McCoy Signed
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Very glad to see this. He is our long term solution. I don't want to be in the position to draft Jake Locker next year.
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Very glad to see this. He is our long term solution. I don't want to be in the position to draft Jake Locker next year.
Very glad to see this. He is our long term solution. I don't want to be in the position to draft Jake Locker next year.
I'm pleased too as I have a lot of faith in Colt McCoy. Not drafting Locker won't bother me as I'm NOT a fan of his.
McCoy will be fine, especially not being rushed into the limelight.
Mike
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Shep, what makes Dez Bryant a good kid?????????? talented yes, good?, commiitted ?
Insight thanks
Shep, what makes Dez Bryant a good kid?????????? talented yes, good?, commiitted ?
Insight thanks
I was being wry. Or a tool, depending on your perspective. I think his "character issues" have been GROSSLY overblown. No arrests, no drug problems, no fights... nothing. He played well in shirts and shorts, earned lots of kudos, and was the first first rounder to sign... because he doesn't wanna miss anything.
It's early, but he's off to a nice start telling everyone to eat his ass. I sure would.
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Very glad to see this. He is our long term solution. I don't want to be in the position to draft Jake Locker next year.
I'm pleased too as I have a lot of faith in Colt McCoy. Not drafting Locker won't bother me as I'm NOT a fan of his.
McCoy will be fine, especially not being rushed into the limelight.
Mike
I'm pleased too as I have a lot of faith in Colt McCoy. Not drafting Locker won't bother me as I'm NOT a fan of his.
McCoy will be fine, especially not being rushed into the limelight.
Mike
I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
And the last thing you want out of your starter at the most important position in team sports... is "fine."
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I'm pleased too as I have a lot of faith in Colt McCoy. Not drafting Locker won't bother me as I'm NOT a fan of his.
McCoy will be fine, especially not being rushed into the limelight.
Mike
I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
And the last thing you want out of your starter at the most important position in team sports... is "fine."
I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
The experts at National Scouting gave Jake Locker the same pre-season grade that they gave Colt McCoy last year. One guy is bigger and has a stronger arm, the other is more accurate and a more consistent decision-maker.
Don't pretend they're in entirely different spheres just because you liked the Pickle more than McCoy.
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I'm pleased too as I have a lot of faith in Colt McCoy. Not drafting Locker won't bother me as I'm NOT a fan of his.
McCoy will be fine, especially not being rushed into the limelight.
Mike
I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
And the last thing you want out of your starter at the most important position in team sports... is "fine."
I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
I heard in Jake's Locker hangs a picture of the real McCoy.
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I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
I heard in Jake's Locker hangs a picture of the real McCoy.
nmills said:
I heard in Jake's Locker hangs a picture of the real McCoy.nice one!
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I'm pleased too as I have a lot of faith in Colt McCoy. Not drafting Locker won't bother me as I'm NOT a fan of his.
McCoy will be fine, especially not being rushed into the limelight.
Mike
I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
And the last thing you want out of your starter at the most important position in team sports... is "fine."
I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
And the last thing you want out of your starter at the most important position in team sports... is "fine."
What QBs in the 2012 draft are you going to want us to draft when we pass on Locker next year???
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http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8193...o-fouryear-deal
Keep em comin !
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Hopefully Hardesty next.
Does anyone have a gut feeling that Montario Hardesty will be a bigger asset for us than Haden ?
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I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
The experts at National Scouting gave Jake Locker the same pre-season grade that they gave Colt McCoy last year. One guy is bigger and has a stronger arm, the other is more accurate and a more consistent decision-maker.
Don't pretend they're in entirely different spheres just because you liked the Pickle more than McCoy.
The experts at National Scouting gave Jake Locker the same pre-season grade that they gave Colt McCoy last year. One guy is bigger and has a stronger arm, the other is more accurate and a more consistent decision-maker.
Don't pretend they're in entirely different spheres just because you liked the Pickle more than McCoy.
