Possible Oc
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Since it has been proclaimed from on high that next year the Browns will have an offensive coordinators, I surmise to list a few potential candidates for this position. These are all "West Coast guys" so they should fit the scheme these yabos want to run:
Steve Mariucci currently with NFL network. May want a HC job if he goes back to coaching.
Scott Linehan OC of the Lions, so he probably won't move laterally
Jack Del Rio Unemployed
Mike Tice OL coach of the Bears
Brad Childress ???, I think unemployed, or he may be coaching at the FCS college level
Bill Callahan OL coach of the Jets
Tom Cable. OL coach of the Seahawks
All are former HCs. Other than Linehan an OC job would be a promotion for them, football wise.
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GOOD GRIEF
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that's a pretty shitty list.
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If Andy Reid gets fired I think things could get interesting. Maybe someone from that staff?
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if thats the only coaches he get to choose from we are even more fucked!!!!
if Reid got fired, Shurmer would be fired 30 seconds later and 30 seconds after that Reid would be the next Browns coach. It will not happen, but just sayin
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@king-ghoolie-lives said:
Hey, we agree on something. NOw wait, are you saying it SHOULD be, or WILL BE, an up and comer?
I want someone in the mold of Sam Rutigliano.
Ghoolie,for once we agree...I always loved the way Gamblin Sam ran offense....other than Infante the browns havent had an OC worth a fuck since.
Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~ -
Zombo said:
Del Rio is a defensive guy, the rest are washed up. It"ll be a young up and comer ...
Z
Certainly that could be the case. I just don't have any way of identifying who that "young up and comer" may be. Do you have any names?
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@king-ghoolie-lives said:
Hey, we agree on something. NOw wait, are you saying it SHOULD be, or WILL BE, an up and comer?
I want someone in the mold of Sam Rutigliano.
Ghoolie,for once we agree...I always loved the way Gamblin Sam ran offense....other than Infante the browns havent had an OC worth a fuck since.
Ghoolie,for once we agree...I always loved the way Gamblin Sam ran offense....other than Infante the browns havent had an OC worth a fuck since.
Except that with Holmgren here any OC we get will HAVE to be a WCO purist. I listed the names I listed because they all come from the Bill Walsh coaching tree. Obviously Shurmur is from a branch off that tree. And whoever the OC is going to be will be a little bud off that tree....unless it is one of the "old-timers" that I named above. The Primary reason that Mangini was let go was not because he lost games, but because he came from the Parcells/Belichick tree and not from the Walsh tree. Holmgren wanted a Walsh protege and nothing else would do.
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A new OC will have be a sprout from this:
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Mike Sherman was fired recently.
Mike Sherman was fired recently.
That's who I was going to say.
He has the background. It would be a great selection.
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Gip, you're all around one of the top posters on this board and i'm not calling you out at all but I'm so damn tired of this coaching tree stuff. I understand that for some reason guys like Holmgren hold it in some magical regard, but a coach should be hired based on how good or bad he is and how he fits for the team. Sure learning under top guys is great, but plenty of people learn under guys and still aren't good coaches for teams.
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Gip, you're all around one of the top posters on this board and i'm not calling you out at all but I'm so damn tired of this coaching tree stuff. I understand that for some reason guys like Holmgren hold it in some magical regard, but a coach should be hired based on how good or bad he is and how he fits for the team. Sure learning under top guys is great, but plenty of people learn under guys and still aren't good coaches for teams.
Gip, you're all around one of the top posters on this board and i'm not calling you out at all but I'm so damn tired of this coaching tree stuff. I understand that for some reason guys like Holmgren hold it in some magical regard, but a coach should be hired based on how good or bad he is and how he fits for the team. Sure learning under top guys is great, but plenty of people learn under guys and still aren't good coaches for teams.
I understand what you are saying, but the fact of the matter is...it is the guys that do the hiring that DO take this coaching tree business seriously. Is there any doubt in your mind that Shurmur is here not because he was by far the best candidate for the job but because he was a bud on a branch of the Walsh/Holmgren tree?
And another factor is that I believe a lot of these "Walsh/Holmgren tree" guys are represented by the same agent, a guy named Bob Lamonte, who represents Holmgren, Heckert and other Browns front office types.
So, essentially the hiring of Shurmur was simply a backscratching.....or you could say, an incestuous arrangement. It is also why Shurmur isn't going anywhere after this season:
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2011/01/pat_shurmurs_hiring_widens_nfl.html
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the only person on that walsh tree that even barely sniffed of a usable OC would be billick. and with his association to baltimore we all know how good that would go over in ctown. besides it would be like a demotion to these guys that were once HCes.
get an up and comer HC from college who runs something like what holmgren wants here.....even though i think the WCO is played.
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the only person on that walsh tree that even barely sniffed of a usable OC would be billick. and with his association to baltimore we all know how good that would go over in ctown. besides it would be like a demotion to these guys that were once HCes.
get an up and comer HC from college who runs something like what holmgren wants here.....even though i think the WCO is played.
the only person on that walsh tree that even barely sniffed of a usable OC would be billick. and with his association to baltimore we all know how good that would go over in ctown. besides it would be like a demotion to these guys that were once HCes.
get an up and comer HC from college who runs something like what holmgren wants here.....even though i think the WCO is played.
Rather than a college guy it would probably be something like an offensiver line coach, a WR coach, a RB coach or a QB coach.
And as mentioned above, it better be a Bob Lamonte client. Here are some other possibilities, clients of Lamonte:
Yes, Mike Sherman, now unemployed
In fact, he may be the only other guy on the list. I was going to say Mike Heimerdinger former OC of the Titans, but OOPs....he died of cancer in September.
