Bye Bye Mangini
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Ok i agree he shut his mouth, but did he play? To me it seemed like he didnt want to be out there..
YOU brought up a point about Vickers.. You saw him jawing at the begining of the game with Lewis right?
Tell me this, Lewis had like 5-8 guys surrounded him and Vickers was by himself. Why the phuck didnt any other browns have his back?
You do realize that Hillis played the whole game with a back and rib injury, not to mention the knee injury that he just got over this week. I sorry the guy that is responsible for 50% of our offense has to play through injuries that most others would just sit out with. I would have honestly been more happy if Vickers had just shut his mouth and played the game. I would rather guys just shut up the other team with their play instead of firing back like a bunch of dip shits. If you want a team of jawing dicks then start rooting for the Bengals.
Hillis-iz-Boss said:
You do realize that Hillis played the whole game with a back and rib injury, not to mention the knee injury that he just got over this week. I sorry the guy that is responsible for 50% of our offense has to play through injuries that most others would just sit out with. I would have honestly been more happy if Vickers had just shut his mouth and played the game. I would rather guys just shut up the other team with their play instead of firing back like a bunch of dip shits. If you want a team of jawing dicks then start rooting for the Bengals.I would also rather have guys who could shut guys up with there play.. my exact point.
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Hillis-iz-Boss said:
You do realize that Hillis played the whole game with a back and rib injury, not to mention the knee injury that he just got over this week. I sorry the guy that is responsible for 50% of our offense has to play through injuries that most others would just sit out with. I would have honestly been more happy if Vickers had just shut his mouth and played the game. I would rather guys just shut up the other team with their play instead of firing back like a bunch of dip shits. If you want a team of jawing dicks then start rooting for the Bengals.I would also rather have guys who could shut guys up with there play.. my exact point.
I would also rather have guys who could shut guys up with there play.. my exact point.
But as where you want guys to mouth off before hand, I just want them to play, regardless of what was said about them or to them. Plus I also don't consider players quitters when they have reduced play when they are playing through an injury the received, an injury that we as normal people would get off work for which compared to football isn't shit.
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I would also rather have guys who could shut guys up with there play.. my exact point.
But as where you want guys to mouth off before hand, I just want them to play, regardless of what was said about them or to them. Plus I also don't consider players quitters when they have reduced play when they are playing through an injury the received, an injury that we as normal people would get off work for which compared to football isn't shit.
Hillis-iz-Boss said:
But as where you want guys to mouth off before hand, I just want them to play, regardless of what was said about them or to them. Plus I also don't consider players quitters when they have reduced play when they are playing through an injury the received, an injury that we as normal people would get off work for which compared to football isn't shit.I just wanted to see more energy out of our team. I like how haden carries himself on and off the field.
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One thing I hated about leading up to this game is Ray Lewis running his mouth and Hillis not saying anything.
To me it shows that lack of swagger for the team, i want some one who is cocky and will back it up.. If it was me, i would have said " well lewis USE to be a good LB 5 years ago"
Then I would have played like I WANTED to be on the field. I am not sure how hurt Hillis was but it seemed like Lewis really got into his head.
Our team plays with no swagger at all.
Our team plays with the swagger of a cripple <--- thats from a song lol
And yes, I also wished Hillis would have said something in response to Lewis' comments, but I guess there are 2 ways you can view the situation.
1: Hillis needs to respond to Lewis and stick up for himself.
2: If Hillis responds, that just motivates Lewis to play that much harder. Giving the opponent extra motivation isn't good.
Our team plays with the swagger of a cripple <--- thats from a song lol
And yes, I also wished Hillis would have said something in response to Lewis' comments, but I guess there are 2 ways you can view the situation.
1: Hillis needs to respond to Lewis and stick up for himself.
2: If Hillis responds, that just motivates Lewis to play that much harder. Giving the opponent extra motivation isn't good.
or
3. Hillis decides to be the bigger man and lets his skill do the talking for him rather then stoop down to the same level that Lewis is on. He didn't even acknowledge lewis which in my book is better then saying na na im better then you are.
Yea, trash talking is nice but he's injured so why run your mouth if your not 100% sure you can back it up?
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Ok i agree he shut his mouth, but did he play? To me it seemed like he didnt want to be out there..
