Underwhelmed
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I think Fewell is the only guy who would bring more passion and intensity to the Browns.
It's a bit odd that Ryan didn't/hasn't yet gotten an interview that we know of...
Ryan had quite a good defense a lot of times without having premier talent at lb, ...
I don't get the dedication to Eric Wright over Haden, though.
I'd hire Fewell. The other two more and more, remind me of Mangini's lack of intensity, at least on the sidelines...
I would have liked Mangini kept, but Dabol had to go. That, I think, was Mangini's downfall. Maybe Mangini didn't want to fire Dabol.
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I don't really like Shurmur as a HC candidate. He really only has this past year to show that he could be a HC. Even if he is another defensive guy, I think Fewell is the best option at present. As long as we get a good OC, I don't feel that a guy like Fewell would be a bad candidate.
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Cleveland will never be a complete team, the desire for the "winner" is so bad in Cleveland that no HC or set of FO people will ever have enough time to actually build it. That makes is REAL tough for the guys waiting around and hoping for that year after year awesome team. It takes time, but the city of Cleveland will never allow that time IMO.
If Holmgren had come out with a few strategically placed public statements in support of Mangini and company, I believe he could have bought the coach another year of fan support. It takes a strong person to stand up to the knuckleheads in the Cleveland media but I believe that could have been done. A good draft and some recruiting of vital talent would also have helped.
Now if Holmgren takes over the team himself as coach, that's another story but I'd be surprised. That's not why Lerner brought him in.
That's not why Lerner brought him in.
Lerner brought him into to bring a winner to Cleveland. I am pretty sure nothing was taken off the table when they hired Holmgren, and I am thinking Lerner probably wants Mike to take the job.
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No at least not yet kshutchins, holmgren obviously wants to try and make the next coach from scratch since no big names want or will coach here, and its on his clock..
If it works out we will all forget about the past ten years and look forward to the next 10 years and if not then nothing much was gained and nothing was lost because shurmur couldnt possibly be as bad as mangini from a gameday prospective..
I really hope this is it as fans we need some consistency as much as the players do but it has to be the right guy and there is very little on this shurmur guy but he seems to be as popular to many ram fans as dabs was to browns fans..
But on the otherhand the rams having spags as a HC would be similar to us having mangini and doesnt tell us much about shurmur as a leader of men....
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5-11 is 5-11
crappy playcalling is crappy playcalling
lots of empty seats in your stadium doesn't sell 'growth'
you are what your record says you are... mangini wasn't a bad guy or a bad coach, he just wasn't getting the job done. regardless of the talent or injuries aside, you have to win in the nfl to keep your job.
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5-11 is 5-11
crappy playcalling is crappy playcalling
lots of empty seats in your stadium doesn't sell 'growth'
you are what your record says you are... mangini wasn't a bad guy or a bad coach, he just wasn't getting the job done. regardless of the talent or injuries aside, you have to win in the nfl to keep your job.
5-11 is 5-11
crappy playcalling is crappy playcalling
lots of empty seats in your stadium doesn't sell 'growth'
you are what your record says you are... mangini wasn't a bad guy or a bad coach, he just wasn't getting the job done. regardless of the talent or injuries aside, you have to win in the nfl to keep your job.
Well then, Cribbs had a bad year means Cribbs sucks, Colt throwing 6 INT's no matter if they bounced off the hands of the TE's and WR's and being hit while he was throwing from lack of protection means Colt sucks. Black and white right?
If at first you dont succeed, skydiving is not for you. -
5-11 is 5-11
crappy playcalling is crappy playcalling
lots of empty seats in your stadium doesn't sell 'growth'
you are what your record says you are... mangini wasn't a bad guy or a bad coach, he just wasn't getting the job done. regardless of the talent or injuries aside, you have to win in the nfl to keep your job.
Well then, Cribbs had a bad year means Cribbs sucks, Colt throwing 6 INT's no matter if they bounced off the hands of the TE's and WR's and being hit while he was throwing from lack of protection means Colt sucks. Black and white right?
Well then, Cribbs had a bad year means Cribbs sucks,
BIG difference is Cribbs has shown excellence in a Browns uniform. We know he is good. We have seen what he is capable of.
Apples and oranges comparison.
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There are NOT any coaches who have interviewed for the job that are BETTER or even as GOOD as Mangini. I think it was a dumb move to fire him if Holmgren isn't going to coach himself.