They're in WILDLY different spheres. McCoy was the 85th pick in the draft. Locker will go somewhere between #1 overall and #10 overall... unless he gets hurt.
Not in the same conversation. With only one year in a pro style offense, Locker was considered a strong candidate to go #1 overall. With four years as a starter in Texas, McCoy was a late 3rd round pick.
How are they in the same sphere? I don't get it.
Hey, I have my doubts about McCoy at the next level... but he was worth some risk and a decent value that late. Why not? But Locker has earned Elway comparisons, and that's really rare. He has world class physical ability... and he's smart with a great work ethic, too. He left a lot of money on the table to develop for another year under Sark.
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I recently read that when Colt McCoy has a wet dream, he's Jake Locker.
And the last thing you want out of your starter at the most important position in team sports... is "fine."
What QBs in the 2012 draft are you going to want us to draft when we pass on Locker next year???
What QBs in the 2012 draft are you going to want us to draft when we pass on Locker next year???
I think the Browns are in a very complicated situation at QB, deciding how to use this brief "bridge" with Jake Delhomme.
I'm sure the team expects to compete this year. Let's say they go 7-9 and, as planned, McCoy gets nowhere near the field. They draft somewhere around the middle of the round... maybe 14th. Chances are that Locker and Luck are long gone... but there's absolutely no more evidence that McCoy is an NFL starter than there was last April, when he went 85th in the draft in spite of a VERY high profile.
What do you do? Do you let McCoy become just like Frye, a third rounder who makes you NOT take your serious long-term QB in the draft the next season? How long would the Browns go without an elite long-term quarterback prospect?
Before you say it, yeah... I think Holmgren is really sharp and I cheered the hiring. One of my fears is that he thinks he can make anybody a quarterback. I'm not sure where that comes from given that he's had two in his head coaching career -- Favre (a super talent) and Hasselbeck (a very good one, but never really great). One was a 33rd pick who was acquired with a first round pick. The other was a very specific situation, where he traded for a quarterback he'd drafted at a previous team.
What he's never done is drafted a quarterback after round one... and expected him to become a starter for his team. He always HAD long-term starters in place (Favre and Hasselbeck).
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it's july of 2010, folks. no reason to speculate on QBs yet. claussen was supposed to go top 10. how's that working out?
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Hopefully Hardesty next.
Does anyone have a gut feeling that Montario Hardesty will be a bigger asset for us than Haden ?
Hopefully Hardesty next.
Does anyone have a gut feeling that Montario Hardesty will be a bigger asset for us than Haden ?
Without hesitation, yes. I loved the Hardesty pick.
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Stanzi's a beast
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What QBs in the 2012 draft are you going to want us to draft when we pass on Locker next year???
I think the Browns are in a very complicated situation at QB, deciding how to use this brief "bridge" with Jake Delhomme.
I'm sure the team expects to compete this year. Let's say they go 7-9 and, as planned, McCoy gets nowhere near the field. They draft somewhere around the middle of the round... maybe 14th. Chances are that Locker and Luck are long gone... but there's absolutely no more evidence that McCoy is an NFL starter than there was last April, when he went 85th in the draft in spite of a VERY high profile.
What do you do? Do you let McCoy become just like Frye, a third rounder who makes you NOT take your serious long-term QB in the draft the next season? How long would the Browns go without an elite long-term quarterback prospect?
Before you say it, yeah... I think Holmgren is really sharp and I cheered the hiring. One of my fears is that he thinks he can make anybody a quarterback. I'm not sure where that comes from given that he's had two in his head coaching career -- Favre (a super talent) and Hasselbeck (a very good one, but never really great). One was a 33rd pick who was acquired with a first round pick. The other was a very specific situation, where he traded for a quarterback he'd drafted at a previous team.
What he's never done is drafted a quarterback after round one... and expected him to become a starter for his team. He always HAD long-term starters in place (Favre and Hasselbeck).
