The Final Proof Of Oline Value
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Hint: What offensive line kicked the Pittspuke butts in the playoffs this year? Answer: Does anybody think Tebow is an "elite qb" ?????
Hereis the offensive line for Denver, with their one wr
...
bookend tackles. Solid bigtime center. Solid LG. To find a fa to fill in at RG is a cool thing. But that doesn't work
for bookend tackles. Those are hard to find. That's why they draft them high.
So, Tim Tebow TEBOW"ED the egg-sucking weasel Pittspuke girliemen.
Offensive line gave him a ton of good protection. Tebow torched the squeelers for 316 yards. Does anybody think Tebow is a Peyton? Or Brady?
Come on, man. The offensive line is the engine of the car. The qb is the all important steering wheel.
The remaining cast are the tires. But with no good offensive line, the car loses the race, no matter how outstanding
the steering wheel is. @@
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LEFT TACKLE
Ryan Clady #78 Tackle Denver Broncos Height: 6-6 Weight: 315
Born: Sep 6, 1986 - Long Beach, CA
College: Boise State
Draft: 2008 - 1st round (12th pick) by the Denver Broncos
LEFT GUARD
Zane Beadles #68 Guard Denver Broncos Team Home
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Born: Nov 19, 1986 - Casper, WY
College: Utah
Draft: 2010 - 2nd round (13th pick) by the Denver Broncos
CENTER
J.D. Walton #50 Center Denver Broncos Team Home
NewsTeam ReportBlogsScores & ScheduleStatsRosterDepth ChartTransactionsPhotosHeight: 6-3 Weight: 305
Born: Mar 24, 1987 - Lawton, OK
College: Baylor
Draft: 2010 - 3rd round (16th pick) by the Denver Broncos
RIGHT GUARD (fa)
Russ Hochstein #71 Guard Denver Broncos Team Home
NewsTeam ReportBlogsScores & ScheduleStatsRosterDepth ChartTransactionsPhotosHeight: 6-4 Weight: 300
Born: Oct 7, 1977 - Hartington, NE
College: Nebraska
Draft: 2001 - 5th round (20th pick) by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
RIGHT TACKLE
Orlando Franklin #74 Tackle Denver Broncos Team Home
NewsTeam ReportBlogsScores & ScheduleStatsRosterDepth ChartTransactionsPhotosHeight: 6-7 Weight: 330
Born: Dec 16, 1987 - Delray Beach, FL
College: Miami (FL)
Draft: 2011 - 2nd round (14th pick) by the Denver Broncos
Demaryius Thomas #88 Wide Receiver Denver Broncos Team Home
NewsTeam ReportBlogsScores & ScheduleStatsRosterDepth ChartTransactionsPhotosHeight: 6-3 Weight: 235
Born: Dec 25, 1987 - Dublin, GA
College: Georgia Tech
Draft: 2010 - 1st round (22nd pick) by the Denver Broncos
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It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs.
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Ryan Clady plays both LG and LT?
That's a hell of a player.
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It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs.
jparsh said:
It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs.
The Patriots probably have the best offensive line in football as far as pass protection goes, and their guys have big contracts. I'm not sure about every pick they got drafted at, but I know Mankins was 1st round pick(32nd).
I'd rather they get OL in the 2nd and 3rd though, as well as through FA.
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I'm not trying to argue the point of having a good O line is important, but were those the same guys that Orton had when they shit the bed early in the season? Both Orton and Tebow aren't elite but Orton can at least throw a spiral.
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Tebow is a good football player, I don't care if some of his throws aren't perfect spirals.
Bookmark this thread, do whatever, I don't care, the Broncos(or whichever team gets him in the future) WILL win a superbowl at some point with Tim Tebow.
T:T baby.
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An O line is important, no doubt. But it's tough to justify 1st round linemen unless they're your LT. I guess a center can be thrown in there as well, but they tend to be more late 1st round usually. If you have a cohesive unit that works on a string with one another, than your talent at oline doesn't have to be tremendous. Our line was considered bad but even they started playing better at the end of the year when they had time together.
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It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs. jparsh
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LOL. No, I don't get drunk on root beer. @@ But guard dawg heard coyotes off in the distance, and woke me up barking like crazy, so I rebuilt the fire in
the fireplace, and got online. Of course the Browns have some high draft picks on their oline. The point is, offensive RIGHT GUARD and RIGHT TACKLE.
