Draft Thoughts 2013
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Although we needed the upgrades we got through this draft, next year we definitely need to take about 3 OG to make sure 2 of them are good. After taking a new QB, if needed. Every year, the teams that go to the super bowl have good talent at all OL and DL positions.. we've got the D, both OT, and of course C -- it's the OG that need help.
Many teams build from the outside-in, but championship teams are built inside-out every time.
Think about it: Jerry Rice, the best WR of all time, touched the ball... 5 times each game. He was drafted by a team who had easily won the super bowl the season before and finished #2 in scoring offense - but their leading receiver that year was Roger Craig. WR's do not change anything.. it's all about the OL/DL. Even the 49ers last year got into the WR-in-the-first act with AJ Jenkins, and he never saw the field. 5.3% of Lions plays this past year ended with Calvin Johnson catching a pass.. the best season by a WR in history.. and he had the same number of TD's as Gordon.
Bottom line: It is ridiculous, utterly ridiculous, to dish out megabucks to a guy who, in a great year, might touch the ball on just 5 percent of NFL snaps and do little to nothing 95 percent of the time.
Yes, a Browns player from the 2013 draft is an example of tremendously efficient value.
Although we needed the upgrades we got through this draft, next year we definitely need to take about 3 OG to make sure 2 of them are good. After taking a new QB, if needed. Every year, the teams that go to the super bowl have good talent at all OL and DL positions.. we've got the D, both OT, and of course C -- it's the OG that need help.
Many teams build from the outside-in, but championship teams are built inside-out every time.
Think about it: Jerry Rice, the best WR of all time, touched the ball... 5 times each game. He was drafted by a team who had easily won the super bowl the season before and finished #2 in scoring offense - but their leading receiver that year was Roger Craig. WR's do not change anything.. it's all about the OL/DL. Even the 49ers last year got into the WR-in-the-first act with AJ Jenkins, and he never saw the field. 5.3% of Lions plays this past year ended with Calvin Johnson catching a pass.. the best season by a WR in history.. and he had the same number of TD's as Gordon.
Bottom line: It is ridiculous, utterly ridiculous, to dish out megabucks to a guy who, in a great year, might touch the ball on just 5 percent of NFL snaps and do little to nothing 95 percent of the time.
Yes, a Browns player from the 2013 draft is an example of tremendously efficient value.
I have a feeling this Gilkey kid is going to surprise us and challenge for a starting position at guard within the next two years.
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Although we needed the upgrades we got through this draft, next year we definitely need to take about 3 OG to make sure 2 of them are good. After taking a new QB, if needed. Every year, the teams that go to the super bowl have good talent at all OL and DL positions.. we've got the D, both OT, and of course C -- it's the OG that need help.
Many teams build from the outside-in, but championship teams are built inside-out every time.
Think about it: Jerry Rice, the best WR of all time, touched the ball... 5 times each game. He was drafted by a team who had easily won the super bowl the season before and finished #2 in scoring offense - but their leading receiver that year was Roger Craig. WR's do not change anything.. it's all about the OL/DL. Even the 49ers last year got into the WR-in-the-first act with AJ Jenkins, and he never saw the field. 5.3% of Lions plays this past year ended with Calvin Johnson catching a pass.. the best season by a WR in history.. and he had the same number of TD's as Gordon.
Bottom line: It is ridiculous, utterly ridiculous, to dish out megabucks to a guy who, in a great year, might touch the ball on just 5 percent of NFL snaps and do little to nothing 95 percent of the time.
Yes, a Browns player from the 2013 draft is an example of tremendously efficient value.
I have a feeling this Gilkey kid is going to surprise us and challenge for a starting position at guard within the next two years.
Skeptical2013 said:
I have a feeling this Gilkey kid is going to surprise us and challenge for a starting position at guard within the next two years.
I agree. This kid seems very determined & has a mean streak.
Mike
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Skeptical2013 said:
I have a feeling this Gilkey kid is going to surprise us and challenge for a starting position at guard within the next two years.
I agree. This kid seems very determined & has a mean streak.
Mike
I agree. This kid seems very determined & has a mean streak.
