Clowney is a Brownie
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Clowney's 3-cone and shuttle are very low. He's an explosive athlete, but his pressures at edge in Houston and Tennessee came not by beating the OT upfield, but rather by going inside of the OT after going upfield. Just what tia wants to hear! [And the reason why Clowney is&was overrated..]
So his high "double team rate" combined with "pass rush win" combined with no sacks is not because he's actually double-teamed at the line but rather because that inside move brings him into the OG. And, the inside move means the OT quickly recovers.
Clowney at DT in passing situations is actually not terrible, because lining up at DT and/or stunting with the DT is how the pressure numbers were achieved when Vrabel was the DL coach in Houston. It's not implausible - Clowney had 9 sacks during one of the seasons JJ was injured the entire year.
Because Clowney is a rental and a weird mix of skills [Is he a DI? Is he an edge? You decide!] I still wouldn't be shocked if it's DL in the first.
Clowney's 3-cone and shuttle are very low. He's an explosive athlete, but his pressures at edge in Houston and Tennessee came not by beating the OT upfield, but rather by going inside of the OT after going upfield. Just what tia wants to hear! [And the reason why Clowney is&was overrated..]
So his high "double team rate" combined with "pass rush win" combined with no sacks is not because he's actually double-teamed at the line but rather because that inside move brings him into the OG. And, the inside move means the OT quickly recovers.
Clowney at DT in passing situations is actually not terrible, because lining up at DT and/or stunting with the DT is how the pressure numbers were achieved when Vrabel was the DL coach in Houston.
Because Clowney is a rental, I still wouldn't be shocked if it's DL in the first.
So before I could respond to Barry, he deleted his post to mine. I was going to respond that the context of the double teams is also important. I don't believe a lot of chip helps gets throw at Clowney because he has survived on athletic ability so long that his technical pass rushing arsenal never really improved. I would suspect the double teams are from the guard to his side giving help to the inside shoulder of the OT when JD tries to win inside.
I'm under no guise as to what his strengths and weaknesses are. What I am hoping for is that, playing opposite of Myles and hopefully along with a decent IDL, his weaknesses can be masked by the surrounding talent.
My chief concern was cost and we didn't overpay so.... Time to let it ride.
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Move up for Kwitty and move Clowney to DT next to Myles
God, I hope you're not saying that beyond obvious passing situations.
God, I hope you're not saying that beyond obvious passing situations.
Not really. But he is a great run stopper. You know from my pushing for Barmore where I really am on all this. Another force in the middle you have to double team. I loved the Jackson pickup, but I see him as the mentor for a guy like Barmore who is still wet behind the ears.
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God, I hope you're not saying that beyond obvious passing situations.
Not really. But he is a great run stopper. You know from my pushing for Barmore where I really am on all this. Another force in the middle you have to double team. I loved the Jackson pickup, but I see him as the mentor for a guy like Barmore who is still wet behind the ears.
Not really. But he is a great run stopper. You know from my pushing for Barmore where I really am on all this. Another force in the middle you have to double team. I loved the Jackson pickup, but I see him as the mentor for a guy like Barmore who is still wet behind the ears.
Significant difference between 6'5 250 and 6'3 325.
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I'll make the argument that Clowney was waaaaaaay more hyped entering the NFL than Myles was.
Yes and no...
Yes, due to the video of JC's hit on the tsun kid...
No, because there was a real debate as to who the #1 overall prospect was when Clowney came out. Not the case for MG's class.
Yes and no...
Yes, due to the video of JC's hit on the tsun kid...
No, because there was a real debate as to who the #1 overall prospect was when Clowney came out. Not the case for MG's class.
There WAS some debate on who should be picked #1 the year Garrett came out, at least among the media and the fans. And I saw rumors that there was some debate even in the Browns front office. Maybe it should not have been serious debate, but there was some debate.
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I am cautiously optimistic with this signing. Keeping him healthy I think will be the key. He can be very disruptive when on field. Even without getting sacks he is up there in QB pressures and he is very good against the run which I hope will come into play against the Ravens. I think this signing doesn't mean we have to reach on an edge player and let the draft fall to us. I would prefer one of the better LBs if possible but would be fine with the top defensive player available regardless of position in the 1st round.