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Well then, Cribbs had a bad year means Cribbs sucks,
BIG difference is Cribbs has shown excellence in a Browns uniform. We know he is good. We have seen what he is capable of.
Apples and oranges comparison.
BIG difference is Cribbs has shown excellence in a Browns uniform. We know he is good. We have seen what he is capable of.
Apples and oranges comparison.
Cant look at it that way, if 5-11 is 5-11, Cribbs bad year is Cribbs sucks. Black and white, thats the way of these guys...
If at first you dont succeed, skydiving is not for you. -
Is anyone else feeling that way about this coaching change? I would rather have kept Mangini. None of the candidates interviewed so far has impressed me one bit.
In "another forum" I was RIPPED to SHREDS because I said this was a stupid move. Yeah Holmgren is who is he is, yeah he has a major history in football. That means everything he says or does is perfect? NOPE! In fact, the guy has had losing seasons as well.......Cleveland will never be a complete team, the desire for the "winner" is so bad in Cleveland that no HC or set of FO people will ever have enough time to actually build it. That makes is REAL tough for the guys waiting around and hoping for that year after year awesome team. It takes time, but the city of Cleveland will never allow that time IMO.
Just frustrated, take it for what it is....
In "another forum" I was RIPPED to SHREDS because I said this was a stupid move. Yeah Holmgren is who is he is, yeah he has a major history in football. That means everything he says or does is perfect? NOPE! In fact, the guy has had losing seasons as well.......Cleveland will never be a complete team, the desire for the "winner" is so bad in Cleveland that no HC or set of FO people will ever have enough time to actually build it. That makes is REAL tough for the guys waiting around and hoping for that year after year awesome team. It takes time, but the city of Cleveland will never allow that time IMO.
Just frustrated, take it for what it is....
Agree 100% Holmgren may not want to coach but he wants to get credit for it if it comes. Mangini actually had the ship going in the right direction and then it was time to make another change. I've lost a lot of interest that isn't going to come back and I am about ready to just say SCREW IT and not bother following the nfl. I won't be a hypocrit and follow the steelers, just find something else to do with my time
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5-11 is 5-11
crappy playcalling is crappy playcalling
lots of empty seats in your stadium doesn't sell 'growth'
you are what your record says you are... mangini wasn't a bad guy or a bad coach, he just wasn't getting the job done. regardless of the talent or injuries aside, you have to win in the nfl to keep your job.
Well then, Cribbs had a bad year means Cribbs sucks, Colt throwing 6 INT's no matter if they bounced off the hands of the TE's and WR's and being hit while he was throwing from lack of protection means Colt sucks. Black and white right?
Well then, Cribbs had a bad year means Cribbs sucks, Colt throwing 6 INT's no matter if they bounced off the hands of the TE's and WR's and being hit while he was throwing from lack of protection means Colt sucks. Black and white right?
you think cribbs or colt can survive here with another year of numbers like this year?
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Well then, Cribbs had a bad year means Cribbs sucks, Colt throwing 6 INT's no matter if they bounced off the hands of the TE's and WR's and being hit while he was throwing from lack of protection means Colt sucks. Black and white right?
you think cribbs or colt can survive here with another year of numbers like this year?
you think cribbs or colt can survive here with another year of numbers like this year?
Did I say I actually think that? Im not the black and white kinda thinker, there has to be reasons for SOME of these results, others are not interested in the reasons.
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you think cribbs or colt can survive here with another year of numbers like this year?
Did I say I actually think that? Im not the black and white kinda thinker, there has to be reasons for SOME of these results, others are not interested in the reasons.
Did I say I actually think that? Im not the black and white kinda thinker, there has to be reasons for SOME of these results, others are not interested in the reasons.
i wasn't trying to put you in a corner on it,
but glossing over losing seasons with 'reasons' is the equivelent to stalling.
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How do we know the next coach isn't better than Mangini? John Harbaugh and Mike Smith weren't sexy picks, but they look pretty damn smart now. The coach that's "better than Mangini" is the coach that tops his 5-11 high water mark, period. Not that tough.
This is Holmgren's team. The sense at OBR is exactly what I've been saying, that he's absolutely going to do things his way with people who run his systems and he won't be "hands off" in any way, shape or form. He won't take on the 15 hour days of a head coach but he'll be pulling all the strings. Considering Mangini is NEVER mentioned in the same breath with Holmgren, well... that's a HUGE upgrade.