Mike
Really chuckled at this submission from a fan about the Browns' draft to Bud Shaw's column in the PD.
"Let's see. It took five pretty high-priced people in the 'war room' -- plus many others doing research and evaluations -- to draft a total of five players: An underweight linebacker, an undersized corner, a safety coming off an Achilles tear, a guy who dealt drugs and a lineman with a history of an irregular heartbeat. Another year without a sense of urgency. ... What am I missing?" -- Gary, Wickliffe
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I agree. This kid seems very determined & has a mean streak.
Mike
Really chuckled at this submission from a fan about the Browns' draft to Bud Shaw's column in the PD.
"Let's see. It took five pretty high-priced people in the 'war room' -- plus many others doing research and evaluations -- to draft a total of five players: An underweight linebacker, an undersized corner, a safety coming off an Achilles tear, a guy who dealt drugs and a lineman with a history of an irregular heartbeat. Another year without a sense of urgency. ... What am I missing?" -- Gary, Wickliffe
Skeptical2013 said:
Really chuckled at this submission from a fan about the Browns' draft to Bud Shaw's column in the PD.
"Let's see. It took five pretty high-priced people in the 'war room' -- plus many others doing research and evaluations -- to draft a total of five players: An underweight linebacker, an undersized corner, a safety coming off an Achilles tear, a guy who dealt drugs and a lineman with a history of an irregular heartbeat. Another year without a sense of urgency. ... What am I missing?" -- Gary, Wickliffe
What he is missing is the fact that the hard work and effort leading into this draft was borne primarily by guys that were on Tom Heckert's scouting staff....and that Lombardi didn't give a shit what those guys did and wanted only to take a couple of guys he was high on....and defer a large part of this draft to next year when he and "his guys" are the ones doing the scouting and picking.
So....absolutely this shows that Lombardi did NOT know the talent in this draft....didn't want guys who he knew were going to be gone after the draft to have much input into this draft....and only wants success if it is His Guys, i.e. his scouts and the players they selects who are the ones that achieve that success. So...absolutely correct. Not only is there no sense of urgency....there is no desire for immediate success if the credit therefore could be attributed to his successor.
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Does anybody care to take a shot on the players Heckert would have picked if he was still in charge? Would it have been that different?
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
Does anybody care to take a shot on the players Heckert would have picked if he was still in charge? Would it have been that different?
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Skeptical2013 said:
Really chuckled at this submission from a fan about the Browns' draft to Bud Shaw's column in the PD.
"Let's see. It took five pretty high-priced people in the 'war room' -- plus many others doing research and evaluations -- to draft a total of five players: An underweight linebacker, an undersized corner, a safety coming off an Achilles tear, a guy who dealt drugs and a lineman with a history of an irregular heartbeat. Another year without a sense of urgency. ... What am I missing?" -- Gary, Wickliffe
What he is missing is the fact that the hard work and effort leading into this draft was borne primarily by guys that were on Tom Heckert's scouting staff....and that Lombardi didn't give a shit what those guys did and wanted only to take a couple of guys he was high on....and defer a large part of this draft to next year when he and "his guys" are the ones doing the scouting and picking.
So....absolutely this shows that Lombardi did NOT know the talent in this draft....didn't want guys who he knew were going to be gone after the draft to have much input into this draft....and only wants success if it is His Guys, i.e. his scouts and the players they selects who are the ones that achieve that success. So...absolutely correct. Not only is there no sense of urgency....there is no desire for immediate success if the credit therefore could be attributed to his successor.
What he is missing is the fact that the hard work and effort leading into this draft was borne primarily by guys that were on Tom Heckert's scouting staff....and that Lombardi didn't give a shit what those guys did and wanted only to take a couple of guys he was high on....and defer a large part of this draft to next year when he and "his guys" are the ones doing the scouting and picking.
So....absolutely this shows that Lombardi did NOT know the talent in this draft....didn't want guys who he knew were going to be gone after the draft to have much input into this draft....and only wants success if it is His Guys, i.e. his scouts and the players they selects who are the ones that achieve that success. So...absolutely correct. Not only is there no sense of urgency....there is no desire for immediate success if the credit therefore could be attributed to his successor.
