grades. It won’t interest some but will others.....food for thought for those that think the Ravens won the draft ?
May I have a link, please, explaining methodology for "AAS" vs. "AAS Rank" in to this chart?
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Wills ...... A ....best tackle in the draft...... Athleticism is off the chart, has the best O line coach in football to set him up for success at LT and also has a certain hall of famer for guidance.
Delpit ...... A ....... best safety in the draft ..Thorpe award winner... Tackling issues can be corrected and we have a really good DC for that ....was regarded as top 15 pick at the end of 2018 and played for most of 2019 with a high ankle sprain. ....during the play offs and championship game he did not miss a tackle
Elliott .... A ....... Pff had him in top 25 on their big board .....Steal of the draft ..... huge upside
Phillips .... B- .... Good run blocker, sucks in coverage ...... has a high motor but needs to improve in coverage or will get torched ...
Bryant ... A- ..... Plays like an over sized receiver and was the best TE in football in 2019 .... needs to bulk up a little for blocking duties, but wont see much of the field on running plays.
Harris ... B .... Flexibility means he can slot in at guard too ...undersized but has great technique ....team captain at Washington
Peoples Jones .... B+ ...... Some Browns fans on Twitter were upset we did not grab him in the 4th round and were horrified when we did not in the 5th ... vertical leap off the chart at the combine 44.5
Wills ...... A ....best tackle in the draft...... Athleticism is off the chart, has the best O line coach in football to set him up for success at LT and also has a certain hall of famer for guidance.
Delpit ...... A ....... best safety in the draft ..Thorpe award winner... Tackling issues can be corrected and we have a really good DC for that ....was regarded as top 15 pick at the end of 2018 and played for most of 2019 with a high ankle sprain. ....during the play offs and championship game he did not miss a tackle
Elliott .... A ....... Pff had him in top 25 on their big board .....Steal of the draft ..... huge upside
Phillips .... B- .... Good run blocker, sucks in coverage ...... has a high motor but needs to improve in coverage or will get torched ...
Bryant ... A- ..... Plays like an over sized receiver and was the best TE in football in 2019 .... needs to bulk up a little for blocking duties, but wont see much of the field on running plays.
Harris ... B .... Flexibility means he can slot in at guard too ...undersized but has great technique ....team captain at Washington
Peoples Jones .... B+ ...... Some Browns fans on Twitter were upset we did not grab him in the 4th round and were horrified when we did not in the 5th ... vertical leap off the chart at the combine 44.5
Interesting. Thanks Darren!
1 thing I didn't know about Phillips is that he led LSU in tackles with 113 last year. In comparison, Queen had 85. In the last 3 years, Queen only broke up 2 passes while Phillips was only slightly better with 5 pass breakups. Athlon's Draft Guide has Queen as the #2 rated ILB and Phillips as the OLB.
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USA Sports grades are out....
NFL draft grades 2020: Ravens, Vikings nab top team hauls while Packers, Eagles confound
The 2020 NFL draft has a bow on it, which means it's time for instant gratification: report cards for all 32 teams.
But first, a moment to spotlight the folly of this exercise given it generally takes about three years to fairly grade a club's draft performance.
How many people gave the New Orleans Saints an "A+" in 2017, when they picked offensive rookie of the year Alvin Kamara, defensive rookie of the year Marshon Lattimore and future all-pro Ryan Ramczyk? Might be the best class of the decade.
And how many gave the San Francisco 49ers an "A" in 2017, when they took defenders Solomon Thomas and Reuben Foster in Round 1?
But whatever. We're all looking for welcome distractions in the world of COVID-19, so let's jump that grading gun again and start scribbling with our digital red pen:
B+....... Cleveland Browns:
Seems rookie GM Andrew Berry has hit the ground running for a franchise that's been dysfunctional for so long. He followed up a nice free-agent harvest with what projects as a solid draft, first-round OT Jedrick Wills possibly the man who can finally fill Joe Thomas' void and second-round S Grant Delpit a potential gem. Given David Njoku is still on the roster, it's worth asking how many tight ends Berry and new coach Kevin Stefanski need after signing Austin Hooper to a huge contract and drafting highly regarded Harrison Bryant in Round 4.
Grade Summary:
- A+ .... none
- A ...... BLT, IND, MN
- A- ..... AZ, CIN, WSH, DAL, PTG
- B+ ..... CLE, DNV, SF, TB
- B ....... CAR, CHI, DET, LAC, LAR, NE, NYJ
- B- ...... BUF, NO
- C+ .... JAX, KC, NYG
- C ....... LAV, MIA
- C- ...... ATL
- D+ ..... SEA, TN
- D ....... GB, PHI
- F ........ HOU
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
USA Sports grades are out....
