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What I believe and know to be true

Political Discussion
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  • @tiamat63 said:

    Well at least you were looking for it this time.    

    Just remember one thing, sarcasm doesn't give you a pass. Much of the time it is an expression of your bitterness.

    @gorka said:

    Just remember one thing, sarcasm doesn't give you a pass. Much of the time it is an expression of your bitterness.

    On the contrary, Oscar Wilde expresses sarcasm as an expression of the "highest form of intelligence". 

    And if you're into the idea of delving into social and intellectual constructs, both Harvard and Yale have published studies detailing their belief in the expression of sarcasm as a medium for true creativity.    Of course, sarcasm can also be low hanging and un-original fruit depending on the context of the rebuttal.  

  • @mld-woody said:

    I believe you believe that

    Just curious, besides God are there any others you don't agree with?

    WSS

    @westside-steve said:

    Just curious, besides God are there any others you don't agree with?

    WSS

    "I believe that true Americans love their country"

    That's loaded garbage. Acting like America is perfect at everything. Acting like there are "true" Americans. 

    You should be able to realize your country's faults and failures. Only then can you actually work to make it better. 

    If your head is stuck in the sand shouting "Merica#1" then you'll never improve the thing you say you love. 

    You can love something and realize it has flaws. 

  • @gorka said:

    Just remember one thing, sarcasm doesn't give you a pass. Much of the time it is an expression of your bitterness.

    On the contrary, Oscar Wilde expresses sarcasm as an expression of the "highest form of intelligence". 

    And if you're into the idea of delving into social and intellectual constructs, both Harvard and Yale have published studies detailing their belief in the expression of sarcasm as a medium for true creativity.    Of course, sarcasm can also be low hanging and un-original fruit depending on the context of the rebuttal.  

    @tiamat63 said:

    On the contrary, Oscar Wilde expresses sarcasm as an expression of the "highest form of intelligence". 

    And if you're into the idea of delving into social and intellectual constructs, both Harvard and Yale have published studies detailing their belief in the expression of sarcasm as a medium for true creativity.    Of course, sarcasm can also be low hanging and un-original fruit depending on the context of the rebuttal.  

    I can't dispute that. Sounds legit.

  • @westside-steve said:

    Just curious, besides God are there any others you don't agree with?

    WSS

    "I believe that true Americans love their country"

    That's loaded garbage. Acting like America is perfect at everything. Acting like there are "true" Americans. 

    You should be able to realize your country's faults and failures. Only then can you actually work to make it better. 

    If your head is stuck in the sand shouting "Merica#1" then you'll never improve the thing you say you love. 

    You can love something and realize it has flaws. 

    @mld-woody said:

    "I believe that true Americans love their country"

    That's loaded garbage. Acting like America is perfect at everything. Acting like there are "true" Americans. 

    You should be able to realize your country's faults and failures. Only then can you actually work to make it better. 

    If your head is stuck in the sand shouting "Merica#1" then you'll never improve the thing you say you love. 

    You can love something and realize it has flaws. 

    Yes you can Woody. Of course that would make the statement true. The caveat would be after the statement. Americans love their country. The caveat would be but they can also see places for improvement. Fair enough?

    WSS

  • @gorka said:

    That'd be a lot of flowers!

    There are certainly many many good people. I just don't believe goodness is an inherited human trait.

    In so many cases I don't think it's really Good vs Evil even though I think that exists. If I let myself get too philosophical about it it occurs to me that if a wolf eats a sheep it's not evil it's just the way it is. 

    And just naturally given the choice people will start to drift into the path of least resistance. Unfortunately that's an easy hook for the politicians preach "hey it's not your fault it's that other guy's fault you aren't successful. Or happy. Or WTF ever."

    WSS

    @westside-steve said:

    In so many cases I don't think it's really Good vs Evil even though I think that exists. If I let myself get too philosophical about it it occurs to me that if a wolf eats a sheep it's not evil it's just the way it is. 

    And just naturally given the choice people will start to drift into the path of least resistance. Unfortunately that's an easy hook for the politicians preach "hey it's not your fault it's that other guy's fault you aren't successful. Or happy. Or WTF ever."

    WSS

    We're starting to drift into religious  ground whether you believe people are  inherently "good" or "bad". I have my opinion, but I'm not about to share it. 

  • @westside-steve said:

    Just curious, besides God are there any others you don't agree with?

    WSS

    "I believe that true Americans love their country"

    That's loaded garbage. Acting like America is perfect at everything. Acting like there are "true" Americans. 

    You should be able to realize your country's faults and failures. Only then can you actually work to make it better. 

    If your head is stuck in the sand shouting "Merica#1" then you'll never improve the thing you say you love. 

    You can love something and realize it has flaws. 

    @mld-woody said:

    "I believe that true Americans love their country"

    That's loaded garbage. Acting like America is perfect at everything. Acting like there are "true" Americans. 

    You should be able to realize your country's faults and failures. Only then can you actually work to make it better. 

    If your head is stuck in the sand shouting "Merica#1" then you'll never improve the thing you say you love. 