I'm still perplexed why people are so high on Mingo -- I don't see it and I saw many of LSU's games, but I'll let the experts do the final judging. Also a bit perplexed why we took McFadden when several others corners were rated much higher by nearly everyone, but at least McFadden has a rep for being able to cover receivers. ( I'll never forget the confused look on Mel Kiper's face when the Browns took McFadden instead of Webb of Poser. ) I think the Slaughter pick was a big miss when Rambo was still there and we could have traded upjust afew places to get a better quality safety.
But I am intrigued by the 7th round picks and some of the FAs. I'm beginning to get a sneaking suspicion that this draft is going to be best known for the 7th rounders and UFAs more than the bigger name players. Browns may end up with the best OL in football in another year as Faulk and Gilkey could be big time players.
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Does anybody care to take a shot on the players Heckert would have picked if he was still in charge? Would it have been that different?
Does anybody care to take a shot on the players Heckert would have picked if he was still in charge? Would it have been that different?
Heckert would have probably traded down with the Rams. Selecting at #16 he would have taken Kenny Vaccaro, the S from Texas. In round two (with the Rams' second pick) , he would have taken a quality CB and then taken a TE in round three. That would have been just what the team needed!
Lombardi is an idiot for not trading with the Rams. Mingo wasn't worth sticking at #6.
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What he is missing is the fact that the hard work and effort leading into this draft was borne primarily by guys that were on Tom Heckert's scouting staff....and that Lombardi didn't give a shit what those guys did and wanted only to take a couple of guys he was high on....and defer a large part of this draft to next year when he and "his guys" are the ones doing the scouting and picking.
So....absolutely this shows that Lombardi did NOT know the talent in this draft....didn't want guys who he knew were going to be gone after the draft to have much input into this draft....and only wants success if it is His Guys, i.e. his scouts and the players they selects who are the ones that achieve that success. So...absolutely correct. Not only is there no sense of urgency....there is no desire for immediate success if the credit therefore could be attributed to his successor.
I'm still perplexed why people are so high on Mingo -- I don't see it and I saw many of LSU's games, but I'll let the experts do the final judging. Also a bit perplexed why we took McFadden when several others corners were rated much higher by nearly everyone, but at least McFadden has a rep for being able to cover receivers. ( I'll never forget the confused look on Mel Kiper's face when the Browns took McFadden instead of Webb of Poser. ) I think the Slaughter pick was a big miss when Rambo was still there and we could have traded upjust afew places to get a better quality safety.
But I am intrigued by the 7th round picks and some of the FAs. I'm beginning to get a sneaking suspicion that this draft is going to be best known for the 7th rounders and UFAs more than the bigger name players. Browns may end up with the best OL in football in another year as Faulk and Gilkey could be big time players.
Skeptical2013 said:
I'm still perplexed why people are so high on Mingo -- I don't see it and I saw many of LSU's games, but I'll let the experts do the final judging. Also a bit perplexed why we took McFadden when several others corners were rated much higher by nearly everyone, but at least McFadden has a rep for being able to cover receivers. ( I'll never forget the confused look on Mel Kiper's face when the Browns took McFadden instead of Webb of Poser. ) I think the Slaughter pick was a big miss when Rambo was still there and we could have traded upjust afew places to get a better quality safety.
But I am intrigued by the 7th round picks and some of the FAs. I'm beginning to get a sneaking suspicion that this draft is going to be best known for the 7th rounders and UFAs more than the bigger name players. Browns may end up with the best OL in football in another year as Faulk and Gilkey could be big time players.
What YOU think, or what some particular expert here or there might think is irrelevent. Lombardi and Banners are the opinions that count...and far as experts....they all disagree anyway.
But, I hope you are right about the UDFAs.
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Does anybody care to take a shot on the players Heckert would have picked if he was still in charge? Would it have been that different?
Heckert would have probably traded down with the Rams. Selecting at #16 he would have taken Kenny Vaccaro, the S from Texas. In round two (with the Rams' second pick) , he would have taken a quality CB and then taken a TE in round three. That would have been just what the team needed!