NFL draft grades 2020: Ravens, Vikings nab top team hauls while Packers, Eagles confound
The 2020 NFL draft has a bow on it, which means it's time for instant gratification: report cards for all 32 teams.
But first, a moment to spotlight the folly of this exercise given it generally takes about three years to fairly grade a club's draft performance.
How many people gave the New Orleans Saints an "A+" in 2017, when they picked offensive rookie of the year Alvin Kamara, defensive rookie of the year Marshon Lattimore and future all-pro Ryan Ramczyk? Might be the best class of the decade.
And how many gave the San Francisco 49ers an "A" in 2017, when they took defenders Solomon Thomas and Reuben Foster in Round 1?
But whatever. We're all looking for welcome distractions in the world of COVID-19, so let's jump that grading gun again and start scribbling with our digital red pen:
B+....... Cleveland Browns:
Seems rookie GM Andrew Berry has hit the ground running for a franchise that's been dysfunctional for so long. He followed up a nice free-agent harvest with what projects as a solid draft, first-round OT Jedrick Wills possibly the man who can finally fill Joe Thomas' void and second-round S Grant Delpit a potential gem. Given David Njoku is still on the roster, it's worth asking how many tight ends Berry and new coach Kevin Stefanski need after signing Austin Hooper to a huge contract and drafting highly regarded Harrison Bryant in Round 4.
Grade Summary:
- A+ .... none
- A ...... BLT, IND, MN
- A- ..... AZ, CIN, WSH, DAL, PTG
- B+ ..... CLE, DNV, SF, TB
- B ....... CAR, CHI, DET, LAC, LAR, NE, NYJ
- B- ...... BUF, NO
- C+ .... JAX, KC, NYG
- C ....... LAV, MIA
- C- ...... ATL
- D+ ..... SEA, TN
- D ....... GB, PHI
- F ........ HOU
USA Sports grades are out....
Grade Summary:
- A+ .... none
- A ...... BLT, IND, MN
- A- ..... AZ, CIN, WSH, DAL, PTG
- B+ ..... CLE, DNV, SF, TB
- B ....... CAR, CHI, DET, LAC, LAR, NE, NYJ
- B- ...... BUF, NO
- C+ .... JAX, KC, NYG
- C ....... LAV, MIA
- C- ...... ATL
- D+ ..... SEA, TN
- D ....... GB, PHI
- F ........ HOU
I would have rated Denver higher than that. Many new toys for Lock to play with.
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USA Sports grades are out....
NFL draft grades 2020: Ravens, Vikings nab top team hauls while Packers, Eagles confound
The 2020 NFL draft has a bow on it, which means it's time for instant gratification: report cards for all 32 teams.
But first, a moment to spotlight the folly of this exercise given it generally takes about three years to fairly grade a club's draft performance.
How many people gave the New Orleans Saints an "A+" in 2017, when they picked offensive rookie of the year Alvin Kamara, defensive rookie of the year Marshon Lattimore and future all-pro Ryan Ramczyk? Might be the best class of the decade.
And how many gave the San Francisco 49ers an "A" in 2017, when they took defenders Solomon Thomas and Reuben Foster in Round 1?
But whatever. We're all looking for welcome distractions in the world of COVID-19, so let's jump that grading gun again and start scribbling with our digital red pen:
B+....... Cleveland Browns:
Seems rookie GM Andrew Berry has hit the ground running for a franchise that's been dysfunctional for so long. He followed up a nice free-agent harvest with what projects as a solid draft, first-round OT Jedrick Wills possibly the man who can finally fill Joe Thomas' void and second-round S Grant Delpit a potential gem. Given David Njoku is still on the roster, it's worth asking how many tight ends Berry and new coach Kevin Stefanski need after signing Austin Hooper to a huge contract and drafting highly regarded Harrison Bryant in Round 4.
Grade Summary:
- A+ .... none
- A ...... BLT, IND, MN
- A- ..... AZ, CIN, WSH, DAL, PTG
- B+ ..... CLE, DNV, SF, TB
- B ....... CAR, CHI, DET, LAC, LAR, NE, NYJ
- B- ...... BUF, NO
- C+ .... JAX, KC, NYG
- C ....... LAV, MIA
- C- ...... ATL
- D+ ..... SEA, TN
- D ....... GB, PHI
- F ........ HOU
USA Sports grades are out....