That means two guys make sense: Shurmur and Mornhinweg... and the latter hasn't been interviewed. There's also Mike Sherman getting some light play, but I think Holmgren likes that Shurmur is "fresh" and only 45, and won't object to being mentored. I also expect our new DC to be a bit sage, like John Fox, to help support Shurmur.
I'm totally down with all of this. I think everybody else will be pretty soon. I love Heckert at GM and I like the idea of Holmgren finally making the Browns HIS team.
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How do we know the next coach isn't better than Mangini? John Harbaugh and Mike Smith weren't sexy picks, but they look pretty damn smart now. The coach that's "better than Mangini" is the coach that tops his 5-11 high water mark, period. Not that tough.
This is Holmgren's team. The sense at OBR is exactly what I've been saying, that he's absolutely going to do things his way with people who run his systems and he won't be "hands off" in any way, shape or form. He won't take on the 15 hour days of a head coach but he'll be pulling all the strings. Considering Mangini is NEVER mentioned in the same breath with Holmgren, well... that's a HUGE upgrade.
That means two guys make sense: Shurmur and Mornhinweg... and the latter hasn't been interviewed. There's also Mike Sherman getting some light play, but I think Holmgren likes that Shurmur is "fresh" and only 45, and won't object to being mentored. I also expect our new DC to be a bit sage, like John Fox, to help support Shurmur.
I'm totally down with all of this. I think everybody else will be pretty soon. I love Heckert at GM and I like the idea of Holmgren finally making the Browns HIS team.
How do we know the next coach isn't better than Mangini? John Harbaugh and Mike Smith weren't sexy picks, but they look pretty damn smart now. The coach that's "better than Mangini" is the coach that tops his 5-11 high water mark, period. Not that tough.
This is Holmgren's team. The sense at OBR is exactly what I've been saying, that he's absolutely going to do things his way with people who run his systems and he won't be "hands off" in any way, shape or form. He won't take on the 15 hour days of a head coach but he'll be pulling all the strings. Considering Mangini is NEVER mentioned in the same breath with Holmgren, well... that's a HUGE upgrade.
That means two guys make sense: Shurmur and Mornhinweg... and the latter hasn't been interviewed. There's also Mike Sherman getting some light play, but I think Holmgren likes that Shurmur is "fresh" and only 45, and won't object to being mentored. I also expect our new DC to be a bit sage, like John Fox, to help support Shurmur.
I'm totally down with all of this. I think everybody else will be pretty soon. I love Heckert at GM and I like the idea of Holmgren finally making the Browns HIS team.
Thank you, Mrs. Holmgren!
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Is anyone else feeling that way about this coaching change? I would rather have kept Mangini. None of the candidates interviewed so far has impressed me one bit.
Is anyone else feeling that way about this coaching change? I would rather have kept Mangini. None of the candidates interviewed so far has impressed me one bit.
Yep. I think it was a dumb move. Furthermore, we can pretty much kiss Gruden coming here goodbye as I heard on the radio this morning that he is staying with ESPN. GO FIGURE! Every time since this team has returned in 1999 we have been told to trust_____________(insert name). What works elsewhere, does not mean it is going to work in Cleveland! No I don't trust Holmgren, because we've been down this road before with previous regimes! Where has it gotten us? This is just down right sad if you ask me. We're going to end up stuck with another "head coach in training" where instead they could have kept Mangini who had experience prior to coming to Cleveland, and with another draft or two we could have been all right. Now I'm not so sure. I hope they get this right. The Cleveland sports scene is a complete mess right now, and we need SOMEONE to step up! The Cavs are unwatchable, and I'm pretty sure that the Indians are going to continue to be the farm team for other major league baseball teams, as it looks like the Dolans have no intentions of spending the money to put together a contender. I don't mean to be negative (maybe it's the shitty weather playing into it) but it's just very disappointing.
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Cant look at it that way, if 5-11 is 5-11, Cribbs bad year is Cribbs sucks. Black and white, thats the way of these guys...
You're dreaming if you think Browns fans aren't smarter than that.
You guys are making Mangini out to be much smarter than he is. Take one person out of the equation - Peyton Hillis - and we win 2 games max.