I think the Browns are in a very complicated situation at QB, deciding how to use this brief "bridge" with Jake Delhomme.
I'm sure the team expects to compete this year. Let's say they go 7-9 and, as planned, McCoy gets nowhere near the field. They draft somewhere around the middle of the round... maybe 14th. Chances are that Locker and Luck are long gone... but there's absolutely no more evidence that McCoy is an NFL starter than there was last April, when he went 85th in the draft in spite of a VERY high profile.
What do you do? Do you let McCoy become just like Frye, a third rounder who makes you NOT take your serious long-term QB in the draft the next season? How long would the Browns go without an elite long-term quarterback prospect?
Before you say it, yeah... I think Holmgren is really sharp and I cheered the hiring. One of my fears is that he thinks he can make anybody a quarterback. I'm not sure where that comes from given that he's had two in his head coaching career -- Favre (a super talent) and Hasselbeck (a very good one, but never really great). One was a 33rd pick who was acquired with a first round pick. The other was a very specific situation, where he traded for a quarterback he'd drafted at a previous team.
What he's never done is drafted a quarterback after round one... and expected him to become a starter for his team. He always HAD long-term starters in place (Favre and Hasselbeck).
McCoy and Frye can't even be compared. What QB would we have drafted in 2006 instead of giving Frye a chance? Lets see, we picked 12th and Young, Leinart and Cutler were gone... A quick scan of that year's draft tells me the next QB off the board was Tarvaris Jackson with the last pick in the 2nd round, so basically a 3rd rounder. How would that be an upgrade over Frye at that point.
Oh, but I'm sure we could have moved up to get Cutler or Leinart since they were drafted #10 and #11. Moving up did such wonders for us the next year with Brady Quinn, so I'm sure we would have picked Leinart and been in the same position we are now.
By the way, it has been posted countless times, but here is a list of QBs Holmgren helped develop: Joe Montana, Steve Young, Bret Favre, Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselback, Aaron Brooks, and Seneca Wallace. I count 7 good-great starters on that list, including two hall of famers and one who will be a first ballot pick. Seems like a pretty good record to me, but what do I know, I'm not a QB guru like you.
One more question: Why would Holmgren have ever drafted a QB in round 1 when he had Favre and Hasslebeck? Your point that he's only ever picked later round QBs (and had a good track record of success doing so) doesn't hold much water because he had two all-star QBs in their primes.
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Samoth, that's the wrong draft. The Browns passed on Aaron Rodgers at #3 to take Braylon Edwards.
I wanted Rodgers or Shawne Merriman in round one, Vincent Jackson in round two. I feel pretty good about my (oft repeated) opinion at this point. I thought Charlie Frye was grossly overrated (remember when some thought the Packers would take him at 24?)... and agreed with Simms and Peter King when they called him a lifetime backup and 5th round talent.
And remember... Frye went higher than McCoy.
EDIT: Oh, I get it. You meant the draft AFTER Frye. Sorry. Only had a minute to read/post.
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I think the Browns are in a very complicated situation at QB, deciding how to use this brief "bridge" with Jake Delhomme.
I'm sure the team expects to compete this year. Let's say they go 7-9 and, as planned, McCoy gets nowhere near the field. They draft somewhere around the middle of the round... maybe 14th. Chances are that Locker and Luck are long gone... but there's absolutely no more evidence that McCoy is an NFL starter than there was last April, when he went 85th in the draft in spite of a VERY high profile.
What do you do? Do you let McCoy become just like Frye, a third rounder who makes you NOT take your serious long-term QB in the draft the next season? How long would the Browns go without an elite long-term quarterback prospect?
Before you say it, yeah... I think Holmgren is really sharp and I cheered the hiring. One of my fears is that he thinks he can make anybody a quarterback. I'm not sure where that comes from given that he's had two in his head coaching career -- Favre (a super talent) and Hasselbeck (a very good one, but never really great). One was a 33rd pick who was acquired with a first round pick. The other was a very specific situation, where he traded for a quarterback he'd drafted at a previous team.