The other one was Mike Singletary.....but he is a defensive coach. The only thing about Singletary is that his personality would be good counterbalance to the dullness of Murmur.
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Gip, you're all around one of the top posters on this board and i'm not calling you out at all but I'm so damn tired of this coaching tree stuff. I understand that for some reason guys like Holmgren hold it in some magical regard, but a coach should be hired based on how good or bad he is and how he fits for the team. Sure learning under top guys is great, but plenty of people learn under guys and still aren't good coaches for teams.
I understand what you are saying, but the fact of the matter is...it is the guys that do the hiring that DO take this coaching tree business seriously. Is there any doubt in your mind that Shurmur is here not because he was by far the best candidate for the job but because he was a bud on a branch of the Walsh/Holmgren tree?
And another factor is that I believe a lot of these "Walsh/Holmgren tree" guys are represented by the same agent, a guy named Bob Lamonte, who represents Holmgren, Heckert and other Browns front office types.
So, essentially the hiring of Shurmur was simply a backscratching.....or you could say, an incestuous arrangement. It is also why Shurmur isn't going anywhere after this season:
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2011/01/pat_shurmurs_hiring_widens_nfl.html
I understand what you are saying, but the fact of the matter is...it is the guys that do the hiring that DO take this coaching tree business seriously. Is there any doubt in your mind that Shurmur is here not because he was by far the best candidate for the job but because he was a bud on a branch of the Walsh/Holmgren tree?
And another factor is that I believe a lot of these "Walsh/Holmgren tree" guys are represented by the same agent, a guy named Bob Lamonte, who represents Holmgren, Heckert and other Browns front office types.
So, essentially the hiring of Shurmur was simply a backscratching.....or you could say, an incestuous arrangement. It is also why Shurmur isn't going anywhere after this season:
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2011/01/pat_shurmurs_hiring_widens_nfl.html
yea I hear you. It's just sad it's like that because you're 100% right on the last part. Shurmer was a hire due largely to this great tree of wisdom and right now he looks like he couldn't coach a high school team to wins. I do think as much as i dislike him as a coach think he should get at least one more year, no coach unless you go 0-16 deserves the axe after a season especially with all that happened.
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Here is Sherman's "resume" of sorts:
After Packers head coach Mike Holmgren resigned to accept the Seattle Seahawks head coach position, Holmgren hired Sherman to become the offensive coordinator for the 1999 season.
[edit] Green Bay PackersIn his six-year head coaching career with the Packers from 2000β05, Sherman compiled a 57β39 regular season record and a 2β4 postseason record. Sherman had used the West Coast Offense offensive strategy at Green Bay.[8][9]
In 2000, Sherman became the head coach of the Green Bay Packers. He led the Packers to five consecutive winning seasons from 2000β04. From 2002β2004, he led the Packers to three consecutive NFC North Division titles. From 2000β04, he compiled a 53β27 record, and a .663 winning percentage, which was the second highest in Packers history, trailing that of Vince Lombardi's, who is one of the most successful coaches in the history of football. Additionally, Green Bay and the Philadelphia Eagles were the only two teams to make the playoffs for four consecutive seasons from 2001β04.
An offensive-minded coach, Sherman led the Packers to break franchise records for rushing in 2003 and passing in 2004. In 2003, Packers quarterback Brett Favre led the NFL in touchdown passes, in addition to setting a franchise record for rushing yardage. The 2003 team also gained a total of 442 points, which is the third most in franchise history (461 in 2009, 456 in 1996, when the team won the Super Bowl).
Despite receiving a contract extension earlier in the 2005 season, Sherman was fired by the Packers on January 2, 2006, after compiling a 4β12 record β Green Bay's first losing record since the 1991 season. The Packers had lost pro bowlers Javon Walker, Bubba Franks and Ahman Green to Injured Reserve early in the season.[10]
[edit] General managerSherman succeeded Ron Wolf as General Manager of the Packers in 2001, taking on the dual role of Head Coach and General Manager. Although the promotion of Sherman to GM was made prior to the 2001 NFL Draft, Wolf handled the actual draft duty in 2001. Sherman brought in 3 of the core players that were on the Packers 2010 roster. He drafted Nick Barnett (2003 Rd 1 #29), Scott Wells, (2004 Rd 7 #251 - complimentary pick), and acquired Cullen Jenkins as a rookie free agent after the 2003 draft.
Sherman's 1st solo draft pick as GM & in charge of the draft was Javon Walker in 2002, who made the Pro Bowl in 2004, and was traded to the Denver Broncos in 2006.
In 2005 the Packers hired Ted Thompson from the Seattle Seahawks to take over Sherman's General Manager duties, although Sherman remained the Packers' head coach for one more season.
[edit] Houston TexansThe Houston Texans hired Sherman as the assistant head coach/offense coach on February 15, 2006. On January 17, 2007, he was promoted to offensive coordinator, and remained as assistant head coach. In the 2006 season, the Texans' regular season offense ranked 28th out of 32 NFL teams.[11] In the 2007 season, Sherman's first year as the offensive coordinator, the Texans' regular season offense improved to a ranking of 14.[12]
The Texans finished the 2006 season with a 6β10 record. In 2007, they finished 8β8.
And FYI, he is "only" 56 years old. So he is really not by any means over the hill as a coach.
So, ballpeen is right, he may be the perfect candidate.
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I hear what Ghoolie and Zombo are saying about wanting the new OC to be a young "up and comer", but, in actuality don't you think that role is filled by Shurmur himself, more or less? To me, Shurmur looks like he needs help from someone with experience. Someone with a track record. Sherman could fill that bill. Unless you can come up with a better candidate.
One thing is for Shur, Sher, Shur, Sher...this team needs help offensively from some quarter.
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