YOU brought up a point about Vickers.. You saw him jawing at the begining of the game with Lewis right?
Tell me this, Lewis had like 5-8 guys surrounded him and Vickers was by himself. Why the phuck didnt any other browns have his back?
You do realize that Hillis played the whole game with a back and rib injury, not to mention the knee injury that he just got over this week. I sorry the guy that is responsible for 50% of our offense has to play through injuries that most others would just sit out with. I would have honestly been more happy if Vickers had just shut his mouth and played the game. I would rather guys just shut up the other team with their play instead of firing back like a bunch of dip shits. If you want a team of jawing dicks then start rooting for the Bengals.
Hillis-iz-Boss said:
I sorry the guy that is responsible for 50% of our offense has to play through injuries that most others would just sit out with.During the game I think they said Hillis is responsible for either 70% or 80% of the rushing yards this year. I could be wrong.
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Hillis-iz-Boss said:
I sorry the guy that is responsible for 50% of our offense has to play through injuries that most others would just sit out with.During the game I think they said Hillis is responsible for either 70% or 80% of the rushing yards this year. I could be wrong.
During the game I think they said Hillis is responsible for either 70% or 80% of the rushing yards this year. I could be wrong.
It was something crazy like 87 % of rushing yards.
Hodges has 1.5% of rushing yards
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5-11, now 5-10, and a very bad day for coaching in Cleveland. This couldn't be any clearer: Mangini is gone.
Best guess has Holmgren and Haskell making McCoy the triggerman of a WCO, a great scenario that sure as hell isn't "starting over" given that both guys are already here. We need at least two very serious WRs who can get open like Green Bay's WCO WRs do. It'll happen: One in the first round, another in free agency.
The defense? Can't say for sure. But I feel pretty certain about Mangini heading out and the WCO heading in.
5-11, now 5-10, and a very bad day for coaching in Cleveland. This couldn't be any clearer: Mangini is gone.
Best guess has Holmgren and Haskell making McCoy the triggerman of a WCO, a great scenario that sure as hell isn't "starting over" given that both guys are already here. We need at least two very serious WRs who can get open like Green Bay's WCO WRs do. It'll happen: One in the first round, another in free agency.
The defense? Can't say for sure. But I feel pretty certain about Mangini heading out and the WCO heading in.
Well, the look on Mnagini's face after the game spoke volumes- like the guy KNOWS he's toast. Not for lack of trying, or creativity on offense for a change. At this stage the Browns have to play error free football to win they didn't. Colt had a more typical rookie game. Massaquoi get stripped. Those picks and fumble were caused by Mangini, I suppose.
You can blame Magini for lousy clock management at the half, but little else. We don't have the horses, so fire the coach.
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5-11, now 5-10, and a very bad day for coaching in Cleveland. This couldn't be any clearer: Mangini is gone.
Best guess has Holmgren and Haskell making McCoy the triggerman of a WCO, a great scenario that sure as hell isn't "starting over" given that both guys are already here. We need at least two very serious WRs who can get open like Green Bay's WCO WRs do. It'll happen: One in the first round, another in free agency.
The defense? Can't say for sure. But I feel pretty certain about Mangini heading out and the WCO heading in.
Well, the look on Mnagini's face after the game spoke volumes- like the guy KNOWS he's toast. Not for lack of trying, or creativity on offense for a change. At this stage the Browns have to play error free football to win they didn't. Colt had a more typical rookie game. Massaquoi get stripped. Those picks and fumble were caused by Mangini, I suppose.
You can blame Magini for lousy clock management at the half, but little else. We don't have the horses, so fire the coach.
We don't have the horses, so fire the coach.
The sad thing is the same could be said for all Browns coaches since 1999.
Revolving GMs and coaches, incremental and other high draft picks and the talent is still significantly below that of an NFL playoff contender.
Maybe Chris Palmer is still the best coach of the new Browns.
This season if very important to the Holmgren group, having a year under their belt.
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We don't have the horses, so fire the coach.
The sad thing is the same could be said for all Browns coaches since 1999.
Revolving GMs and coaches, incremental and other high draft picks and the talent is still significantly below that of an NFL playoff contender.
Maybe Chris Palmer is still the best coach of the new Browns.
This season if very important to the Holmgren group, having a year under their belt.