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In "another forum" I was RIPPED to SHREDS because I said this was a stupid move. Yeah Holmgren is who is he is, yeah he has a major history in football. That means everything he says or does is perfect? NOPE! In fact, the guy has had losing seasons as well.......Cleveland will never be a complete team, the desire for the "winner" is so bad in Cleveland that no HC or set of FO people will ever have enough time to actually build it. That makes is REAL tough for the guys waiting around and hoping for that year after year awesome team. It takes time, but the city of Cleveland will never allow that time IMO.
Just frustrated, take it for what it is....
Agree 100% Holmgren may not want to coach but he wants to get credit for it if it comes. Mangini actually had the ship going in the right direction and then it was time to make another change. I've lost a lot of interest that isn't going to come back and I am about ready to just say SCREW IT and not bother following the nfl. I won't be a hypocrit and follow the steelers, just find something else to do with my time
Agree 100% Holmgren may not want to coach but he wants to get credit for it if it comes. Mangini actually had the ship going in the right direction and then it was time to make another change. I've lost a lot of interest that isn't going to come back and I am about ready to just say SCREW IT and not bother following the nfl. I won't be a hypocrit and follow the steelers, just find something else to do with my time
I think alot of us are kind of feeling the same way. I guess we are fair weather fans.....even though it took me over 50 years of passionate fandom to get to this point. There is nothing, really to make me think Holmgren is committed to making this team a winner. While I wanted Mangini to return for at least one more season, I would have been okay with it, if there was a better option. I don't think Holmgren will coach, just because of the risk that it will damage his reputation....to fail here. Hiring somebody else, he can always place the blame elsewhere next season when we go 5 - 11 again. He wouldn't do that publicly....he would take the blame and say that he is ultimately responsible, but most of the fans would just blame the coach....as usual. Maybe I'm wrong about Holmgren...I sure hope so....but based on what I'm seeing and hearing regarding his search for a HC., I'm not impressed. In fact....I was more excited about Romeo Crennel as HC, than I am about any of these guys. Like I said....I hope I'm wrong.
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How do we know the next coach isn't better than Mangini? John Harbaugh and Mike Smith weren't sexy picks, but they look pretty damn smart now. The coach that's "better than Mangini" is the coach that tops his 5-11 high water mark, period. Not that tough.
This is Holmgren's team. The sense at OBR is exactly what I've been saying, that he's absolutely going to do things his way with people who run his systems and he won't be "hands off" in any way, shape or form. He won't take on the 15 hour days of a head coach but he'll be pulling all the strings. Considering Mangini is NEVER mentioned in the same breath with Holmgren, well... that's a HUGE upgrade.
That means two guys make sense: Shurmur and Mornhinweg... and the latter hasn't been interviewed. There's also Mike Sherman getting some light play, but I think Holmgren likes that Shurmur is "fresh" and only 45, and won't object to being mentored. I also expect our new DC to be a bit sage, like John Fox, to help support Shurmur.
I'm totally down with all of this. I think everybody else will be pretty soon. I love Heckert at GM and I like the idea of Holmgren finally making the Browns HIS team.
How do we know the next coach isn't better than Mangini? John Harbaugh and Mike Smith weren't sexy picks, but they look pretty damn smart now. The coach that's "better than Mangini" is the coach that tops his 5-11 high water mark, period. Not that tough.
Shep, you know it isn't just looking at the record. The schedule will be easier next year. McCoy will have a full off season to polish his skills. If it weren't for Fujita and Robaire being injured we would probably have had a couple of extra wins. Bring in a new guy with our schedule next year and 7-9 or 8-8 is equivalent. 8-8 might be a slight improvement. But, I would have expected at least 8-8 from mangini next year and actually would have given him an ultimatum.
Holmgren didn't like mangini's style and it is his team. He now owns everything and will be fired if this doesn't work.
But, Holmgren probably bought some time. There will be posturing "We need to run a 4-3 to be champions and because of the past years with mangini it will take some time to switch. blah blah blah"
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Cant look at it that way, if 5-11 is 5-11, Cribbs bad year is Cribbs sucks. Black and white, thats the way of these guys...
You're dreaming if you think Browns fans aren't smarter than that.
You guys are making Mangini out to be much smarter than he is. Take one person out of the equation - Peyton Hillis - and we win 2 games max.
You're dreaming if you think Browns fans aren't smarter than that.
You guys are making Mangini out to be much smarter than he is. Take one person out of the equation - Peyton Hillis - and we win 2 games max.
Who wanted Hillis? Hmmm?
If at first you dont succeed, skydiving is not for you.
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