Grade Summary:
- A+ .... none
- A ...... BLT, IND, MN
- A- ..... AZ, CIN, WSH, DAL, PTG
- B+ ..... CLE, DNV, SF, TB
- B ....... CAR, CHI, DET, LAC, LAR, NE, NYJ
- B- ...... BUF, NO
- C+ .... JAX, KC, NYG
- C ....... LAV, MIA
- C- ...... ATL
- D+ ..... SEA, TN
- D ....... GB, PHI
- F ........ HOU
Pit no way A-. Second pick some small school LB who never played against an NFL caliber lineman.
B tops.
Chase Cesspool does scare me a little though. A big, fast, Calvin Johnson size WR. And he loves to block...like that other Stealer wide receiver since retired that we loved to hate.
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Is Casserly rockin' a rug???
That, or he found a shampoo made by Chia pet.
Every time I see Charlie on TV, I think of the movie "Tommy Boy" & Tommy's buddy (David Spade) with his wig blowin' in the wind. Always good for a laugh.
Mike
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Honestly.....grading a draft now is a completely useless proposition.
Honestly.....grading a draft now is a completely useless proposition.
You're right.
But it's excellent theatre.
Our musical works to date http://www.arielsatticmusic.com/ -
Wills ...... A ....best tackle in the draft...... Athleticism is off the chart, has the best O line coach in football to set him up for success at LT and also has a certain hall of famer for guidance.
Delpit ...... A ....... best safety in the draft ..Thorpe award winner... Tackling issues can be corrected and we have a really good DC for that ....was regarded as top 15 pick at the end of 2018 and played for most of 2019 with a high ankle sprain. ....during the play offs and championship game he did not miss a tackle
Elliott .... A ....... Pff had him in top 25 on their big board .....Steal of the draft ..... huge upside
Phillips .... B- .... Good run blocker, sucks in coverage ...... has a high motor but needs to improve in coverage or will get torched ...
Bryant ... A- ..... Plays like an over sized receiver and was the best TE in football in 2019 .... needs to bulk up a little for blocking duties, but wont see much of the field on running plays.
Harris ... B .... Flexibility means he can slot in at guard too ...undersized but has great technique ....team captain at Washington
Peoples Jones .... B+ ...... Some Browns fans on Twitter were upset we did not grab him in the 4th round and were horrified when we did not in the 5th ... vertical leap off the chart at the combine 44.5
1Peoples Jones .... B+ ...... Some Browns fans on Twitter were upset we did not grab him in the 4th round and were horrified when we did not in the 5th ... vertical leap off the chart at the combine 44.5
Honestly, I think the historic depth at WR in this draft caused a lot of WRs to fall. From Lamb in the first to KJ Hill in the 7th. Being potentially the greatest WR class of all time meant teams could wait.
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Andy Benoit on SI
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Brugler loved our draft. He rated it the 3rd best of all 32 teams. Unfortunately Baltimore was first. Cowboys second. Bengals were 6 and Pittsburgh 23.
His synopsis:
3. Cleveland Browns
ROUND/PICK #PLAYERPOSITIONSCHOOL1 (10) Jedrick Wills OT 
Alabama
2 (44) Grant Delpit DS 
LSU
3 (88) Jordan Elliott DT 
Missouri
3 (97) Jacob Phillips LB LSU
4 (115) Harrison Bryant TE 
Florida Atlantic
5 (160) Nick Harris OC 
Washington
6 (187) Donovan Peoples-Jones WR 
Michigan
Favorite pick: Jedrick Wills, OT, Alabama
A top-five ranked player on my board, the Browns drafted the best tackle in the class at No. 10 overall. I took some heat last fall when he shot to the top of my tackle rankings, but that reflects the tape and the Browns were able to get him. There is a projection with him moving from the right side to left tackle, but he has all the talent to do so and make Pro Bowls while on his rookie contract. My only gripe with the Browns’ class was their decision to draft Jacob Phillips over Malik Harrison, but I loved every other pick.Day three pick who could surprise: Harrison Bryant, TE, Florida Atlantic
Part of the reason the Browns are so highly ranked on this list is the way they maximized the value of their three Day Three picks. Bryant might not be a bully as a blocker, but he can stretch the seam and shine in the quick passing game. Bryant has the talent to be an upgrade over David Njoku this season. -
We got an A from Bucky Brooks so we can all sleep well now ....
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I've been looking for a capsulized summary of our D's coverage scheme.
Not familiar with a match(up)-zone concept for 2ndaries. I'm more used to hearing it in B-ball, especially at the college level.
Guessing that they are conceptually similar with focus, if not proximity, dictated by who enters your assigned area... just a lot more area to cover vs B-ball... which makes football seem to be a much more difficult application.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Brugler loved our draft. He rated it the 3rd best of all 32 teams. Unfortunately Baltimore was first. Cowboys second. Bengals were 6 and Pittsburgh 23.