The sad thing is the same could be said for all Browns coaches since 1999.
Revolving GMs and coaches, incremental and other high draft picks and the talent is still significantly below that of an NFL playoff contender.
Maybe Chris Palmer is still the best coach of the new Browns.
This season if very important to the Holmgren group, having a year under their belt.
Exactly what I've been saying John. The revolving door has got to stop sometime, and I hope it's now. We're in year two of a total rebuild, and because they're aren't (to some folks here's minds) instant results let's blow it up again and start over.
Some folks might not like Mangini's style- but it will win games- IF you don't make killing mistakes. The Browns were on their way until Massaquoi got stripped, and Colt threw the pick. B-more goes on a long drive, tires out an undermanned defense and the rest is history.
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The sad thing is the same could be said for all Browns coaches since 1999.
Revolving GMs and coaches, incremental and other high draft picks and the talent is still significantly below that of an NFL playoff contender.
Maybe Chris Palmer is still the best coach of the new Browns.
This season if very important to the Holmgren group, having a year under their belt.
Exactly what I've been saying John. The revolving door has got to stop sometime, and I hope it's now. We're in year two of a total rebuild, and because they're aren't (to some folks here's minds) instant results let's blow it up again and start over.
Some folks might not like Mangini's style- but it will win games- IF you don't make killing mistakes. The Browns were on their way until Massaquoi got stripped, and Colt threw the pick. B-more goes on a long drive, tires out an undermanned defense and the rest is history.
Exactly what I've been saying John. The revolving door has got to stop sometime, and I hope it's now. We're in year two of a total rebuild, and because they're aren't (to some folks here's minds) instant results let's blow it up again and start over.
Some folks might not like Mangini's style- but it will win games- IF you don't make killing mistakes. The Browns were on their way until Massaquoi got stripped, and Colt threw the pick. B-more goes on a long drive, tires out an undermanned defense and the rest is history.
Problem is, it's not Holmgren's style and Holmgren is the boss. The only way Walrus keeps rolling without his guys and his systems is if the Browns are winning. It looks like we'll go from 5-11 to 5-11. The Chiefs went from winning 10 games in three years to probably winning 11 in 2010. The Rams went from 1-15 to probably 8-8 and a division championship.
That's the league we play in... not one where 4-12 to 5-11 to 5-11 is considered progress. Worse, the Browns closed really, really badly, not on a four-game winning streak like last year. Nobody made it rough on Holmgren.
This is the Holmgren era, not the Mangini era.
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Well, here we go, the Cleveland Browns HC carousel has begun AGAIN! Mangini will be fired making a lot of "fans" very happy, we all will be hearing names like Cowher and Gruden and resurrecting Paul Brown and seeing if Lombardi has a grandson, but will either end up with Holmgren coaching (which destroys the solid structure this team FINALLY has) or some coordinator moving up to HC for the first time. About this time in 2012 (if the earth is still here) we will be talking the SAME thing. FIRE THE COACH!
I dont know, maybe its just me and all, but NO "big name" or "well established" coach is going to come to Cleveland! ITS CAREER SUICIDE! This city (and partially understandable) is SO impatient and SO miserable that they want to be the Patriots or Stools over night. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN! The LACK of TALENT on this team for YEARS will NEVER ALLOW A COACH TO COME IN AND WIN OUT! NEVER!
I also find it funny that people want to switch back to the 4-3. That would be a COMPLETE overhaul of the front 7 of the D. After complaining about the 4-3 for years......again, the cycle. LOL!
When will Cleveland learn? Hoping for losses, nitpicking stupid crap, forgetting any positive thing and only focusing on the negatives.......its what Cleveland does.......
I guess I should join the fight then. I hope for a loss game one next year, it will be a meaningless win that will only cause (insert new HC name here) to be here longer and will just screw up our draft pick anyway! YEAH!
Sorry, just sick of losing, and sick of all the "FIRE EVERYONE!" all the flippin time........banghead
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Well, here we go, the Cleveland Browns HC carousel has begun AGAIN! Mangini will be fired making a lot of "fans" very happy, we all will be hearing names like Cowher and Gruden and resurrecting Paul Brown and seeing if Lombardi has a grandson, but will either end up with Holmgren coaching (which destroys the solid structure this team FINALLY has) or some coordinator moving up to HC for the first time. About this time in 2012 (if the earth is still here) we will be talking the SAME thing. FIRE THE COACH!