It doesn't work well with only one half of the oline working.
The point is, Tebow TEBOWed the DEFENSE of the squeelers, not the offense with injuries. The defense was fine, despite one safety not playing. The point is,
the Bronco's oline handled the squeeler defense, after getting themselves into the playoffs.... with a qb that most figure is NOT "elite" by any stretch.
Miss the point if you want to, but it's true. Even a TEBOW can play an excellent defense and win, with the oline established to do the job.
Or, do you think Tebow is Peyton?
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Ryan Clady plays both LG and LT?
That's a hell of a player. Tim Couch
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Okay, that's funny. I misclicked. I fixed it. The Broncos LOG was only a second round pick by them.
That is bookend tackles. Check around the NFL - successful teams have bookend tackles, who seal off the edges.
Only one edge, and you have the Browns. Two ends to the offensive line.
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An O line is important, no doubt. But it's tough to justify 1st round linemen unless they're your LT. I guess a center can be thrown in there as well, but they tend to be more late 1st round usually. If you have a cohesive unit that works on a string with one another, than your talent at oline doesn't have to be tremendous. Our line was considered bad but even they started playing better at the end of the year when they had time together. J
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I'm not saying RT should be a 1st rounder. Just that the Broncos paid serious attention to the right side. I don't care if it's third round, or fifth. But the tackles are at a premium
with so many speed rushers out there. Left side tackles/blind side especially.
The guy I picked in the third round of my stupid mock draft, is the last guy I saw on the lists that would probably do great at RT for the Browns as a starter.
But, Hicks did a very nice job playing RT for injured Pashos.
Pashos could backup nicely at OG and ROT as a veteran, but he was outquicked badly many times this season, and play after play was blown up.
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It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs. jparsh
*************************************************
LOL. No, I don't get drunk on root beer. @@ But guard dawg heard coyotes off in the distance, and woke me up barking like crazy, so I rebuilt the fire in
the fireplace, and got online. Of course the Browns have some high draft picks on their oline. The point is, offensive RIGHT GUARD and RIGHT TACKLE.
It doesn't work well with only one half of the oline working.
The point is, Tebow TEBOWed the DEFENSE of the squeelers, not the offense with injuries. The defense was fine, despite one safety not playing. The point is,
the Bronco's oline handled the squeeler defense, after getting themselves into the playoffs.... with a qb that most figure is NOT "elite" by any stretch.
Miss the point if you want to, but it's true. Even a TEBOW can play an excellent defense and win, with the oline established to do the job.
Or, do you think Tebow is Peyton?
It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs. jparsh
*************************************************
LOL. No, I don't get drunk on root beer. @@ But guard dawg heard coyotes off in the distance, and woke me up barking like crazy, so I rebuilt the fire in
the fireplace, and got online. Of course the Browns have some high draft picks on their oline. The point is, offensive RIGHT GUARD and RIGHT TACKLE.
It doesn't work well with only one half of the oline working.
The point is, Tebow TEBOWed the DEFENSE of the squeelers, not the offense with injuries. The defense was fine, despite one safety not playing. The point is,
the Bronco's oline handled the squeeler defense, after getting themselves into the playoffs.... with a qb that most figure is NOT "elite" by any stretch.
Miss the point if you want to, but it's true. Even a TEBOW can play an excellent defense and win, with the oline established to do the job.
Or, do you think Tebow is Peyton?
What kind of rootbeer? I'll only drink Virgils, the best rootbeer you can buy.
I got your point, you equated a good oline with winning playoff games. I disagreed with you. A good oline is nice, no doubt but it's not the end all be all. And I also said that the Steelers would have won the game if not for some injuries. Would you have still listed off a group of high round offensive linemen if the Broncos lost but managed to put up 20 points? Everything comes down to winning and losing, so I doubt this would even be a thread if the Broncos lost the game 30-20.
We need playmakers, at the QB position and WR position. RB's are a dime a dozen, just plug in a solid guy and you'll be fine. We've already got a few good TE's. And our line started playing better at the end of the year. I suspect that a single change at RT should equal a pretty damn good line for the Browns.
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It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs.
jparsh said:
It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs.
Ya on one side of the line and Steinbach didn't play this season less you forgot. I don't think we need to be using anymore 1st round picks on linemen, at least for a while. But it is important to find GOOD o linemen either in FA or in the middle of the draft. The 7th round journey many Pashos is not cutting it.