What he's never done is drafted a quarterback after round one... and expected him to become a starter for his team. He always HAD long-term starters in place (Favre and Hasselbeck).
McCoy and Frye can't even be compared. What QB would we have drafted in 2006 instead of giving Frye a chance? Lets see, we picked 12th and Young, Leinart and Cutler were gone... A quick scan of that year's draft tells me the next QB off the board was Tarvaris Jackson with the last pick in the 2nd round, so basically a 3rd rounder. How would that be an upgrade over Frye at that point.
Oh, but I'm sure we could have moved up to get Cutler or Leinart since they were drafted #10 and #11. Moving up did such wonders for us the next year with Brady Quinn, so I'm sure we would have picked Leinart and been in the same position we are now.
By the way, it has been posted countless times, but here is a list of QBs Holmgren helped develop: Joe Montana, Steve Young, Bret Favre, Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselback, Aaron Brooks, and Seneca Wallace. I count 7 good-great starters on that list, including two hall of famers and one who will be a first ballot pick. Seems like a pretty good record to me, but what do I know, I'm not a QB guru like you.
One more question: Why would Holmgren have ever drafted a QB in round 1 when he had Favre and Hasslebeck? Your point that he's only ever picked later round QBs (and had a good track record of success doing so) doesn't hold much water because he had two all-star QBs in their primes.
McCoy and Frye can't even be compared. What QB would we have drafted in 2006 instead of giving Frye a chance? Lets see, we picked 12th and Young, Leinart and Cutler were gone... A quick scan of that year's draft tells me the next QB off the board was Tarvaris Jackson with the last pick in the 2nd round, so basically a 3rd rounder. How would that be an upgrade over Frye at that point.
Oh, but I'm sure we could have moved up to get Cutler or Leinart since they were drafted #10 and #11. Moving up did such wonders for us the next year with Brady Quinn, so I'm sure we would have picked Leinart and been in the same position we are now.
By the way, it has been posted countless times, but here is a list of QBs Holmgren helped develop: Joe Montana, Steve Young, Bret Favre, Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselback, Aaron Brooks, and Seneca Wallace. I count 7 good-great starters on that list, including two hall of famers and one who will be a first ballot pick. Seems like a pretty good record to me, but what do I know, I'm not a QB guru like you.
One more question: Why would Holmgren have ever drafted a QB in round 1 when he had Favre and Hasslebeck? Your point that he's only ever picked later round QBs (and had a good track record of success doing so) doesn't hold much water because he had two all-star QBs in their primes.
You misunderstood. What you state in the last 'graph is exactly my point: There's a popular notion that Holmgren has a history of drafting quarterbacks later in the draft and turning them into starters and first round values. He's never actually done that. He's never drafted a guy later in the draft with any INTENTION of starting him. And none of them ever actually started for the team that drafted them.
In fact, VERY few quarterbacks drafted after about pick #33 EVER start for the teams that drafted them. The only ones who've gone on to do anything in the past decade are Romo and Brady.
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The experts at National Scouting gave Jake Locker the same pre-season grade that they gave Colt McCoy last year. One guy is bigger and has a stronger arm, the other is more accurate and a more consistent decision-maker.
Don't pretend they're in entirely different spheres just because you liked the Pickle more than McCoy.
They're in WILDLY different spheres. McCoy was the 85th pick in the draft. Locker will go somewhere between #1 overall and #10 overall... unless he gets hurt.
Not in the same conversation. With only one year in a pro style offense, Locker was considered a strong candidate to go #1 overall. With four years as a starter in Texas, McCoy was a late 3rd round pick.
How are they in the same sphere? I don't get it.
Hey, I have my doubts about McCoy at the next level... but he was worth some risk and a decent value that late. Why not? But Locker has earned Elway comparisons, and that's really rare. He has world class physical ability... and he's smart with a great work ethic, too. He left a lot of money on the table to develop for another year under Sark.