I dont know, maybe its just me and all, but NO "big name" or "well established" coach is going to come to Cleveland! ITS CAREER SUICIDE! This city (and partially understandable) is SO impatient and SO miserable that they want to be the Patriots or Stools over night. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN! The LACK of TALENT on this team for YEARS will NEVER ALLOW A COACH TO COME IN AND WIN OUT! NEVER!
I also find it funny that people want to switch back to the 4-3. That would be a COMPLETE overhaul of the front 7 of the D. After complaining about the 4-3 for years......again, the cycle. LOL!
When will Cleveland learn? Hoping for losses, nitpicking stupid crap, forgetting any positive thing and only focusing on the negatives.......its what Cleveland does.......
I guess I should join the fight then. I hope for a loss game one next year, it will be a meaningless win that will only cause (insert new HC name here) to be here longer and will just screw up our draft pick anyway! YEAH!
Sorry, just sick of losing, and sick of all the "FIRE EVERYONE!" all the flippin time........banghead
Well, here we go, the Cleveland Browns HC carousel has begun AGAIN! Mangini will be fired making a lot of "fans" very happy, we all will be hearing names like Cowher and Gruden and resurrecting Paul Brown and seeing if Lombardi has a grandson, but will either end up with Holmgren coaching (which destroys the solid structure this team FINALLY has) or some coordinator moving up to HC for the first time. About this time in 2012 (if the earth is still here) we will be talking the SAME thing. FIRE THE COACH!
I dont know, maybe its just me and all, but NO "big name" or "well established" coach is going to come to Cleveland! ITS CAREER SUICIDE! This city (and partially understandable) is SO impatient and SO miserable that they want to be the Patriots or Stools over night. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN! The LACK of TALENT on this team for YEARS will NEVER ALLOW A COACH TO COME IN AND WIN OUT! NEVER!
I also find it funny that people want to switch back to the 4-3. That would be a COMPLETE overhaul of the front 7 of the D. After complaining about the 4-3 for years......again, the cycle. LOL!
When will Cleveland learn? Hoping for losses, nitpicking stupid crap, forgetting any positive thing and only focusing on the negatives.......its what Cleveland does.......
I guess I should join the fight then. I hope for a loss game one next year, it will be a meaningless win that will only cause (insert new HC name here) to be here longer and will just screw up our draft pick anyway! YEAH!
Sorry, just sick of losing, and sick of all the "FIRE EVERYONE!" all the flippin time........banghead
Do me a favor quit putting Cowher in the equation. He won't coach the Browns. I have a better chance of catching a piggy back ride from big foot to Kennywood with the park open JUST FOR ME. It's not gonna happen.
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Well, here we go, the Cleveland Browns HC carousel has begun AGAIN! Mangini will be fired making a lot of "fans" very happy, we all will be hearing names like Cowher and Gruden and resurrecting Paul Brown and seeing if Lombardi has a grandson, but will either end up with Holmgren coaching (which destroys the solid structure this team FINALLY has) or some coordinator moving up to HC for the first time. About this time in 2012 (if the earth is still here) we will be talking the SAME thing. FIRE THE COACH!
I dont know, maybe its just me and all, but NO "big name" or "well established" coach is going to come to Cleveland! ITS CAREER SUICIDE! This city (and partially understandable) is SO impatient and SO miserable that they want to be the Patriots or Stools over night. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN! The LACK of TALENT on this team for YEARS will NEVER ALLOW A COACH TO COME IN AND WIN OUT! NEVER!
I also find it funny that people want to switch back to the 4-3. That would be a COMPLETE overhaul of the front 7 of the D. After complaining about the 4-3 for years......again, the cycle. LOL!
When will Cleveland learn? Hoping for losses, nitpicking stupid crap, forgetting any positive thing and only focusing on the negatives.......its what Cleveland does.......
I guess I should join the fight then. I hope for a loss game one next year, it will be a meaningless win that will only cause (insert new HC name here) to be here longer and will just screw up our draft pick anyway! YEAH!