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I am cautiously optimistic with this signing. Keeping him healthy I think will be the key. He can be very disruptive when on field. Even without getting sacks he is up there in QB pressures and he is very good against the run which I hope will come into play against the Ravens. I think this signing doesn't mean we have to reach on an edge player and let the draft fall to us. I would prefer one of the better LBs if possible but would be fine with the top defensive player available regardless of position in the 1st round.
I am cautiously optimistic with this signing. Keeping him healthy I think will be the key. He can be very disruptive when on field. Even without getting sacks he is up there in QB pressures and he is very good against the run which I hope will come into play against the Ravens. I think this signing doesn't mean we have to reach on an edge player and let the draft fall to us. I would prefer one of the better LBs if possible but would be fine with the top defensive player available regardless of position in the 1st round.
I love the signing. We now have a brilliantly improved depth chart to look at. The defensive line rotation looks
like a kick ass unit. But absolutely nailed it you did - "Top defensive player available regardless of position" - I'm fine with it.
so different now:
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I am cautiously optimistic with this signing. Keeping him healthy I think will be the key. He can be very disruptive when on field. Even without getting sacks he is up there in QB pressures and he is very good against the run which I hope will come into play against the Ravens. I think this signing doesn't mean we have to reach on an edge player and let the draft fall to us. I would prefer one of the better LBs if possible but would be fine with the top defensive player available regardless of position in the 1st round.
I love the signing. We now have a brilliantly improved depth chart to look at. The defensive line rotation looks
like a kick ass unit. But absolutely nailed it you did - "Top defensive player available regardless of position" - I'm fine with it.
so different now:
so different now:
....good to see Gustin moving further down the depth chart. Nothing against him, it just means that our talent depth is improving.
BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE -
so different now:
....good to see Gustin moving further down the depth chart. Nothing against him, it just means that our talent depth is improving.
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Browns sign Jadeveon Clowney, stamping NFL’s smartest free agency class
If you’re handing out an offseason trophy for talent retention, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers have locked up the title. If you’re awarding points for smart and patient bargain shopping for meaningful talent, the Cleveland Browns have edged everyone in the NFL, including the piggy-bank-breaking New England Patriots.
After adding a multitude of starting-level pieces for some reasonable contracts, the Browns plucked one more on Wednesday, signing talented-but-often-bewildering defensive end Jadeveon Clowney to a one-year contract for $8 million (with incentives that could push the deal to $10 million). It’s the culmination of a pursuit that failed last year, when the Browns offered Clowney a handful of different contract options, only to watch him take a one-year deal with the Tennessee Titans.
Despite missing out on Clowney last season and then watching him struggle through a knee injury, Browns general manager Andrew Berry didn’t sour on the defensive end, still believing that Cleveland represents the right fit to reset Clowney’s career.
Courtship, study of Clowney has been going on for years
A source familiar with the deal told Yahoo Sports that Berry has been watching Clowney closely going back to his days in the Philadelphia Eagles' personnel department. The Eagles briefly considered trading for Clowney in the summer of 2018, when the Houston Texans ultimately dealt him to the Seattle Seahawks. It was during that period of vetting — and then watching his tape again as the Browns' general manager — that Berry began to feel like Clowney would be an ideal fit opposite defensive end Myles Garrett. A Browns source said that’s ultimately what Berry had in mind when he pursued Clowney last offseason, believing that Garrett and Clowney would be an ideal pairing to push each other on the field and in the meeting room.A
That ultimately never came to fruition, with Clowney signing in Tennessee. A source said Berry continued to keep tabs on him, knowing that he might be an economical free agency option following the 2020 pandemic season, particularly if Clowney would sign a one-year “prove it” deal. That’s precisely what this week’s signing represents: An opportunity for Clowney to revive his career and showcase his fit in a Browns defense that is continuing to add speed and scheme flexibility.