They're in WILDLY different spheres. McCoy was the 85th pick in the draft. Locker will go somewhere between #1 overall and #10 overall... unless he gets hurt.
I guess that's why Locker got a 2nd round grade from the NFL Draft Advisory Committee...because, like the Pickle, he is/was a lock to go in the top ten.
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McCoy and Frye can't even be compared. What QB would we have drafted in 2006 instead of giving Frye a chance? Lets see, we picked 12th and Young, Leinart and Cutler were gone... A quick scan of that year's draft tells me the next QB off the board was Tarvaris Jackson with the last pick in the 2nd round, so basically a 3rd rounder. How would that be an upgrade over Frye at that point.
Oh, but I'm sure we could have moved up to get Cutler or Leinart since they were drafted #10 and #11. Moving up did such wonders for us the next year with Brady Quinn, so I'm sure we would have picked Leinart and been in the same position we are now.
By the way, it has been posted countless times, but here is a list of QBs Holmgren helped develop: Joe Montana, Steve Young, Bret Favre, Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselback, Aaron Brooks, and Seneca Wallace. I count 7 good-great starters on that list, including two hall of famers and one who will be a first ballot pick. Seems like a pretty good record to me, but what do I know, I'm not a QB guru like you.
One more question: Why would Holmgren have ever drafted a QB in round 1 when he had Favre and Hasslebeck? Your point that he's only ever picked later round QBs (and had a good track record of success doing so) doesn't hold much water because he had two all-star QBs in their primes.
You misunderstood. What you state in the last 'graph is exactly my point: There's a popular notion that Holmgren has a history of drafting quarterbacks later in the draft and turning them into starters and first round values. He's never actually done that. He's never drafted a guy later in the draft with any INTENTION of starting him. And none of them ever actually started for the team that drafted them.
In fact, VERY few quarterbacks drafted after about pick #33 EVER start for the teams that drafted them. The only ones who've gone on to do anything in the past decade are Romo and Brady.
You misunderstood. What you state in the last 'graph is exactly my point: There's a popular notion that Holmgren has a history of drafting quarterbacks later in the draft and turning them into starters and first round values. He's never actually done that. He's never drafted a guy later in the draft with any INTENTION of starting him. And none of them ever actually started for the team that drafted them.
In fact, VERY few quarterbacks drafted after about pick #33 EVER start for the teams that drafted them. The only ones who've gone on to do anything in the past decade are Romo and Brady.
He did turn them into starters, just for other teams. It's not like he had no hand in training them when they were backups in Green Bay. He ended up getting better value for them than he paid once they were traded away. Why would any of these guys ever start a game in Green Bay when Favre hasn't missed a start in his career? If Favre was still in Green Bay, Aaron Rogers would be entering year 6 of bench riding backup status, or would have been traded to another team for move value than he was drafted for.
Who cares what team drafts somebody if that guy becomes a starter? Hasselbeck, Brunell and Brooks were all starting Qbs for many years despite their draft position. Once again you are ignoring the fact that they were not asked to start in Green Bay, and were drafted as projects/backups, but through strong training became all-star QBs for other teams throughout the league. Why don't you understand this?
We spent first round picks on Tim Couch and Brady Quinn who both flame out, yet our most successful years since returning have been helmed by Kelly Holcomb and Derek Anderson. The Bengals spent years drafting David Klingers and Akili Smiths until they finally found a winner with Carson Palmer. Not every first round QB is a huge success, but you refuse to let the facts become part of your opinion.
You're already calling for us to spend 70+ million dollars next year on Jake Locker, who you assume will be #1 overall before he plays his senior season. How did that work out for Matt Leinart, Aaron Rogers, Brady Quinn, and Jimmy Clausen? Locker may have a terrible year and take a huge fall like Jeven Snead. Who knows? Certainly not you.
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