Sorry, just sick of losing, and sick of all the "FIRE EVERYONE!" all the flippin time........banghead
Do me a favor quit putting Cowher in the equation. He won't coach the Browns. I have a better chance of catching a piggy back ride from big foot to Kennywood with the park open JUST FOR ME. It's not gonna happen.
Homotron said:
Do me a favor quit putting Cowher in the equation. He won't coach the Browns. I have a better chance of catching a piggy back ride from big foot to Kennywood with the park open JUST FOR ME. It's not gonna happen.I agree, I used it as an example of the CHANTS 2 years ago, not out of reality.
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Well, here we go, the Cleveland Browns HC carousel has begun AGAIN! Mangini will be fired making a lot of "fans" very happy, we all will be hearing names like Cowher and Gruden and resurrecting Paul Brown and seeing if Lombardi has a grandson, but will either end up with Holmgren coaching (which destroys the solid structure this team FINALLY has) or some coordinator moving up to HC for the first time. About this time in 2012 (if the earth is still here) we will be talking the SAME thing. FIRE THE COACH!
I dont know, maybe its just me and all, but NO "big name" or "well established" coach is going to come to Cleveland! ITS CAREER SUICIDE! This city (and partially understandable) is SO impatient and SO miserable that they want to be the Patriots or Stools over night. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN! The LACK of TALENT on this team for YEARS will NEVER ALLOW A COACH TO COME IN AND WIN OUT! NEVER!
I also find it funny that people want to switch back to the 4-3. That would be a COMPLETE overhaul of the front 7 of the D. After complaining about the 4-3 for years......again, the cycle. LOL!
When will Cleveland learn? Hoping for losses, nitpicking stupid crap, forgetting any positive thing and only focusing on the negatives.......its what Cleveland does.......
I guess I should join the fight then. I hope for a loss game one next year, it will be a meaningless win that will only cause (insert new HC name here) to be here longer and will just screw up our draft pick anyway! YEAH!
Sorry, just sick of losing, and sick of all the "FIRE EVERYONE!" all the flippin time........banghead
Do me a favor quit putting Cowher in the equation. He won't coach the Browns. I have a better chance of catching a piggy back ride from big foot to Kennywood with the park open JUST FOR ME. It's not gonna happen.
Homotron said:
Do me a favor quit putting Cowher in the equation. He won't coach the Browns. I have a better chance of catching a piggy back ride from big foot to Kennywood with the park open JUST FOR ME. It's not gonna happen.Agree with you on the Chin- but agree with everything else in the post. Maybe Holmgren will give Mangini one more year and put the boo birds to rest at least until September.
If you take it to the negative Nancy's logical conclusion, you should fire every new coach the first year he doesn't win the Super Bowl.
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Well, here we go, the Cleveland Browns HC carousel has begun AGAIN! Mangini will be fired making a lot of "fans" very happy, we all will be hearing names like Cowher and Gruden and resurrecting Paul Brown and seeing if Lombardi has a grandson, but will either end up with Holmgren coaching (which destroys the solid structure this team FINALLY has) or some coordinator moving up to HC for the first time. About this time in 2012 (if the earth is still here) we will be talking the SAME thing. FIRE THE COACH!
I dont know, maybe its just me and all, but NO "big name" or "well established" coach is going to come to Cleveland! ITS CAREER SUICIDE! This city (and partially understandable) is SO impatient and SO miserable that they want to be the Patriots or Stools over night. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN! The LACK of TALENT on this team for YEARS will NEVER ALLOW A COACH TO COME IN AND WIN OUT! NEVER!
I also find it funny that people want to switch back to the 4-3. That would be a COMPLETE overhaul of the front 7 of the D. After complaining about the 4-3 for years......again, the cycle. LOL!
When will Cleveland learn? Hoping for losses, nitpicking stupid crap, forgetting any positive thing and only focusing on the negatives.......its what Cleveland does.......
I guess I should join the fight then. I hope for a loss game one next year, it will be a meaningless win that will only cause (insert new HC name here) to be here longer and will just screw up our draft pick anyway! YEAH!
Sorry, just sick of losing, and sick of all the "FIRE EVERYONE!" all the flippin time........banghead
Do me a favor quit putting Cowher in the equation. He won't coach the Browns. I have a better chance of catching a piggy back ride from big foot to Kennywood with the park open JUST FOR ME. It's not gonna happen.