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Virgils root beer? Never heard of it. Now I'm missing out. dammit. I ususally like Barq's, or Frosttop. Now I have to try Virgils...
You said:
"I got your point, you equated a good oline with winning playoff games"
Not by itself, for cryin out loud. I also listed Thomas, wr, drafted in the first round. Their other wr was a 3rd rounder.
I've just been saying, that you don't have to have an elite qb to win games, but you have to have that surrounding cast,
The offensive line for the Browns needs a RT. Desperately. They need an elite, burner, star wr who catches everything thrown to him.
And a bigtime rb. They don't have to be first round picks. But they have to be able to do what the offense needs them to do.
The Browns, most years since 99, ignored the offensive line badly in drafts. And all the losing seasons show it.
Can run, can't pass protect. The wr's, qb, and rb's must have the blocking. And Denver had it. Go back and watch how much time
Tebow had on a whole lot of his throws.
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Virgils root beer? Never heard of it. Now I'm missing out. dammit. I ususally like Barq's, or Frosttop. Now I have to try Virgils...
You said:
"I got your point, you equated a good oline with winning playoff games"
Not by itself, for cryin out loud. I also listed Thomas, wr, drafted in the first round. Their other wr was a 3rd rounder.
I've just been saying, that you don't have to have an elite qb to win games, but you have to have that surrounding cast,
The offensive line for the Browns needs a RT. Desperately. They need an elite, burner, star wr who catches everything thrown to him.
And a bigtime rb. They don't have to be first round picks. But they have to be able to do what the offense needs them to do.
The Browns, most years since 99, ignored the offensive line badly in drafts. And all the losing seasons show it.
Can run, can't pass protect. The wr's, qb, and rb's must have the blocking. And Denver had it. Go back and watch how much time
Tebow had on a whole lot of his throws.
Virgils root beer? Never heard of it. Now I'm missing out. dammit. I ususally like Barq's, or Frosttop. Now I have to try Virgils...
You said:
"I got your point, you equated a good oline with winning playoff games"
Not by itself, for cryin out loud. I also listed Thomas, wr, drafted in the first round. Their other wr was a 3rd rounder.
I've just been saying, that you don't have to have an elite qb to win games, but you have to have that surrounding cast,
The offensive line for the Browns needs a RT. Desperately. They need an elite, burner, star wr who catches everything thrown to him.
And a bigtime rb. They don't have to be first round picks. But they have to be able to do what the offense needs them to do.
The Browns, most years since 99, ignored the offensive line badly in drafts. And all the losing seasons show it.
Can run, can't pass protect. The wr's, qb, and rb's must have the blocking. And Denver had it. Go back and watch how much time
Tebow had on a whole lot of his throws.
Look at the top 10 RB's and see how many of those teams are in the playoffs, then go look at the top 10 QB's and see how many of them are in the playoffs. I think it's something like 9 out of the 12 playoff teams have top 10 QB's. With RB's, I think it's something like 4 of the 12 playoff teams have top 10 running backs. Same goes for wide outs, most of the playoff teams don't have top WR's. The glue that binds the elite teams are in fact, elite QB's.
And I watched most of the game, as much of the game as I could watch over my fiances grandmother house with her 19in SD tv with rabbit eras
I know Tebow had time. I could be wrong, I don't know the Steelers official game plan, but if I had to guess I'd say that they were purposely not being overly aggressive in order to contain Tebow. If you had a choice of letting Tebow beat you with his arm or legs, you choose his arm. -
Go look at the top ten offensive lines......
look at the offensive lines of the top ten qb's and rb's.....
You need the pieces in place to get the job done. And the big guys who lead the way are not to be ignored.
Even Jim Brown gave all the credit in the world to his offensive line. The Browns will draft a RT in the third or fourth rounds, I thinkl.
Or, they will sign one.... just fix the problem over there. Add elite wr, killer rb, rt, and watch the Browns offense starting kicking arse..
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Go look at the top ten offensive lines......
look at the offensive lines of the top ten qb's and rb's.....
You need the pieces in place to get the job done. And the big guys who lead the way are not to be ignored.
Even Jim Brown gave all the credit in the world to his offensive line. The Browns will draft a RT in the third or fourth rounds, I thinkl.
Or, they will sign one.... just fix the problem over there. Add elite wr, killer rb, rt, and watch the Browns offense starting kicking arse..
Go look at the top ten offensive lines......
look at the offensive lines of the top ten qb's and rb's.....