How good was Browns' offseason?
https://sports.yahoo.com/browns-sign-jadeveon-clowney-stamping-nf-ls-smartest-free-agency-class-163045424.html
....... continued at Yahoo sports...... It's worth it !
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so different now:
....good to see Gustin moving further down the depth chart. Nothing against him, it just means that our talent depth is improving.
....good to see Gustin moving further down the depth chart. Nothing against him, it just means that our talent depth is improving.
Just noticed this on the link:
FREE AGENTS / CAP CASUALTIES FACC 94 CLAYBORN, ADRIAN CC 93 Goodson, BJ UFA 18 Hall, Marvin UFA 54 VERNON, OLIVIER UFA 23 SENDEJO, ANDREW UFA FACC 10 None of these guys are signed yet. Any chance any of them stick With the Browns? Would resigning Vernon actually be a smart move?
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....good to see Gustin moving further down the depth chart. Nothing against him, it just means that our talent depth is improving.
Just noticed this on the link:
FREE AGENTS / CAP CASUALTIES FACC 94 CLAYBORN, ADRIAN CC 93 Goodson, BJ UFA 18 Hall, Marvin UFA 54 VERNON, OLIVIER UFA 23 SENDEJO, ANDREW UFA FACC 10 None of these guys are signed yet. Any chance any of them stick With the Browns? Would resigning Vernon actually be a smart move?
Just noticed this on the link:
FREE AGENTS / CAP CASUALTIES FACC 94 CLAYBORN, ADRIAN CC 93 Goodson, BJ UFA 18 Hall, Marvin UFA 54 VERNON, OLIVIER UFA 23 SENDEJO, ANDREW UFA FACC 10 None of these guys are signed yet. Any chance any of them stick With the Browns? Would resigning Vernon actually be a smart move?
I don't think those guys are in the plans going forward.
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Just noticed this on the link:
FREE AGENTS / CAP CASUALTIES FACC 94 CLAYBORN, ADRIAN CC 93 Goodson, BJ UFA 18 Hall, Marvin UFA 54 VERNON, OLIVIER UFA 23 SENDEJO, ANDREW UFA FACC 10 None of these guys are signed yet. Any chance any of them stick With the Browns? Would resigning Vernon actually be a smart move?
I don't think those guys are in the plans going forward.
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Agree....I mean, if they want another edge I think they would draft one rather than bring Olivier back.
Vernon could/should be available at the start of the season in case we have someone go down. But keep in mind he’s older and recovering from an Achilles in late December- how effective do folks think he will be in 2021?
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...yeah...that's not very flattering...
But I once was watching a game and saw a replay of a play that he had just made......he was lined up inside and at the snap of the ball he juked one way, then pounced back in the other direction and tapped the guard on the back as he was leaving him in the dust while wrapping up the QB and ending the play before it even got started. I remember being in awe ....of somebody of that size, being so blazing quick.....
We'll see.
It's probably a good idea to build a nice rotation for Myles. We saw how he struggled for breath after having COVID last year. And who knows how long that lasts? And who knows what the NFL is going to be like this year, COVID wise? A good rotation might be a good idea especially in COVID times.
Regarding covid- I don't see that being an issue for NFL teams 2021, certainly not to the extent it was last year. Unless players and coaches are being dum-dums or antivaxxers, they should all be vaccinated before training camp starts. But as I like to say 95% effective isn't 100% effective.
Clowney does not get after the qb. He exists on name rec. He is very strong against the run tho.
We bought in a body Vag. Checking Spotrac- they have him as #73 in edge salary obligation. We certainly didn't overpay for what's likely a one year rent-a-player.
And I noticed you still have TJ Watt on his rookie deal- get ready to pay up, or he's heading for greener $$$ pastures next year, just like Steven Nelson and Bud Dupree did. Remains to be seen if keeping Ben around for a last hurrah is going to be worth it. FWIW, Bleacher report has you as one of the top 5 teams in the league on the verge of imminent collapse. Hmmm, you have a guy I never heard of as your only center, (duck Ben) and Joe Haden is running on fumes at CB.