Homotron said:
Do me a favor quit putting Cowher in the equation. He won't coach the Browns. I have a better chance of catching a piggy back ride from big foot to Kennywood with the park open JUST FOR ME. It's not gonna happen.As much as I hate to say it but I agree with you. I dont ever see him coming here. It will only tarnish his legacy in Pissburgh. Then again I dont see him coaching ever again.
He had a good thing going on in pittsburgh and he still left. I dont know if it was because of his family or he just wanted to quit while on top but why give up a good team just to start all over again when you could of kept winning in the first place.
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It's not the Browns... it's the NFL. If you follow up 5-11 with 5-11 and a very uninspired last several games, you're either fired or damn lucky, period. It's a fact.
But this situation is unusual because this is the Holmgren era in Cleveland, not the Mangini era. I'd guess that 9 of 10 "experts" were stunned that Holmgren didn't bring in his own people and his own systems, which would be totally understandable. Now he will... and should.
It's not much in the way of starting over if Holmgren moves to the sideline and Haskell becomes OC... and let's be brutally honest: Mangini and Daboll are NOT Holmgren and Haskell. They've accomplished nothing in this league. Holmgren has been to THREE Super Bowls and won one. Few coaches can match that.
The Rams and Chiefs weren't thought to be exactly talent-laden... but both are gonna be in the playoffs after several dismal years. The Browns have lots of good players -- Thomas, Steinbach, Mack, Watson, Vickers, Hillis, McCoy, Rubin, Rogers, Gocong, Benard, Fujita, Brown, Haden, Ward, Cribbs, and Dawson are all very, VERY good football players. Yes, we have a gaping hole at WR and need help at RT. Sure, we need another LB and a DE. But that's not nearly the talent deficit so many here wanna claim to excuse Mangini.
The Chiefs went into this year thought to be weak just about everywhere but RB. I lived there for 17 years and I have scads of super-fan friends who said the team was a mess. Now they're 10-5.
It's not the Browns. It's reality in the NFL.
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Exactly what I've been saying John. The revolving door has got to stop sometime, and I hope it's now. We're in year two of a total rebuild, and because they're aren't (to some folks here's minds) instant results let's blow it up again and start over.
Some folks might not like Mangini's style- but it will win games- IF you don't make killing mistakes. The Browns were on their way until Massaquoi got stripped, and Colt threw the pick. B-more goes on a long drive, tires out an undermanned defense and the rest is history.
Problem is, it's not Holmgren's style and Holmgren is the boss. The only way Walrus keeps rolling without his guys and his systems is if the Browns are winning. It looks like we'll go from 5-11 to 5-11. The Chiefs went from winning 10 games in three years to probably winning 11 in 2010. The Rams went from 1-15 to probably 8-8 and a division championship.
That's the league we play in... not one where 4-12 to 5-11 to 5-11 is considered progress. Worse, the Browns closed really, really badly, not on a four-game winning streak like last year. Nobody made it rough on Holmgren.
This is the Holmgren era, not the Mangini era.
Problem is, it's not Holmgren's style and Holmgren is the boss. The only way Walrus keeps rolling without his guys and his systems is if the Browns are winning. It looks like we'll go from 5-11 to 5-11. The Chiefs went from winning 10 games in three years to probably winning 11 in 2010. The Rams went from 1-15 to probably 8-8 and a division championship.
That's the league we play in... not one where 4-12 to 5-11 to 5-11 is considered progress. Worse, the Browns closed really, really badly, not on a four-game winning streak like last year. Nobody made it rough on Holmgren.
This is the Holmgren era, not the Mangini era.
Yeah Shep look a little closer- the mighty turnaround Chiefs have played one team with a winning record. Shades of Anderceptions "miracle" 10-6. And the Rams aren't much better- they got blown out by 38 by the freaking Detroit Lions. The Browns have played seven of the ten teams with the best records in the NFL (2 of them twice- and beaten the Pats and Saints) so if you want to tell me the Rams and Chiefs would still be sporting those records if they had played the Browns murderers row, dream on. & FWIW, KC needed a pick 6 to beat the Browns.
And I wouldn't be so certain Holmgren is totally married into "his" system, and "his" guys.