You need the pieces in place to get the job done. And the big guys who lead the way are not to be ignored.
Even Jim Brown gave all the credit in the world to his offensive line. The Browns will draft a RT in the third or fourth rounds, I thinkl.
Or, they will sign one.... just fix the problem over there. Add elite wr, killer rb, rt, and watch the Browns offense starting kicking arse..
You are undeniably right about a line being important. I'm just saying not important enough to use 5 1st and 2nd round picks on them. In my perfect football world the LT would be the only 1st rounder taken. Center and possibly RT could be 2nd round. Then the guards would be 3rd at the highest.
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Virgils root beer? Never heard of it. Now I'm missing out. dammit. I ususally like Barq's, or Frosttop. Now I have to try Virgils...
You said:
"I got your point, you equated a good oline with winning playoff games"
Not by itself, for cryin out loud. I also listed Thomas, wr, drafted in the first round. Their other wr was a 3rd rounder.
I've just been saying, that you don't have to have an elite qb to win games, but you have to have that surrounding cast,
The offensive line for the Browns needs a RT. Desperately. They need an elite, burner, star wr who catches everything thrown to him.
And a bigtime rb. They don't have to be first round picks. But they have to be able to do what the offense needs them to do.
The Browns, most years since 99, ignored the offensive line badly in drafts. And all the losing seasons show it.
Can run, can't pass protect. The wr's, qb, and rb's must have the blocking. And Denver had it. Go back and watch how much time
Tebow had on a whole lot of his throws.
Look at the top 10 RB's and see how many of those teams are in the playoffs, then go look at the top 10 QB's and see how many of them are in the playoffs. I think it's something like 9 out of the 12 playoff teams have top 10 QB's. With RB's, I think it's something like 4 of the 12 playoff teams have top 10 running backs. Same goes for wide outs, most of the playoff teams don't have top WR's. The glue that binds the elite teams are in fact, elite QB's.
And I watched most of the game, as much of the game as I could watch over my fiances grandmother house with her 19in SD tv with rabbit eras
I know Tebow had time. I could be wrong, I don't know the Steelers official game plan, but if I had to guess I'd say that they were purposely not being overly aggressive in order to contain Tebow. If you had a choice of letting Tebow beat you with his arm or legs, you choose his arm.jparsh said:
Look at the top 10 RB's and see how many of those teams are in the playoffs, then go look at the top 10 QB's and see how many of them are in the playoffs. I think it's something like 9 out of the 12 playoff teams have top 10 QB's. With RB's, I think it's something like 4 of the 12 playoff teams have top 10 running backs. Same goes for wide outs, most of the playoff teams don't have top WR's. The glue that binds the elite teams are in fact, elite QB's.
I would argue that only 5 playoff teams have elite QBs: Packers, Patriots, Giants, Steelers, and the Saints. Flacco is the only other QB (that isn't elite) that has even won a playoff game (Ok Yates did this past weekend but someone had to win).
Every team needs a franchise QB to win a Superbowl with few exceptions. But to give all the credit to the QBs and ignore the great WRs, RBs, and OL on these teams is pretty ridiculous. You think most playoff teams have only a great QB and no supporting cast (and this is not including defensive playmakers)?
Packers: Greg Jennings, Jordy Nelson, and Jermichael Finley (plus OL is full of 1st and 2nd rounders)
Saints: Marques Colston, Jimmy Graham, Robert Meachem, and Sproles (plus a very good OL)
Patriots: Rob Gronkowski, Wes Welker, and Aaron Hernandez (and outstanding offensive line)
Ravens: Anquan Boldin, Torrey Smith, Ray Rice and Vonta Leach
Giants: Hakeem Nicks, Victor Cruz, and Jake Ballard (Jacobs and Bradshaw help set up playaction)
Steelers: Mike Wallace, Antonio Brown, and Rashard Mendenhall (Isaac Redman is great backup RB)
Texans: Andre Johnson, Arian Foster, and Ben Tate
Lions: Calvin Johnson, Brandon Pettigrew, and Titus Young
Falcons: Roddy White, Tony Gonzalez, Julio Jones, and Michael Turner
Bengals: A.J. Green and Jermaine Gresham
49ers: Vernon Davis, Frank Gore, and Michael Crabtree
Broncos: Willis McGahee and DeMaryius Thomas
And just for fun..
Cleveland: Greg Little? and half of an offensive line.