Regarding covid- I don't see that being an issue for NFL teams 2021, certainly not to the extent it was last year. Unless players and coaches are being dum-dums or antivaxxers, they should all be vaccinated before training camp starts. But as I like to say 95% effective isn't 100% effective.
We bought in a body Vag. Checking Spotrac- they have him as #73 in edge salary obligation. We certainly didn't overpay for what's likely a one year rent-a-player.
And I noticed you still have TJ Watt on his rookie deal- get ready to pay up, or he's heading for greener $$$ pastures next year, just like Steven Nelson and Bud Dupree did. Remains to be seen if keeping Ben around for a last hurrah is going to be worth it. FWIW, Bleacher report has you as one of the top 5 teams in the league on the verge of imminent collapse. Hmmm, you have a guy I never heard of as your only center, (duck Ben) and Joe Haden is running on fumes at CB.
Larry my good man, you are straight up talking out of those clappy butt cheeks of yours with this one. Steven Nelson was released and the rumor at the time was because he didn't want to compete with Sutton for starter reps opposite Haden. He also wanted more money which he rightfully earned with his play. However to say he went to greener pastures is factually untrue. He wanted to stay but the team has been grooming sutton and it's now his time. Haden is most definitely not running on fumes, maybe you will see a decline this season as he gets another year older but one fact with haden remains. You all cut him loose entirely too soon or much like Nelson just didn't want to pay him and he left. Has Nelson even signed a new contract with someone?
Dupree was always going to be gone at that's just good drafting. The minute TJ became what TJ became Dupree after his 5th year was going to get paid and he deserves it. TJ Watt will be a Steeler next contract, it's a virtual guarantee. Soooo morale of the story is this, Dupree no matter what happned with Ben was always going to go to another team after he became what he currently is and thats one of the best edge rushers in the game. Nelson lost his job to Sutton. Now he of course said it had zero to do with Sutton but he definitely wanted more money and then after the fact said "they never talked to me about taking less" well how can a team talk to you about taking less when you want more money? unless it was a matter of structuring it in such a way to allow for some upfront relief. Three starters have also now taken less money to stay with the Steelers. Juju, alualu AND vince williams. The Steelers demise has been talked about for decades now and i'm still waiting for it to officially happen. If it does it will because of the QB position. A collapse long term just ISN'T going to happen.
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Clowney's 3-cone and shuttle are very low. He's an explosive athlete, but his pressures at edge in Houston and Tennessee came not by beating the OT upfield, but rather by going inside of the OT after going upfield. Just what tia wants to hear! [And the reason why Clowney is&was overrated..]
So his high "double team rate" combined with "pass rush win" combined with no sacks is not because he's actually double-teamed at the line but rather because that inside move brings him into the OG. And, the inside move means the OT quickly recovers.
Clowney at DT in passing situations is actually not terrible, because lining up at DT and/or stunting with the DT is how the pressure numbers were achieved when Vrabel was the DL coach in Houston. It's not implausible - Clowney had 9 sacks during one of the seasons JJ was injured the entire year.
Because Clowney is a rental and a weird mix of skills [Is he a DI? Is he an edge? You decide!] I still wouldn't be shocked if it's DL in the first.
I still wouldn't be shocked if it's DL in the first.
Me either, and considering how few of the DLinemen on the roster now are signed past the 2021 season, DLine should be a big priority still in this draft.
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Regarding covid- I don't see that being an issue for NFL teams 2021, certainly not to the extent it was last year. Unless players and coaches are being dum-dums or antivaxxers, they should all be vaccinated before training camp starts. But as I like to say 95% effective isn't 100% effective.
We bought in a body Vag. Checking Spotrac- they have him as #73 in edge salary obligation. We certainly didn't overpay for what's likely a one year rent-a-player.
And I noticed you still have TJ Watt on his rookie deal- get ready to pay up, or he's heading for greener $$$ pastures next year, just like Steven Nelson and Bud Dupree did. Remains to be seen if keeping Ben around for a last hurrah is going to be worth it. FWIW, Bleacher report has you as one of the top 5 teams in the league on the verge of imminent collapse. Hmmm, you have a guy I never heard of as your only center, (duck Ben) and Joe Haden is running on fumes at CB.