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Problem is, it's not Holmgren's style and Holmgren is the boss. The only way Walrus keeps rolling without his guys and his systems is if the Browns are winning. It looks like we'll go from 5-11 to 5-11. The Chiefs went from winning 10 games in three years to probably winning 11 in 2010. The Rams went from 1-15 to probably 8-8 and a division championship.
That's the league we play in... not one where 4-12 to 5-11 to 5-11 is considered progress. Worse, the Browns closed really, really badly, not on a four-game winning streak like last year. Nobody made it rough on Holmgren.
This is the Holmgren era, not the Mangini era.
Yeah Shep look a little closer- the mighty turnaround Chiefs have played one team with a winning record. Shades of Anderceptions "miracle" 10-6. And the Rams aren't much better- they got blown out by 38 by the freaking Detroit Lions. The Browns have played seven of the ten teams with the best records in the NFL (2 of them twice- and beaten the Pats and Saints) so if you want to tell me the Rams and Chiefs would still be sporting those records if they had played the Browns murderers row, dream on. & FWIW, KC needed a pick 6 to beat the Browns.
And I wouldn't be so certain Holmgren is totally married into "his" system, and "his" guys.
Yeah Shep look a little closer- the mighty turnaround Chiefs have played one team with a winning record. Shades of Anderceptions "miracle" 10-6. And the Rams aren't much better- they got blown out by 38 by the freaking Detroit Lions. The Browns have played seven of the ten teams with the best records in the NFL (2 of them twice- and beaten the Pats and Saints) so if you want to tell me the Rams and Chiefs would still be sporting those records if they had played the Browns murderers row, dream on. & FWIW, KC needed a pick 6 to beat the Browns.
And I wouldn't be so certain Holmgren is totally married into "his" system, and "his" guys.
I made this same point 2 weeks ago, don't be surprised if your very good point gets ignored.
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Problem is, it's not Holmgren's style and Holmgren is the boss. The only way Walrus keeps rolling without his guys and his systems is if the Browns are winning. It looks like we'll go from 5-11 to 5-11. The Chiefs went from winning 10 games in three years to probably winning 11 in 2010. The Rams went from 1-15 to probably 8-8 and a division championship.
That's the league we play in... not one where 4-12 to 5-11 to 5-11 is considered progress. Worse, the Browns closed really, really badly, not on a four-game winning streak like last year. Nobody made it rough on Holmgren.
This is the Holmgren era, not the Mangini era.
Yeah Shep look a little closer- the mighty turnaround Chiefs have played one team with a winning record. Shades of Anderceptions "miracle" 10-6. And the Rams aren't much better- they got blown out by 38 by the freaking Detroit Lions. The Browns have played seven of the ten teams with the best records in the NFL (2 of them twice- and beaten the Pats and Saints) so if you want to tell me the Rams and Chiefs would still be sporting those records if they had played the Browns murderers row, dream on. & FWIW, KC needed a pick 6 to beat the Browns.
And I wouldn't be so certain Holmgren is totally married into "his" system, and "his" guys.
Yeah Shep look a little closer- the mighty turnaround Chiefs have played one team with a winning record. Shades of Anderceptions "miracle" 10-6. And the Rams aren't much better- they got blown out by 38 by the freaking Detroit Lions. The Browns have played seven of the ten teams with the best records in the NFL (2 of them twice- and beaten the Pats and Saints) so if you want to tell me the Rams and Chiefs would still be sporting those records if they had played the Browns murderers row, dream on. & FWIW, KC needed a pick 6 to beat the Browns.
And I wouldn't be so certain Holmgren is totally married into "his" system, and "his" guys.
He's a lifetime WCO guy. I have no testicles left to bet (meaning I should know better), but if I did, I'd bet on two things: Mangini is gone and we're running a WCO with McCoy next year. Holmgren won't fail in Cleveland with somebody else's systems. He bleeds WCO.
I get the variables, injuries and schedule. But in the end, nobody gives a shit about excuses, even valid ones. The Browns once again had one of the worst offenses in the NFL, something a Walsh disciple like Holmgren will not just live with.
From where I sit: Holmgren, WCO, McCoy, A.J. Green or Julio Jones. Other high level additions (draft and f/a): RT, DE, and LB. Four positions, two FA and the top two picks.
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