Lombardi is an idiot for not trading with the Rams. Mingo wasn't worth sticking at #6.
Skeptical2013 said:
Heckert would have probably traded down with the Rams. Selecting at #16 he would have taken Kenny Vaccaro, the S from Texas. In round two (with the Rams' second pick) , he would have taken a quality CB and then taken a TE in round three. That would have been just what the team needed!
Lombardi is an idiot for not trading with the Rams. Mingo wasn't worth sticking at #6.
I saw a report yesterday claiming that the Rams didn't, in fact, propose a trade with Cleveland. It claims that the Rams had actually locked up their trade the night before.
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Pre-draft, National Football Post had McFadden higher than mathieu, wreh-wilson, poser, ryan, and the CB's following them.
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Pre-draft, National Football Post had McFadden higher than mathieu, wreh-wilson, poser, ryan, and the CB's following them.
Pre-draft, National Football Post had McFadden higher than mathieu, wreh-wilson, poser, ryan, and the CB's following them.
CBS Sports also had him rated higher than Poyer and Webb....the same as Ryan and Wreh-Wilson...all 3rd rounders. Mathieu was rated a round higher on talent. (of course I suspect they didn't account for off field issues.)
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Skeptical2013 said:
Heckert would have probably traded down with the Rams. Selecting at #16 he would have taken Kenny Vaccaro, the S from Texas. In round two (with the Rams' second pick) , he would have taken a quality CB and then taken a TE in round three. That would have been just what the team needed!
Lombardi is an idiot for not trading with the Rams. Mingo wasn't worth sticking at #6.
I saw a report yesterday claiming that the Rams didn't, in fact, propose a trade with Cleveland. It claims that the Rams had actually locked up their trade the night before.
I saw a report yesterday claiming that the Rams didn't, in fact, propose a trade with Cleveland. It claims that the Rams had actually locked up their trade the night before.
I'm sure! LOL!
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Pre-draft, National Football Post had McFadden higher than mathieu, wreh-wilson, poser, ryan, and the CB's following them.
CBS Sports also had him rated higher than Poyer and Webb....the same as Ryan and Wreh-Wilson...all 3rd rounders. Mathieu was rated a round higher on talent. (of course I suspect they didn't account for off field issues.)
CBS Sports also had him rated higher than Poyer and Webb....the same as Ryan and Wreh-Wilson...all 3rd rounders. Mathieu was rated a round higher on talent. (of course I suspect they didn't account for off field issues.)
McFadden certainly wasn't mentioned by anyone I watched or listened to before the draft and that includes the guys at ESPN and NFL Network and the Plain dealer. McFadden's slection doesn't bother me as much as Salughter, who is mediocre compared to Rambo.
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CBS Sports also had him rated higher than Poyer and Webb....the same as Ryan and Wreh-Wilson...all 3rd rounders. Mathieu was rated a round higher on talent. (of course I suspect they didn't account for off field issues.)
McFadden certainly wasn't mentioned by anyone I watched or listened to before the draft and that includes the guys at ESPN and NFL Network and the Plain dealer. McFadden's slection doesn't bother me as much as Salughter, who is mediocre compared to Rambo.
Skeptical2013 said:
McFadden certainly wasn't mentioned by anyone I watched or listened to before the draft and that includes the guys at ESPN and NFL Network and the Plain dealer. McFadden's slection doesn't bother me as much as Salughter, who is mediocre compared to Rambo.
Slaughter was "off the books" as a prospect because of his injuries. So you don't know how he would have been rated had he been in the amongst the "usual suspects" As it is, he may be one of the Pros from Dover.
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CBS Sports also had him rated higher than Poyer and Webb....the same as Ryan and Wreh-Wilson...all 3rd rounders. Mathieu was rated a round higher on talent. (of course I suspect they didn't account for off field issues.)
McFadden certainly wasn't mentioned by anyone I watched or listened to before the draft and that includes the guys at ESPN and NFL Network and the Plain dealer. McFadden's slection doesn't bother me as much as Salughter, who is mediocre compared to Rambo.
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