Larry my good man, you are straight up talking out of those clappy butt cheeks of yours with this one. Steven Nelson was released and the rumor at the time was because he didn't want to compete with Sutton for starter reps opposite Haden. He also wanted more money which he rightfully earned with his play. However to say he went to greener pastures is factually untrue. He wanted to stay but the team has been grooming sutton and it's now his time. Haden is most definitely not running on fumes, maybe you will see a decline this season as he gets another year older but one fact with haden remains. You all cut him loose entirely too soon or much like Nelson just didn't want to pay him and he left. Has Nelson even signed a new contract with someone?
Dupree was always going to be gone at that's just good drafting. The minute TJ became what TJ became Dupree after his 5th year was going to get paid and he deserves it. TJ Watt will be a Steeler next contract, it's a virtual guarantee. Soooo morale of the story is this, Dupree no matter what happned with Ben was always going to go to another team after he became what he currently is and thats one of the best edge rushers in the game. Nelson lost his job to Sutton. Now he of course said it had zero to do with Sutton but he definitely wanted more money and then after the fact said "they never talked to me about taking less" well how can a team talk to you about taking less when you want more money? unless it was a matter of structuring it in such a way to allow for some upfront relief. Three starters have also now taken less money to stay with the Steelers. Juju, alualu AND vince williams. The Steelers demise has been talked about for decades now and i'm still waiting for it to officially happen. If it does it will because of the QB position. A collapse long term just ISN'T going to happen.
Larry my good man, you are straight up talking out of those clappy butt cheeks of yours with this one. Steven Nelson was released and the rumor at the time was because he didn't want to compete with Sutton for starter reps opposite Haden. He also wanted more money which he rightfully earned with his play. However to say he went to greener pastures is factually untrue. He wanted to stay but the team has been grooming sutton and it's now his time. Haden is most definitely not running on fumes, maybe you will see a decline this season as he gets another year older but one fact with haden remains. You all cut him loose entirely too soon or much like Nelson just didn't want to pay him and he left. Has Nelson even signed a new contract with someone?
Dupree was always going to be gone at that's just good drafting. The minute TJ became what TJ became Dupree after his 5th year was going to get paid and he deserves it. TJ Watt will be a Steeler next contract, it's a virtual guarantee. Soooo morale of the story is this, Dupree no matter what happned with Ben was always going to go to another team after he became what he currently is and thats one of the best edge rushers in the game. Nelson lost his job to Sutton. Now he of course said it had zero to do with Sutton but he definitely wanted more money and then after the fact said "they never talked to me about taking less" well how can a team talk to you about taking less when you want more money? unless it was a matter of structuring it in such a way to allow for some upfront relief. Three starters have also now taken less money to stay with the Steelers. Juju, alualu AND vince williams. The Steelers demise has been talked about for decades now and i'm still waiting for it to officially happen. If it does it will because of the QB position. A collapse long term just ISN'T going to happen.
This is what we here call "homer spin" and a Trumpist like refusal to face reality.
Nelson and Dupree were lost because they wanted money that the Steelers could not pay them.
And he thinks that TJ Watt will take less money just to play with the Steelers? Maybe a few guys did that in order to have one last hurrah with BR...but that does not mean that TJ will do that when there is no more BR there. You say that the Steelers demise will be because of the QB position. How long did it take the Steelers to get back into position after Bradshaw retired? About as long as it took the Browns after Bernie Kosar was gone.
And, if Steeler fans are officially waiting for that demise to happen....you must of missed it, because here it is:
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Regarding covid- I don't see that being an issue for NFL teams 2021, certainly not to the extent it was last year. Unless players and coaches are being dum-dums or antivaxxers, they should all be vaccinated before training camp starts. But as I like to say 95% effective isn't 100% effective.
We bought in a body Vag. Checking Spotrac- they have him as #73 in edge salary obligation. We certainly didn't overpay for what's likely a one year rent-a-player.