    You can love America and realize it has flaws. 

    I think your last statement is implied in the original one. That's my view anyway.

    I believe that many liberals do love this country.

    It is the left that truly doesn't. We often use the term "liberal" as being synonymous with "the left". There is a stark difference between the left and liberals. I will explain later. I am in the middle of painting.

    Ill leave you with a quote from self proclaimed liberal and Harvard Law School Prof Alan Dershowitz.

     “As a liberal, as an American, and as a Jew, I far more fear the left than the right.”
     

  • @westside-steve said:

    In so many cases I don't think it's really Good vs Evil even though I think that exists. If I let myself get too philosophical about it it occurs to me that if a wolf eats a sheep it's not evil it's just the way it is. 

    And just naturally given the choice people will start to drift into the path of least resistance. Unfortunately that's an easy hook for the politicians preach "hey it's not your fault it's that other guy's fault you aren't successful. Or happy. Or WTF ever."

    WSS

    We're starting to drift into religious  ground whether you believe people are  inherently "good" or "bad". I have my opinion, but I'm not about to share it. 

    @hoorta said:

    We're starting to drift into  religious  ground whether you believe people are  inherently "good" or "bad". I have my opinion, but I'm not about to share it. 

    Fair enough. I certainly have my opinions and even though I'm not a devout man I'm sure they are shaped buy religious teachings to an extent.

    WSS

  • @hoorta said:

    We're starting to drift into  religious  ground whether you believe people are  inherently "good" or "bad". I have my opinion, but I'm not about to share it. 

    Fair enough. I certainly have my opinions and even though I'm not a devout man I'm sure they are shaped buy religious teachings to an extent.

    WSS

    @westside-steve said:

    Fair enough. I certainly have my opinions and even though I'm not a devout man I'm sure they are shaped buy religious teachings to an extent.

    WSS

    OK, here's my POV- and it was formed by the comments of one of the most educated Catholic philosopher\theologians I've ever run across- Robert Barron. He can quote everyone from Plato and Aristotle on the secular side to Augustine and Aquinas on the religious side to the present day. 

    Goes how much you hold to Creation, Adam & Eve, and The Devil. God created man good. Genesis "and God saw that it was good".  But those two originals messed it up for us. So we certainly have a tendency to follow our passions- the bad side, aided by the devil- but we can overcome those tendencies. So we're created "good", anyone think a newborn is somehow bad? They are what they are. Though we all inherit "the mark of Cain" if you will, due to the original screw up.  Easy to get distracted by searching for wealth, pleasure, power, or esteem- and too much of that is where the bad comes in.  And for sure, there's some individuals who have totally lost their moral compass. Like the Johnny Cash song- "I killed a man just to watch him die."  There's currently a nasty individual in Lucasville who fits the description. 

    There you have it, some would totally disagree.   

  • I go to President trump for his wisdom and guidance on spiritual matters.......

  • @westside-steve said:

    Fair enough. I certainly have my opinions and even though I'm not a devout man I'm sure they are shaped buy religious teachings to an extent.

    WSS

    OK, here's my POV- and it was formed by the comments of one of the most educated Catholic philosopher\theologians I've ever run across- Robert Barron. He can quote everyone from Plato and Aristotle on the secular side to Augustine and Aquinas on the religious side to the present day. 

    Goes how much you hold to Creation, Adam & Eve, and The Devil. God created man good. Genesis "and God saw that it was good".  But those two originals messed it up for us. So we certainly have a tendency to follow our passions- the bad side, aided by the devil- but we can overcome those tendencies. So we're created "good", anyone think a newborn is somehow bad? They are what they are. Though we all inherit "the mark of Cain" if you will, due to the original screw up.  Easy to get distracted by searching for wealth, pleasure, power, or esteem- and too much of that is where the bad comes in.  And for sure, there's some individuals who have totally lost their moral compass. Like the Johnny Cash song- "I killed a man just to watch him die."  There's currently a nasty individual in Lucasville who fits the description. 

    There you have it, some would totally disagree.   

    @hoorta said:

    OK, here's my POV- and it was formed by the comments of one of the most educated Catholic philosopher\theologians I've ever run across- Robert Barron. He can quote everyone from Plato and Aristotle on the secular side to Augustine and Aquinas on the religious side to the present day. 

    Goes how much you hold to Creation, Adam & Eve, and The Devil. God created man good. Genesis "and God saw that it was good".  But those two originals messed it up for us. So we certainly have a tendency to follow our passions- the bad side, aided by the devil- but we can overcome those tendencies. So we're created "good", anyone think a newborn is somehow bad? They are what they are. Though we all inherit "the mark of Cain" if you will, due to the original screw up.  Easy to get distracted by searching for wealth, pleasure, power, or esteem- and too much of that is where the bad comes in.  And for sure, there's some individuals who have totally lost their moral compass. Like the Johnny Cash song- "I killed a man just to watch him die."  There's currently a nasty individual in Lucasville who fits the description. 

    There you have it, some would totally disagree.   

    100% agree.