His synopsis:
3. Cleveland Browns
ROUND/PICK #PLAYERPOSITIONSCHOOL1 (10) Jedrick Wills OT Alabama
2 (44) Grant Delpit DS LSU
3 (88) Jordan Elliott DT Missouri
3 (97) Jacob Phillips LB LSU
4 (115) Harrison Bryant TE Florida Atlantic
5 (160) Nick Harris OC Washington
6 (187) Donovan Peoples-Jones WR Michigan
Favorite pick: Jedrick Wills, OT, Alabama
A top-five ranked player on my board, the Browns drafted the best tackle in the class at No. 10 overall. I took some heat last fall when he shot to the top of my tackle rankings, but that reflects the tape and the Browns were able to get him. There is a projection with him moving from the right side to left tackle, but he has all the talent to do so and make Pro Bowls while on his rookie contract. My only gripe with the Browns’ class was their decision to draft Jacob Phillips over Malik Harrison, but I loved every other pick.Day three pick who could surprise: Harrison Bryant, TE, Florida Atlantic
Part of the reason the Browns are so highly ranked on this list is the way they maximized the value of their three Day Three picks. Bryant might not be a bully as a blocker, but he can stretch the seam and shine in the quick passing game. Bryant has the talent to be an upgrade over David Njoku this season.Brugler loved our draft. He rated it the 3rd best of all 32 teams. Unfortunately Baltimore was first. Cowboys second. Bengals were 6 and Pittsburgh 23.
His synopsis:
3. Cleveland Browns
ROUND/PICK #PLAYERPOSITIONSCHOOL1 (10) Jedrick Wills OT Alabama
2 (44) Grant Delpit DS LSU
3 (88) Jordan Elliott DT Missouri
3 (97) Jacob Phillips LB LSU
4 (115) Harrison Bryant TE Florida Atlantic
5 (160) Nick Harris OC Washington
6 (187) Donovan Peoples-Jones WR Michigan
Favorite pick: Jedrick Wills, OT, Alabama
A top-five ranked player on my board, the Browns drafted the best tackle in the class at No. 10 overall. I took some heat last fall when he shot to the top of my tackle rankings, but that reflects the tape and the Browns were able to get him. There is a projection with him moving from the right side to left tackle, but he has all the talent to do so and make Pro Bowls while on his rookie contract. My only gripe with the Browns’ class was their decision to draft Jacob Phillips over Malik Harrison, but I loved every other pick.Day three pick who could surprise: Harrison Bryant, TE, Florida Atlantic
Part of the reason the Browns are so highly ranked on this list is the way they maximized the value of their three Day Three picks. Bryant might not be a bully as a blocker, but he can stretch the seam and shine in the quick passing game. Bryant has the talent to be an upgrade over David Njoku this season.I see Harrison Bryant utilized differently. He may have challenged the seams at FAU but that will be harder to do here.
He’s a guy you go to on 3rd and 6 to get a first down.
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I've been looking for a capsulized summary of our D's coverage scheme.
Not familiar with a match(up)-zone concept for 2ndaries. I'm more used to hearing it in B-ball, especially at the college level.
Guessing that they are conceptually similar with focus, if not proximity, dictated by who enters your assigned area... just a lot more area to cover vs B-ball... which makes football seem to be a much more difficult application.
I've been looking for a capsulized summary of our D's coverage scheme.
Not familiar with a match(up)-zone concept for 2ndaries. I'm more used to hearing it in B-ball, especially at the college level.
Guessing that they are conceptually similar with focus, if not proximity, dictated by who enters your assigned area... just a lot more area to cover vs B-ball... which makes football seem to be a much more difficult application.
It's lot of non-verbal pass offs and key reading based on receivers in pattern, initial breaks and motions. vis a vis your coverage call. I.E. Quarters schemes vs 2x2 sets have safeties playing the #2 vertical yet fall off if they push flat or shallow. Some quarters might almost inverse that call (i''ve run that, but didn't enjoy it) where the #2 is read and the corner becomes a squat defender if the #2 breaks flat while the safety rotates over the #1. Run fits in a cover 4 vary greatly by team and coaches. Some love turning runs back inside to pursuit (my philosophy) others love spilling backs to the safeties that they trust to make hits and tackles. Some coaches play their safeties so close to the box and their corners soft that it's hard to tell if you're getting inverted coverage or not. There is a great amount of detail.
edit: pattern matching zones basically are zone pick ups with man coverage fundamentals. Honestly, I hate having to describe it in a sentence or two.
My understanding of Saban's cover 3 is limited but I know he favors safety play that isn't reduced to 'FS' v 'SS' or field safety vs boundary safety. Their guys tend to align on where the ball is marked and what side the strength of the offensive formation is.
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