And I noticed you still have TJ Watt on his rookie deal- get ready to pay up, or he's heading for greener $$$ pastures next year, just like Steven Nelson and Bud Dupree did. Remains to be seen if keeping Ben around for a last hurrah is going to be worth it. FWIW, Bleacher report has you as one of the top 5 teams in the league on the verge of imminent collapse. Hmmm, you have a guy I never heard of as your only center, (duck Ben) and Joe Haden is running on fumes at CB.
Larry my good man, you are straight up talking out of those clappy butt cheeks of yours with this one. Steven Nelson was released and the rumor at the time was because he didn't want to compete with Sutton for starter reps opposite Haden. He also wanted more money which he rightfully earned with his play. However to say he went to greener pastures is factually untrue. He wanted to stay but the team has been grooming sutton and it's now his time. Haden is most definitely not running on fumes, maybe you will see a decline this season as he gets another year older but one fact with haden remains. You all cut him loose entirely too soon or much like Nelson just didn't want to pay him and he left. Has Nelson even signed a new contract with someone?
Dupree was always going to be gone at that's just good drafting. The minute TJ became what TJ became Dupree after his 5th year was going to get paid and he deserves it. TJ Watt will be a Steeler next contract, it's a virtual guarantee. Soooo morale of the story is this, Dupree no matter what happned with Ben was always going to go to another team after he became what he currently is and thats one of the best edge rushers in the game. Nelson lost his job to Sutton. Now he of course said it had zero to do with Sutton but he definitely wanted more money and then after the fact said "they never talked to me about taking less" well how can a team talk to you about taking less when you want more money? unless it was a matter of structuring it in such a way to allow for some upfront relief. Three starters have also now taken less money to stay with the Steelers. Juju, alualu AND vince williams. The Steelers demise has been talked about for decades now and i'm still waiting for it to officially happen. If it does it will because of the QB position. A collapse long term just ISN'T going to happen.
Larry my good man, you are straight up talking out of those clappy butt cheeks of yours with this one. Steven Nelson was released and the rumor at the time was because he didn't want to compete with Sutton for starter reps opposite Haden. He also wanted more money which he rightfully earned with his play. However to say he went to greener pastures is factually untrue. He wanted to stay but the team has been grooming sutton and it's now his time. Haden is most definitely not running on fumes, maybe you will see a decline this season as he gets another year older but one fact with haden remains. You all cut him loose entirely too soon or much like Nelson just didn't want to pay him and he left. Has Nelson even signed a new contract with someone?
Dupree was always going to be gone at that's just good drafting. The minute TJ became what TJ became Dupree after his 5th year was going to get paid and he deserves it. TJ Watt will be a Steeler next contract, it's a virtual guarantee. Soooo morale of the story is this, Dupree no matter what happned with Ben was always going to go to another team after he became what he currently is and thats one of the best edge rushers in the game. Nelson lost his job to Sutton. Now he of course said it had zero to do with Sutton but he definitely wanted more money and then after the fact said "they never talked to me about taking less" well how can a team talk to you about taking less when you want more money? unless it was a matter of structuring it in such a way to allow for some upfront relief. Three starters have also now taken less money to stay with the Steelers. Juju, alualu AND vince williams. The Steelers demise has been talked about for decades now and i'm still waiting for it to officially happen. If it does it will because of the QB position. A collapse long term just ISN'T going to happen.
blah blah blah squealers went to the superbowls so make excuses now blah blah blah.
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Fuck the stilllers.
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One thing I’ve noticed, browsing other Steeler forums across the good ole World Wide Web (I’m a masochistic and love reading what they post, went to like 4 different sites), is that they are beginning to talk about the browns in entire threads. Very much so like we usually do with the Steelers the last 20 years.
my point is, when a team is a threat, They garner attention. Yinzers are beginning to worry about the browns. It is a very refreshing thing to see. They are arguing, hopelessly comparing, and some even coming to grips that we are the better roster and team. They are panicking. So damn nice to see
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