Do you still actually believe RG3 or any other QB could have success with that kind of supporting cast?
I think you should reexamine your theory on QBs..
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One thing to remember too guys. Our offenseive play calling did not have us stretching the field very much. Teams could blitz because we would throw 5 yards on 3rd and 8. Pats are constantly stretching D's. When the Defense is kept honest, that helps the Offensive line as well because a defense can't send as many people.
Pittsburgh DC lost that game for them just as much as Tebow's exectution of the play by the way.
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Go look at the top ten offensive lines......
look at the offensive lines of the top ten qb's and rb's.....
You need the pieces in place to get the job done. And the big guys who lead the way are not to be ignored.
Even Jim Brown gave all the credit in the world to his offensive line. The Browns will draft a RT in the third or fourth rounds, I thinkl.
Or, they will sign one.... just fix the problem over there. Add elite wr, killer rb, rt, and watch the Browns offense starting kicking arse..
Go look at the top ten offensive lines......
look at the offensive lines of the top ten qb's and rb's.....
You need the pieces in place to get the job done. And the big guys who lead the way are not to be ignored.
Even Jim Brown gave all the credit in the world to his offensive line. The Browns will draft a RT in the third or fourth rounds, I thinkl.
Or, they will sign one.... just fix the problem over there. Add elite wr, killer rb, rt, and watch the Browns offense starting kicking arse..
So why can't we fill 3 spots and get a franchise QB in the same draft?
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It's late, maybe you're drunk or something? Besides...Thomas 1st round pick, Mack 1st round pick, Steinbach, early 2nd round pick. The Browns have high draft pick linemen. It hasn't done shit for them. And as much as I hate the Steelers, a healthy Pittsburgh team beats the hell out of the Broncos. Even with that fabulous offensive line they have there in Denver. And come back after this weekend and tell me if the team with the great line or great QB are continuing on in the playoffs. jparsh
*************************************************
LOL. No, I don't get drunk on root beer. @@ But guard dawg heard coyotes off in the distance, and woke me up barking like crazy, so I rebuilt the fire in
the fireplace, and got online. Of course the Browns have some high draft picks on their oline. The point is, offensive RIGHT GUARD and RIGHT TACKLE.
It doesn't work well with only one half of the oline working.
The point is, Tebow TEBOWed the DEFENSE of the squeelers, not the offense with injuries. The defense was fine, despite one safety not playing. The point is,
the Bronco's oline handled the squeeler defense, after getting themselves into the playoffs.... with a qb that most figure is NOT "elite" by any stretch.
Miss the point if you want to, but it's true. Even a TEBOW can play an excellent defense and win, with the oline established to do the job.
Or, do you think Tebow is Peyton?
What kind of rootbeer? I'll only drink Virgils, the best rootbeer you can buy.
I got your point, you equated a good oline with winning playoff games. I disagreed with you. A good oline is nice, no doubt but it's not the end all be all. And I also said that the Steelers would have won the game if not for some injuries. Would you have still listed off a group of high round offensive linemen if the Broncos lost but managed to put up 20 points? Everything comes down to winning and losing, so I doubt this would even be a thread if the Broncos lost the game 30-20.
We need playmakers, at the QB position and WR position. RB's are a dime a dozen, just plug in a solid guy and you'll be fine. We've already got a few good TE's. And our line started playing better at the end of the year. I suspect that a single change at RT should equal a pretty damn good line for the Browns.
jparsh said:
What kind of rootbeer? I'll only drink Virgils, the best rootbeer you can buy.
I got your point, you equated a good oline with winning playoff games. I disagreed with you. A good oline is nice, no doubt but it's not the end all be all. And I also said that the Steelers would have won the game if not for some injuries. Would you have still listed off a group of high round offensive linemen if the Broncos lost but managed to put up 20 points? Everything comes down to winning and losing, so I doubt this would even be a thread if the Broncos lost the game 30-20.
We need playmakers, at the QB position and WR position. RB's are a dime a dozen, just plug in a solid guy and you'll be fine. We've already got a few good TE's. And our line started playing better at the end of the year. I suspect that a single change at RT should equal a pretty damn good line for the Browns.
What I think is that for the Browns to win they need a good offensive line, and a good QB. Also good WRs and RBs. Also, they should have a good defensive line, linebackers, and defensive backs. And don't forget the kicker, punter, and kick returners.
But, more importantly than all that....they need a good coach. You think they can find one somewhere?
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